Advocates want to reinvent DDA as funding source

[thelakelander]

By David Bauerlein
The rap on Jacksonville's old Downtown Development Authority was it had no authority - the agency could make recommendations to city leaders but the City Council had the final say.

But as downtown development has sputtered in recent years, some influential business leaders are exploring how Jacksonville could bring back the Downtown Development Authority - or an agency like it - and give it control over a recurring source of tax dollars.

The concept is still being fleshed out by members of the Jacksonville Civic Council, a group of corporate and civic leaders that studies community issues and has the ear of city officials.

The Jacksonville Civic Council is focusing on three areas of downtown's Northbank:

- Laura Street would have cafes and shops between The Jacksonville Landing and Hemming Plaza. Haskell said restoration of the abandoned Laura Street Trio and old Barnett Bank building are essential. The JEDC has been in talks with developers about renovating the historic buildings into apartments and a hotel. Haskell said opening the middle of the Landing so a plaza connects Laura Street to the Riverwalk. That concept has been discussed before but the city and Landing owner Toney Sleiman could not agree on how to pay for it.

- The current site of the County Courthouse and City Hall annex will be available for redevelopment after the new courthouse opens. Haskell said the redevelopment could build an 80,000- to 100,000-square-foot exhibit hall for conventions next to the Hyatt Regency hotel. The exhibit hall would add to convention space that already exists in the 966-room hotel. Other property could be used for entertainment and retail, expanding the nightlife scene that has emerged along Bay Street.

- The Shipyards, where plans for condominiums bit the dust after the housing bubble burst, could be the location of a public attraction that draws people downtown, Haskell said.

"Clearly, this is something that will not be done for free," he said. "We've got to have a business plan, an economic plan that's sound."

http://jacksonville.com/business/2010-10-10/story/advocates-want-reinvent-dda-funding-source

[CS Foltz]

I am not sure we need one more agency for downtown! How many is needed with dedicated funding? What is DVI to be used for...............we have enough duplication of services don't we?

[CS Foltz]

OK stephen.........you don't have to convince me about the Millions that have been wasted to this point in time! My biggest problem here is the continuance of taxpayer money being wasted...........studies being done that have allready been done, repeatedly no less, so just where do we go to get the most bang for our money? Another agency, along with the beauracy that it takes to run it or do we just bite the bullet, scrub everything and start from scratch? Right now with no direction what so ever from the current administration, methinks we are running around in small circles and no matter what organization is overseeing this, there is taxpayer money that will form the basis of their operation! I am beginning to believe, we need to start from scratch, with a clean slate, a clear directive and mandate that controls what is done and what the end goals are to be. But thats just me!

[CS Foltz]

stephen..........I can not help but to agree! Your correct with the DNA aspect and that is why I am not for DDA being brought back to life! I am still leaning towards scrubbing it all and starting over. From  a money point of view, I think we would get more bang for the buck and the chances of suceeding would also be enhanced! I aslo agree with your take on the "Projects" breakdown.........we need a massive reorganization to take place with priorities firmly set  and the means to fund something along those lines! Maybe going into Chapter 11 might be a good thing for us all?

[simms3]

I agree with all of you, but I think Preston Haskell is smart enough to agree with just about all of our ideas, too.  He mentions opening up the Landing (the first I have really heard an MJ outsider mention that, at least in the FTU), he mentions an 80-100,000 SF exhibition hall on courthouse site, he mentions Shipyards without specifics, but in his own words, it sounds like he would prefer something organic for the Shipyards.  Also, he throws a lot of money around.  Don't be surprised to see him "donate" to a project (s) he likes.

For a short article that didn't have time or space to discuss all of the small little details that could make a big impact (and who's purpose was to describe an agency that could approve and fastrack projects) it packed a punch.  I am sure if there were something to come of it, we would see a more comprehensive article on what the agency could and could not do.  If it could amend policy like parking enforcement, I'm sure the next article would mention such things.

As I commented on FTU, if we could have a municipal monarch, I would be comfortable with Preston Haskell as king.  Unlike most of our public officials now, Mr. Haskell is an investor.  He wants to do what is right and will boost his investments (and at this point his investments are in city-wide affairs so his boosting his investments boosts us all).  I think he also knows what he is doing, I mean having built from the ground up America's largest design/build firm that does projects internationally and all.  My dad worked for him in the 90s.  He's an interesting guy, quite progressive.  He also likes to install sprinkler systems in his spare time as a hobby.

Stephen, one day if you're wealthy like Preston Haskell and you think the homeless deserve better in our town (and maybe they do), maybe you can throw your own money at that and build a mega homeless center to how you see fit.  I think Mr. Haskell wants to see individual projects go up (like opening the Landing and Laura St trio and something on Shipyards site), but he also knows for them to work they have to be connected in a pedestrian oriented environment.  He's no idiot.  The Laura Street streetscape is addressing this on one end.  We are getting there finally.

Increasing water fountains and benches certainly may help walkability (certainly benches...water fountains, eh I wouldn't drink out of one downtown unless I was a bum).  If you put in more benches without dividers, more fountains, more public phones, and more homeless centers, you think we won't have an even larger homeless problem downtown? 

[Dog Walker]

None of them address the underlying need to create organic economic activity (not incentives), remove the obstacles to success  (the parking enforcement clowns, the total lack of social services for the homeless, the forbidding pedestrian environment as a result---nowhere to sit, no bathrooms, no public telephones, no water) or reconnect the downtown physically back with the neighborhoods that solely created it---riverside, springfield, durkeeville, the eastside, and san marco.

If you don't address these issues, then there isnt a project or a set of projects that is going to work.

Words that need to be tattooed on the foreheads of all of the members of the Civic Council so that they would have to read them every time they meet.  None of them has ever had to deal with what needs to be done as outlined above, so none of them has a clue about how to do it.  "If your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail."  The Civic Council is a bunch of very smart, highly accomplished people who don't have the tools to solve the problem.

[CS Foltz]

Gentlemen.........I agree with the concept, money will not solve all of the downtown issue's! I also agree that real estate developers, with downtown connections, do not have all of the tools needed to do the job....so I am back to square one again........who is? DDA & DVI & JEDC are hampered by a variety of issue's with a very narrow focus that does not address some of the problems we have...homeless,basic amenities for anyone, and nothing that caters to a tourist option! Maybe we need to conside a seperate outside agency? When I refer to "A Vison" I am refering to what could be rather than what we have and this is why I make the comment about the City of Jacksonville going Chapter 11! Start from scratch, with a clean slate, organize and attack from a different direction...........since the direction we are moving does not bode well over a long term outlook!

[Dog Walker]

drivelous

Wow, Stephen, that is up there with Sarah!   

[simms3]

Simms.

seriously spare me the politics.  Its drivelous at times.  You seem like  a good kid, why spoil it with the obsessive compulsive politics?

If you dump the homeless onto the streets every morning with no where to go and then you purposefully design a downtown to make it uncomfortable for the homeless to make them 'go away', in the process you also end up making it uncomfortable for everyone else. It becomes, defacto a downtown for the homeless.

There are no politics in this idea, just business realities.  Now if you will kindly take your partisan goggles off for a while, you might be able to contribute something constructive.

In my case, my 'dad' didnt have to work with Preston in order to get an opinion of him, and to be frank, I think he would be horrified at the suggestion that what downtown needs is a 'municipal monarch', much less that he should be the one nominated for the role.

Weve been on a couple of the same committees together and I share some of your impressions of him.

However, I agree with DogWalker that this group of guys, being in essense real estate developers, do not have all the tools to address what needs to be solved downtown.

First of all you interjected your partisan opinion that the homeless in your own words had "a total lack of social services" downtown.  YOU brought up the homeless and said they needed more, I simply said that may or may not be, but done improperly would only exasperate the "situation" we so frequently talk about here (not to mention the perception that Jax suburbanites have already of downtown).  I think you can increase benches with dividers and make the fountains we already have actually function, and you can increase shade trees and pavers and put in wider sidewalks, but the homeless aren't lacking 100% here.

Also, I was tongue in cheek joking about the monarch.  I thought that was obvious.

Also, nobody has all of the tools necessary to make downtown great.  That's why it requires a team ranging from public input, good elected officials, and wealthy investors like Preston Haskell and some developers with vision to make it happen.  Even here on MJ we don't have all the tools.

[simms3]

Stephen, you basically are this website and so influential, but you are also probably the most political cornerstone poster on here.  I'm not trying to lob an insult, but hearing that coming from you was a little bit of a hypocritical shocker.  I really wasn't being political just then; you weren't either, but arguing that the homeless have a complete lack of social services can sound more political than anything I said.

[simms3]

If you bother reading the downtown forums you will see that the demands put on the business owners by being forced to pick up the slack are enough to sink a small business.

http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2008-apr-homeless-are-the-paramount-end-user-of-downtown

Read it and agree.  BUT downtown Jax has no worse a homeless problem than any other downtown I have been in (and much less a visible problem than the downtown I currently live in).  We just need more businesses and people downtown and maybe we can tackle the homeless problem differently.  Making it more comfortable for the homeless is not a way to make it easier on the small businesses, in my uneducated opinion.

[CS Foltz]

Public input, to this point, has been pretty well ignored! I offer the "Budget Workshops" as proof! DCSB did basically the same thing, ignored the input from the Citizens Committee, which was formed strictly for citizens input! I do agree that it takes a team effort, unless we are willing to go the dictatorship route, and part of the problem is the incompetent people surrounding Hiz Honor!" Running the City like a business" was Johnny's mantra and I see just where this has gotten us as of today! Had all kinds of public input regarding the Budget, where did that land us? It is kinda obvious what we have now, is not what we need for the long term and from my viewpoint...... reinventing DDA is just one more conduit for public money to go out the back door!

[simms3]

Well if Johnny had better input on the planning side, we could have seen his results, but in downtown.  Remember, he did bring several large companies' headquarters to Jax and he has gotten the ball rolling on Cecil (unrelated to DT I know, but will eventually be big for the city), and he has done a good bit for the port and airport.  Most of those companies he brought went straight to the burbs.  He needed a better team around him to make sure these companies still came, but came downtown.  And his having no background in planning, he screwed up initially with Thoburn, but he DID correct himself with Killingsworth.  Also, he's only partly to blame for the Courthouse.  Bottom line is even moreso than the mayor, we need a better "team" and a much better City Council.  I'm not expecting much given the average Jax voter, but we'll see.

And thanks Stephen, I'm glad we're back on the same track.

[thelakelander]

None of them address the underlying need to create organic economic activity (not incentives), remove the obstacles to success  (the parking enforcement clowns, the total lack of social services for the homeless, the forbidding pedestrian environment as a result---nowhere to sit, no bathrooms, no public telephones, no water) or reconnect the downtown physically back with the neighborhoods that solely created it---riverside, springfield, durkeeville, the eastside, and san marco.

If you don't address these issues, then there isnt a project or a set of projects that is going to work.

Words that need to be tattooed on the foreheads of all of the members of the Civic Council so that they would have to read them every time they meet.  None of them has ever had to deal with what needs to be done as outlined above, so none of them has a clue about how to do it.  "If your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail."  The Civic Council is a bunch of very smart, highly accomplished people who don't have the tools to solve the problem.

The quotes above pretty much sum up this whole discussion.  For some reason, we believe that downtown's problems can only be taken care of by spending millions on gimmicks.  This strategy hasn't worked in over a half century and there's no reason to think that it will work now.

While the big projects should great and exciting, its the little "affordable" organic elements we continue to ignore that can make or break downtown and the surrounding area.  Let's get these right before dumping millions into a decades old black hole.  The guys behind the Civic Council are pretty smart.  Hopefully, they'll pick up on this.