The Paramount End User of Downtown

[Driven1]

i wouldn't say that is racy at all...that is completely what we are looking for on here.

[stug]

Where was the video of the people sleeping on a sidewalk taken?

[Eazy E]

5.  The Library Bathrooms on all four floors, during almost the entire day, are filled with people showering, shaving and clogging the air with an almost unbearable stench.


7.  There are almost no outdoor seating cafes in the downtown because of the incredibly aggressive panhandling that takes place at tableside whenever such ventures are attempted.

5) I go in the Library all the time-- never have I seen a homeless person in one, let alone using it as a showering facility.
7) I eat lunch in the middle of Hemming plaza all the time, right in the middle of homeless people and they never approach me, let alone make me feel unsafe.

Also, whoever is harassing the homeless guy in the third of stephen's videos is a piece of shit-- I hope he develops a mental illness, loses his home, and is forced to walk the streets, shitting his pants.  "We don't want your kind down here-- who the fuck does this guy think he is? If it is the La Cena owner, that guy is on notice that not only will I never eat in his restaurant, but also, when people ask me for recommendations on eating downtown (which they often do as I live and work here) I will tell them what a shitbag he is (if that wasn't him, my apologies Mr. La Cena).

Jesus, does not one have any empathy anymore? Go to ANY major city in America and this is what downtown looks like.  People who think we won't have downtown development until the homeless somehow disappear, is living in some sort of fantasy land.  In short, realize that but for the grace of God, there goes you.

[Eazy E]

Stephen-
Yeah, I didn't have a problem with the article (didn't even realize you were the author).  Rather, I felt I was arguing against what I hear from practically EVERYONE in Jax regarding downtown, and I think your article captured all their collective thoughts and presented the pro & con nicely.  I have nothing against what you are writing, just the opinions of so many in Jax that downtown-- even in the daytime-- is unsafe*, which I have never felt, even when walking home to Springfield from TSI at 1 AM.

* granted, I am a 6 ft plus dude, but still.

[heights unknown]

Hi Driven;

Great post; I agree with all that you said; and yes, people from other countries who come to America, who probably had it really bad in those countries, come here, "turn to," as we used to say in the Navy, and end up upper Middle Class or higher; this is basically true.  We in America are basically spoiled and are privy and exposed to numerous opportunities from birth on up, and there should be no excuse for anyone to become homeless, this I agree with.  In addition, most of us in this country take everything for granted and don't really think about what we are doing but feel life should be handed to us on a silver platter; not so.  We have to work and work hard to obtain real success unless it is in fact handed to us on a silver platter.

That being said, regardless of WHY people end up homeless the bottom line is, when they end up that way, they do need a helping hand.  Relook at my post at the numerous problems that beset the homeless that contribute or cause them to be homeless.  Many of these are social problems, some or most stemming from childhood, others psychological, others medical or medically physical (handiciap/disabilities), and others out of pure stupidity or negligence.  Don't get me wrong guys, I am not trying to give an excuse for the homeless being the way that they are; but I am trying to get everyone to see that there is much more to homelessness than what most see on the surface, and also to get everyone to see underneath the dirt and grime so you will know exactly some or most of the items and issues that cause homelessness.

True people from other countries come here with nothing, work hard and scrimp, scratch and save, then bounce back, and eventually live good or are even quasi-rich so to speak; but most of them that come here are not beset with many of the social ills and problems such as drug use/abuse, alcoholism, dead beat dads, child molesters, disabled, etc.  What I am saying is this:  We can sit back and talk about the problem, or even in a negative light belittle it; but sometimes we do this without fully understanding the crap that contributes to the dirt and grime; do you feel me?  So, if they are homeless, and need help, and truly understand why they are homeless, how they got there, and what they need to do to return as productive members of society, I believe our job as social servants, and citizens of our great country, is to give and provide them the help that they need.  We do it for other countries and sendd trillions around the world...most for stupid incendiary reasons, so why not do it for our own?

Heights Unknown

[heights unknown]

Thanks Stephendare; we try hard at Avis!

I think one good solution would be for each City to have a good location, and not necessarily downtown, for the homeless.  And I am not talking "day care."  I am talking about a Center/Shelter with Compound.  Not only would it have food, clothing, and temporary shelter services, but it would also house intense counseling and assistance programs addressing each problematic need for the homeless person, i.e., drug/alcohol, financial, prison/Jail, Medical Problems, Disability/Handicapped, Family Problems (teen, domestic, dead beat dads, etc.), employment/day labor/jobs, etc.  The center would have to be of a good size to take care of most or all of the homeless population for that area.  But again, the Center would not only temporarily house the homeless, but the main mission and goal would be to attack and eliminate the social ills and problems that caused that person to be homeless.

[RiversideGator]

People really try to overthink this issue and try to moralize too much.  The solution to the homeless situation is quite simple:  Return to the 1950s policy of mass arrests for drunks, bums, vagrants and the mentally ill.  The mentally ill will then be committed to a state mental hospital for a period of years, not days, in order to get the proper treatment for their problems.  Drunks/drug addicts will be held in secure treatment facilities for months to dry them out.  And, the perpetually lazy will now spend their leisure time in jail.  And by doing this, you will allow the sane and legitimate citizens and taxpayers and their families to feel safe and welcome in downtown again.

So, there you have it.  Problem solved.  Now, admittedly this is difficult to implement as it will require a conservative judiciary and some backbone on the City Council, but the road map is right there and the route is clear. 

[JeffreyS]

It seems like many of you have thought about this.  We have been offered what seems like a good solution in the article.  Can we cite an example of a city that solved this problem is there a model we can emulate.

[Midway ®]

People really try to overthink this issue and.....blah....blah....blah....

So, there you have it.  Problem solved.  Now, admittedly this is difficult to implement as it will require a conservative judiciary and some backbone on the City Council, but the road map is right there and the route is clear. 

Well... that's certainly one thing you don't do, ....overthink this issue.

[gatorback]

RG: when was the last time you went to jail? A lot of the arrested would love your plan as to them its a roof over their heads and three square meals with tv and remote.  The cost is soaring as too. I don't want to pay for that. Okay I would pay for blue colar crimes, robbery and battery/loss of life. The 50s vs 2000? That's a stretch

[RiversideGator]

It seems like many of you have thought about this.  We have been offered what seems like a good solution in the article.  Can we cite an example of a city that solved this problem is there a model we can emulate.

Jacksonville circa 1950

[RiversideGator]

People really try to overthink this issue and.....blah....blah....blah....

So, there you have it.  Problem solved.  Now, admittedly this is difficult to implement as it will require a conservative judiciary and some backbone on the City Council, but the road map is right there and the route is clear. 

Well... that's certainly one thing you don't do, ....overthink this issue.

I dont recall accusing you of thinking, Midway.  I was talking about the others.

[gatorback]

Thank you.  I don't know what the answer is for the ones that need other solutions; however, for the ones that we can fix I'm sure there's more of a cost effective solution then just throwing them in jail. 
NYC gives out "tickets" that the recreational user has to pay.  As far as the homeless, I'll never forget the testimony of one saying, "I just want to go upstairs and have a place to sleep and some food."  The honorable judge told this person, "I can't keep sending you up there...it's not a hotel." 

[RiversideGator]

RG: when was the last time you went to jail? A lot of the arrested would love your plan as to them its a roof over their heads and three square meals with tv and remote.  The cost is soaring as too. I don't want to pay for that. Okay I would pay for blue colar crimes, robbery and battery/loss of life. The 50s vs 2000? That's a stretch

Actually, I worked in the Duval County jail for about a year.  It sucks.  It is a stretch to say that people would prefer life there to finding a job and a place to live. 

Note that this solution only applies to those who choose to be lazy and beg downtown.  The real insane would be treated and not in jail either (if I were King).  It really amuses me how these do gooders believe that it is better for the insane to be living on the streets in their own filth than for them to be in secure treatment facilities.  Which policy is really humane?

[Coolyfett]

Doesnt every inner city have this issue? I know when I was in Denver in Oct for a convention, I stayed downtown at the Hilton thats near the convention center and as we drove into downtown we pasted what the cab driver called "vaigrant island" or something like that. It was were the homeless shelter, food bank and a few other centers for homeless were located, there must have been atleast 150 homeless in one area. But it was just outside of the core.

Yes man!!! Every major city has this situation(not a problem)...I don't get this topic. I mean who cares??? If homeless people keep you from going where YOU WANT TO GO, then that just means you didn't want to be there to begin with. I have been to a few major American cities and the homeless are always around. They are not going anywhere. Leave em be. If they ask for money tell em NO and keep it moving!! They ain't animals. Hemming Plaza and the Main Library were some of my favorite places to kick it, even played a few chess games with some the of the homeless's best lol. Jacksonville is a CITY!!! Not a frigging town country bunkers!!!


Eeewwwww look the homeless.....OMG the homeless.....I mean really?  No disrespect but these are some dumb ass responses. In a way it sorta irritates me how people want Jacksonville to have the BIG CITY LIFESTYLE but only want certain parts of it. Bums come with the BIG CITY LIFESTYLE folks. Peace