Consolidated Government's Effect on Downtown. Affordable Urban Core Housing Issues

[duvaldude08]

My friend stays in Orlando and says that one of the high rise condos in their downtown has started taking section 8! LOL I dont want use to resort to that, but some affordable housing project needs to be created. For example, I stay in a gated apartment comunnity in Baymeadows and pay $633.00 a month, for a huge apartment, upgraded kitchen with washer and dryer. That's what I mean by affordable! (with a few extras)  "Affordable" does not necessairly mean "ghetto" or "hood".

[Captain Zissou]

If it cost $200 a square foot to develop residential space from permitted start to permitted finish, would $20,000 a year be unreasonable rent for a 1000 square foot apartment?  That's $1667 a month.  So called "affordable housing" may no longer exist outside the ghetto, and even there, a room in a ramshackle boarding house goes for $100 or more a week.

Jerry, are you Joking??  If your cost to build is $200/ sq ft and you rent at an annual rate of $200/ sq ft, you break even in a year.  Considering the traditional financing mix of 20/80 equity to debt, you're looking at 465% profit in year two after debt service  assuming you pass through maintenance costs to your tenants.  Everyone and their mother, father, sister/wife, and red neck uncle would be building condos if that was the case.  

A good investment returns about 20% cash on cash per year.

$1,600-$2,200 should be the upper end of 2 bedroom rentals in Jax.  $1,400 should be the absolute ceiling for 1 bedrooms, and that should make up less than 5% of the housing stock, as that is how our demographics are constructed.  Market rate should be $1,100-$1,500 for to bedroom and $600-$900 for single.  

[JC]

If it cost $200 a square foot to develop residential space from permitted start to permitted finish, would $20,000 a year be unreasonable rent for a 1000 square foot apartment?  That's $1667 a month.  So called "affordable housing" may no longer exist outside the ghetto, and even there, a room in a ramshackle boarding house goes for $100 or more a week.

Jerry, are you Joking??  If your cost to build is $200/ sq ft and you rent at an annual rate of $200/ sq ft, you break even in a year.  Considering the traditional financing mix of 20/80 equity to debt, you're looking at 465% profit in year two after debt service  assuming you pass through maintenance costs to your tenants.  Everyone and their mother, father, sister/wife, and red neck uncle would be building condos if that was the case.  

A good investment returns about 20% cash on cash per year.

$1,600-$2,200 should be the upper end of 2 bedroom rentals in Jax.  $1,400 should be the absolute ceiling for 1 bedrooms, and that should make up less than 5% of the housing stock, as that is how our demographics are constructed.  Market rate should be $1,100-$1,500 for to bedroom and $600-$900 for single.  

$2000 / 4br - Clean, bright, new renovated 4br hardwood floors NO FEE! (W159St/Bway) (Inwood / Wash Hts)

No Fee! New renovated apt! Apt is located at 504 West 159th Street between Broadway & Amsterdam Avenue in diverse and historic Washington Heights. It is a prewar walk-up building that we work hard to maintain a good condition. Building has security camera for tenant security. Apt is newly re-done, freshly painted, clean and brand new kitchen appliances, faucets, sinks, vanity, fixtures and doors, repolished hardwood floors, new tiled kitchen and bath floor. Separate windowed kitchen for the chef of the house, separate bedrooms can be used as a home office. Rent includes heat and hot water.
Rental features:

* 4 bedrooms
* renovated bath
* renovated kitchen
* new tile floors
* stainless steel stove/ gas range
* custom granite countertop
* real cherry cabinetry
* stainless steel refrigerator
* high ceilings
* polished new hardwood floors
* new coat of paint

Serious inquiries only please call Sammy (646) 808-2233.




cats are OK - purrr
dogs are OK - wooof
it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests
Fee Disclosure: application & credit check fee
Listed By: soho properties

http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/abo/1808380549.html

History
The series of ridges overlooking the Hudson were sites of villas in the 19th century, including the extensive property of John James Audubon.

In the early 1900s, Irish immigrants moved to Washington Heights. European Jews went to Washington Heights to escape Nazism during the 1930s and the 1940s. During the 1950s and 1960s, many Greeks moved to Washington Heights; the community was referred to as the "Astoria of Manhattan." As the nickname became widespread, Cubans and Puerto Ricans moved to the area. By the 1980s and 1990s, the neighborhood became mostly Dominican. By the 2000s, after years when gangsters ruled a thriving illegal drug trade, urban renewal began. Many Dominicans moved to Morris Heights, University Heights, and other west Bronx neighborhoods.[5] While gentrification is often blamed for rapid changes in the neighborhood, the changes in population also reflect the departure of the dominant nationality. Even though Dominicans still make up 73 percent of the neighborhood, their moves to the Bronx have made room for Mexicans and Ecuadorians, according to The Latino Data Project of the City University of New York.[6] The proportion of whites in Washington Heights has declined from 18 percent in 1990 to 14 percent in 2005.[7]


Transportation

Three of the bridges that cross the Harlem River are visible: the High Bridge (a pedestrian bridge that has been closed for many years); the Alexander Hamilton Bridge (part of Interstate 95); and the Washington Bridge. In this photo, looking north, the Washington Heights neighborhood of Manhattan is on the left and the Bronx is on the right.Washington Heights is connected to Fort Lee, New Jersey, via the Othmar Ammann-designed George Washington Bridge. The Pier Luigi Nervi-designed George Washington Bridge Bus Terminal is located at the Manhattan end of the bridge. The Trans-Manhattan Expressway, a portion of Interstate 95, proceeds from the George Washington Bridge in a trench between 178th and 179th Streets. To the east, the Highway leads to the Alexander Hamilton Bridge across the Harlem River to the Bronx and the Cross-Bronx Expressway. The Washington Bridge crosses the Harlem River just north of the Alexander Hamilton Bridge. High Bridge is the oldest Harlem River span still in existence, crossing the river just south of the Alexander Hamilton Bridge. Originally it carried the Croton Aqueduct as part of the New York City water system and later functioned as a pedestrian bridge that has been closed since 1970. It has been recently announced High Bridge will reopen after a 20 million dollar renovation project.

Subways
Washington Heights is served by the New York City Subway. On the Eighth Avenue Line (A and C) service is available at the 155th Street, 163rd Streetâ€"Amsterdam Avenue, 168th Street station. The C line ends at 168th St. The A train continues and stops at 175th Streetâ€"George Washington Bridge Bus Terminal, 181st Street, 190th Street, Dyckman Street and 207th Street, with Dyckman named for a family that once owned property in the area. Along the Broadway-Seventh Avenue Line, the 1 train has stations at 157th Street, 168th Street, 181st Street, 191st Street, Dyckman Street and 207th Street.


This is all 15 minutes from central park, probably 5 minutes by bike to the bike path that runs the entire length of Manhattan along the west side highway, no lights just a long ride on the river!  There are just too many things to list really.

Again this is not a diss on Jacksonville, I love the potential DT has but for freaking serious, 1200 for two beds?

[JC]

I really dont know much about the city owned housing stock but it seems like renovating them, with the army of unemployed trades people living in Duval County would be a great place to start, then just charge tennants rent based on what it would cost to maintain the properties.  DT needs working class people badly!

[Captain Zissou]

^ That sounds good to me.  The city owns enough property for it.  Unfortunately, the city prefers laborers of the illegal sort.

[JC]

^ That sounds good to me.  The city owns enough property for it.  Unfortunately, the city prefers laborers of the illegal sort.

Unfortunately you are correct!

[tufsu1]

why should downtown living necessarily be cheap?  

When I was in college in Philly, I would have loved to live in Center City but couldn't afford it....so we lived at the periphery...just like Riverside, Springfield, and San marco offer here.

And when I looked to buy my first place in Tampa, I couldn't afford Hyde Park...so I got a place as close to it as I could (about 1/2 mile away).

[fieldafm]

why should downtown living necessarily be cheap?

Because downtown does not offer a standard of living comparable to ANY peer cities... nor even its own surrounding neighborhoods.  Currently, you're essentially paying higher rents than rental communities at the beach for absolutely no reason other than to say 'I live downtown'.

You have to walk before you can run.  Currently, we are crawling downtown.

[Captain Zissou]

why should downtown living necessarily be cheap?  

When I was in college in Philly, I would have loved to live in Center City but couldn't afford it....so we lived at the periphery...just like Riverside, Springfield, and San marco offer here.

And when I looked to buy my first place in Tampa, I couldn't afford Hyde Park...so I got a place as close to it as I could (about 1/2 mile away).

Downtown living should not be cheap, downtown Jax should be cheap due to market economics.  Low Demand+High Supply=CHEAP

Downtown prices increase because they are established neighborhoods with amenities and conveniences and luxury not offered elsewhere.  People want to live there and enjoy this lifestyle of luxury, culture, and convenience, so they pay a premium.  People out bid other people, and prices go up.  Other than nice bathroom fixtures, our downtown has none of these things.  Downtown Jax offers no justification for high prices other than the developers are trying to line their pockets.  

That's like walking into a group and claiming "I'm in charge".  When asked why, you respond "because I said so."  Just because the downtown buildings say they're expensive, doesn't mean they should be.  Our market has no need for 600 high end units on the south bank.  

[Jaxson]

As for affordable, why is it preferable to have units that are expensive, but vacant?  

[Captain Zissou]

I can tell you why they won't lower the price on units at the Peninsula.  This is a quote, they "don't want to reduce the prestige of the building".  Meanwhile, they are swimming in debt. 

[Doctor_K]

Let's see how their prestige holds up once they foreclose and end up completely abandoned.

Not too smart.

[hillary supporter]

hillary supporter:  Am I interpreting your post wrong?  What I gleaned from your post in summary: Market rate housing is not economically viable, in its current form.  We need subsidies for developers to make market rate, or even below market rate housing work.  Therefore, we need a liberal councilman who will chuck big time bucks at developers to put cheap houses downtown?

[/quote/]
I was thinking of purely low income public housing, in my mind , controlled directly by the city. Like the NYC Housing Authority. But, from the vibe of this thread and in recent years, it has been done in the matter you described and you are right it has failed. Big time. I felt this could be done with only a liberal mayor, not councilman, to execute a very radical approach for DT development.
But i also pointed out that the more conservative approach would be to continue to move as we are and accept the fact of a metropolitan area (culturally) not centered on its downtown. This is the plan currently and the one which a majority of Jacksonville voters support.
Isnt a lot of municipal housing projects located throughout the city now? i do know that many now recieve monthly subsidies to supplement their housing (rental) costs ( through HUD). 

[fieldafm]

I was thinking of purely low income public housing, in my mind , controlled directly by the city. Like the NYC Housing Authority. But, from the vibe of this thread and in recent years, it has been done in the matter you described and you are right it has failed. Big time. I felt this could be done with only a liberal mayor, not councilman, to execute a very radical approach for DT development.
But i also pointed out that the more conservative approach would be to continue to move as we are and accept the fact of a metropolitan area (culturally) not centered on its downtown. This is the plan currently and the one which a majority of Jacksonville voters support.
Isnt a lot of municipal housing projects located throughout the city now? i do know that many now recieve monthly subsidies to supplement their housing (rental) costs ( through HUD).  

I just don't see how this is a political argument?  Charlotte and Orlando's(two peer cities) downtown core are experiencing a rebirth... and they didn't get their b/c of the political party of the mayor in office, rather the policies they put into place to foster development of their downtown(s).

I don't see how a bunch of Section 8 housing filling up downtown highrises would all of a sudden reverse the toxic policies our downtown operates under.  You'll have to explain how that would reverse the current tide of business leaving downtown(mainly due to the cost of operating downtown), and the fact that our current residents lack basic amenities and a quality of life that is much poorer than that of the downtown in any peer cities?

[Wacca Pilatka]

Though it's probably true that the majority of Jacksonville voters, and many power brokers in the city, are averse to centering on downtown, the right leadership can sway that opinion, and it's happened from both sides of the political aisle: Godbold with the Billion Dollar Decade, Delaney with the sales tax increase under the Better Jacksonville Plan.

I just want a leader raised up for Jacksonville who can get the city collectively behind that core-centered focus again.  I don't think the political party of that leader matters.  It seems to me that there are at least four candidates in this election who would advocate for the major leitmotifs of this site, representing both major parties.

More significantly, when I think of Godbold and Delaney, I think of two leaders who got people thinking positively about Jacksonville again and at least temporarily broke the cycle of self-deprecation that seems to hang over this city I love and hold back its potential, of which Stephen has so eloquently written and recently reposted.  I think of Godbold's inauguration speech about creating a community of believers, and of Delaney's eulogy for Bill Foley in which he spoke of how we all knew he (and Godbold) loved the city and by extension made everyone love it.  

Glorious Johnson's speech on "a city deferred" hits me square in the heart in the same way those moments did.  I am thankful she, Jim Bailey, Rick Mullaney, and Audrey Moran are candidates in this election because they give me every indication that they are committed to breaking the negative pall and embracing the common sense policies that can turn the core around.  Their political party affiliations do not matter to me because I do not think those affiliations in any way define what their policies will be.