Cuban embargo: makes no sense

[Dan B]

The quickest way to end the regime in Cuba is to open the doors wide open, and let the cash and tourism flow in.

[BridgeTroll]

Your right ben... we created those entities... so we could do some economic terrorism and kill babies.

Looks like you've been reading too much one-sided history.

Right back at ya baybee...

[Cricket]

There is no "economic terrorism"  Your term is a bumper sticker and no more.  

Bumper stick or not, terrorism is what it is. We use the word, "terrorism" self-servingly. When other nations resist us, we use certain words to describe them like "terrorists" and "insurgents". We use euphemisms like  "regime change" and "liberation" to describe our own terroristic actions. If the denial of human rights is the reason for the Cuban embargo, let's be consistent and embargo every other nation that denies human rights to their people.

[rjp2008]

"First, Cuba is not nearly as oppressive as one would think."

Both the US and the European Union understand that basic human rights, political freedom, and essential private property protections and civil liberties are severely restricted in Cuba by a one-party system socialist government. There is no question on that.

But I guess some people want government to think for them, control their lives, throw them in prison when they disagree...etc. Looks like things are moving that way in this country unfortunately too...


I suppose his next defense will be supporting how humane and free things are in NK, Iran and Venezuela.

[BridgeTroll]

Our embargo of Cuba certainly does not create "terror".  Suicide bombers create terror, suicidal pilots flying into buildings create terror.  

Not being able to sell bananas in the U.S. is an economic embargo.

You are right... Terrorism is what it is... an economic embargo... is what it is also...

[Cricket]

You are right... Terrorism is what it is... an economic embargo... is what it is also...

You made my point.

When we are directly responsible for wholesale anxiety in a country by depriving them of the same trade rights that we extend to other countries, notwithstanding their own human rights records, that is economic terrorism. Take off your stars and stripes glasses for one minute and see that it is time that we acknowledge like Canada and the EU that our embargo is serving no purpose but showing us to be the big bad bully that we are.

[Overstreet]

..........The quickest way to end the regime in Cuba is to open the doors wide open, and let the cash and tourism flow in.......

My Cuban connection agrees with you.

He also says that the majority of Cubans today have grown up under Castro and don't know any different. If you are well placed you have stuff from other countries. South American and European countries don't have trade or travel embargos. They come and visit regularly.

He has relatives there that report restrictions on internet usage and any outside communications. If you get outside of the tourist areas you find the poverty. He says it is the middle class and below that are hurt by the embargo. It is time to end it.

The problem is the old timers in South Florida have some political clout and don't want it. There are some radio stations down there that campaign against Castro's Cuba every day.

[BridgeTroll]

Hey Cricket... I think I have said a number of times that the embargo has outlived its usefulness and we should negotiate a return to normal relations.  Please go back and carefully read my posts...

When we are directly responsible for wholesale anxiety

  Holy smokes... you have redefined terrorism to include "wholesale anxiety"?  Do you hear yourself?

[rjp2008]

Cuba is responsible for it's own actions! It has chosen state-controlled socialism, let it reap what it has sown. They chose to ally with the Soviets, piss us off, and continue to maintain a freedom-despising socialist state.

Socialists like the poster here now wants to bully the US to ignore the crap Cuba continues to put it's own people through. We are under no obligation to trade with them. Their misery is their own fault.

The sad thing is - if Raoul would open that country up to political freedom, allow other points of view and participation besides his own thugs, we would be right there offering concessions in return. But they won't, because control (socialism) hates free democracy.

[BridgeTroll]

For those interested in facts rather than emotional hyperbole...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_embargo_against_Cuba

The United States embargo against Cuba (described in Cuba as el bloqueo, Spanish for "the blockade") is a commercial, economic, and financial embargo partially imposed on Cuba in October 1960. It was enacted after Cuba expropriated the properties of United States citizens and corporations and it was strengthened to a near-total embargo in February 1962.

Entitled the Cuban Democracy Act, the embargo was codified into law in 1992 with the stated purpose of maintaining sanctions on the Castro regime so long as it continues to refuse to move toward "democratization and greater respect for human rights".[1] In 1996, Congress passed the Helms-Burton Act, which further restricted United States citizens from doing business in or with Cuba, and mandated restrictions on giving public or private assistance to any successor regime in Havana unless and until certain claims against the Cuban government are met. In 1999, U.S. President Bill Clinton expanded the trade embargo even further by ending the practice of foreign subsidiaries of U.S. companies trading with Cuba. In 2000, Clinton authorized the sale of certain "humanitarian" US products to Cuba.

It has been advocated that the pro-embargo Cuban-American exiles, whose votes are crucial in Florida, have swayed many politicians to also adopt similar views.[2] The Cuban-American views have been opposed by business leaders whose financial interests prompt them to argue that trading freely would be good for Cuba and the United States.[3]

At present, the embargo, which limits American businesses from conducting business with Cuban interests, is still in effect and is the most enduring trade embargo in modern history. Despite the existence of the embargo, the United States is the fifth largest exporter to Cuba (6.6% of Cuba's imports are from the US).[4] However, Cuba must pay cash for all imports, as credit is not allowed.[5]

[Cricket]

When we are directly responsible for wholesale anxiety

  Holy smokes... you have redefined terrorism to include "wholesale anxiety"?  Do you hear yourself?

Look it up yourself, my learned friend: 

Quality of causing terror: an instance or cause of intense fear or anxiety 

[ben says]

The ignorance is frightening. Anything the US State Department/US media throws at you, you buy without thinking twice.

Cuba is responsible for it's own actions! It has chosen state-controlled socialism, let it reap what it has sown. They chose to ally with the Soviets, piss us off, and continue to maintain a freedom-despising socialist state.

Socialists like the poster here now wants to bully the US to ignore the crap Cuba continues to put it's own people through. We are under no obligation to trade with them. Their misery is their own fault.

The sad thing is - if Raoul would open that country up to political freedom, allow other points of view and participation besides his own thugs, we would be right there offering concessions in return. But they won't, because control (socialism) hates free democracy.

You sound like George Bush...

We are allies with the EU, yet all those countries are state-run socialist countries...

and by the way, we are also allies with Russia, too...

[ben says]

Your right ben... we created those entities... so we could do some economic terrorism and kill babies.

Looks like you've been reading too much one-sided history.

Right back at ya baybee...

Do you know anything about the history of Al Qaeda/Taliban? Clearly not, or you would know that we funded them, groomed them, gave them weapons, had them fight a proxy war for us, etc...

Click the following link to see the Taliban in the Oval Office....

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://whitenoiseinsanity.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/reaganmeetstalibanwhitehouse.jpg&imgrefurl=http://whitenoiseinsanity.com/2009/04/20/remember-when-reagan-met-with-taliban-leaders-in-the-white-house/&usg=__A1wFuzPl0s31lkGdG_newV4WgkE=&h=499&w=750&sz=68&hl=en&start=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=nU2_6IBUFwS09M:&tbnh=94&tbnw=141&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dreagan%2Bwith%2Bthe%2Btaliban%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dsafari%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Den%26tbs%3Disch:1

[BridgeTroll]

   Right... Cricket... OK... you go right ahead and call it whatever you want...   embargo = terrorism  tomato/tomahto... potato/potahto  same thing.

Ben... Well aware of where the Taliban and al qaida came from.  I know the history and better yet... Why these things happened.  I also am fully cognizant of the context of the times... when they happened.  Something you apparently have only recently learned on the internet.

[urbanlibertarian]

End the embargo.  They almost never work and this one certainly hasn't.  Cuba will gradually become a lot more like Russia, China and Viet Nam and a lot less like North Korea.