Jacksonville-Miami rail project rejected

[thelakelander]

There is not enough money to fix everything on the Santa list. So I say, make a choice, fix downtown or fix your Jax-Miami rail system. To me, its silly to fix the prime right now, when downtown needs more help. Once downtown is thriving, it will attract more tax dollars and fed dollars to help pay for the prime.

If you don't fix downtown, you are not worthy of improving the prime and growing rail.

If the choice is mass transit or downtown, then I'd say screw downtown.  If you can develop a reliable mass transit system that connects multiple neighborhoods (including downtown), then all will benefit (again, including downtown).  On the other hand, no matter how much money you dump into downtown, if you can't successfully integrate it with the rest of the community, you're efforts will fail.  Nevertheless, this isn't a downtown or Jax-Miami rail issue.  DTs problems will have to be solved locally.  The FEC project is something involving the State and Feds.

[CS Foltz]

Well it would have helped emmensly if Johnny had started his downtown upgrade long before now! With 17 months to go, I don't see much being fully accomplished to completion other than another $23 Million Dollars out the door! I guess my next question should be........will local companies get to do the work or will we be importing again? That Court House misery offends me to no end and the prime contractor  is still collecting our money and last that I heard..........$350 Million to build! How are we to pay for this one?

[tufsu1]

The courthouse itself is $224 million...and data shows that 2/3 of the woirkers are local.

[CS Foltz]

Big fella.........do I need to remind you that the voters approved $190 Million for a new Courthouse! Last cost projections I saw said $350 Million...........I hope I am wrong! If 2/3's of the workers are local, that would mean the other 1/3 ain't from around here............hope they have their green cards!

[tufsu1]

CS...the voters approved a half-cent sales tax increase....the projects and costs were part of the backup material.

[CS Foltz]

Yep............I remember bc I voted "YES" on that half-cent sales increase............but Court House was approved for $190 Million was it not?

[Ocklawaha]

There is not enough money to fix everything on the Santa list. So I say, make a choice, fix downtown or fix your Jax-Miami rail system. To me, its silly to fix the prime right now, when downtown needs more help. Once downtown is thriving, it will attract more tax dollars and fed dollars to help pay for the prime.

If you don't fix downtown, you are not worthy of improving the prime and growing rail.

What are you smoking Mtrain? Fixing downtown is a local issue, as is the Prime Osbourne Convention Closet, while Jax - Miami rail is both State and National. Even if we could fix one or the other financially, how do we call Amtrak and tell them, no sweat man, Jacksonville's got this one. LOL!

Downtown is OUR baby, but the best way to fix it is with new investment dollars from the private sector, which in turn bumps up the tax base making infrastructure improvements easier. The best way to get those new private dollars flowing into downtown is with fixed rail mass transit in general, and streetcars in particular. Add rail and the downtown with very little direction, will fix itself.

Our only input on the Jax-Miami rail route is probably going to be our station or stations. If we can get the Prime shut down long enough to create a vibrant Jacksonville Terminal once again, we'll be in fine shape. Letting JTA go off splattering buildings and towers all over LaVilla isn't going to solve anything and will create more problems then they solve, not to mention giving the city another black eye for our "could of", "would of," "should of," habits, half built and abandoned.

In the interm, the best action plan for Jacksonville is to delay the ("JRTC") Jacksonville Terminal project until we can work with the Prime Osborne's property. Build streetcars ASAP, with local commuter rail, as a development maker. Send letters of support and lobby Congress to get not just the FEC trains, but the Dixie Flyer, Royal Palm, City of Miami, Gulf Wind, Carolina Special, all back on track.

OCKLAWAHA

[CS Foltz]

Sure thing Ock.............but getting the current Administration to get off the pot will be hard but I am game!

[tufsu1]

Yep............I remember bc I voted "YES" on that half-cent sales increase............but Court House was approved for $190 Million was it not?

not really....there were estimates for all the projects, but you didn't vote on them

[stjr]

CS, what I think Tufsu is telling us is we were sucker punched with bait and switch.  Never vote for something that doesn't have better checks and balances as we can't trust public officials to stick to the game plan.  Lesson learned.

In fairness, proposing all those projects in such a short time was a bit over the top.  I voted against the plan myself because, while I liked parts of it, I was concerned about what eventually happened:  costs exceeding estimates and projects I favored taking a back seat to ones I was against.

It would have been better to have all the designs and bids in before submitting something to the voters but I suppose that was too impractical.  The other option was to vote on smaller segments or even by project, but Delaney knew that bundling would get a lot more votes by promising a little something for everyone so that they would take the sum total to get their little piece of the action.  And, it worked.

[NthDegree]

There's no doubt in my mind that this project won't get funding if it stays on the radar.

I find this comment odd.  But being a newcomber I am quite sure I have missed some of the predispositions others already know or assume.  Would you please explain this comment to me lake?

[CS Foltz]

Well...........I trusted Delaney about as much as I trust Johnny now............I did vote for the half cent sales tax increase and from what I remember the "Court House" was on the ballot and the price was $`190 Million Dollars! If they did use bait and switch............no matter how good it sounds  or what its intentions are, I will be voting against it!

[thelakelander]

There's no doubt in my mind that this project won't get funding if it stays on the radar.

I find this comment odd.  But being a newcomber I am quite sure I have missed some of the predispositions others already know or assume.  Would you please explain this comment to me lake?

I should have said "will".  There is actually an article in this week's Jax Biz Journal about them attempting to get funding through a different source.

[vicupstate]

Well...........I trusted Delaney about as much as I trust Johnny now............I did vote for the half cent sales tax increase and from what I remember the "Court House" was on the ballot and the price was $`190 Million Dollars! If they did use bait and switch............no matter how good it sounds  or what its intentions are, I will be voting against it!

It wasn't bait and switch, it was INFLATION.  Steel and Concrete prices soared in the years after the BJP was passed.  Also, they moved the location from the current one to the new one.  That cost a lot of money but it was worth it to get the courthouse off the river.  That expense (of a new location) should have been included originally, that is my only complaint.

[NthDegree]

Thank you Lakelander. It makes much more sense now! 
I cannot understate how high a priority this Miami-Jax rail corridor is to your neighbors to the south (and beyond).
Now would be a good time for Jacksonville to, pardon the pun, jump aboard.