Q'uran Burning By Gainesville Nutcase.

[buckethead]

Piss christ? OMG a horrible slandering!

I surprised you do not see the double standard!  The "Piss Christ" was considered sacrilegious... just as a Koran burning.  Yet you seem to be indifferent about that and outraged by the burning of a few books.  Why?

No I see the double standard fine, that's my point!

How can the same people object to that but then turn around and burn qurans, call women who get abortions whores, show up at every pride rally carrying "God Hates Fags" signs, and on and on and on? WTF? Seriously? So it's only religious intolerance if it happens to them?

People are free to object to whatever they wish. The difference is that the pisschrist was publicly funded.

SD made a valid point that this church is tax exempt, but that is a bus stop short of being publicly funded.

[BridgeTroll]

BT... I used you as a theoretical example because I did not think you'd be offended. I normally use myself. Thought I'd change it up a bit.

I was not...  surprised but not offended!

[ChriswUfGator]

The level of terrorist attacks by Christian Fundamentalists is now where near the volume of terror by Islamic Fundamentalists.

Lesser volume does not dismiss the actions of Christian terrorists,  but it's nowhere near the global threat that Islamofascists present. Not even in the ball park.

BT... I used you as a theoretical example because I did not think you'd be offended. I normally use myself. Thought I'd change it up a bit.

I hope no one is interpreting my stance as supporting the reverend hayseed. I do support political/religious free speech as well as the right of others to protest when they disagree with it.

I see free speech as an absolute, but being able to say anything is not without consequence.

In fairness, that has a more to do with the unstable political environments in many muslim countries than anything else. Instability that, frankly, the UK and US are almost entirely responsible for if you trace back the roots of the issues through the 20th century. The fraudulent US intelligence and subsequent unfounded Iraq war have reeeeeeeally not helped matters either.

[BridgeTroll]

No I see the double standard fine, that's my point!

How can the same people object to that but then turn around and burn qurans, call women who get abortions whores, show up at every pride rally carrying "God Hates Fags" signs, and on and on and on? WTF? Seriously? So it's only religious intolerance if it happens to them?

Cool.  I look forward to your denunciations in the future when "left wing nutjobs" use sacrilegious symbolism to make a point.

[ChriswUfGator]

Piss christ? OMG a horrible slandering!

I surprised you do not see the double standard!  The "Piss Christ" was considered sacrilegious... just as a Koran burning.  Yet you seem to be indifferent about that and outraged by the burning of a few books.  Why?

No I see the double standard fine, that's my point!

How can the same people object to that but then turn around and burn qurans, call women who get abortions whores, show up at every pride rally carrying "God Hates Fags" signs, and on and on and on? WTF? Seriously? So it's only religious intolerance if it happens to them?

People are free to object to whatever they wish. The difference is that the pisschrist was publicly funded.

SD made a valid point that this church is tax exempt, but that is a bus stop short of being publicly funded.

That's a silly distraction from the real point here.

Gay pride rallies aren't publicly funded, yet there's always a bunch of right-wing christian nutjobs carrying "God Hates Fags" signs. All the abortion doctors who have been killed or firebombed weren't on the government payroll. Hell, the funny thing is, all that mess about 10 years ago when the conservative religo-nazis were trying to slap the 10 Commandments all over every public building, our courthouses, city halls, public parks, etc., ARE ACTUALLY PUBLICLY FUNDED.

So again, I guess it's only intolerance if it's happening TO them?

[buckethead]

My point is that tax exempt means that the tax monies shouldnt be subject to their approval if we are going to get all technical about government funding.

Except you seem to refuse to acknowledge that a congregation is comprised of individual taxpayers. The outcry over the PC was by churches AND individuals.

Are you also saying that any tax exempt group should not be allowed to seek political recourse?

[ChriswUfGator]

Are you also saying that any tax exempt group should not be allowed to seek political recourse?

"Can" doesn't = "Should" especially when these same people are the first ones to complain whenever anything happens that they consider intolerant of their faith.

[buckethead]

Piss christ? OMG a horrible slandering!

I surprised you do not see the double standard!  The "Piss Christ" was considered sacrilegious... just as a Koran burning.  Yet you seem to be indifferent about that and outraged by the burning of a few books.  Why?

No I see the double standard fine, that's my point!

How can the same people object to that but then turn around and burn qurans, call women who get abortions whores, show up at every pride rally carrying "God Hates Fags" signs, and on and on and on? WTF? Seriously? So it's only religious intolerance if it happens to them?

People are free to object to whatever they wish. The difference is that the pisschrist was publicly funded.

SD made a valid point that this church is tax exempt, but that is a bus stop short of being publicly funded.

That's a silly distraction from the real point here.

Gay pride rallies aren't publicly funded, yet there's always a bunch of right-wing christian nutjobs carrying "God Hates Fags" signs. All the abortion doctors who have been killed or firebombed weren't on the government payroll. Hell, the funny thing is, all that mess about 10 years ago when the conservative religo-nazis were trying to slap the 10 Commandments all over every public building, our courthouses, city halls, public parks, etc., ARE ACTUALLY PUBLICLY FUNDED.

So again, I guess it's only intolerance if it's happening TO them?

Gay Pride rallies have not been discontinued by the religious right. Publicly funded artwrok deemed offensive was shut down. I have no problem with people carrying "God Hates Fags" sign in protest of whatever from a free speech standpoint. I do have a problem with the content of the sign from a personal, moral standpoint.

I think dood is an idiot. His book burning stunt is indeed inflammatory and should be universally and LOUDLY denounced by those who feel the same.

What should not happen is for the government (at any level) to use force to compel him to refrain from being an idiot book burner.

We can argue the 10 commandment issue all day, but since I happen to agree with you on that, it would be silly.

[BridgeTroll]

"Can" doesn't = "Should"

Great to hear!  This should apply to our friends the "flag Burners" in this country also.  While constitutionally protected... It most certainly should not be done.  Lets spread the word!

[buckethead]

My point is that tax exempt means that the tax monies shouldnt be subject to their approval if we are going to get all technical about government funding.

Except you seem to refuse to acknowledge that a congregation is comprised of individual taxpayers. The outcry over the PC was by churches AND individuals.

Are you also saying that any tax exempt group should not be allowed to seek political recourse?

No.  Are you under the impression that politics can solve any religious conviction?

If our wall of separation between church and state prevents the governor from legislating what can be said from the pulpit, it also prevents the preacher from legislating for the rest of us.

True, unless a majority of legislators feels compelled to act based on voter sentiment. Read: Piss christ

[buckethead]

But it seems like there are people on this board that would like to make aggressively offensive attacks on religion the norm again.

Could you please point those out to me?

It has been my experience that intolerance of religion is as prevalent on the left as it is on the right. 2¢

[buckethead]

The most intolerance of religion I have seen is in the Christian right and the irreligious left.

The few Muslims I have know have seemed to be the most tolerant of others. (ironically)

[BridgeTroll]

"Can" doesn't = "Should"

Great to hear!  This should apply to our friends the "flag Burners" in this country also.  While constitutionally protected... It most certainly should not be done.  Lets spread the word!

Because the flag is a religion? um.  ok.  I guess there are people who would literally worship anything.

So that makes it OK?  It is a desecration of a symbol people hold dear.  The Bible, Torah, Koran, National Flag are powerful symbols as indicated by the outrage at this latest incident.  Desecrating or mocking them is offensive it seems... even to those NOT affiliated with the symbol.

While in SERE school(POW camp)... many years ago... We were held standing in formation for hours having not eaten or slept for hours... towards the end of this exercise an instructor pulled out a Bible... and slowly began ripping pages out, burning them, and mocking the characters within.   They did the same with the American flag.  The reactions of various participants was predictable and had it not been an exercise... they would have ended up dead.

[BridgeTroll]

The most intolerance of religion I have seen is in the Christian right and the irreligious left.

The few Muslims I have know have seemed to be the most tolerant of others. (ironically)

Having lived in a few muslim countries I can assure you religous intolerance is quite visible.  But like here... the vast majority ARE tolerant and respectful.  Reverand goofball in Gainsville no more represents christians than does osama bin laden does muslims... bin laden is probably smarter though...

[BridgeTroll]

I'm surprised that you would not see flag burning and book burning in the same light.  Most people would see both as a desecration and a morally abhorant method of making a political statement.

I'm shocked!