Ionia Street: losing its battle?

[Debbie Thompson]

I am in no way suggesting that any sort/style/template of the undistinguishable track-housing be built.  I think that it's up to the Preservation society to stritly adhere to their core principle, which is retain the value of the area.  But I think that new homes can be built, that fall in line with old-world charm and new world products.

The craftsmanship can be replicated.  The materials can be made more durable and from recycled product.  I'm not saying it's an inexpensive way to rebuild the neighborhood, just a less expensive way to do it.  

I don't like emptly lots either, but I believe that they sell better than a lot with a discarded home on it.  You keep the 'historic' value by allowing people to build 'historic' homes.  Oxymoron I know, but truth.

The craftsmanship cannot be duplicated.  "Historic" homes that are 30 days old are not historic. Does that mean historic-type homes should not be built in Springfield. No, it doesn't. But for far too long, the thinking has been, "tear down that 100 year old house and we'll put one up like it."  But the new houses are not "just like it."  For one thing, they all look alike, just as in a cookie-cutter subdivision.  It only took me 2 passes through the neighborhood before I could point out the "historic" homes versus the truly historic homes.  The wood products are not as good, because the historic homes are from old growth timber.  And, the craftsmanship is in no way similar.  The moldings and architectural detail cannot be duplicated affordably.  Not to mention, they aren't old houses.  

There are new house people and old house people.  If you are a new house people, and you can't find an already-vacant lot in Springfield to buy (there are unfortunately lots of them) then go build a "historic" home in the suburbs and leave our historic districts alone, please. :-)  We want to keep our remaining historic housing stock.

Thank goodness urban renewal never came to 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, Founder's Hall, or Notre Dame.

[iloveionia]

"Every house has a story." 
"If walls could talk."
"The greenest house is already built."

I am so proud of my little 1908 bungalow on Ionia Street.  She is a labor of love and I feel good every time I come home.  An old home in need of constant love a care is not for everyone, and that's okay, BUT, Springfield is a Nationally Recognized Historic District.  That makes it different. 

[sheclown]

1320 Ionia is going before HPC this afternoon.

[Debbie Thompson]

We need to start bringing pictures to the meetings to show the structural integrity of these houses.  Code is saying they are in bad shape. We need pictures to prove they are not in danger of falling down, or that is the perception that will exist.

[sheclown]

Debbie I agree.

But this is not a simple case of "he said" "she said". 

Code is saying these houses do not meet the requirements set forth in the statutes for minimal residential safety.  Who could argue against that?  They don't.

Preservationists claim that buildings ought not have to meet that stringent standard -- that if they do, they are all doomed.

Pictures are important.  As a building contractor with ample experience on historic properties, I will tell you one of the first things I do is look down the side of the house.  If the siding runs true and level, to me, that says a lot about how well the house is holding up. 

Even with that being said...if an exterior wall is bowed out, it can be made structurally sound once again.  If the siding runs down the house like a drunken sailor, this can also be remedied.

Pictures also give a "face" to our message.

[Debbie Thompson]

Good point, sheclown.  Besides pictures, if the house looks "wonky" we need to bring numbers. Then we can say yes, maybe the joists are bad, and the house is sagging, but it would only cost $xxxx to jack the house up and replace or sister the joists.  We need to let the HPC know what the structural repair costs are.  Sometimes, they are surprisingly affordable.

[sheclown]

Good point, sheclown.  Besides pictures, if the house looks "wonky" we need to bring numbers. Then we can say yes, maybe the joists are bad, and the house is sagging, but it would only cost $xxxx to jack the house up and replace or sister the joists.  We need to let the HPC know what the structural repair costs are.  Sometimes, they are surprisingly affordable.

I think that is a great idea.  People are often over-anxious about structural work.

It used to make me laugh that people don't blink when you give them the price for major structural repairs to their house.  Yet, to repair the delicate interior trim, makes them faint.

It is all just carpentry work. 

[buckethead]

I would suggest that structural work is often less expensive than trim when dealing with historic structures.

There is really nothing to replacing rotten, sagging or water damaged floor systems. Piece of cake.

[CS Foltz]

buckethead..........I agree! Joists and structure is easier to deal with and trying to find someone who is old school enough to replicate trims takes some real effort!

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Not completely true.  I work for a company that does just that, and it's been here since the '20s.  Just in the past year we have finished up a job in Atlanta doing restoration to the Ebenzer Church the Martin Luther Kings preached in.

We have the necessary attention to detail and ability to recreate even the most obscure trim profiles.  The cost is what people tend to frown at.  You can purchase modern (read Home Depot, Lowes) mouldings for about 1/3 of the cost of real wood, custom mouldings and installation drives the cost up as well.  We send craftsmen not production crews and you have to pay for that as well.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

If any of you are serious about getting some pricing for a remodel, you can IM me.  I'm not trying to use the boards for advertisement.

[uptowngirl]

If you have a bell, slab or basement structural costs can significantly increase. Most houses in Springfield are on piers, and are much easier and cheaper to adress.

But ya'll are correct in custom anything, especially trim work is more expensive '-)

[uptowngirl]

12th st w between Pearl and Blvd is gone. I fought hard (resulting in a nasty visit from the former ED to my personal residence) for the last remaining house on that street about three years ago, but lost the battle. It was a gorgeous little all stone bungalow but had the bad of luck of a neighbor on Pearl St (two full vacant lots away) complaining that hoodlums were using it illegally. How sad that our historical homes always end up paying for a neighbor's complaints, city policy, and an owners apathy.

[CS Foltz]

Kids............any battle requires recon work to establish boundries and axis of attack! Maybe a simple road trip through the area would establish what is and what isn't hoodlum heaven! Any home properly mothballed is not a candidate for habitation as gang central!

[KuroiKetsunoHana]

it's really not even logical to demolish a house because ov illegal activity--sure, criminals prefer to have a roof over their heads while they're doïng their thing, but a lot ov these folks aren't shy.  tear down the houses they've been using and next thing you know they'll be all up in your azaleas, smoking through your BMW's collapsible antenna.

...ov course, most ov the residents know this already.  the only reason the city doesn't is that 'illegal activity' has been the excuse used in countless vendetta complaints since before i was born.