What is America's Future?.......Destruction?

[Bostech]

Well Stephen you got it wrong.Reason United States was great because PEOPLE believed in it.Not just Americans but every person around world.
Well thats GONE.
After many people got screwed like us in ex-Yu,after housing bubble and economic collapse,after Bush and Iraq invasion people have lost fate and trust in US.
Let me compare United States to ....Tiger Wood.
great athlete,CLEAN image,everyone was looking in up to,investing their time and money...but one day everything changed and people found out Tigar is nothing but dirty cheater.
People turned back overnight,lost trust and fate in Tiger Wood.
And it will NEVER be the same.People will never look up to him again no matter how good his game is.
For Tiger Woods it was all those mistresses for US are all those wars.

[heights unknown]

Texas gone....excellent.

When it all goes down, I want to be Burgermeister of CLEVELAND!

By the way brother Heights, what do you think about the Bible Code?
http://www.bible-codes.org/why-genuine-mene-tekel-uparsin-riddles-2.htm
(This seems like a fair site)

OCKLAWAHA

Hey Ock; by the way, thanks for your insightful responses in the forum; I love it when you respond.

In all due respect I see the Bible as what it is, the literal word of God, i.e., God speaking to Mankind; so, I don't agree with the Bible codes.

God says what he means and means what he says and doesn't need to sugar coat or water anything down for us to understand.

(In all due respect)

"HU"

[NotNow]

I'm not going to bicker with you on this.  We have had this conversation ad nauseum.  Your history is suspect and your constant banging of the sarcastic, name calling, partisian drum is exactly the kind of din and noise that distracts the rest of us from our most important responsibilities.  

The US Constitution clearly and succinctly defines the authority and responsibility of the Federal Government.  Any grade schooler can read the document and the Federalist Papers (in their entirety) and see that.  No national debt does not mean no credit rating.  Referring to Alexander Hamilton and his original Bank of America has no bearing on this (and I think you know that).  All Governments borrow money for certain purposes and all have a "credit rating".  Even those that are Constitutionally bound to a balanced budget.  I even allowed for "dangers to the Republic".  (But I think you know these things too.)  

I said "the business of AMERICA is business".  YOU said "the business of the Government is business."  Check yourself.  America is us.  We conduct ourselves privately.  The Federal Government should tend to it's business, such as national defence and national infrastructure.

The rest of your argument is just noise.   I don't care if it's Al Gore, Mr. Tyson, or Jessie Ventura, if he or she is willing to honestly participate in government as written in our founding document, they have my vote.  It will take 100 Senator's and 435 Representatives and nine Supreme Court justices as well as a President to restore our government to what it should be.  It is obvious that our Federal government (all parties) is bloated, spending insanely and irresponsibly, and overstepping its Constitutional authority.  It will take HONESTY, INTEGRITY, and PERSEVERANCE on the part of the aforementioned government officials as well as from us, the citizens.  The bigger picture is how we conduct ourselves.  How we expect our State and local officials to act.  The same rules apply to all of us and we must stand up as a Nation and enforce these values on our government and each other.  Yes, that means JUDGEMENT.  That means we don't stand for the Wall Street trader who steals by falsifying records just like we don't stand for welfare frauds who steal the same way.  We expect people to take care of themselves if they can and be thankful when the rest of us take care of you.  Easy stuff.  We just need to be responsible citizens who demand the same from our public Officials.  

I think the majority of us do believe these things.  I don't think it matters who got your vote for President over the last few elections.  Basic values are just that.  If you think the Nation we have today is what you want then good for you.  I don't feel that way and I don't believe the majority of us feel that way.  We want a Nation that working and productive, honest and friendly to all, humble and soft spoken, moral and firm in belief, solvent and deliberate.  I look out and see many people living lives that are true to these values.  I want my life to be true to these values.  I want my neighbors to be true to these values.  I want my city, State, and Federal Government to be true to these values as well.  

You continue on your course and I will continue on mine.  The truth of that course is revealed within short order.

[Midway ®]

NN thank you for your original writings. It is so much better than the reprints of articles and charts and graphs posted by other ex-members, less tedious and more self revelatory.

I find the encoded subtext of your essays somewhat troubling, however.

But that's the problem with original writings. But thanks, nonetheless.

[NotNow]

I am not calling names StephenDare!, I am simply telling the truth.  

You don't need to provide me with any "tools", I have the actual document to prove my case.  Your statement:

""States Rights" is not 'strict construction' of the US Constitution.  The Constitution was established to provide federal national unity to our country.  This is the exact opposite of the States Rights argument as the creation of Federal Power must necessarily come at the expense of State Power.

There are so many fallacies involved with the claim that States Rights/Limited Government arguments are somehow Strict Constitutionalism that the mind fairly boggles.  They are literal opposites."

is just amazing.  Where did you go to school again?  Just a few things:

"The Constitution of the United States of America is the supreme law of the United States. It is the foundation and source of the legal authority underlying the existence of the United States of America and the federal government of the United States. It provides the framework for the organization of the United States government and for the relationship of the federal government to the states, to citizens, and to all people within the United States.

The Constitution defines the three main branches of government: a legislature, in the form of a bicameral Congress; an executive branch led by the President; and a judicial branch headed by the Supreme Court. The Constitution specifies the powers and duties of each branch. The Constitution reserves all unenumerated powers for the respective states and the people, thereby establishing the federal system of government."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Constitution

"The constitution defines the powers of Congress; and every power not expressly delegated to that body, remains in the several state-legislatures. The sovereignty and the republican form of government of each state is guaranteed by the constitution; and the bounds of jurisdiction between the federal and respective state governments, are marked with precision. In theory, it has all the energy and freedom of the British and Roman governments, without their defects. In short, the privileges of freemen are interwoven into the feelings and habits of the Americans; liberty stands on the immoveable basis of a general distribution of property and diffusion of knowledge; but the Americans must cease to contend, to fear, and to hate, before they can realize the benefits of independence and government, or enjoy the blessings, which heaven has lavished, in rich profusion, upon this western world. - Noah Webster October 10, 1787"

http://oll.libertyfund.org/?option=com_staticxt&staticfile=show.php%3Ftitle=669&chapter=206205&layout=html&Itemid=27

The U. S. Constitution is by definition a limit on the authority of the Federal Government.  I am shocked that an educated man would argue differently.

As for "business", Americans are free to pursue their lives in any manner that they wish.  We are not limited by "caste" or "station" and our educations and livelihoods are not mandated by our families, ranks, sex, race, or other factors, only by our abilities.  The Federal Government has no Constitutional authority and no moral authority to interfere, except in matters of national emergency and the enumerated powers.  Why is this so hard to understand?

As for your "predictions", I don't remember arguing with you about the economy.  Your criminalization of Blackwater and other civilian organizations was unfounded, as was your criminal accusations against U. S. Military troops.  Blackwater employees have not been convicted of any crimes.  I also recall bemoaning the fact that the U. S. Military was forced to use civilian contractors at all, and have consistently stated that the military should be staffed to fulfill ALL of its missions, including supply and logistics.  As for President Obama, there was never any doubt that he would win the election, was there?  I know I never said he wouldn't.  It was a race between Hillary and him from the beginning.  Outcome of the war in the Middle East...do you mean the current conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan?   Aren't we still in both countries?  

StephenDare!, when you advocate communist policies, then people will think you are a communist.  You have asked your little "communist test" several times on this forum and argued in support of its points.  I think you call yourself a "former Reagan Republican" but your actions speak louder than your words.  I don't recall calling you a terrorist sympathiser.  I don't think you are a bad person, I just think that you have found an area you feel comfortable arguing about.  

As for the truth being revealed,  yep, I'm used to it.  Honorable persons are successful and respected.  I am happy to report that all of those persons that I alluded to in my earlier post who lived the values that I believe in are successful and highly respected across the board.  Again, actions speak louder than words.  Our lives and how we have lived them say much more about us than a few words typed in the dark.


Update---Gotta add a couple of things...as for your manhood, I simply pointed out that you were criticizing those who took on the responsibility of fighting for what they believed in and supporting their country.  They risked and are risking their LIVES over a principal that you have spent many hours sitting in a coffee shop talking about or typing about.  If that challenges your manhood...sorry.  

But, I do appreciate your optimism on this thread.  It is sorely needed and I appreciate the reminder of the positive future as well.

[NotNow]

NN thank you for your original writings. It is so much better than the reprints of articles and charts and graphs posted by other ex-members, less tedious and more self revelatory.

I find the encoded subtext of your essays somewhat troubling, however.

But that's the problem with original writings. But thanks, nonetheless.

Once again, I didn't "encode" anything.  I thought I said things plainly and succinctly.  If you see some secret psychological code then you are doing what you do best....making s&%t up. If you have a valid argument, make it.  Otherwise, you are just one of the 10%.

[Johnny]

"There will be time where people will think they know everything,but they will know nothing".

The irony

So you've been talking to some of our resident atheists and deists huh?

OCKLAWAHA

Either you quoted the wrong comment or you misunderstood my post....

[NotNow]

Allright, tell me where I am wrong.  Is HU off the mark when he points out the dangerous place that our nation resides?  Are you happy with the status quo?  If not, what changes, individual, local, state, and federal are needed in your opinion? 

[Midway ®]

NN, since the assertion that 90% of the U.S. population is in agreement with your core beliefs, and that assertion is central to your argument, please offer some citation in support of your assertion.

[NotNow]

You first.  Where am I wrong?  Is HU off the mark when he points out the dangerous place that our nation resides?  Are you happy with the status quo?  If not, what changes, individual, local, state, and federal are needed in your opinion? 

[Ocklawaha]

"There will be time where people will think they know everything,but they will know nothing".

The irony

So you've been talking to some of our resident atheists and deists huh?

OCKLAWAHA

Either you quoted the wrong comment or you misunderstood my post....

No Johnny, just being my smart-ass self!

OCKLAWAHA

[Ocklawaha]

Hey Ock; by the way, thanks for your insightful responses in the forum; I love it when you respond.

In all due respect I see the Bible as what it is, the literal word of God, i.e., God speaking to Mankind; so, I don't agree with the Bible codes.

God says what he means and means what he says and doesn't need to sugar coat or water anything down for us to understand.

(In all due respect)

"HU"

Thanks brother Heights, likewise I really enjoy your caution to the wind, upfront Christian posts, and respect your views.

I think you'd find we're not all that far apart in our base beliefs, in fact I wonder how many would be willing to post what (if any) religious belief/s they were brought up in, or have converted to? No one has to do this, but it would be VERY INTERESTING from a studied viewpoint. I'll start by telling everyone, I am a PK! Yeah, bet y'all never guessed that one was coming. I grew up in the SW (Ortega) side of town and in what were then little country Baptist, and Methodist Churches. My father was also (when not playing Navy Exchange Commander) a former big band musician who then donated his free time to the churches as minister of music. Yukon, Immanuel, FBC Orange Park, FUMC Orange Park, and I think a Nazarene Church down that way long, long, ago. I became a hippie, ended up in the Vietnam Stew, got disabled, married a Colombian Franciscan Nun, and attended the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod. Now sort of "church hopping/hunting in WGV".

As for the Bible Code, or Word, I believe the Word is Divine, and inspired, I also believe the "code" is a modern revelation that is not fully understood yet, not fully developed, nor is it's intent or value been realized. We know the code has predicted several major world events down to the day, time, place, etc... I have also heard we are ALL IN IT, including name, place of birth, some basics and date of death! (I haven't gone there!) Mossad, the Israeli Intelligence Agency is reportedly using the code now, and I have heard will issue a letter admitting to such (Interesting?). The first Gulf War missile attacks and the assassination of the Prime Minister were encoded down to the second. Yet there are codes talking of World War in the same conflict with a disclaimer "Will you change it!" The stuff is simply unreal. Before anyone goes off on this, let me say so far I haven't used any Christian Sources, staying with the Israeli University's and Government studies, since if the code is real, they either convert or lose!

OCKLAWAHA

[heights unknown]

Hmm, sounds like exciting stuff Ock; and, I respect your views and excitement about the codes.  This I do know...everything that happens on the planet is contingent of the way mankind acts and our behavior and choices that we (mankind) make.  We are the guardians and overseers of this planet; the animals, and everything else is subservient to us and what we do, so, it is paramount that mankind makes the right choices; if we don't, the planet, along with ourselves as a product of our wrong choices, suffers.

"HU"

[Midway ®]

Ok;

http://www.religioustolerance.org/ev_publi.htm

There are a few things of special note on this page:

1. The polls taken of Fox News viewers are skewed as expected.
2. The higher the education, the more skewed towards evolution.

Now, I am establishing a rough equivalency between the obviously religious fundamentalist  views that are apparently at the core of this thread and the results of the polling at the attached link, because it is the closest representation that I can easily find representative polling on. If you have other data, please feel free to present it.

[NotNow]

Midway,  your usual boogeymen of Fox News and religion have nothing to do with what we were discussing.  Try to focus on the question.

Where am I wrong?  Is HU off the mark when he points out the dangerous place that our nation resides?  Are you happy with the status quo?  If not, what changes, individual, local, state, and federal are needed in your opinion?