Strider banned from SPAR building

[Karl_Pilkington]

Springfield is as lucky to have you as they were to have Propecia!

man, don't tell me that he/she whatever is not in SPR anymore?  Propecia was my favorite 8th street tranny.... damn.

[Karl_Pilkington]

I'll have to go get a 40 of OE and remember the good times!  R.I.P Propecia!

[BridgeTroll]

needed replacing anyways from the old bullet holes.

Was Vampire Improv THAT bad??

[sheclown]

Quote from: ChriswUfGator on Today at 01:55:25 PM

And how does this group get off with an orchestrated campaign to do harm to others in the first place? This is supposed to be a historical preservation group, and instead they're engaged in little more than politics, backroom dealings, and smear campaigns. I've never seen a similar organization that represents so little of the population of the area in which it operates, nor one which has managed to create so many enemies. Actions like this don't bother you on some ethical level?

This is one of the problems.  They are so focused on revenge for Strider and me that they are letting their initial and primary job get neglected.  Add this to the fact that they allow developers to seduce them into ripping down historic homes and the neglect turns to actively destroying what was their mission.

There's also a lot of talk about property values.  Many of us feel that protecting the historic fabric of the neighborhood (insuring that no more homes be torn down) comes above development-at-any-cost.

We are hoping that we can join SAMBA, especially now that we operate on Main Street, and work toward something positive.  However, should Strider end up in jail over trespassing charges, that might put a damper on our involvement.

[fsu813]

Strider,

it is comical to redirect my last unawnsered question. I'm asking the wrong question?

As a recent home buyer and as someone who knows people in general, rehab/boarding houses are not desirable and do not increase property values.

I looked at the house for sale recently that was 2 houses down from a rehab house, on Hubbard, and one of the deciding factors was "hey, i think i'd rather not live 2 houses down from a that".

to try and deflect this common sense rule of thumb is ridiculous. people generally don't want to live next to them. it's a fact. i think everyone, but you, would agree with that.

btw, i welcome a thrift store on Main, fine with me, and I have no perosnal knowledge of the history b/t SPAR & Strider, so i can only go on what i've heard. but in general, yes, i don't want any more boarding/rehab houses in my neighborhood.....we have plenty and the general consensus is the less there is in a small area, the better for values.

[nvrenuf]

Um okay, I guess we shouldn't give a shit about our property values or anything that might possibly affect them?? I'd like to get rid of the ho's and crack houses, dealers & thieving addicts too. Just because you complain about one issue doesn't mean you've forgotten the others. And if I recall the question also had to do with desirability. Do a random survey of potential homeowners, given the choice of a bunch of halfway houses or not, which would they choose?

SPAR is distributing a list of businesses that people are supposed to call and file complaints about, even when the businesses are actually operating lawfully ... SPAR's spamming COJ with bogus complaints...  SPAR's distribution of a list of businesses they don't like, while instructing people to spam COJ with complaints about them...orchestrated campaign involving a list of businesses distributed to dozens of people

Before the tar & feathers comes out, I'm not championing SPAR. I do know that I and many other residents have tried to get this list and are told the only list they have is of legal & illegal rooming houses and it will not be distributed. So who are the dozens of people getting it? Nobody here would just be spreading blasphemous rumors would they? Someone here claiming this is going on MUST have seen this list? If so, please share!! Inquiring minds want to know.

SPAR also to my knowledge has always offered to issue COJ complaints on behalf of residents who do not wish to do it themselves. So it is easy to say it is all SPAR's doing but much of it could be due to a neighbor who just doesn't like you who asks SPAR to issue the COJ ticket.

[fsu813]

oh jeez Stephen,

1) crack houses don't advertise themselves as crack houses, in fact, the more suddle and unnoticed they are the better, as far as they are concerned. rehab houses are relatively obvious. the home i referenced actually has a sign out in front of it.

2) you're right about one thing - if i thought there was a crack house 2 doors down from a house for sale, i probably wouldn't buy that one either. they BOTH are bad for values. simply stating "well, crack houses are bad for values too" doesn't mean that rehab/borading houses are not......it means they both are.

3) i would contend, as most would, that the crack houses DO, in fact, bring down values in the neighborhood. of course they do. talk to any potential home buyer. It's crazy to think otherwise. thank goodness there's not too much of that around anymore. Prostitutes bring values down as well, yes. I'm not sure where you got the notion that these various negative things haven't affected home prices.......they have. Heck, if there were no drug houses or prositutes....there would be much greater interest in the area & people wouldn't get scared off. Of course they impact values and desirability.

you would have a very difficult time arguing to anyone that rehab/boarding houses, crack houses, and prosititutes do NOT have an affect of property values.

in fact, that's mission impossible. but i hope you try!

[ChriswUfGator]

Before the tar & feathers comes out, I'm not championing SPAR. I do know that I and many other residents have tried to get this list and are told the only list they have is of legal & illegal rooming houses and it will not be distributed. So who are the dozens of people getting it? Nobody here would just be spreading blasphemous rumors would they? Someone here claiming this is going on MUST have seen this list? If so, please share!! Inquiring minds want to know.

Your position is pretty well undermined by the very fact that there even IS a "list"...

So let me ask you, what's a nonprofit historic preservation group doing keeping "lists" on people and businesses (that they don't like) in the first place? How does acting like a mini-KGB possibly fit their mission statement, or preserve any historic properties?

For the last decade, they've been consumed with B.S. like that, while 1/3 the neighborhood has been bulldozed. So if you're judging the organization's effectiveness by its succes in reaching objectives, then SPAR has utterly failed in its mission. The bottom line is that they have no business keeping "lists" in the first place. They don't even accomplish what they're supposed to do, I have a hard time understanding where they find the time to engage in all this drama. Every month there's new SPAR drama, without fail.

And just as another general proposition to toss out there, when someone's keeping a $h!t list on others, do you really think it exists to do what? Lend a helping hand? Is SPAR just intending to send a bouquet of flowers to everyone on the list, right? Wine and cheese baskets maybe? ROFL

And to answer your question, read the correspondence at the beginning of this thread, and Louise Despain's comments to Joe. It's pretty obvious what the purpose of the list is.

[fsu813]

Stephen -

Hmmmm. So when I was seriously thinking about buying the house on the corner of Hubbard and 2nd or 1st (can't remember), 2 spots down from the huge rehab house, your telling me.....what?

that i should have been afraid of the drugs, prosititutes, etc more? Well, i didn't observe it to be an issue in that vicinity, so that wasn't the issue. Living 2 doors down from the rehab house was.
hard to argue with that.


Yes, i do agree that drugs and prostituion are more of a problem than rehab/boardng houses....but they are all net negatives on the neighborhood. While drugs and prositution are extremely difficult to curb for a small community organization let alone any other agency (ask the police), rehab/boarding houses are much easier to address. I suspect that is why SPAR has pursued it - b/c they are able impact that, in fact they have (ie, the contraversy over the house on Boulevard).

And, like someone said, i know (from attending the SHADCO meetings) that SPAR is trying to impact drugs & prositutes as well.

In fact, next Tuesday, the 22nd, there is special SHADCO meeting focusing on 8th street alone.....and what can be done to address that which is condisered the most visible flaw of the neighborhood, the drugs & prositutes there. All opinions and viewpoints being heard is a good thing, as far as i'm concerned.

Since it's not a SPAR meeting, Stephen, i hope you can make it. SAMBA isn't SPAR either, so i hope you can make those meetings too. i haven't seen you at either much and i think it'd be great if you attend.

For someone who seems to be in touch with the neighborhood, I haven't seen you at very many of the neighborhood organizations or meetings at all.

Perhaps we can debate in person then, it's fun (in my opinion).

[fsu813]

ChrisUF,

SPAR does more than preservation, fyi. it's in thier name.

R = revitalization.

which can encompass many things. revitalization can include: lowering crime, increasing property values, beautifcation, supporting 'postive' ventures and being critical of ventures deemed 'negative', etc


I really wish you'd put the time, effort, and money into creating a new neighborhood group since SPAR is so poor, in your opinion.

[ChriswUfGator]

ChrisUF,

SPAR does more than preservation, fyi. it's in thier name.

R = revitalization.

which can encompass many things. revitalization can include: lowering crime, increasing property values, beautifcation, supporting 'postive' ventures and being critical of ventures deemed 'negative', etc


I really wish you'd put the time, effort, and money into creating a new neighborhood group since SPAR is so poor, in your opinion.

I no longer have any property there, though they definitely annoyed and hassled me when I did. And hearing how they continue to treat others poorly annoys me now. You're either their "kind" of people, and share their ideas, or you're excluded and treated like crap. It's been that way as long as I've been here (10 years).

As to starting a replacement organization, I think that's a great idea, but isn't that a risky proposition? I mean, have to ask whether I really want to get added to....dun...dun....dun...."THE LIST" (cue cheesy 1950's horror movie organ music).

But since you mentioned their name, then maybe someone could explain to me how acting like a mini-KGB and keeping $h!t lists on people helps preserve and revitalize? It seems to be working! I guess all those vacant lots where there were 100-year old houses 2 or 3 years ago have been "revitalized"?

[Karl_Pilkington]

I'm thinking this whole "list" affair is going to end up like this.....  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwKON8QsQoI

[AlexS]

Your position is pretty well undermined by the very fact that there even IS a "list"...

So let me ask you, what's a nonprofit historic preservation group doing keeping "lists" on people and businesses (that they don't like) in the first place?

Many organizations keep lists (both electronic and paper) for various purposes. JSO keeps lists to identify trouble spots by the number of calls pertaining to a location. Trouble spots get more attention. Maybe SPAR keeps a list for a similar purpose.

[nvrenuf]

Your position is pretty well undermined by the very fact that there even IS a "list"...

The point I'm making is no one has seen any such list, yet on here dozens of people have received it with explicit instruction on what they should do with it. Why would a Historic neighborhood group keep a list of illegal and legal fill-in-the-blank houses? Because some were grandfathered in and some were not. If a resident calls about what they think is an illegal house SPAR can tell them 1) nope, its grandfathered don't worry about it or 2) that's a potential issue and ask zoning to get involved. That seems like normal stuff.

Do they like Joe? Sure doesn't sound like it. But its quite an assumption to think they are sending out the hounds on everyone. Anyway gotta go, actually have other things to do on a Friday night.

[ChriswUfGator]

Anyway gotta go, actually have other things to do on a Friday night.

Just for the record, you do realize you posted that at 7pm on a Friday night, right? 

Were you aiming for irony, or was it unintentional?