Police State Downtown.

Started by stephendare, January 27, 2009, 04:25:47 PM

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BridgeTroll

#135
February 11, 2009, 06:26:18 PM
Both of the xray pix show people hiding weapons... Are you saying these cameras should be forbidden at airports?
In a boat at sea one of the men began to bore a hole in the bottom of the boat. On being remonstrating with, he answered, "I am only boring under my own seat." "Yes," said his companions, "but when the sea rushes in we shall all be drowned with you."

gatorback

#136
February 11, 2009, 06:30:55 PM Last Edit: February 11, 2009, 06:33:14 PM by gatorback
What does x-rays have to do with the police state downtown?  Are there x-rays downtown at this point?
'As a sinner I am truly conscious of having often offended my Creator and I beg him to forgive me, but as a Queen and Sovereign, I am aware of no fault or offence for which I have to render account to anyone here below.'   Mary, queen of Scots to her jailer, Sir Amyas Paulet; October 1586

Shwaz

#137
February 11, 2009, 06:34:33 PM
Is there documentation that these are xray camera's being installed locally?

As for the video, that was taken on private property and in fact not against the law to distribute. Unless maybe the teens were underage than it might be considered distribution of child pornography.

Also, aren't you further violating this teen couple's privacy by sharing this video with others or is fair when you're just making a point... because the police will use the video to make their point when the images become visual evidence. Quite the conundrum.    
And though I long to embrace, I will not replace my priorities: humour, opinion, a sense of compassion, creativity and a distaste for fashion.

Shwaz

#138
February 11, 2009, 06:41:07 PM
QuoteShwaz, I assume that you were unaware of this fact

I'm fully aware that on most commercial private properties I am under their watchful eye. Maybe that's why I'm not hosted on these websites doing any ridiculous.
And though I long to embrace, I will not replace my priorities: humour, opinion, a sense of compassion, creativity and a distaste for fashion.

gatorback

#139
February 11, 2009, 06:41:09 PM
Sorry...I hit the remove button...my post was:

That's staged.  Girls don't act like that.
'As a sinner I am truly conscious of having often offended my Creator and I beg him to forgive me, but as a Queen and Sovereign, I am aware of no fault or offence for which I have to render account to anyone here below.'   Mary, queen of Scots to her jailer, Sir Amyas Paulet; October 1586

gatorback

#140
February 11, 2009, 06:49:42 PM Last Edit: February 11, 2009, 07:01:40 PM by gatorback
Well, given new information I have and all that discussion above, I may just have a problem with the cams downtown. 
'As a sinner I am truly conscious of having often offended my Creator and I beg him to forgive me, but as a Queen and Sovereign, I am aware of no fault or offence for which I have to render account to anyone here below.'   Mary, queen of Scots to her jailer, Sir Amyas Paulet; October 1586

Shwaz

#141
February 11, 2009, 06:51:26 PM Last Edit: February 11, 2009, 07:03:11 PM by Shwaz
Quotewhich means that you would avoid downtown while having fun i suppose?

If I was worried about losing control of my actions and the public footage being hosted illegally on the web. Yes... but I'm not. The videos above were taken on private property.

If by chance both of these instances were to occur than I would be entitled to sue the city for defamation of character and invasion of privacy.

I'll pose the same question to you. Will the cameras stop you from having fun downtown?
And though I long to embrace, I will not replace my priorities: humour, opinion, a sense of compassion, creativity and a distaste for fashion.

gatorback

#142
February 12, 2009, 04:24:00 PM
The Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution is the part of the Bill of Rights which guards against unreasonable searches and seizures.  Are cameras a volations of this?
'As a sinner I am truly conscious of having often offended my Creator and I beg him to forgive me, but as a Queen and Sovereign, I am aware of no fault or offence for which I have to render account to anyone here below.'   Mary, queen of Scots to her jailer, Sir Amyas Paulet; October 1586

Johnny

#143
February 12, 2009, 04:36:25 PM
Quote from: gatorback on February 12, 2009, 04:24:00 PM
The Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution is the part of the Bill of Rights which guards against unreasonable searches and seizures.  Are cameras a volations of this?

No more than x-ray at the airport.

Shwaz

#144
February 12, 2009, 05:18:28 PM
QuoteNo, because they arent going to get installed.  Otherwise, yes.

Why would anyone in their right mind go out with people for drinking dancing and carousing with the guarantee that they will be filmed?

Which is my point.

You've definitely piqued my interest and have me wondering what constitutes a crazy night of partying with you esteban. I'll be up at burrito gallery around 6 call me if you're blowing it out downtown tonight before the camera's get installed. 535-1352  8)
And though I long to embrace, I will not replace my priorities: humour, opinion, a sense of compassion, creativity and a distaste for fashion.

CMG22

#145
February 12, 2009, 05:50:32 PM
Quote from: Johnny on February 12, 2009, 04:36:25 PM
No more than x-ray at the airport.

That's not fair at all.  For decades, it has been deemed that your 4th Amendment rights are not being infringed upon if you are screened at airports. In fact, in the 70s it was determined that as long as you have a right to refuse the search and leave, then you may do so.  Recently, however, if you have passed through the magnetometer and/or placed your baggage on a belt, you and it are subject to search.  United States v. Aukai, 04-10226
"Go to heaven for the climate, hell for the company."  --Mark Twain

NotNow

#146
February 12, 2009, 05:55:38 PM
As Johnny stated much, much earlier in this thread, it is a well established standard that there is no right to privacy on public streets or in public areas.  Therefore, there is no fourth ammendment block to installing cameras which observe such areas.  The question is not CAN CCTV be installed, but SHOULD CCTV be installed?
Deo adjuvante non timendum

NotNow

#147
February 12, 2009, 09:16:58 PM Last Edit: February 12, 2009, 09:19:30 PM by NotNow
Here is a discussion from California that I think logically discusses both sides of this controversy, it has good case histories and was written with real facts by people with real educations:

http://www.library.ca.gov/crb/97/05/

Morality?  Honor blood and principles?  I thought you didn't wan't to be seen partying with a 32?  Are we honoring ALL of the principles that this country was founded on?  Or just the ones we like now?
Deo adjuvante non timendum

NotNow

#148
February 12, 2009, 09:32:23 PM
And here is a link to the actual guidelines.  Of course, these do not carry any power of law and must voluntarily be adhered to:

http://www.theiacp.org/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=L8L%2BrgmpfWQ%3D&tabid=423

I still believe that more police officers on the street would be far better than a CCTV system, but as a deterrent and system of identification of suspects and evidence of criminal activity, these are a cheaper alternative.
Deo adjuvante non timendum

Johnny

#149
February 17, 2009, 10:22:47 AM
Quote from: CMG22 on February 12, 2009, 05:50:32 PM
Quote from: Johnny on February 12, 2009, 04:36:25 PM
No more than x-ray at the airport.

That's not fair at all.  For decades, it has been deemed that your 4th Amendment rights are not being infringed upon if you are screened at airports. In fact, in the 70s it was determined that as long as you have a right to refuse the search and leave, then you may do so.  Recently, however, if you have passed through the magnetometer and/or placed your baggage on a belt, you and it are subject to search.  United States v. Aukai, 04-10226

You're not required to go downtown either.

* I know I'm 5 days late on this response, but I have been busy.
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