Downtown Development Update: What's rising, what's delayed

[Ken_FSU]

So apparently there's now some kind of DIA-funded festival street project going in on the Southbank.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2026/oct/12/flagler-avenue-to-become-a-festival-street-on-southbank/

Certainly not a terrible idea, but would be nice to know how it's meant to fit into Downtown more broadly, or if the changes for adjacent transit have any impact on the usefulness of this, or even what programming is meant to make use of this space.

I read it is 800 feet long.  Will that be enough to build a robust following?  That doesn't see very long to me for this project but I guess it is a good start. Where will the parking be?

If it has success, the City needs to then revisit closing the nearby Main Street Bridge to cars and using it for pedestrians and bicyclists to cross back and forth over the river, maybe with a street market at the same time on the Northbank.  This would follow the very successful closure of the bridge (and Bay Street to the stadium) when we hosted the Super Bowl.  It was wall to wall pedestrians. 

The City claimed to learn some lessons from the Super Bowl hosting, but I have not seen a single one implemented.  Even most of the multimillion dollar bridge lights stopped working soon after, never to be fixed again. 

Closing streets on weekends is a very inexpensive way to bring vibrancy to Downtown.  Don't understand why we don't do it like so many other cities including New York and Tokyo.

It's almost like we need to engage some experts in master planning, involve the community, figure out how all these pieces work together to create a unified whole, and then plan and prioritize investment accordingly.

I'm in Tallahassee for the week doing some speaking at FSU. Every time I come back to Tally, I am astounded by how the Gaines Street Master Plan has so quickly and so completely transformed the corridor between FSU, FAMU, and the Capitol/Downtown. With no end in sight to new development. Went from warehouses and blight to a roaring, vibrant economic engine for the city in like a decade tops.

Meanwhile, we are just burning through money downtown, subsidizing random projects here and there, with no larger vision at all. I just don't get why it's so hard for the DIA to admit that a package of CRAs and TIFs stapled together with Bay Street marked over with yellow highlighter as "Nightlife?" and Laura/Hogan marked over with a green highlighter as "Restaurants?" is not a master plan.

[jaxlongtimer]

^ If we would just freeload off of other cities and copy and paste we would be well ahead of the present state.

Much of this isn't rocket science, it is execution.

Make streets safe and pedestrian friendly, line them with endless store fronts, make them attractive with some nice vegetation, park benches, trash cans, restrooms, brick pavers, public art, some mass transit running down the middle connecting to perimeter parking, have a focal point like a square, circle with fountain, historic building, stage and/or small park, and good wayfaring.  In some ways, RAM mimics much of this and that's a bunch of volunteers from the neighborhood.  No big studies, experts, Chamber trips to other cities, etc., just some plain ol' common sense about how to engage humans and keep them coming back.

With some decent zoning requirements and less money than one incentive to a developer, we could be on our way.

[Ken_FSU]

^ If we would just freeload off of other cities and copy and paste we would be well ahead of the present state.

Much of this isn't rocket science, it is execution.

Make streets safe and pedestrian friendly, line them with endless store fronts, make them attractive with some nice vegetation, park benches, trash cans, restrooms, brick pavers, public art, some mass transit running down the middle connecting to perimeter parking, have a focal point like a square, circle with fountain, historic building, stage and/or small park, and good wayfaring.  In some ways, RAM mimics much of this and that's a bunch of volunteers from the neighborhood.  No big studies, experts, Chamber trips to other cities, etc., just some plain ol' common sense about how to engage humans and keep them coming back.

With some decent zoning requirements and less money than one incentive to a developer, we could be on our way.

Preach!

It's so batty to hear City Council members saying that once the Gateway Publix is complete, our downtown has officially crossed the finish line.

Like, WHAT?

[Steve]

Two questions
1. Would Mary Street be closed at Flagler during these festival events?
2. What is the traffic count on Flagler and on Mary?
3. How will access to the Hampton Inn parking and the parking deck next to Southern Grill?

The answers will help assess what impact these festival events will have on Southbank traffic. I don't see much negative impact, unless traffic is much higher than I expect.

Waiting to see the presentation posted here.

I haven't heard of this until the Daily Record article. I mean, it's not a terrible idea. If you look at every vehicular property, all of the ones that have access from Flagler also have a DIFFERENT access point so with coordination from the properties, closing these accesses for construction and events shouldn't be a huge issue.

That said, one thing I'm seeing is that there's exactly one permanent storefront facing the property, the Southern Grill. Unless one of these garages is planning to retrofit retail or there's a plan for other development, it's going to be all temporary setups for any event.

[CityLife]

Like TUFSU said, the Flagler plan has been in the CRA Plan for awhile. DIA workshopped the idea 2 and a half years ago. Some interesting discussion here:

https://forum.metrojacksonville.com/index.php/topic,37873.msg527980.html#msg527980

I love the idea of having a festival street downtown, but it's only worth the capital investment if it is going to lead to redevelopment where the street is lined with outdoor dining and active uses. They are using Clematis Street in WPB as the model for this, but they are just not comparable. Clematis Street is lined with dining and entertainment uses for almost half a mile heading away from a large waterfront park. Right now, the uses surrounding Flagler makes redevelopment challenging. So you will likely end up with a cool street for events, but a dead zone the rest of the time.

Here's what I posted about the project when DIA originally workshopped it.

A good example of not executing at a high level is the proposed Flagler Avenue Share Street (Page 64 of presentation). I have pushed for years on here for DT Jax to develop a heavily pedestrian oriented street that is lined on both sides with outdoor seating and dining/entertainment. They even used my favorite example of this in Florida (Clematis Street) on the slide. So I respect the effort, but, Flagler Avenue between  Riverplace and Prudential can never be anything close to this. You have the Hampton Inn and Treaty Oak taking up the entire first half of the block (though I guess each could be retrofitted with street facing storefronts). Then there is a parking garage on the entire SW half of that block. Only the empty surface lot on the SE half seems ripe for storefronts. Then moving under the skyway there is a large parking garage covering the entire block adjacent to Riverplace. Unless there is something they know about those parking garages, this seems like a fruitless effort.

[acme54321]

My concern with the Flagler is that there it is surrounded by parking decks, a random interstate side model hotel, and one park.  It's just a MEH area.  What's the draw?

[Charles Hunter]

Looking at the Southbank in Google aerials, there really isn't a 'good' place for the Flagler Avenue concept. It seems like a solution in search of a problem.

>>"We wanna do this cool street-thing. Where's a couple of blocks where it won't screw up traffic?"<<

At one time (a long time ago) something similar was considered for the South Main Street under-bridge with the same limits - Prudential to Riverplace Boulevard (or maybe it was still "Gulf Life Drive"?)

As an aside - Will "Museum Circle" west of South Main be renamed to Riverplace Boulevard? There ain't no museum there no more.

[Ken_FSU]

My concern with the Flagler is that there it is surrounded by parking decks, a random interstate side model hotel, and one park.  It's just a MEH area.  What's the draw?

Just looked at the map.

Like, what are we even doing anymore?

How does this $2.5 million investment spur economic activity and growth for the Southbank? There's nothing there. And no infrastructure or storefronts to take advantage of the foot traffic.

Dare I ask who the operator of these isolated festivals will be?

This $2.5 million would be SO MUCH BETTER spent elsewhere on the Southbank. Expedite buildout of the Friendship Fountain restaurant or add the projector for the lightshow. Add some container style concession areas for Friendship Fountain or RiversEdge. Bank it for programming.

There's no reason at all for this concept to exist in this location. It helps no one. It spurs nothing. It ads nothing to the tax rolls.

It's genuinely like no one has any idea what they are doing big picture. Just tossing money at random projects here and there with no underlying strategy.

[thelakelander]

Any plans to improve San Marco Boulevard between Friendship Fountain and I-95/San Marco?

Its doesn't have to be a festive street but it can be a much better ped and bike friendly corrdor that links the riverfront and San Marco together cohesively while also connecting three major projects (e.g. Related, Haskell, Baptist Hotel).

As for festive streets, the Southbank was never a traditional part of downtown. It will take years of smart and intentional infill to change its urban street edge. Clematis would be more applicable to doing something on Laura, Adams, Forsyth, Hogan or Bay on the Northbank. Again, a master plan would really help.

[jcjohnpaint]

Not to mention the riverwalk will eventually skirt around the San Marco to Prudential. The Flagler stretch seems so random, and without considering the through-way between Doubletree and Riverplace tower to the river makes it even more isolated. Are there plans to add retail to the garages? The block including the two hotels is so suburban and dead.

[thelakelander]

There are no plans to convert those garages into retail.

[CityLife]

Does anyone remember when the Jacksonville Seafood festival was held on the Southbank Riverwalk? I can remember it happening in the 90's and being absolutely packed. I think they may have even had floating docks or barges in the calmer  portion of the river around Chart House.

Why not direct Southbank festivals to the Riverwalk? Especially with the new RiversEdge park and the newly upgraded Friendship Fountain? Friendship Fountain used to the the focal point of festival events on the Southbank.

And agree with Lake that a Clematis like festival street should be on the Northbank. Downtown's Master Plan for the Southbank in 2023 didn't even identify Flagler for anything. Look at Page 26 of the plan.  https://dia.jacksonville.gov/getattachment/dea6c0e6-f9f4-4436-beee-d1cb48608e7e/DIA-Downtown-Master-Plan-Summary_Web.pdf?lang=en-US

The Plan has a more interesting idea to to use San Marco Boulevard to Prudential as a way to connect the Riverwalk around the Acosta and expand it into San Marco.

[Charles Hunter]

Does anyone remember when the Jacksonville Seafood festival was held on the Southbank Riverwalk? I can remember it happening in the 90's and being absolutely packed. I think they may have even had floating docks or barges in the calmer  portion of the river around Chart House.

Why not direct Southbank festivals to the Riverwalk? Especially with the new RiversEdge park and the newly upgraded Friendship Fountain? Friendship Fountain used to the the focal point of festival events on the Southbank.

Longer-term plans include creating a Riverwalk gateway along Flagler Avenue,
which would be transformed through wider sidewalks, a tree canopy, lighting ARTEA
upgrades and modernized street furnishings to attract retail, dining
and nightlife.

And agree with Lake that a Clematis like festival street should be on the Northbank. Downtown's Master Plan for the Southbank in 2023 didn't even identify Flagler for anything. Look at Page 26 of the plan.  https://dia.jacksonville.gov/getattachment/dea6c0e6-f9f4-4436-beee-d1cb48608e7e/DIA-Downtown-Master-Plan-Summary_Web.pdf?lang=en-US

The Plan has a more interesting idea to to use San Marco Boulevard to Prudential as a way to connect the Riverwalk around the Acosta and expand it into San Marco.

Did you miss something? Page 26 (of the linked PDF, numbered page 48 of the report) says this about Flagler Avenue:

Longer-term plans include creating a Riverwalk gateway along Flagler Avenue,
which would be transformed through wider sidewalks, a tree canopy, lighting ARTEA
upgrades and modernized street furnishings to attract retail, dining
and nightlife.

I think jcjohnpaint touched on the Marco route of the Riverwalk.

Not to mention the riverwalk will eventually skirt around the San Marco to Prudential.

[CityLife]

^I saw that. If you look at the rendering of the Master Plan for the Southbank on page 26 it does not show Flagler as a Riverwalk connection. It just mentions future plans for Flagler in the narrative. The point was that if it was a great idea and a no brainer, it would have been on the original Master Plan like San Marco Boulevard was.

[thelakelander]

Thats private property. Hard to make future plans for land you don't own and when the land owner might not be in alignment.