The Downtown jail fallacy

[jaxlongtimer]

Some form of study by Council is set to begin. Also includes Lori Boyer's pitch on the jail site for a convention center.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2023/aug/14/city-council-special-committee-will-study-downtown-jail-police-facilities/

Based on the rendering with the article, it looks like the convention center is on the JSO HQ's site and the jail behind it is still there.  Haha.  What's that all about?

[thelakelander]

^I wouldn't get caught up on these renderings. No one even knows if a convention center is feasible at that particular location at this point. You're only setting yourself up for disappointment when this doesn't materialize.

[marcuscnelson]

The first meeting of the special committee was today.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2023/aug/16/special-city-council-committee-begins-look-at-downtown-jail-police-facilities/

[thelakelander]

There will be fight if there's a push to move the jail from the current location to LaVilla.....

If the jail and the sheriff's office were to be moved, it would cost the city hundreds of millions to do so, but there is also the question of where it would go. And it seemed a general consensus could be somewhere near the courthouse.

https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/08/16/city-council-group-considering-duval-county-jail-move-eyes-area-near-courthouse-as-possible-landing-spot/

[marcuscnelson]

Guess a lot of people here were on to something about the idea that near the courthouse would be an idea.

Doesn't mean it should go there but folks certainly had a feeling about it.

Good luck to LaVilla.

[Charles Hunter]

There will be fight if there's a push to move the jail from the current location to LaVilla.....

If the jail and the sheriff's office were to be moved, it would cost the city hundreds of millions to do so, but there is also the question of where it would go. And it seemed a general consensus could be somewhere near the courthouse.

https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/08/16/city-council-group-considering-duval-county-jail-move-eyes-area-near-courthouse-as-possible-landing-spot/

Yeah, when I read that I thought, "Uh, not only No, but Hell No!"
I could see a small pre-trial detention facility adjacent to the Court House, but only with room for a day or two's worth of court cases.

he seven-story structure is 629,000 square feet. Though it employs 384 detention deputies and about 80 civilian employees, it only has 250 parking spaces.

I really hope someone figures out that, with 3 shifts, all 464 employees are not onsite at the same time. But ... once the U2C is zipping around Bay Street, employees could park at the Stadium and ride the super duper AVs. 
OK, if there are only 2 shifts, parking could be a problem.

[fsu813]

There will be fight if there's a push to move the jail from the current location to LaVilla.....

If the jail and the sheriff's office were to be moved, it would cost the city hundreds of millions to do so, but there is also the question of where it would go. And it seemed a general consensus could be somewhere near the courthouse.

https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/08/16/city-council-group-considering-duval-county-jail-move-eyes-area-near-courthouse-as-possible-landing-spot/

Wait.... you're saying a gas station, shuttle maintenance facility, and jail aren't revitalizing LaVilla? What more do you want! They even tore down Captain Sandy's historic building,  now a beautiful vacant lot primed for infill!

[thelakelander]

^Yes, the neighborhood may as well be an urban sewer. That's the way its being treated.

[Jax_Developer]

Lol moving the jail to LaVilla would be almost as bad of a decision as placing it on the river. Pass it to the next generation seems to be a common theme here.

In my opinion, if it does move they need to move it wayy out of the way along I-10, and just pay the cost of shuttling. Doing any of this in an urban area just means we are building up and spending way more $$ than necessary.

[simms3]

https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/08/16/city-council-group-considering-duval-county-jail-move-eyes-area-near-courthouse-as-possible-landing-spot/

If the jail and the sheriff's office were to be moved, it would cost the city hundreds of millions to do so, but there is also the question of where it would go. And it seemed a general consensus could be somewhere near the courthouse.

"Yes, it's about moving the jail. But as we look at moving it, what's going to be there? Do we need more land? Is it better? I think one of the lessons that we learned is that it's probably better to go horizontal as opposed to vertical," Councilman Rahman Johnson said.

I'm just combining the emboldened thoughts above, which followed one another.  Quote: move to courthouse area and spread it out horizontally as opposed to vertically.



I just can't hold back from being nice anymore.  What the freaking hell is in our water that we have so many truly dumb people running this joint?  How can this be a trail of thought, by anyone, living here or running this town?  That makes literally no sense.  If you want the horizontal spread out jail, then move the jail way the hell out of the urban core, let alone downtown.  Otherwise, go very vertical, but this thing does not need to be super close to the courthouse.

We already let one administration screw up the street grid and take hella payment for his own Gate Concrete company.  Let the corruption games begin again for this jail move.

[Ken_FSU]

You leave town for two days on a business trip, and when you come back the city is talking about building a horizontal prison in LaVilla.

Classic Jacksonville.

We can never resist a good 50-year mistake.

Maybe the $1 billion network of clown cars be repurposed to transport prisoners when JTA finally realizes that Uber does the same thing, at more than 20 mph, at the same cost to consumers, across a wider geography, without the 10-minute headway, complicated app, and drug dealer sitting in your lap.

[landfall]

I wonder if putting the CC on the jail site is the compromise for the Hyatt to give up that parcel on Bay?

[thelakelander]

I can't image so. A convention center at the jail site does nothing for the Hyatt. Plus, for that convention center to be successful, it would need an attached hotel of its own. So all it would add to is more tax money to subsidize additional competition against a convention center hotel we've already subsidized.

[jaxjaguar]

Just put the jail on Exchange Island, no neighborhoods or people living there to offend other than the occasional kayaker. Ferry the inmates to the old Landing ramps and shuttle them to the courthouse... Then 60 years from now when it closes we'll have some good escape attempt stories and can make it a tourist attraction

[vicupstate]

I can't image so. A convention center at the jail site does nothing for the Hyatt. Plus, for that convention center to be successful, it would need an attached hotel of its own. So all it would add to is more tax money to subsidize additional competition against a convention center hotel we've already subsidized.

Wouldn't a CC at the jail site be sufficiently close to the Hyatt such that the Hyatt would be the defacto CC hotel? Especially since the Hyatt itself has convention space of its own?