Robert Montgomery: Bill Bishop the Unlikely Liberal

[theduvalprogressive]

Jeffery I'll be honest; I come from a family of Northeastern Liberal Republicans(a dead breed nowadays). My Grandfather worked for Nelson Rockefeller as an assistant and later on three campaigns along with Jacob Javitts and many others. I worked as an intern for Arlen Specter while in college still hoping that after Reagan there was a possibility that the GOP would move to the center. Once the Conservatives took over I realized there was no hope. I still, out of sentimentality, keep my registry as a Republican although most of the time I vote for Greens and Libertarians. So I can respect what you say about the FDP. There is nothing to respect about them on any level.

[JC]

There are many of us out here that will never vote for a republican.Why? It was the republican ideas rules regulation and action that caused one our countrys worst financial desasters. If any will still hold onto the title republican that mean you still subscribe to those same idea rules and regulations. Why would i vote for anyone who ideas and actions have mostly always led to a downfall for most and full pockets for a few...so. no. Im gay and a bohemian and very liberal and i would not vote for a republican for nothing in the world...when bishop trows away his title of republican.

I know this thread is not about national issues but I couldn't let this go unchecked. 

Every president in the last 30 years including Bill Clinton is the reason that the economy is shit and the American Middle Class is now the Chinese Middle Class. 

Glass Steagal was passed in 1932 by Herbert Hoover, a Republican president. 

DEFINITION OF 'GLASS-STEAGALL ACT'
An act the U.S. Congress passed in 1933 as the Banking Act, which prohibited commercial banks from participating in the investment banking business. The Glass-Steagall Act was sponsored by Senator Carter Glass, a former Treasury secretary, and Senator Henry Steagall, a member of the House of Representatives and chairman of the House Banking and Currency Committee. The Act was passed as an emergency measure to counter the failure of almost 5,000 banks during the Great Depression. The Glass-Steagall lost its potency in subsequent decades and was finally repealed in 1999.


Bill Clinton a Democrat was president in 1999 when Glass Steagall was replaced.  The repeal of Glass Steagall is credited with the financial crisis but its more than that.

"In fact, the financial crisis might not have happened at all but for the 1999 repeal of the Glass-Steagall law that separated commercial and investment banking for seven decades. If there is any hope of avoiding another meltdown, it's critical to understand why Glass-Steagall repeal helped to cause the crisis. Without a return to something like Glass-Steagall, another greater catastrophe is just a matter of time."

http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/economic-intelligence/2012/08/27/repeal-of-glass-steagall-caused-the-financial-crisis

Bill Clinton was also responsible for NAFTA, which is credited with putting the final nail in the coffin of American manufacturing. 

Its very hard to just completely blame Republicans for the financial crisis and I have never ever voted for a Republican but your argument is flawed based on the two items I posted above.

I will be voting for Bill Bishop because I believe he is being sincere when discussing the issues, I can't say the same for the other two party affiliated candidates.  He is also willing to talk about increasing taxes (which is necessary) and he does not come out anti gay or pivot when the questions are asked. 

[finehoe]

Glass Steagal was passed in 1932 by Herbert Hoover, a Republican president. 

No, it wasn't.  It was signed law by President Roosevelt on June 16, 1933.

Bill Clinton a Democrat was president in 1999 when Glass Steagall was replaced.  The repeal of Glass Steagall is credited with the financial crisis but its more than that.

True enough, but it should be noted that the law the repealed Glass-Steagall, the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act is named after three Republican legislators .

Bill Clinton was also responsible for NAFTA, which is credited with putting the final nail in the coffin of American manufacturing.

NAFTA had nothing to do with American manufacturing moving to China, which was the main cause of death of manufacturing in this country.  And to give Clinton all the credit/blame for NAFTA also isn't accurate.  The agreement was ceremonially signed in Ottawa, Mexico City and Washington on December 17, 1992 by Bush I.  Yes, the actual treaty was signed by Clinton, after being voted on in the House by 132 Republicans and 102 Democrats, and the Senate by 34 Republicans and 27 Democrats.

... your argument is flawed based on the two items I posted above.

Flawed argument countered with flawed facts?

[JC]

A separate 1932 law also known as the Glass–Steagall Act is described in the article Glass–Steagall Act of 1932./

Who was president from march 1929 to march 1923?

And yes, you are correct NAFTA is the north american free trade act and I should have parsed the two issies which have occurred in the last three decades but the point of my argument stands which is that regardless of party affiliation any and every president can fuck up the economy, as demonstrated by Bill Clinton.

[finehoe]

every president can fuck up the economy, as demonstrated by Bill Clinton.

Average economic growth of 4.0% per year, compared to average growth of 2.8% during the previous years. The economy grew for 116 consecutive months, the most in history.

Creation of more than 22.5 million jobs—the most jobs ever created under a single administration, and more than were created in the previous 12 years. Of the total new jobs, 20.7 million, or 92%, were in the private sector.

Economic gains spurred an increase in family incomes for all Americans. Since 1993, real median family income increased by $6,338, from $42,612 in 1993 to $48,950 in 1999 (in 1999 dollars).

Overall unemployment dropped to the lowest level in more than 30 years, down from 6.9% in 1993 to just 4.0% in January 2001. The unemployment rate was below 5% for 40 consecutive months. Unemployment for African Americans fell from 14.2% in 1992 to 7.3% in 2000, the lowest rate on record. Unemployment for Hispanics fell from 11.8% in October 1992 to 5.0% in 2000, also the lowest rate on record.

Inflation dropped to its lowest rate since the Kennedy Administration, averaging 2.5%, and fell from 4.7% during the previous administration.

The homeownership rate reached 67.7% near the end of the Clinton administration, the highest rate on record.

The poverty rate also declined from 15.1% in 1993 to 11.8% in 1999, the largest six-year drop in poverty in nearly 30 years. This left 7 million fewer people in poverty than there were in 1993.

The surplus in fiscal year 2000 was $237 billion—the third consecutive surplus and the largest surplus ever.

If only more presidents would fuck up the economy like that.

[JC]

every president can fuck up the economy, as demonstrated by Bill Clinton.

Average economic growth of 4.0% per year, compared to average growth of 2.8% during the previous years. The economy grew for 116 consecutive months, the most in history.

Creation of more than 22.5 million jobs—the most jobs ever created under a single administration, and more than were created in the previous 12 years. Of the total new jobs, 20.7 million, or 92%, were in the private sector.

Economic gains spurred an increase in family incomes for all Americans. Since 1993, real median family income increased by $6,338, from $42,612 in 1993 to $48,950 in 1999 (in 1999 dollars).

Overall unemployment dropped to the lowest level in more than 30 years, down from 6.9% in 1993 to just 4.0% in January 2001. The unemployment rate was below 5% for 40 consecutive months. Unemployment for African Americans fell from 14.2% in 1992 to 7.3% in 2000, the lowest rate on record. Unemployment for Hispanics fell from 11.8% in October 1992 to 5.0% in 2000, also the lowest rate on record.

Inflation dropped to its lowest rate since the Kennedy Administration, averaging 2.5%, and fell from 4.7% during the previous administration.

The homeownership rate reached 67.7% near the end of the Clinton administration, the highest rate on record.

The poverty rate also declined from 15.1% in 1993 to 11.8% in 1999, the largest six-year drop in poverty in nearly 30 years. This left 7 million fewer people in poverty than there were in 1993.

The surplus in fiscal year 2000 was $237 billion—the third consecutive surplus and the largest surplus ever.

If only more presidents would fuck up the economy like that.

Are you kidding me right now? 

Do you truly believe that the long term impact of policies adopted under the Clinton Administration are not attributable to him? 

I am not going to cut and paste shit back and forth with you.  The fact of the matter is that the income gap has increased tremendously since the 1980s, wages have been stagnant since the 1970s and the US has hemorrhaged manufacturing jobs since the late 1990s.  Clinton's policies had everything to do with that. 

[mtraininjax]

Whatever Bill Bishop was selling on March 24, all of Jacksonville was not buying it.

[Jax native]

Whatever Bill Bishop was selling on March 24, all of Jacksonville was not buying it.

Actually about 17 % believed in Bill Bishop.  But it looks like you are hell bent on pounding him in every single thread tonight, so I'll let you be.  All the negative comments are surely the way to get people on board with your ideas.  Right?

[JC]

Whatever Bill Bishop was selling on March 24, all of Jacksonville was not buying it.

I think that many people did not have a chance to hear about or from Bill Bishop. The first time I heard him speak was on NPR and the other two times I saw him was during the debate. By that point I had already seen a TON of negative ads from Curry. I think that if more people were informed about him and his ideas he would have done better.

I also think that if he would have made stuff up and promised more spending without explaining how it was going to be paid for he would have done better.

Maybe this is me being arrogant but I feel like people who voted for Curry were uninformed or were tricked in some way because his arrogance, negativity and empty promoses seemed obvious to me. Where as Bill Bishop seemed to have a very honest approach and was willing to keep politically unpopular items on the table such as raising taxes to pay for the pension.

[vicupstate]

every president can fuck up the economy, as demonstrated by Bill Clinton.

Average economic growth of 4.0% per year, compared to average growth of 2.8% during the previous years. The economy grew for 116 consecutive months, the most in history.

Creation of more than 22.5 million jobs—the most jobs ever created under a single administration, and more than were created in the previous 12 years. Of the total new jobs, 20.7 million, or 92%, were in the private sector.

Economic gains spurred an increase in family incomes for all Americans. Since 1993, real median family income increased by $6,338, from $42,612 in 1993 to $48,950 in 1999 (in 1999 dollars).

Overall unemployment dropped to the lowest level in more than 30 years, down from 6.9% in 1993 to just 4.0% in January 2001. The unemployment rate was below 5% for 40 consecutive months. Unemployment for African Americans fell from 14.2% in 1992 to 7.3% in 2000, the lowest rate on record. Unemployment for Hispanics fell from 11.8% in October 1992 to 5.0% in 2000, also the lowest rate on record.

Inflation dropped to its lowest rate since the Kennedy Administration, averaging 2.5%, and fell from 4.7% during the previous administration.

The homeownership rate reached 67.7% near the end of the Clinton administration, the highest rate on record.

The poverty rate also declined from 15.1% in 1993 to 11.8% in 1999, the largest six-year drop in poverty in nearly 30 years. This left 7 million fewer people in poverty than there were in 1993.

The surplus in fiscal year 2000 was $237 billion—the third consecutive surplus and the largest surplus ever.

If only more presidents would fuck up the economy like that.

The fact of the matter is that the income gap has increased tremendously since the 1980s, wages have been stagnant since the 1970s and the US has hemorrhaged manufacturing jobs since the late 1990s.  Clinton's Trickle down economic policies had everything to do with that. 

Fixed it for you.

Finehoe, I'm sure you are aware facts don't matter to the right, but thanks for posting the truth for those that actually believe there are two sides to every argument.

[finehoe]

The fact of the matter is that the income gap has increased tremendously since the 1980s, wages have been stagnant since the 1970s....  Clinton's policies had everything to do with that.

So your saying his policies had everything to do with issues that began long before he was ever in office.  Okay.

[JC]

The fact of the matter is that the income gap has increased tremendously since the 1980s, wages have been stagnant since the 1970s....  Clinton's policies had everything to do with that.

So your saying his policies had everything to do with issues that began long before he was ever in office.  Okay.

No, what I am saying is what I have been saying all along.  Regardless of who has been in office since the 70's we have been going in the wrong direction, the evidence of that is very clear.  You can offer your lopsided opinion of Clinton's economic policy all you want, I really don't care because the truth is obvious to anyone who spends 10 minutes googling about the increased income gap, stagnant wages and the slow death of the American middle class. 

[finehoe]

I really don't care

Apparently you do.  No one mentioned Clinton's policies until you brought it up.  Yes, it's undeniable that since the early 70s there has been an  increased income gap, stagnant wages and the dissipation of the American middle class.  However, the facts show that these trends slowed during the Clinton administration, so to single him out as a major cause of these phenomenon is not only historically inaccurate, it shows willful ignorance.

[JC]

And here we go, full circle.  I mentioned Clinton because NAFTA is part of the problem and so was the repeal of Glass Steagall.  I used these two issues to drive the point home because the poster I was responding to said he would not vote for a Republican based on their economic policies.  Democrats who are beholden to corporate interests are not immune to hurting the American people, just like Republicans.   

Your posts and shit attitude toward me scream troll and I am done feeding you.