Bring Home The USS Adams To Downtown Jacksonville

[Kerry]

To Kerry's point, and to Dan Bean's credit, this was always a grass roots only initiative.  The city never stepped in, kept changing the rules, and bogged down the process with bureaucracy.  Also, local industry, and the local good old boy power structure never got behind it.  The cost would have been a rounding error for CSX, Fidelity National, EverBank, and all the rest.  Not to mention Khan.  What Dan did should be applauded.  And the city should be embarrassed.

I'm glad you brought up the total lack of corporate support.  I've lived in a lot of places and I have never seen a corporate base so removed from the community as the one here in Jax is.  Outside of Florida Blue I am hard pressed to find any overly generous corporations in Jax.  In many cities companies are falling over each other to get their name into the public domain and help build up their community - if for no other reason than they compete with other companies in the region for employees.

I don't know if companies aren't interested or they just aren't being asked.

[marcuscnelson]

To Kerry's point, and to Dan Bean's credit, this was always a grass roots only initiative.  The city never stepped in, kept changing the rules, and bogged down the process with bureaucracy.  Also, local industry, and the local good old boy power structure never got behind it.  The cost would have been a rounding error for CSX, Fidelity National, EverBank, and all the rest.  Not to mention Khan.  What Dan did should be applauded.  And the city should be embarrassed.

I'm glad you brought up the total lack of corporate support.  I've lived in a lot of places and I have never seen a corporate base so removed from the community as the one here in Jax is.  Outside of Florida Blue I am hard pressed to find any overly generous corporations in Jax.  In many cities companies are falling over each other to get their name into the public domain and help build up their community - if for no other reason than they compete with other companies in the region for employees.

I don't know if companies aren't interested or they just aren't being asked.

I will say that more recently, Vystar seems to be stepping up to the plate. Between moving downtown, buying a name on the Arena, and sponsoring events like the Lantern Parade, they're certainly doing better than most.

[downtownbrown]

All Dan Bean ever needed was 2 or 3 million bucks. A pittance in the scheme of things.

[vicupstate]

To Kerry's point, and to Dan Bean's credit, this was always a grass roots only initiative.  The city never stepped in, kept changing the rules, and bogged down the process with bureaucracy.  Also, local industry, and the local good old boy power structure never got behind it.  The cost would have been a rounding error for CSX, Fidelity National, EverBank, and all the rest.  Not to mention Khan.  What Dan did should be applauded.  And the city should be embarrassed.

As far as the city goes, this sounds like passive-aggressive behavior on their part to kill it without looking like the bad guy by just saying 'No'.   

[Snaketoz]

I could care less about getting an old, worn out ship.  I'd much rather have a real destination attraction.  Just think about it.  If you lived up in the Midwest and was thinking of travelling south, what would you choose?  An outdated old rust bucket, or Disney World, Epcot, Universal, etc.  We are just too close to the Orlando area to squander money on a ship.  How about a Six Flags type attraction, a spruced-up beach, or a nice aquarium?  Botanical gardens?

[Kerry]

We can't 'out Orlando' Orlando.  The problem with Jax is we try to hit a grand slam with every at-bat when we really just need to focus on getting on base - be it a hit, walk, or being hit by a wild pitch.  Jax needs momentum to get things rolling and that is something City leadership doesn't want to focus on.  We want to go to the World Series without ever winning a game. In my opinion it is because each Mayor only has 4 years to make a splash.  We aren't going to conceive, plan, fund, and build an aquarium or anything else in a 4 year time period.  If I had one wish for Jax it would be to cut the number of Council Seats in half and move to a City Manager government.

[vicupstate]

If I had one wish for Jax it would be to cut the number of Council Seats in half and move to a City Manager government.

What good would cutting the council seats do?
   
A City Manager only does what the Mayor and Council tell him or her to do.

Take the term limits off the Mayor's office, make it non-partisan and that would be a big step in the right direction. Ranked Choice Voting would be great also, but that is pretty progressive for a city like JAX.     

[Kerry]

I don't want to stray into that topic.

[Snaketoz]

I don't want to be Orlando either.  What I want is something for the area folks to be proud of, and keep us home.  Nice to show off to visitors too.

[Kerry]

I don't want to be Orlando either.  What I want is something for the area folks to be proud of, and keep us home.  Nice to show off to visitors too.

I can certainly appreciate that desire.  Jax is lacking a signature show piece.  Go to any model center in a new subdivision around Jax and look at the marketing photos they have on the walls.  They don't show sprawling subdivisions and strip shopping centers (which is 99.9% of Jax) - they show The Landing, Friendship Fountain, and the Town Center - even if their subdivision is 25 miles from those things.  Those are our best show pieces - a has-been shopping center, a broken fountain, and a fake town center.

We have an amazing river flowing through downtown and we do practically nothing with it because we are waiting on the silver bullet project - Lot J, Shipyards, The District, a new convention center, or whatever the next great idea was.  Hell, it is been nearly 30 years and we are still waiting for the intangibles to come to fruition for landing an NFL expansion team.

The Adam's would have been the first significant publicly accessible improvement to the Jax waterfront in over 30 years and the City took a pass on it.  Go figure.  Hell's bells - we even built our cruise terminal out in the middle of nowhere instead of near downtown and I don't want to hear any nonsense about downtown being to far from the ocean - the Tampa cruise terminal is 35 miles from open water, Mobile is 30 miles, and New Orleans is well over 100 miles.

[thelakelander]

The cruise terminal situation deals more with modern ships not being able to get under the Mathews and Hart Bridges. Neither Mobile or New Orleans have that issue and the Sunshine Skyway's air draft clearance is 180', restricting Tampa's future.

[Kerry]

A cruise ship doesn't have to go all the way to downtown although it would be nice if it could.  American Cruise Lines does dock downtown but they have a much smaller vessel.

[downtownbrown]

I don't want to be Orlando either.  What I want is something for the area folks to be proud of, and keep us home.  Nice to show off to visitors too.

That's what the Adams would have been. To a lot of folks, it's not an old rust bucket, but I won't get into history and service.  The point is it shouldn't be either/or downtown.  It should be this/AND that. 


Kerry once again is 100% right. Just get on base.

[thelakelander]

A cruise ship doesn't have to go all the way to downtown although it would be nice if it could.  American Cruise Lines does dock downtown but they have a much smaller vessel.

^I was just providing a little historical background perspective to that particular observation.  I don't recall anyone seriously claiming DT was too far from the ocean and that's how it ended up not being closer to downtown. Years ago, the old Ford plant off Talleyrand was considered because that was as far as you could get a large cruise ship close to the core. As ships have grown, the feeling is that the current terminal is also restricted in long term growth due to the Dames Point Bridge. This was a major reason Jaxport tried moving it to Mayport.



With that said, there's nothing stopping smaller vessels from docking downtown, if that's the market niche they want to pursue.

[Kerry]

Downtown or Mayport - it is just another example of local leadership asleep at the wheel.  4,000 people a week coming to Jax from all over the country and we do nothing to cater to them and their dollars.  We don't offer a single shore excursion for them to partake in while they are here - not a single one.  Last I looked Tampa had something like 20 offered that a tourist could book through the criuse ship or a travel agent.

I've watched 300 high networth senior citizens get off the American Cruise Line ship downtown and then wonder aimlessly around looking for something to do.  Again, not a single shore excursion for them to partake in.  If I had a boat I would sure as heck offer some kind of tour for $50 or $60 per person.

Btw - the American Cruise is between $3500 and $6000 per person - so you know the people aboard have money to spend.