A New Look for Avondale's St. Johns Village Project

[ProjectMaximus]

^lol, thanks Lake!

[JeffreyS]

I would like it you could visit the restaurant from the water by boat.  When they dredge the creek a couple of boat slips or just tie ups would be fantastic.  I don't love the surface lot by the street just a bit more of the retail fronting the street would add a lot of pedestrian feel.

[fieldafm]

I don't love the surface lot by the street just a bit more of the retail fronting the street would add a lot of pedestrian feel.

I don't mind that so much.  While it would be preferential for the setback to hug the sidewalk I can a) certainly appreciate the desire for potential residents to be closer to the waterfront instead of St Johns b) it appears there will be far less surface parking than the current buildings c) it appears there will be an opening that invites pedestrians to the waterfront area so there are some sight lines preserved of the water (the only sight lines of Fishweir now is the gap caused by the large surface parking lots seperating St Johns Village from the Commander, which isnt necessarily an appealing spectacale).

I think the bigger pressing issue from a design standpoint is how the as-yet undetermined parking garage portion of the development will interact at the pedestrian level. 

[thelakelander]

Yeah, I'm not crazy about that surface parking lot but it's a challenging site and the opposition from many, makes things a bit more difficult.  I also think the largest issue is the as-yet undetermined parking garage design.  That's a building that can make or break the site and everything surrounding it.  A highly interactive green space/plaza at the intersection could possibly have the ability to spread redevelopment opportunity in the vicinity.

[Cheshire Cat]

Is the picture beginning this thread of what the view on the street would be or from the water?

[InnerCityPressure]

^

There are (very difficult to see) docks in that photo, so that would be a view from the water

[grimss]

I can never figure out how to insert an image, but the link to a view from St. Johns is here: http://wp.me/a3uUEJ-78

[thelakelander]

view from the creek:


view from St. Johns Avenue:

[If_I_Loved_you]

Councilman Jim Love will host a Town Hall / Mediation meeting on Wednesday, July 17th, 2013, to discuss the St. Johns Village project / PUD and site plan (Legislation # 2013-341 & 2013-342).  The meeting location and time have changed. The  meeting will now be held at the FSCJ / Kent Campus Auditorium (Park St. at Blanding Blvd.) from 7:00 pm to 8:30 pm. Representatives of the St. Johns Village development, nearby residents, and other interested parties are invited to attend
For more information, please contact:

KEVIN KUZEL
EXEC ASSISTANT
JIM LOVE / CITY COUNCILMAN
JAX-FL / DISTRICT 14
(904) 630-1677
(904) 710-7992 (cell)

http://commander-rezoning.com/2013/06/11/town-hall-meeting-scheduled-for-july-17/

[Cheshire Cat]

Thanks guys!

[JeffreyS]

Anyone live blogging?

[I-10east]

Not sure people really understand what the word 'progress' means.

'Progress' meant tearing down the Holiday Inn City Center for the Federal Courthouse, but yet many people bitched about that. I guess that beauty is in the eye of the beholder concerning old buildings.

[thelakelander]

Anyone live blogging?

I didn't live blog but I did attend most of the meeting.  In short, the crowd, represented by RAP, the neighborhood just north of the Commander and Fishweir, believe the scale of what's shown is too large and dense for the neighborhood.  While praising the development team for working with the community, they'd like the developer work within the confines of what the overlay allows and not attempt to change the site's land use to accommodate higher density.

[tayana42]

Issues of concern: 
1. Intensity of the development is too high for the neighborhood.
2. Mass of project makes it impossible to transition to HDR when adjacent to HDR; that's undesirable.
3. Developer wants to change the land use for one-half of the land to the highest density in Duval County, HDR.  There is plenty of HDR land already designated in the county that is undeveloped.  The Comprehensive plan notes that the 74 acres exceed the projected need for HDR land for the next 20 years.  The developer could build on any of some 50 undeveloped but designated HDR parcels that are available.  A number of appropriate sites exist in the city core.
4.  An HDR land use change, according the the comprehensive plan, should be within 1/2 mile of an existing or proposed rapid transit stop.  The land is not within that distance.  Furthermore, the parcel is served by a single 2-lane road with no bicycle lanes  ins the neighborhood.
5. There is little public benefit offered by this proposed development; the kayak launch is pointless without both dredging of the creek to make it navigable, and dedicated parking for vehicles with kayaks with a public access route to/from the launch.
Developer wants a huge land use change, wants an exception to not adhere to the setback rules, wants an exception to the Zoning Overlay to exceed the maximum height (150' vs 60' permitted), wants to dramatically exceed the footprint limits, and wants to drop the $800,000.00 contribution to dredging the creek, without which, the creek is a silted mud flat most of the time.
Let's hope we see something better next round.   

[thelakelander]

3. Developer wants to change the land use for one-half of the land to the highest density in Duval County, HDR.  There is plenty of HDR land already designated in the county that is undeveloped.  The Comprehensive plan notes that the 74 acres exceed the projected need for HDR land for the next 20 years.  The developer could build on any of some 50 undeveloped but designated HDR parcels that are available.  A number of appropriate sites exist in the city core.

From what I understood last night, the developer is a part of a team where the actual land owner wants to redevelop this particular under utilized parcel they already own.  They're already invested in this property.  Going elsewhere isn't going to resolve the issue of doing something with the Commander/St. Johns Villas site.

With that said, what's the community's vision for that area? Is it a situation of where everyone is fine with status quo or are there desired things that the redevelopment of this property can help deliver to the area?

5. There is little public benefit offered by this proposed development; the kayak launch is pointless without both dredging of the creek to make it navigable, and dedicated parking for vehicles with kayaks with a public access route to/from the launch.

There is the potential for great public benefit.  For Avondale, benefit could be this development being an anchor that pulls the pressure of commercial infill from other areas of heated debate and popularity, like right up the street (Shoppes of Avondale). 

Another potential benefit is better public access to the creek and river, in a neighborhood where most of the waterfront access is private.

Another public benefit is that if this thing is designed right, it could anchor redevelopment of the commercial district along Herschel, south of Fishweir Creek.  However, I guess this could be a pro or con depending on the person and if they desire more commercial development in the area.

Developer wants a huge land use change, wants an exception to not adhere to the setback rules, wants an exception to the Zoning Overlay to exceed the maximum height (150' vs 60' permitted)

I haven't followed this project as much as many of you have but I did like Wayne Wood's suggestion of seeing what could be designed onsite, under the rules of the existing overlay.  I know our comp plan is pretty suburban in nature but it will be good to see what the variation is between what's proposed and what would be allowed if no land use change was given.