Jacksonville investor on Downtown: 'They’re still in the Dark Ages'

[thelakelander]

Not everyone is willing to throw their money into downtown at this point...

“There’s an almost imponderable number of variables you have to deal with,” Gonzales said. “There’s very little clarity into the future. I’m not Promethean. So when you go Downtown, you have to presume a Renaissance, and they’re still in the Dark Ages.”

full article: http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/blog/2013/06/jacksonville-investor-on-downtown.html

[Intuition Ale Works]

Love this quote

“There are too many events that have to occur that I’m not in control of,” he said, “but one of them would have to be some insightful and judicious leadership from our politicians.”

[ronchamblin]

Not everyone is willing to throw their money into downtown at this point...

“There’s an almost imponderable number of variables you have to deal with,” Gonzales said. “There’s very little clarity into the future. I’m not Promethean. So when you go Downtown, you have to presume a Renaissance, and they’re still in the Dark Ages.”

full article: http://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/blog/2013/06/jacksonville-investor-on-downtown.html

Additional quotes from Biz Journal:

"Well, I asked Gonzales, what would change your mind?"

“There are too many events that have to occur that I’m not in control of,” he said, “but one of them would have to be some insightful and judicious leadership from our politicians.”

Wonder what Gonzales had in mind..... specifically?  I agree that there is a high probability that any emergence from the "Dark Ages" in the core could be sparked by some "right" actions from some of our politicians.  If this is actually true .... and if the right actions are indeed possible.... I wonder why the actions don't occur ... that is, given the obvious need for action?

What conditions or habits are preventing the decisions and actions necessary to cause or force what we could call a renaissance in the urban core?     

[Cheshire Cat]

Ron I wonder the same thing.  It would have been helpful for him to addressed some of the things he thinks need changing to create the "right" environment.  For instance, we all know we need more insightful and judicious leaders, no argument there, but what other things are red flags to him?

[spuwho]

Some, not all use the the Jacksonville market to get further established and reach a level of equity to leverage their opportunity into another market, or into a larger property.

With the recent "blood bath" in mid-tier commercial properties like this, some pension funds, investment funds, or hedge funds that have foreclosed on prior owners or LLC's, are finally disposing of these assets now that the market is starting to sort out, but before new inventory gets built out.

Not sure what Mr. Gonzales has in mind long term, but he seems to have other real estate investment vehicles out there to work the market along with his wife.

Acord Centurion LLC
Acorn Deerwood 1 LLC
Acorn Lakeside LLC
Acorn Family Limited Partnership I and II LLP
900 Regency Square Corporation
Acorn Daytona LLC
Acorn Ridge Lending
Acorn Ridge
Coral Kote International

[ronchamblin]

Please allow me a little venting.

I'm becoming increasingly disappointed in individuals like Gonzales, not intending to pick on him personally of course, but some of these fellows obviously have some cash, and the ability to borrow.  Unfortunately the comfortable fellows, with the money to engage investment, seem unwilling to take the urban core risk.  I find myself disappointed and even angered by the repeated decisions by investors and businesses to avoid the core...... to take the easy routes ....to remain unwilling to engage the challenge of the core. 

Risk is a valid factor to consider of course, but I sense that we’ve in our era, and our northeast Florida environment, too many comfortable fellows who seem to lack the balls and the vision to do anything but take the easy routes ... routes which stabilize with mediocrity in the suburbs .... when they could achieve high marks and make great changes if they would “initiate” a renaissance in the core instead of waiting for somebody else to do it.  Get a vision and take a little risk fellows.

Although there are some bold and innovative investors and movers and shakers in northeast Florida, our area seems to be infected with too many comfortable and moneyed fellows who have no balls, vision, or desire to make Jacksonville what it could and should be.

I feel better now.   

   

 

[Cheshire Cat]

Please allow me a little venting.

I'm becoming increasingly disappointed in individuals like Gonzales, not intending to pick on him personally of course, but some of these fellows obviously have some cash, and the ability to borrow.  Unfortunately the comfortable fellows, with the money to engage investment, seem unwilling to take the urban core risk.  I find myself disappointed and even angered by the repeated decisions by investors and businesses to avoid the core...... to take the easy routes ....to remain unwilling to engage the challenge of the core. 

Risk is a valid factor to consider of course, but I sense that we’ve in our era, and our northeast Florida environment, too many comfortable fellows who seem to lack the balls and the vision to do anything but take the easy routes ... routes which stabilize with mediocrity in the suburbs .... when they could achieve high marks and make great changes if they would “initiate” a renaissance in the core instead of waiting for somebody else to do it.  Get a vision and take a little risk fellows.

Although there are some bold and innovative investors and movers and shakers in northeast Florida, our area seems to be infected with too many comfortable and moneyed fellows who have no balls, vision, or desire to make Jacksonville what it could and should be.

I feel better now.   
   

I agree Ron and I am glad you feel better. 

[Cheshire Cat]

Some, not all use the the Jacksonville market to get further established and reach a level of equity to leverage their opportunity into another market, or into a larger property.

With the recent "blood bath" in mid-tier commercial properties like this, some pension funds, investment funds, or hedge funds that have foreclosed on prior owners or LLC's, are finally disposing of these assets now that the market is starting to sort out, but before new inventory gets built out.

Not sure what Mr. Gonzales has in mind long term, but he seems to have other real estate investment vehicles out there to work the market along with his wife.

Acord Centurion LLC
Acorn Deerwood 1 LLC
Acorn Lakeside LLC
Acorn Family Limited Partnership I and II LLP
900 Regency Square Corporation
Acorn Daytona LLC
Acorn Ridge Lending
Acorn Ridge
Coral Kote International

I would say that without knowing what he has in mind, it is a bit difficult to take his statements about us being in the dark ages as anything more than an easy swipe at Jacksonville.  With insight and investment perhaps he could help move the city away from the "dark ages".  Looks to me like he is still willing to invest in some areas of our expansive stone age habitat.  lmao  Perhaps he will consider us once we more efficiently learn how to use the "wheel". 

[fsquid]

Please allow me a little venting.

I'm becoming increasingly disappointed in individuals like Gonzales, not intending to pick on him personally of course, but some of these fellows obviously have some cash, and the ability to borrow.  Unfortunately the comfortable fellows, with the money to engage investment, seem unwilling to take the urban core risk.  I find myself disappointed and even angered by the repeated decisions by investors and businesses to avoid the core...... to take the easy routes ....to remain unwilling to engage the challenge of the core. 

Risk is a valid factor to consider of course, but I sense that we’ve in our era, and our northeast Florida environment, too many comfortable fellows who seem to lack the balls and the vision to do anything but take the easy routes ... routes which stabilize with mediocrity in the suburbs .... when they could achieve high marks and make great changes if they would “initiate” a renaissance in the core instead of waiting for somebody else to do it.  Get a vision and take a little risk fellows.

Although there are some bold and innovative investors and movers and shakers in northeast Florida, our area seems to be infected with too many comfortable and moneyed fellows who have no balls, vision, or desire to make Jacksonville what it could and should be.

I feel better now.   

   

why do that when there is easy money to make.

[vicupstate]

Why criticize this guy for saying the same thing that everyone else says on this forum.  He is saying he would be foolish to invest in the core until the leadership of the city shows that they actually have a clue.  Can't argue with that.

The fact that the city is even considering cutting down the trees and taking out the benches in Hemming Plaza, or letting anyone and everyone build the most suburban designs imaginable in the core, and not lifting a finger to preserve historic buildings in the core or Springfield, is pretty damning evidence that the city leaders still don't have a clue as to what it takes to create an urban renaissance.     
   

[spuwho]

Why would a commercial property firm be interested in the urban core when all he has done is develop suburban type office centers?

(Rhetorically) Do you think someone who can buy existing sub or ex-urban properties, repaint them and call them lease ready would have an interest in dealing with the varied requirements of working in an urban setting?

- Preservation
- Historicals
- Zoning
- Code compliance
- Parking (think Landing here)
- Access to amenities
- Tech aware layouts

and still price it competitively on a psf basis?

I would like to guess that this is where he believes Jacksonville is in the "dark ages". No cohesive planning or strategy about how the urban core should be laid out.  And when we do try to lay out plans, we nit pick it to death until all the special interests have walked over it and end up where we started in the first place.

Only those who have power along with their wealth are willing to deal with this. (ie: Shad Khan)

Those who fall well below Mr. Khan in either just simply will make their money elsewhere. Why go through the hassle?

[Tacachale]

This is the kind of announcement that irks me to the core. He manages to cast aspersions on Downtown without identifying one concrete thing that would make him more "comfortable" in investing there. It could be that he'd invest in downtown if some reasonable positive changes were made, or it could be that he'd never consider anything but cheap suburban office parks as a worthy investment. Weak, weak, weak.

[ronchamblin]

Good question fsquid. .”Why do that when there is easy money to make?”
And makes sense spuwho… “Those who fall well below Mr. Khan  in either, just simply will make their money elsewhere.  Why go through the hassle?”

The goal of making easy money, while giving little or no thought to issues and consequences related to the process, is the American Way…. as taught by the momentum of bimbo brained thinking in the media and most other institutions over many decades.  Yes, anything for maximum profit, no matter the consequences for society, the environment, the working class or, in our case, the suffering urban core.

As recent history has shown, the elite wealthy amongst us, in their quest to be worth more than perhaps their current “twenty million”, will do anything to become worth “twenty billion”, including engaging in practices which ultimately destroy our economy and the ability of the working class to make a survivable living.  The thought process they engage is that of greed, a crime which goes unpunished simply because it is not officially on the books, and because the process of engaging in actions of greed are hidden in criminal activity, the prosecution of which is prevented by bimbo brained, bought, and corrupt politicians, lawyers, and judges.

Easy money?  Fine to seek.  However, every time someone takes the easy route to obtain maximum profit or wealth, as offered by the bimbo thinking “American Way”, we lose in those areas where real work is needed,  where real sacrifice is needed, and where real gains are to be had, gains which stay for many decades, and do not disappear or decline as in a yacht, or multiple homes, or aircraft , or boasting to one's fellow moneyed elites.

Any investment has components of risk and potential gain, with valuable peripheral gains often not seen by the investor, gains which can be made for the urban core.  Investment decisions in northeast Florida made without regard for the needs of our urban core only shows the weakness of the investor, the shallow intentions, the obsession with easy money, an unwillingness to perform real work, an unwillingness to sacrifice, an unwillingness to be concerned for the health of the core, and therefore all citizens of the county who would benefit if it is allowed to emerge to health and vibrancy.   

Yes… Mr. Kahn  is “up there” with the wealth, and therefore has some power.  But regarding the realm of the urban core, I cannot be impressed with him until he takes the real challenge in northeast Florida, which is that of using his wealth and power to force the urban core past the barrier of stagnation.  Is it his responsibility to “revitalize the core”?  Certainly not.  But let’s not shower excessive praise until there is reason for it.  The Jaguars is one thing.  The shipyard development is another.  Both are perhaps sure and easy money makers.  The degree to which the “300 foot television” and the swimming pool will positively affect the revitalization of the urban core is unknown at this point.  One can always “say” that the $40 million or so taxpayer investment in the stadium will be well invested.  But, will it actually “be” a good investment for the city?  Or will it be another form of the boondoggle? 

How many boondoggles have the citizens of Jacksonville engaged?  That’s another story. 

Any objective or goal can be conquered if persistent correct decisions are made regarding it. Apparently, over several decades, not enough people in and around the core have consistently make the right decisions regarding the goal of urban renewal â€" and perhaps some have made decisions obstructing the goal.

Instead of seeking the easy money in the suburbs, maximum profits at all costs, and 300 foot bimbo lights in the stadium….how about quality and long term vision regarding the urban core and its impact upon north east Florida, how about real concern… how about real commitment to worthy goals…. how about real sacrifice…. how about real work…how about something different?
 

[Cheshire Cat]

Why criticize this guy for saying the same thing that everyone else says on this forum.  He is saying he would be foolish to invest in the core until the leadership of the city shows that they actually have a clue.  Can't argue with that.

The fact that the city is even considering cutting down the trees and taking out the benches in Hemming Plaza, or letting anyone and everyone build the most suburban designs imaginable in the core, and not lifting a finger to preserve historic buildings in the core or Springfield, is pretty damning evidence that the city leaders still don't have a clue as to what it takes to create an urban renaissance.     
   

Exactly Vic, he is doing what "everybody" else does!  Perhaps we have become too used to hearing these criticisms and allowing or agreeing with them without question.  I stated in my response to his post that we all well know the need for political change.  That however is a national problem and not exclusive to Jacksonville.  No news here, but when someone disses Jacksonville as in the dark ages without listing valid reasons or sharing a single idea to change what is "wrong" or offer any "solutions" to the perceived problems it's nothing more than casting dispersions without any desire to do the work to create change. 

I think we in Jacksonville need to stop the habit of so readily believing things will not and cannot change when so many, including a bunch of folks on this forum, are working so hard to better things.  If the person doing the criticizing will not buy into change or solutions, I frankly have no patience with their view about a lacking city.   Just my opinion.

[JeffreyS]

Silly article, Let's ask a sprawlville investor to talk about downtown.