Paul Ryan "OMG"

[avonjax]

"Class warfare" is the pet phrase of the right wing.

[fsquid]

"Class warfare" is the pet phrase of the right wing.

At this point it is.  When Reagan was in office it was the pet phrase of the left. 

[mtraininjax]

"Class warfare" is the pet phrase of the right wing.

Actually it is what President Obama is waging right now, anyone with a brain realizes that he is demonizing the people who are successful and asking them to pay more, to subsidize support for the middle class and poor.  What happened to the "We're all in this together" stump speech from 2008? If we are all in this together, we should all pay for the debt. Not just those who have been more successful.

I look at it fairly simply, if a single person has income of 1 million dollars and pays 15% capital gains on the interest they receive, instead of a W2, they pay $150,000 in taxes. As opposed to a single person who makes $50,000 and is in the 25% tax bracket and pays $12,500 in taxes. So the millionaire is paying more than 10x the taxes as the middle class person. But that is not enough for the President, he wants to tax all revenue at the tax bracket level. Penalize the people who have built success to subsidize the country.

Screw it, just go with a flat tax and we all pay the same. That is the "We're all in this together" solution!

[ChriswUfGator]

What absurd logic.

You say it should be fair, and then somehow conclude that paying less because you make more fits the definition. Taxes are a percentage of your income, nobody cares whether the CEO of AT&T is paying more in total dollars than the waitress down the street. What matters in terms of fairness is the percentage each gives. Comparing total dollars paid is apples to pomegranates, since the two don't make the same amount of money.

I've heard that absurd argument a few times now, it's disingenuous and self-serving. Somehow income inequality makes it fair for the person with more income to pay a lower share of it in taxes. Yeah, ok.

[carpnter]

"Class warfare" is the pet phrase of the right wing.

Actually it is what President Obama is waging right now, anyone with a brain realizes that he is demonizing the people who are successful and asking them to pay more, to subsidize support for the middle class and poor.  What happened to the "We're all in this together" stump speech from 2008? If we are all in this together, we should all pay for the debt. Not just those who have been more successful.

I look at it fairly simply, if a single person has income of 1 million dollars and pays 15% capital gains on the interest they receive, instead of a W2, they pay $150,000 in taxes. As opposed to a single person who makes $50,000 and is in the 25% tax bracket and pays $12,500 in taxes. So the millionaire is paying more than 10x the taxes as the middle class person. But that is not enough for the President, he wants to tax all revenue at the tax bracket level. Penalize the people who have built success to subsidize the country.

Screw it, just go with a flat tax and we all pay the same. That is the "We're all in this together" solution!

A single person having an adjusted gross income of $50,000 (which is after all deductions are claimed) does not pay $12,500 in taxes.  Using the 2012 tax tables they pay the following:
10% on the first $8,700  which is $870
15% on the next $26,650 which is $3,997.50
25% on the next $14,650 which is $3662.50  (the next threshold actually goes to $85,650 but we can stop at $50k)
Which totals $8,530 in taxes and about 2/3 of the $12,500 you are using. 

When a person is married and they are filing jointly the tables change and the income thresholds change.

[mtraininjax]

You say it should be fair, and then somehow conclude that paying less because you make more fits the definition. Taxes are a percentage of your income, nobody cares whether the CEO of AT&T is paying more in total dollars than the waitress down the street. What matters in terms of fairness is the percentage each gives. Comparing total dollars paid is apples to pomegranates, since the two don't make the same amount of money.

Who said life was fair? Who said you are entitled to anything? The only thing you are given at birth is the ability to convert Oxygen into Carbon Monoxide, the rest, is up to you, as an individual. Entitlements are a joke!

A single person having an adjusted gross income of $50,000 (which is after all deductions are claimed) does not pay $12,500 in taxes.  Using the 2012 tax tables they pay the following:
10% on the first $8,700  which is $870
15% on the next $26,650 which is $3,997.50
25% on the next $14,650 which is $3662.50  (the next threshold actually goes to $85,650 but we can stop at $50k)
Which totals $8,530 in taxes and about 2/3 of the $12,500 you are using. 

Thanks for the info, I am not a CPA, but I know the argument well, penalize those who use a lower tax rate on the interest income received, instead of receiving a salary. The issue is clear class warfare. Penalize the successful and give the money to the lazy sons of beeches who are in entitlement soup!

[finehoe]

I know the argument well, penalize those who use a lower tax rate on the interest income received, instead of receiving a salary. The issue is clear class warfare.

You're certainly right about that.  Making people who actually work for a living pay a higher percentage of their income in taxes than those who do nothing productive and just sit back and live off income derived from economic rents is clearly class warfare.  War on the lower- and middle-classes by the one percent.

[fsquid]

I know the argument well, penalize those who use a lower tax rate on the interest income received, instead of receiving a salary. The issue is clear class warfare.

You're certainly right about that.  Making people who actually work for a living pay a higher percentage of their income in taxes than those who do nothing productive and just sit back and live off income derived from economic rents is clearly class warfare.  War on the lower- and middle-classes by the one percent.

then lobby to get rid of the capital gains tax or dividend tax.  Wouldn't be the smartest thing to do, but that would be a way to do it.

[carpnter]

A single person having an adjusted gross income of $50,000 (which is after all deductions are claimed) does not pay $12,500 in taxes.  Using the 2012 tax tables they pay the following:
10% on the first $8,700  which is $870
15% on the next $26,650 which is $3,997.50
25% on the next $14,650 which is $3662.50  (the next threshold actually goes to $85,650 but we can stop at $50k)
Which totals $8,530 in taxes and about 2/3 of the $12,500 you are using. 

Thanks for the info, I am not a CPA, but I know the argument well, penalize those who use a lower tax rate on the interest income received, instead of receiving a salary. The issue is clear class warfare. Penalize the successful and give the money to the lazy sons of beeches who are in entitlement soup!

One other thing to note, interest is taxed as normal income not as a capital gain.  Capital gains come from things like the sale of stocks, bonds, real estate.   
Here is a wiki that explains it better than I can.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_gains_tax_in_the_United_States

[finehoe]

One other thing to note, interest is taxed as normal income not as a capital gain.  Capital gains come from things like the sale of stocks, bonds, real estate.

This is true.  However, dividends are taxed at the same rate as capital gains.  Which doesn't change my point above.

[finehoe]

then lobby to get rid of the capital gains tax or dividend tax.  Wouldn't be the smartest thing to do, but that would be a way to do it.

I don't think it should be gotten rid of.  I believe it should be raised to equal the tax rate on a wage or salary.  Why should you be taxed less just because you don't do any actual work?

[avonjax]

"Class warfare" is the pet phrase of the right wing.

Actually it is what President Obama is waging right now, anyone with a brain realizes that he is demonizing the people who are successful and asking them to pay more, to subsidize support for the middle class and poor.  What happened to the "We're all in this together" stump speech from 2008? If we are all in this together, we should all pay for the debt. Not just those who have been more successful.

I look at it fairly simply, if a single person has income of 1 million dollars and pays 15% capital gains on the interest they receive, instead of a W2, they pay $150,000 in taxes. As opposed to a single person who makes $50,000 and is in the 25% tax bracket and pays $12,500 in taxes. So the millionaire is paying more than 10x the taxes as the middle class person. But that is not enough for the President, he wants to tax all revenue at the tax bracket level. Penalize the people who have built success to subsidize the country.

Screw it, just go with a flat tax and we all pay the same. That is the "We're all in this together" solution!

You are delusional if you really believe that. It is fact that a flat tax would be harmful to the poor. It galls so many right wingers when the poor don't pay the same taxes as those who are better off.  When all of you have to try to survive while earning wages that are below the poverty line you may then say what you want. Until then you know nothing of what you speak.

[carpnter]

One other thing to note, interest is taxed as normal income not as a capital gain.  Capital gains come from things like the sale of stocks, bonds, real estate.

This is true.  However, dividends are taxed at the same rate as capital gains.  Which doesn't change my point above.

Only "qualified dividends" are taxed at the capital gains rate.  Otherwise they are taxed as normal income.  It really is a confusing mess.  The tax code is in dire need of simplification.

[bill]

then lobby to get rid of the capital gains tax or dividend tax.  Wouldn't be the smartest thing to do, but that would be a way to do it.

I don't think it should be gotten rid of.  I believe it should be raised to equal the tax rate on a wage or salary.  Why should you be taxed less just because you don't do any actual work?

Because that money has already been taxed. 

[avonjax]

You say it should be fair, and then somehow conclude that paying less because you make more fits the definition. Taxes are a percentage of your income, nobody cares whether the CEO of AT&T is paying more in total dollars than the waitress down the street. What matters in terms of fairness is the percentage each gives. Comparing total dollars paid is apples to pomegranates, since the two don't make the same amount of money.

Who said life was fair? Who said you are entitled to anything? The only thing you are given at birth is the ability to convert Oxygen into Carbon Monoxide, the rest, is up to you, as an individual. Entitlements are a joke!

A single person having an adjusted gross income of $50,000 (which is after all deductions are claimed) does not pay $12,500 in taxes.  Using the 2012 tax tables they pay the following:
10% on the first $8,700  which is $870
15% on the next $26,650 which is $3,997.50
25% on the next $14,650 which is $3662.50  (the next threshold actually goes to $85,650 but we can stop at $50k)
Which totals $8,530 in taxes and about 2/3 of the $12,500 you are using. 

Thanks for the info, I am not a CPA, but I know the argument well, penalize those who use a lower tax rate on the interest income received, instead of receiving a salary. The issue is clear class warfare. Penalize the successful and give the money to the lazy sons of beeches who are in entitlement soup!

It is statements like this that make the right wingers and tea baggers despicable to me. There are those lazy sob's that are in the "entitlement soup," but there are hard working, decent people, many that are forced to be in that "entitlement soup."
If there wasn't so much freakin' greed in our world today, there would be less people in that "entitlement soup."
And yes greed runs all the way down the socioeconomic chain.
So if you're going to hang that tag on everyone in need you get absolutely no respect from me on anything you have to say.
When you meet the fate of so many hardworking people and are suffering their plight. Check back.
Until then..........I won't say it.