Is the JRTC a Mistake in the Making?

[BigGuy219]

^ the problem with that theory is a vast majority of people in Jacksonville probably see no need for the JRTC or transit at all.

as for the Greyhound Station, Mr. Blaylock told me last week that Greyhound really wants to be on Adams St..so they can get right onto I-95 NB....of course, never mind that being on Forsyth St would give them direct access from I-95 NB

I anticipated that someone would jump on the 'Greyhound really wants to be...' line of reasoning via FDOT/JTA. REALLY? I'm an old Jacksonville intercity bus supervisor and spoke with the president and CEO of GLI. He told me in no uncertain terms that GREYHOUND IS NOT DRIVING THIS THING, FDOT AND JTA ARE.

Tacachale, something EVERY citizen of Jacksonville should know is once you allow a disconnected intercity bus terminal to be built, blocks away from the side of any train, connectivity is gone. What purpose is a Transportation Center if it is not to make a trip from New York to Gainesville palatable? Amtrak to Jacksonville and Greyhound to Gainesville. Once you insert 'Gator City Taxi' between the two, you no longer have a transportation center.

Greyhound's Jacksonville ridership is around 3,200,000 annually, Amtrak is a lightweight by comparison.

I'm going to say this with every ounce of my transit pundit heart and soul, BUILD THIS STATION AND THE JRTC COLLAPSES FROM AN INTERCITY TRANSFER HUB, TO A GOOD PLACE TO CATCH A BUS TO HEMMING PLAZA!

Mayor Brown? KILL THIS PROJECT. Consolidate the entire station into the old railroad terminal, the JRTC should be the surface hub of a 4 state region somewhat larger then LaVilla.

OCKLAWAHA

Are people really coming to Jacksonville from New York via Amtrak?

I've traveled from NYC to JAX twice in the past 45 days and flew both times.

I hate flying. I sit there clinging to the arm rests, with white knuckles, and grit teeth. It is one of the worst experiences in my life.

Since relocating to Jacksonville everytime I wanted to go back to NY I tried to get Amtrak tickets, and they were often 2 or 3 times the cost of my airline tickets.

Am I doing something wrong? I just don't see many people taking the train down if they can fly for half the price and 1/10th the time.

[BigGuy219]

^ the problem with that theory is a vast majority of people in Jacksonville probably see no need for the JRTC or transit at all.

as for the Greyhound Station, Mr. Blaylock told me last week that Greyhound really wants to be on Adams St..so they can get right onto I-95 NB....of course, never mind that being on Forsyth St would give them direct access from I-95 NB

I anticipated that someone would jump on the 'Greyhound really wants to be...' line of reasoning via FDOT/JTA. REALLY? I'm an old Jacksonville intercity bus supervisor and spoke with the president and CEO of GLI. He told me in no uncertain terms that GREYHOUND IS NOT DRIVING THIS THING, FDOT AND JTA ARE.

Tacachale, something EVERY citizen of Jacksonville should know is once you allow a disconnected intercity bus terminal to be built, blocks away from the side of any train, connectivity is gone. What purpose is a Transportation Center if it is not to make a trip from New York to Gainesville palatable? Amtrak to Jacksonville and Greyhound to Gainesville. Once you insert 'Gator City Taxi' between the two, you no longer have a transportation center.

Greyhound's Jacksonville ridership is around 3,200,000 annually, Amtrak is a lightweight by comparison.

I'm going to say this with every ounce of my transit pundit heart and soul, BUILD THIS STATION AND THE JRTC COLLAPSES FROM AN INTERCITY TRANSFER HUB, TO A GOOD PLACE TO CATCH A BUS TO HEMMING PLAZA!

Mayor Brown? KILL THIS PROJECT. Consolidate the entire station into the old railroad terminal, the JRTC should be the surface hub of a 4 state region somewhat larger then LaVilla.

OCKLAWAHA

Are people really coming to Jacksonville from New York via Amtrak?

I've traveled from NYC to JAX twice in the past 45 days and flew both times.

I hate flying. I sit there clinging to the arm rests, with white knuckles, and grit teeth. It is one of the worst experiences in my life.

Since relocating to Jacksonville everytime I wanted to go back to NY I tried to get Amtrak tickets, and they were often 2 or 3 times the cost of my airline tickets.

Am I doing something wrong? I just don't see many people taking the train down if they can fly for half the price and 1/10th the time.

hmm.  I just checked tickets and from nyp (Penn Station, NYC) to Jax is 125 round trip, leaving on my birthday, september 28. 

Are plane tickets really only 32 dollars each way from NYC?

Stephen I just checked on Amtrak for this Friday and got quoted $426 roundtrip (which was twice my last roundtrip airfare gotten through Priceline).

If I'm doing something wrong or if there's a train discount site, I'd really like to know, because I genuinely hate flying ... but $416 is too much.

[JFman00]

Jetblue roundtrip for the weekend of Sep 28th is 50 bucks less than Amtrak.

[BigGuy219]

To me, this is even more disturbing.

TRAIN
Friday, August 10
JAX to NYP ... $213; 20 hr, 35 min
Source: Amtrak.com

BUS
Friday, August 10
Jacksonville Express to New York Express ... $95 (advanced purchase); 19 h, 48 minutes
Source: Greyhound.com

So the bus is faster then the train now?

[JFman00]

strange, but when I just searched on Jetblue, they were 100 bucks each way, plus tax and airport fees.  the total price for round trip was 260 something.

On Amtrak, the round trip price was a flat 125.  So flying is 135 dollars more round trip than amtrak.

Jetblue, round trip JFK-JAX leaving 28 SEP returning 1 OCT.

Fare:
$178.00 x 1 = $178.00
Taxes & Fees
$21.60
Total:
$199.60

Amtrak, same thing:


Friday, September 28, 2012
91 Silver Star  (NYP  -  JAX)

Depart: 11:02 am, Fri, Sep 28, 2012
Arrive: 6:55 am, Sat, Sep 29, 2012
Duration: 19 hr, 53 min
Amenities
1 Adult
$125.00

1 Reserved Coach Seat


Subtotal   $125.00

Monday, October 1, 2012
98 Silver Meteor  (JAX  -  NYP)

Depart: 5:08 pm, Mon, Oct 1, 2012
Arrive: 11:06 am, Tue, Oct 2, 2012
Duration: 17 hr, 58 min
Amenities
1 Adult
$125.00

1 Reserved Coach Seat


Subtotal   $125.00

Total $250.00

[BigGuy219]

To me, this is even more disturbing.

TRAIN
Friday, August 10
JAX to NYP ... $213; 20 hr, 35 min
Source: Amtrak.com

BUS
Friday, August 10
Jacksonville Express to New York Express ... $95 (advanced purchase); 19 h, 48 minutes
Source: Greyhound.com

So the bus is faster then the train now?

you should travel by bus!  Problem solved!  you save 20 minutes!

And $125ish!

You may be on to something.

In April I took Greyhound from Jacksonville to Miami and it was very pleasurable. Comfortable seats. Phone chargers. Food stops. Highly recommended.

I got a promotional rate and I believe my ticket was $10!

[BigGuy219]

To me, this is even more disturbing.

TRAIN
Friday, August 10
JAX to NYP ... $213; 20 hr, 35 min
Source: Amtrak.com

BUS
Friday, August 10
Jacksonville Express to New York Express ... $95 (advanced purchase); 19 h, 48 minutes
Source: Greyhound.com

So the bus is faster then the train now?

you should travel by bus!  Problem solved!  you save 20 minutes!

And $125ish!

You may be on to something.

In April I took Greyhound from Jacksonville to Miami and it was very pleasurable. Comfortable seats. Phone chargers. Food stops. Highly recommended.

I got a promotional rate and I believe my ticket was $10!

I will never willingly ride greyhound bus again in my life.  Some people don't seem to mind it, but I hated it. Crowded, uncomfortable seats, no way to walk around, and most of the customers seemed to be just released prisoners when I was going west.

Now the Green Tortoise Line was a different matter altogether.  http://www.greentortoise.com/adventure.travel.html

Stephen, have you tried it since they rebranded their image with the 'Express' service and improved busses?

It's worth a second look!

[Bativac]

I will never willingly ride greyhound bus again in my life.  Some people don't seem to mind it, but I hated it. Crowded, uncomfortable seats, no way to walk around, and most of the customers seemed to be just released prisoners when I was going west.

This! This! A THOUSAND TIMES THIS!!!

[finehoe]

Train vs. Plane going to NYC:

Keep in mind that all three major airports in the NYC region are not that close to the city, and it will cost you in both time and coin to travel between them and Manhattan. The train on the other hand will drop you off right into the heart of midtown.  Plus you can carry as much luggage as you want onto the train, and you don't have to arrive extra early to go through security.  Something to consider.

[BackinJax05]

^^Hopefully one day the train will drop passengers off in the heart (or perhaps bowels) of downtown here, too.

[Ocklawaha]

We the people still don't get it. Train travel shines in the 200-400 mile markets, ergo one doesn't ride the train to New York, they ride to Savannah, Orlando, Tampa, Charleston, Fayetteville, Raleigh etc. Those trips ARE served by a minuscule Miami-JAX-New York fleet of Amtrak trains.

So yes one CAN ride from JAX to New York, or from NYC to Miami, and if one knows how to travel (the true meaning of the word is to sojourn) it can be a very pleasurable experience. The song no longer applies... Harry would be proud.


GREYHOUND LYRICS
The Late Great Harry Chapin

It's midnight at the depot
And I drag my bags in line.
Travellin' light, I got to go
But the bus won't be on time.
Everybody's looking half alive.
Later on the bus arrives.

They punch my ticket
I find a seat
And we move out past the lights.
Come on Driver, where's the heat?
It's cold out in the night.
I keep telling to myself that I don't care.
Come tomorrow, I'll be there.

Take the Greyhound.
It's a dog of a way to get around.
Take the Greyhound.
It's a dog gone easy way to get you down.

Frankly I find the bus and the train quite nice, and yes BIG GUY, the new PREVOST motor coaches are heads and shoulders above any other coach manufacturer. PREVOST CAR has long been the primo brand in the industry, and they know how to make passengers happy. Greyhound took a huge step when it abandoned it's own former subsidiary MCI (Motor Coach Industries) for a massive PREVOST CAR order. PREVOST merged with Volvo, a long time EU coach manufacturer just a couple of years back.

The Prevost H345, is not your fathers bus!

[BackinJax05]

We the people still don't get it. Train travel shines in the 200-400 mile markets, ergo one doesn't ride the train to New York, they ride to Savannah, Orlando, Tampa, Charleston, Fayetteville, Raleigh etc. Those trips ARE served by a minuscule Miami-JAX-New York fleet of Amtrak trains.

So yes one CAN ride from JAX to New York, or from NYC to Miami, and if one knows how to travel (the true meaning of the word is to sojourn) it can be a very pleasurable experience. The song no longer applies... Harry would be proud.


GREYHOUND LYRICS
The Late Great Harry Chapin

It's midnight at the depot
And I drag my bags in line.
Travellin' light, I got to go
But the bus won't be on time.
Everybody's looking half alive.
Later on the bus arrives.

They punch my ticket
I find a seat
And we move out past the lights.
Come on Driver, where's the heat?
It's cold out in the night.
I keep telling to myself that I don't care.
Come tomorrow, I'll be there.

Take the Greyhound.
It's a dog of a way to get around.
Take the Greyhound.
It's a dog gone easy way to get you down.

Frankly I find the bus and the train quite nice, and yes BIG GUY, the new PREVOST motor coaches are heads and shoulders above any other coach manufacturer. PREVOST CAR has long been the primo brand in the industry, and they know how to make passengers happy. Greyhound took a huge step when it abandoned it's own former subsidiary MCI (Motor Coach Industries) for a massive PREVOST CAR order. PREVOST merged with Volvo, a long time EU coach manufacturer just a couple of years back.

The Prevost H345, is not your fathers bus!

It does look nice, Ock. Personally I'd like to see a Greyhound with these features on a Senicruiser.

[Pinky]

strange, but when I just searched on Jetblue, they were 100 bucks each way, plus tax and airport fees.  the total price for round trip was 260 something.

On Amtrak, the round trip price was a flat 125.  So flying is 135 dollars more round trip than amtrak.

Jetblue, round trip JFK-JAX leaving 28 SEP returning 1 OCT.

Fare:
$178.00 x 1 = $178.00
Taxes & Fees
$21.60
Total:
$199.60

Amtrak, same thing:


Friday, September 28, 2012
91 Silver Star  (NYP  -  JAX)

Depart: 11:02 am, Fri, Sep 28, 2012
Arrive: 6:55 am, Sat, Sep 29, 2012
Duration: 19 hr, 53 min
Amenities
1 Adult
$125.00

1 Reserved Coach Seat


Subtotal   $125.00

Monday, October 1, 2012
98 Silver Meteor  (JAX  -  NYP)

Depart: 5:08 pm, Mon, Oct 1, 2012
Arrive: 11:06 am, Tue, Oct 2, 2012
Duration: 17 hr, 58 min
Amenities
1 Adult
$125.00

1 Reserved Coach Seat


Subtotal   $125.00

Total $250.00

20 hours?!?  In a coach seat???   Vs a two hour flight that costs less?   Seriously?  20 hours in a coach seat?  Without even getting into the value of my time, please someone help me understand why anybody (other than someone terrified of flying or a Train Fetishist) would ever do that.  TWENTY HOURS IN A SEAT. 

[BackinJax05]

I would. However, I can't stand flying AND I have a train FETISH - not Fetishist

My dream 3some: ACL 1504, C&O 614, & me buried underneath em!

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

Pinky, you do realize that you can get out of your seat and walk to the bar on the train, right?

Rocking side to side, drinking whiskey, 2 hours of drinking 18 hours of enjoying every inch of that seat in coach.