The S-Line: The Key To Urban Economic Revitalization?

[thelakelander]

Looking for something else but just came across another S-Line shot.  This image was taken looking north along the S-Line at Kings Road in 1955.  The stacks of the 5th & Cleveland incinerator can been seen rising in the background.


State Archives of Florida, Florida Memory, http://floridamemory.com/items/show/52863

[Ocklawaha]

Nice shot of the old crossing watchman's tower. Those were built to standard railroad plans, from a book of plans issued by each company. The tower still standing is pretty cool too because you can see that automatic light signals have been installed at the crossing. I remember well when the crossings at Yukon, Ortega Farms, Ortega Hills etc. were protected by a simple crossbuck on a wooden post.

RAILROAD CROSSBUCK SIGN

I also remember when a McCalls? Heating Oil Fuel Truck got crosswise of 'The City of Miami' at the south Ortega Hills Crossing.  The truck and it's driver were scattered half way to Yukon and weirdly the drivers blood stained bible was found draped over one of the rails.  The idiots on the 5 O:clock news said the driver was rushed to the hospital where he was pronounced dead.  If they rushed him anywhere it was in so many mayonnaise jars. There was no fire but the truck and driver literally exploded in a million pieces. Thank God we have better crossing protection today.

[thelakelander]

It took me a while to figure out where this shot actually was.  Everything in that image has either been pulled up or demolished except the old Standard Oil red brick warehouse in the background.  Anyway, its a great image to show what can actually go into 60' of rail ROW.

[spuwho]

Doesn't seem close does it? Aerial shows the foundations left behind.

I assume that the tower was for the Blanche Street Industrial Lead?

[Ocklawaha]

I assume that the tower was for the Blanche Street Industrial Lead?

Before the railroad crossing gates were fully  automated, a watchman located in the small one room tower would lower the gates when a Seaboard Air Line Railroad train approached the crossing, and raise the gates after the train cleared the crossing.  The gates were raised and lowered by electric motors at the base of the gates which the watchman controlled from inside the tower.

At crossings where there were no electric motors or gates the crossing watchman spotted approaching trains, then went downstairs to block the crossing, using flags or fusees (small flares). Though some crossings were protected by train activated crossing equipment, where back and forth switching was common, a crossing watchman could more precisely control the traffic, as well as pedestrians.  Many watchman locations were required by city ordinance, wonder if Jacksonville's were?

So while the industrial lead may have played a part in the location of the tower, the job itself was more likely to have been to protect traffic including pedestrian, horse, rail and automobile.

Here are a few more from around Florida, one is Jacksonville and one is Tampa, the others unknown locations:

Note the sign saying JAX MAID BREAD!


I believe this one to be near the Eli Witt 'Hav-A-Tampa' cigar plant.


The address of the picture is: 710 Florida Ave, Tampa â€" Amanda Johnsons furnished rooms, at the SW corner of Polk St.

[thelakelander]

Hmm, I guess technology killed thousands of crossing gate jobs....

[peestandingup]

Anyways, has there been any talk about extending this & integrating it into the areas where people actually live? Because honestly I don't see it being used much if that doesn't happen (see my post above). Most people I talk to in the biking community doesn't even know this exists.

I feel like this could be another one of those Jax projects that gets half-assed & then forgotten about.

[Ocklawaha]

Hmm, I guess technology killed thousands of crossing gate jobs....

Yes, funny that the tower abandonments didn't get the same 'THE RAILROADS ARE DYING' headlines that branchline abandonments got in the late 60's and 70's.

[Ocklawaha]

Anyways, has there been any talk about extending this & integrating it into the areas where people actually live? Because honestly I don't see it being used much if that doesn't happen (see my post above). Most people I talk to in the biking community doesn't even know this exists.

I feel like this could be another one of those Jax projects that gets half-assed & then forgotten about.

More likely it is a case of building a bike trail then following that up a couple of years later by laying railroad tracks on top of it, at least if they want it to actually carry people they'll convert it to rail.

[BackinJax05]

Anyways, has there been any talk about extending this & integrating it into the areas where people actually live? Because honestly I don't see it being used much if that doesn't happen (see my post above). Most people I talk to in the biking community doesn't even know this exists.

I feel like this could be another one of those Jax projects that gets half-assed & then forgotten about.

More likely it is a case of building a bike trail then following that up a couple of years later by laying railroad tracks on top of it, at least if they want it to actually carry people they'll convert it to rail.

Too bad they won't do both. (Rail AND bike path next to it)

[Captain Zissou]

If you complete the S Line past Load King to Beaver, then run it down Beaver to Stockton.  Stockton could be made bike friendly down to riverside and then through to the riverwalk.  Then you complete the Hogan's creek Greenway to the other end of the S Line and you have a circular bike route that is pretty lengthy through the core neighborhoods. 

Other than the Hogan's creek portion (which is a very important part), you could get the remainder put together in a short time.  For the time being, making Boulevard/Broad, Pearl, or Main more bike friendly could complete an on-street loop. 

[thelakelander]

Anyways, has there been any talk about extending this & integrating it into the areas where people actually live? Because honestly I don't see it being used much if that doesn't happen (see my post above). Most people I talk to in the biking community doesn't even know this exists.

I feel like this could be another one of those Jax projects that gets half-assed & then forgotten about.

What is "this"?  Are you talking about the existing S-Line bike trail or the S-Line as a "rails with trails" corridor?  If rails with trails, the plan which is included in the Mobility Plan, JTA long range plans, and North Florida TPO's plans call for the S-Line to be a part of a commuter rail line that would connect downtown with the airport area and Nassau County.

[peestandingup]

Anyways, has there been any talk about extending this & integrating it into the areas where people actually live? Because honestly I don't see it being used much if that doesn't happen (see my post above). Most people I talk to in the biking community doesn't even know this exists.

I feel like this could be another one of those Jax projects that gets half-assed & then forgotten about.

What is "this"?  Are you talking about the existing S-Line bike trail or the S-Line as a "rails with trails" corridor?  If rails with trails, the plan which is included in the Mobility Plan, JTA long range plans, and North Florida TPO's plans call for the S-Line to be a part of a commuter rail line that would connect downtown with the airport area and Nassau County.

Obviously I was talking about the biking trail since that was what I mentioned (and all I mentioned) in my previous posts. The rails with trails seems like a pipe dream at this point. A fun & nice dream, but still. The bike trail is there now & is getting work done.

So I take it that's a "no" on extending it where people actually live & want to go? If so, I feel like thats a major missed opportunity for getting an actual "biking loop" that many other cities are doing that connects all their urban neighborhoods together for a real alternative to driving. Like I said months ago, as it stands now its just a bike trail that happens to be in an urban setting. One that quite frankly no one knows about since the entrances are in, let's say, less desirable places.

And I understand that bringing these things to blighted areas is key to their rejuvenation, but you still have to include the places that are currently passed that point too (like Riverside) in the plans so it actually gets used. Or else its just gonna sit there forgotten about (like the Skyway). Its the lack of vision & half-assed approach we've seen time & time again here.

In sum, going "nowhere to nowhere" seems like a great way for it to be underutilized. Not counting of course if the actual rails WITH trails plan gets implemented while we're all still alive.

[thelakelander]

I didn't see in the post I responded to where you specified "trail"....my bad.  As a part of the mobility plan and fee, what's there today would become a part of a citywide bicycle and pedestrian network.  Hopefully, that answers your overall question and concerns.

[thelakelander]

Btw, the existing bike trail was recently extended north, a few miles, to Gateway.  At this point, it doesn't appeal to yuppies and recreational riders but it is used by those living in the Northside neighborhoods it currently penetrates.