Oh now this is smooth, really smooth. I like how Richard was able to slide in scoreboard improvements along with many much more serious issues. I get that we like our football team and that it is good for Jacksonville and appreciate the fact that Mr. Khan has invested in the city via the team. But really, scoreboard improvements with real needs? How about a team who can win a few games for starters? lol
By the way didn't we just close some libraries cause we can't afford them? Are we not talking about cuts to the JSO? Isn't the council looking into how much funding is given to Shand's via UF for those working poor without insurance? I think our priorities are amiss here. No offense to Jags fans and by the way I do know about the financial agreements with the jags regarding the stadium and some of the potential income in them. I just had to smile at the way ole Richard is going at getting what Khan wants. :)
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=540363
QuoteClark
Scoreboards could be part of projects plan
Wednesday, August 28, 10:36 AM EDT
by David Chapman, Staff Writer
Park maintenance, road resurfacing projects and potentially EverBank Field scoreboards will be among the projects added to the Capital Improvement Plan budget that's set to be reviewed Friday.
City Council member Richard Clark said after the Council Finance Committee panel meeting the program's budget is traditionally in the $140 million range, but he expected fiscal 2013-14 to be less than $100 million.
The stadium improvements came up after Council member Robin Lumb discussed several road projects that leveraged private investment, such as an extension of New World Avenue that could mean construction of a middle school, high school and workforce housing.
"Eventually, we're going to have the discussion on the stadium," Clark said.
Clark mentioned Jaguars owner Shad Khan's investment in locker rooms and other stadium improvements at EverBank Field, which as previously reported, totaled more than $7 million.
Afterward he said the City has to find a way to pay for its share of the EverBank improvements. The City has committed to paying about $43 million, with the Jaguars paying the remaining $20 million.
As reported, the scoreboards were estimated to cost $26.5 million, with the Jaguars to pay $20 million and the City the remaining $6.5 million.
Mayor Alvin Brown did not include funding for any of the EverBank improvements in his budget.
The one-hour session mainly focused on roads and parks projects, with Clark offering a slew of park infrastructure projects — new fences, grass, lights and other aspects — he said are critical.
"We simply need to put infrastructure into these parks so kids can use them," Clark said.
He said putting projects on the list will make Council "re-engaged" in the process and, for example, will help the parks system by indicating when maintenance is needed instead of costly replacement projects later.
The subcommittee will again meet Thursday to add more amendments to the plan before the full Finance Committee is scheduled to review the budget Friday.
dchapman@baileypub.com
(904) 356-2466
This tidbit made me chuckle
QuoteMayor Alvin Brown did not include funding for any of the EverBank improvements in his budget.
Quote from: FSBA on August 28, 2013, 08:16:26 PM
This tidbit made me chuckle
QuoteMayor Alvin Brown did not include funding for any of the EverBank improvements in his budget.
and this even after the Jag's flew him to Miami on their private jet. ;)
Could someone please exlain why capital improvements to a City owned facility shouldn't be paid for through the Capital Improvements Plan.
Quote from: tufsu1 on August 28, 2013, 09:18:34 PM
Could someone please exlain why capital improvements to a City owned facility shouldn't be paid for through the Capital Improvements Plan.
I don't think anyone is saying that they shouldn't. I didn't say that. What is under discussion is what should take priority when it comes to the expenditures under the Capital Improvements Plan. Is a scoreboard a top priority?
Why not from the sports complex fund - paid for by fees on sports complex parking and so on?
Why should it compete for very scarce dollar for legitimate capital improvements around the city?
Why didn't the Mayor include the scoreboard and other stadium upgrades in his budget, since he as already given the Jags a commitment the City will pay for these things?
Quote from: Charles Hunter on August 28, 2013, 10:07:20 PM
Why not from the sports complex fund - paid for by fees on sports complex parking and so on?
Why should it compete for very scarce dollar for legitimate capital improvements around the city?
Why didn't the Mayor include the scoreboard and other stadium upgrades in his budget, since he as already given the Jags a commitment the City will pay for these things?
Wasn't this the source of funding initially discussed as a way to pay for the improvements? Correct me if I am mistaken. As you stated with the scarcity of funding is a scoreboard or upgrades to the stadium a priority? As far as the Mayor and his commitment's being followed by a well financed plan, well....you know how that has been going. lol
Brown must have backed out on the loan that was mentioned earlier this summer that was supposed to be repaid with the bed tax.
I wish everyone would stop referring to the scoreboards when they talk about the project and like Khan is pimping the city. The team is actually footing almost all of the bill for the scoreboards. The city is required to contribute 6.5 million to the scoreboards. The remainder of the other 43 million is for the party deck etc etc. The city knew what they signed up for when getting an NFL. Khan has done more of his fair share since purchasing the team. I think we can at least meet him half way.
And while we are on the subject of what should be priority in regard to capital improvement projects, does anyone have any insight? Probably not because we are not part of the city council.
Quote from: duvaldude08 on August 29, 2013, 01:19:06 AM
I wish everyone would stop referring to the scoreboards when they talk about the project and like Khan is pimping the city.
+1000
It seems like mostly non-football fans are against this Everbank Field scoreboard thing. Oh lets see, hypothetically if the subject switched from scoreboards to the beginning phase of a streetcar line (which may or may not be successful) suddenly there would not so be much negativity overall right?
I'm looking forward to those upgrades at the stadium. Everbank is definitely in need for some new scoreboards. When fans realize that there's a downgrade in scoreboards from places like Florida Field, to Everbank Field (like in the FL/GA game) we definitely have an issue here in Jax. This project would make the stadium more fan friendly, and practical (eliminating a big area of tarped-off seating).
Only money generated FROM the stadium should be used ON the stadium.
Luxury items at a sports venue should not take priority over public parks and libraries.
Quote from: tufsu1 on August 28, 2013, 09:18:34 PM
Could someone please exlain why capital improvements to a City owned facility shouldn't be paid for through the Capital Improvements Plan.
Yes. It's absolutely not a real priority compared to other needed capital improvements around the city.
QuoteThe city knew what they signed up for when getting an NFL.
Someone was obviously absent from the 1990s in Jacksonville. Examine the issues at the front then, No Pension issues, No Libraries closing, No JSO or JFRD decreases, it was a time of great growth in Jax. Back in 1995, Georgia Dome in Atlanta was considered a state of the art facility, now the Falcons are calling for entirely new stadiums, because theirs is out-dated.
To say that the city leaders knew that they would have pensions eating up 15% of the budget in 2013-2014 is irresponsible. No one could forsee these issues or problems, to say otherwise is ignorance. They must fix the pension issue for any furture programs/projects to have a chance to survive.
Or sell the stadium to Khan as an option. Let him deal with the GA/FL, Monster Trucks, hot tubs, scoreboards, he has the money for it, let him decide when it is time to upgrade and improve items.
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on August 29, 2013, 06:04:19 AM
Quote from: tufsu1 on August 28, 2013, 09:18:34 PM
Could someone please exlain why capital improvements to a City owned facility shouldn't be paid for through the Capital Improvements Plan.
Yes. It's absolutely not a real priority compared to other needed capital improvements around the city.
that doesn't really answer the question....I asked why an expenditure like this shouldn't be funded as a CIP project.
and yes, I agree that we have more pressing needs...but this is kind of the trend in sports today...and just about every team/owner holds its City hostage.
In my opinion the scoreboards are only being put out there to distract attention from the rest of the budget. I am sure that one could find several "questionable pet projects" in the budget if they looked instead of just taking in the media fodder. Are there better uses? Of course there are. When you quote the libraries being cut, keep in mind was 6 or more, now it is 2. The Brentwood and Maxville. Idk about Maxville, but Brentwood has been losing traffic for past two years. Now ppl just automatically go downtown because the Brentwood library is only opened 3/4 days a week (its on rotating schedule since April), is known to close early if no patrons are visiting, and has sent most of its collection to other libraries. Stop by the library, they are open today. It is on Pearl north of 27th and the head librarian is Maggie. Yesterday they had 7 visitors, but don't go if its raining, the roof has a bad leak. As for JFRD, JSO those threats will be made regardless, that's politics 101. We could have a $1B surplus and some council person would still say "well we may have to cut some law enforcement efforts because we need $1.2B for roads". And why shouldn't it come out of capital improvement? Isn't that a fund developed for major infrastructure maintenance/improvements for city owned facilities?
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 28, 2013, 08:49:27 PM
Quote from: FSBA on August 28, 2013, 08:16:26 PM
This tidbit made me chuckle
QuoteMayor Alvin Brown did not include funding for any of the EverBank improvements in his budget.
and this even after the Jag's flew him to Miami on their private jet. ;)
When was this?
Quote from: tufsu1 on August 29, 2013, 08:44:14 AM
Quote from: ChriswUfGator on August 29, 2013, 06:04:19 AM
Quote from: tufsu1 on August 28, 2013, 09:18:34 PM
Could someone please explain why capital improvements to a City owned facility shouldn't be paid for through the Capital Improvements Plan.
Yes. It's absolutely not a real priority compared to other needed capital improvements around the city.
that doesn't really answer the question....I asked why an expenditure like this shouldn't be funded as a CIP project.
and yes, I agree that we have more pressing needs...but this is kind of the trend in sports today...and just about every team/owner holds its City hostage.
You are so right, and compared to other owners, Khan is being very generous. The Panthers owners flat out told the city and the state of Carolina they need over 100 million in renovations to Bank of America Field, THAT IS OWNED BY THE TEAM, and that the team was not paying for squat.
Has anyone performed an analysis of how much additional advertising revenue can be generated by the scoreboards and whether the city will get a cut of that money to defray some of the capital improvement costs? Those boards are going to be absolutely massive and state-of-the-art, which will allow the team do create a lot more high-impact advertisements.
Quote from: copperfiend on August 29, 2013, 09:42:01 AM
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 28, 2013, 08:49:27 PM
Quote from: FSBA on August 28, 2013, 08:16:26 PM
This tidbit made me chuckle
QuoteMayor Alvin Brown did not include funding for any of the EverBank improvements in his budget.
and this even after the Jag's flew him to Miami on their private jet. ;)
When was this?
It was part of a TU report when they were discussing how Brown and his administration do so much dealing out of the sunshine. Can't remember when the flight took place. You may be able to find the article in the newspaper's online archives.
Quote from: duvaldude08 on August 29, 2013, 01:19:06 AM
I wish everyone would stop referring to the scoreboards when they talk about the project and like Khan is pimping the city. The team is actually footing almost all of the bill for the scoreboards. The city is required to contribute 6.5 million to the scoreboards. The remainder of the other 43 million is for the party deck etc etc. The city knew what they signed up for when getting an NFL. Khan has done more of his fair share since purchasing the team. I think we can at least meet him half way. And while we are on the subject of what should be priority in regard to capital improvement projects, does anyone have any insight? Probably not because we are not part of the city council.
Did you read exactly what I said in my original post? Did you see that I acknowledged the Jags are a good thing for Jacksonville and the fact that Khan's buying the team is also a good thing? Did you notice that I also said that I "get the other funding sources" you are alluding to for the stadium? Did you understand that my commentary was about "Richard Clarks" use of legislation in a way that was very smooth in order to accomplish something "he" wanted done? The commentary is not anti Jags, anti Khan and certainly did not allude to him pimping Jax in any way. Come on now. It was about how legislation is manipulated and sold and about priorities when it comes to our Capital Improvement Funds.
Jeeze, it would be so nice if people read what was written in a less defensive mode and then digested it. This is "not" about the value of the Jags or football. Relax! lmao :) :) (notice the smileys, not angry just bemused)
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:19:56 PM
Quote from: duvaldude08 on August 29, 2013, 01:19:06 AM
I wish everyone would stop referring to the scoreboards when they talk about the project and like Khan is pimping the city. The team is actually footing almost all of the bill for the scoreboards. The city is required to contribute 6.5 million to the scoreboards. The remainder of the other 43 million is for the party deck etc etc. The city knew what they signed up for when getting an NFL. Khan has done more of his fair share since purchasing the team. I think we can at least meet him half way.
Did you read exactly what I said in my original post? Did you see that I acknowledged the Jags are a good thing for Jacksonville and the fact that Khan's buying the team is also a good thing? Did you notice that I also said that I get the other funding sources for the stadium previous discussed. Did you see that my commentary was about "Richard Clarks" used of legislation in a way that was very smooth in order to accomplish something "he" wanted done? The commentary is not anti Jags, anti Khan and certainly did not even allude to him pimping Jax in any way. It was about how legislation is manipulated and sold and about priorities when it comes to our Capital Improvement Funds.
Jeeze, it would be so nice if people read what was written in a less defensive mode. This is "not" about the value of the Jags. Relax! lmao
And while we are on the subject of what should be priority in regard to capital improvement projects, does anyone have any insight? Probably not because we are not part of the city council.
I wish people would look at the bigger picture and what an updated stadium presents in the way of opportunity for huge national events.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/9511533/at-least-7-cities-bid-2016-2017-title-games-sources (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/9511533/at-least-7-cities-bid-2016-2017-title-games-sources)
QuoteMore bids on future title game sites
Updated: July 26, 2013, 2:03 PM ET
By Brett McMurphy | ESPN
217
42
86
EMAIL
PRINT
College football's commissioners will have a lot more choices when deciding where to hold the 2016 and 2017 College Football Playoff championships.
At least seven cities already have decided to bid on the next two championships, sources told ESPN.
Only Arlington, Texas, and Tampa, Fla., bid on the inaugural championship. It was awarded to AT&T Stadium in Arlington and will be held Jan. 12, 2015. It was commonly known the Football Bowl Subdivision commissioners favored AT&T Stadium for the first game, which reduced the number of bidders.
That won't be the case for the next two national title games. There will be a lot more competition for the games on Jan. 11, 2016, and Jan. 9, 2017.
Cities that definitely will bid for the Jan. 11, 2016, game: Glendale, Ariz.; Jacksonville, Fla.; New Orleans; San Antonio; and Tampa.
Cities that will bid for the Jan. 9, 2017, game: Arlington; Jacksonville; Miami; New Orleans; San Antonio; and Tampa.
Cities that host the semifinals are not eligible to host the national title game in the same year. So Miami (Orange Bowl) and Arlington (Cotton Bowl) cannot bid for the 2016 national title game, and Glendale (Fiesta Bowl) and Atlanta (Chick-fil-A Bowl) cannot bid for the 2017 national title game.
Atlanta hasn't decided if it will bid on the 2016 game but is expected to be a strong contender for the 2018 game -- the first year its new stadium will be open.
Scott Jenkins, of the Rose Bowl, said it hasn't decided if it will bid on the 2016 or 2017 game. Florida Citrus Sports CEO Steve Hogan said Orlando, Fla., will not bid on either game but expects to bid on national title games after 2018.
Houston, Nashville, Tenn., San Francisco, San Diego and Washington, D.C., are other cities that have shown interest in pursuing future College Football Playoff championship games.
New York Yankees officials have said they were interested in Yankee Stadium hosting a championship game, but the stadium does not met the minimum seating requirement.
Requests for proposals for the 2016 and 2017 College Football Playoff games are expected to be sent out in the coming weeks.
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=321563 (http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=321563)
QuoteJACKSONVILLE, Fla. -- In the fight to bring more football to Jacksonville, the city's Sports and Entertainment Office tells First Coast News they are making a bid for the College Football Playoff Championships.
It's the ultimate job for the ultimate football fan.
"I've been to Lambeau [Field], Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Miami, Tampa, San Diego," said Jeff Fingland, a Jaguars fan.
For Jeff Fingland, a Jaguars junkie turned Sports Mania manager, the city's bid for the college championships is a win-win and could turn the city into a destination for sports fans.
"They're going to look at NFL schedule, bowl schedule and all these other things, get in a couple of rounds of golf, the weather's always great see this phenomenal new scoreboard and the party deck. It really puts us on the maps as some place to go," Fingland said.
When it comes to supporting your favorite team or favorite sport, football fans are dedicated down to their last dollar.
The city of Jacksonville's Sports and Entertainment Office estimates a college game could bring in $125 million to $150 million dollars, five times the amount from the Florida-Georgia game.
Plus, because the featured teams would be from outside the area, potential visitors would be spending money on food and lodging.
"I'd be all for it, love college, love the pros, I think it's one more event I would spend some money on," said David Allen, a Jaguars fan.
It would also show the Bowl Championship Series, the system that creates the college bowl match-ups, that Jacksonville is a football destination.
Jay Bird
QuoteIn my opinion the scoreboards are only being put out there to distract attention from the rest of the budget. I am sure that one could find several "questionable pet projects" in the budget if they looked instead of just taking in the media fodder.
Pet project? The expenditure of over $50,000,000.00 and discussion of using capital improvements funds to improve the stadium is a pet project? Clearly you have not been paying attention. This is not a case of media fodder or an attempt by anyone at the city to refocus attention away from other serious budget problems. This is a real issue and one that has the support of the Mayor and several city council meetings.
I agree with the bulk of your post, but you opening opinion is just way off the mark. :)
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 12:29:36 PM
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:19:56 PM
Quote from: duvaldude08 on August 29, 2013, 01:19:06 AM
I wish everyone would stop referring to the scoreboards when they talk about the project and like Khan is pimping the city. The team is actually footing almost all of the bill for the scoreboards. The city is required to contribute 6.5 million to the scoreboards. The remainder of the other 43 million is for the party deck etc etc. The city knew what they signed up for when getting an NFL. Khan has done more of his fair share since purchasing the team. I think we can at least meet him half way.
Did you read exactly what I said in my original post? Did you see that I acknowledged the Jags are a good thing for Jacksonville and the fact that Khan's buying the team is also a good thing? Did you notice that I also said that I get the other funding sources for the stadium previous discussed. Did you see that my commentary was about "Richard Clarks" used of legislation in a way that was very smooth in order to accomplish something "he" wanted done? The commentary is not anti Jags, anti Khan and certainly did not even allude to him pimping Jax in any way. It was about how legislation is manipulated and sold and about priorities when it comes to our Capital Improvement Funds.
Jeeze, it would be so nice if people read what was written in a less defensive mode. This is "not" about the value of the Jags. Relax! lmao
And while we are on the subject of what should be priority in regard to capital improvement projects, does anyone have any insight? Probably not because we are not part of the city council.
I wish people would look at the bigger picture and what an updated stadium presents in the way of opportunity for huge national events.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/9511533/at-least-7-cities-bid-2016-2017-title-games-sources (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/9511533/at-least-7-cities-bid-2016-2017-title-games-sources)
QuoteMore bids on future title game sites
Updated: July 26, 2013, 2:03 PM ET
By Brett McMurphy | ESPN
217
42
86
EMAIL
PRINT
College football's commissioners will have a lot more choices when deciding where to hold the 2016 and 2017 College Football Playoff championships.
At least seven cities already have decided to bid on the next two championships, sources told ESPN.
Only Arlington, Texas, and Tampa, Fla., bid on the inaugural championship. It was awarded to AT&T Stadium in Arlington and will be held Jan. 12, 2015. It was commonly known the Football Bowl Subdivision commissioners favored AT&T Stadium for the first game, which reduced the number of bidders.
That won't be the case for the next two national title games. There will be a lot more competition for the games on Jan. 11, 2016, and Jan. 9, 2017.
Cities that definitely will bid for the Jan. 11, 2016, game: Glendale, Ariz.; Jacksonville, Fla.; New Orleans; San Antonio; and Tampa.
Cities that will bid for the Jan. 9, 2017, game: Arlington; Jacksonville; Miami; New Orleans; San Antonio; and Tampa.
Cities that host the semifinals are not eligible to host the national title game in the same year. So Miami (Orange Bowl) and Arlington (Cotton Bowl) cannot bid for the 2016 national title game, and Glendale (Fiesta Bowl) and Atlanta (Chick-fil-A Bowl) cannot bid for the 2017 national title game.
Atlanta hasn't decided if it will bid on the 2016 game but is expected to be a strong contender for the 2018 game -- the first year its new stadium will be open.
Scott Jenkins, of the Rose Bowl, said it hasn't decided if it will bid on the 2016 or 2017 game. Florida Citrus Sports CEO Steve Hogan said Orlando, Fla., will not bid on either game but expects to bid on national title games after 2018.
Houston, Nashville, Tenn., San Francisco, San Diego and Washington, D.C., are other cities that have shown interest in pursuing future College Football Playoff championship games.
New York Yankees officials have said they were interested in Yankee Stadium hosting a championship game, but the stadium does not met the minimum seating requirement.
Requests for proposals for the 2016 and 2017 College Football Playoff games are expected to be sent out in the coming weeks.
http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=321563 (http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=321563)
QuoteJACKSONVILLE, Fla. -- In the fight to bring more football to Jacksonville, the city's Sports and Entertainment Office tells First Coast News they are making a bid for the College Football Playoff Championships.
It's the ultimate job for the ultimate football fan.
"I've been to Lambeau [Field], Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Miami, Tampa, San Diego," said Jeff Fingland, a Jaguars fan.
For Jeff Fingland, a Jaguars junkie turned Sports Mania manager, the city's bid for the college championships is a win-win and could turn the city into a destination for sports fans.
"They're going to look at NFL schedule, bowl schedule and all these other things, get in a couple of rounds of golf, the weather's always great see this phenomenal new scoreboard and the party deck. It really puts us on the maps as some place to go," Fingland said.
When it comes to supporting your favorite team or favorite sport, football fans are dedicated down to their last dollar.
The city of Jacksonville's Sports and Entertainment Office estimates a college game could bring in $125 million to $150 million dollars, five times the amount from the Florida-Georgia game.
Plus, because the featured teams would be from outside the area, potential visitors would be spending money on food and lodging.
"I'd be all for it, love college, love the pros, I think it's one more event I would spend some money on," said David Allen, a Jaguars fan.
It would also show the Bowl Championship Series, the system that creates the college bowl match-ups, that Jacksonville is a football destination.
Again guys, this is not about the worth of the stadium or improvements there. This is about our capital funding, legislation manipulation and priorities. Come on now. Please pay attention to the focus of the conversation, which is "not" about the value of the stadium or improving it. lol
Lord have mercy, I wish we had this much passionate defense of the libraries, JSO funding and the like. lol :)
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:36:54 PM
Lord have mercy, I wish we had this much passionate defense of the libraries, JSO funding and the like. lol :)
Still missing the point, huh?
Is Jacksonville shutting down all of it's libraries? How many are actually locking up? How many are left? How much in late return fee's would it take to cover the FDR pensions and fix all those pesky pot holes?
Some folks just can't buy a clue lol
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:36:54 PM
Lord have mercy, I wish we had this much passionate defense of the libraries, JSO funding and the like. lol :)
Actually if you look at those threads, we did.
Quote from: stephendare on August 29, 2013, 12:55:17 PM
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 12:46:33 PM
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:36:54 PM
Lord have mercy, I wish we had this much passionate defense of the libraries, JSO funding and the like. lol :)
Still missing the point, huh?
Is Jacksonville shutting down all of it's libraries? How many are actually locking up? How many are left? How much in late return fee's would it take to cover the FDR pensions and fix all those pesky pot holes?
Some folks just can't buy a clue lol
Because the pensions are funded by the libraries?
That must be it! lol
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:30:47 PM
Jay Bird QuoteIn my opinion the scoreboards are only being put out there to distract attention from the rest of the budget. I am sure that one could find several "questionable pet projects" in the budget if they looked instead of just taking in the media fodder.
Pet project? The expenditure of over $50,000,000.00 and discussion of using capital improvements funds to improve the stadium is a pet project? Clearly you have not been paying attention. This is not a case of media fodder or an attempt by anyone at the city to refocus attention away from other serious budget problems. This is a real issue and one that has the support of the Mayor and several city council meetings.
I agree with the bulk of your post, but you opening opinion is just way off the mark. :)
I may have missed the mark on my opening, I was simply stating that anytime the budget comes up in any conversation, the scoreboards have to be included. And mostly because it was people have heard or read elsewhere, not from anything they actually read or researched. I don't think the scoreboards are a pet project (I do think stadium pools would be though) but there are some pet projects in the mayors proposal (do they really need new furniture again? And can't it be found cheaper than $300k?) which I feel should be looked at further and questioned about whether they should get those funds or if they would be better used in our public safety, parks or social services funds.
Quote from: JayBird on August 29, 2013, 12:53:02 PM
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:36:54 PM
Lord have mercy, I wish we had this much passionate defense of the libraries, JSO funding and the like. lol :)
Actually if you look at those threads, we did.
Come on Jay Bird, did you really miss that I was messing wif the football lovers on the thread in a manner meant as friendly even with the smiley and lol? Of course there was and is plenty of upset over the libraries. ;) There should be more though over the Pensions and properly funding the JSO, but that of course is another issue.
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:19:56 PM
Quote from: duvaldude08 on August 29, 2013, 01:19:06 AM
I wish everyone would stop referring to the scoreboards when they talk about the project and like Khan is pimping the city. The team is actually footing almost all of the bill for the scoreboards. The city is required to contribute 6.5 million to the scoreboards. The remainder of the other 43 million is for the party deck etc etc. The city knew what they signed up for when getting an NFL. Khan has done more of his fair share since purchasing the team. I think we can at least meet him half way. And while we are on the subject of what should be priority in regard to capital improvement projects, does anyone have any insight? Probably not because we are not part of the city council.
Did you read exactly what I said in my original post? Did you see that I acknowledged the Jags are a good thing for Jacksonville and the fact that Khan's buying the team is also a good thing? Did you notice that I also said that I "get the other funding sources" you are alluding to for the stadium? Did you understand that my commentary was about "Richard Clarks" use of legislation in a way that was very smooth in order to accomplish something "he" wanted done? The commentary is not anti Jags, anti Khan and certainly did not allude to him pimping Jax in any way. Come on now. It was about how legislation is manipulated and sold and about priorities when it comes to our Capital Improvement Funds.
Jeeze, it would be so nice if people read what was written in a less defensive mode and then digested it. This is "not" about the value of the Jags or football. Relax! lmao :) :) (notice the smileys, not angry just bemused)
QuoteBy the way didn't we just close some libraries cause we can't afford them? Are we not talking about cuts to the JSO?
From your original post... what does this have to do with Capital Improvements
http://www.coj.net/my-jax-budget/city-budget/capital-improvement-plan.aspx (http://www.coj.net/my-jax-budget/city-budget/capital-improvement-plan.aspx)
You've steered this conversation off course from your so-called point from the get-go. Are you trying to goad a discussion about slick politics or whether the Capital Projects budget should be funneled into pensions and libraries? ???
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 01:55:19 PM
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 12:19:56 PM
Quote from: duvaldude08 on August 29, 2013, 01:19:06 AM
I wish everyone would stop referring to the scoreboards when they talk about the project and like Khan is pimping the city. The team is actually footing almost all of the bill for the scoreboards. The city is required to contribute 6.5 million to the scoreboards. The remainder of the other 43 million is for the party deck etc etc. The city knew what they signed up for when getting an NFL. Khan has done more of his fair share since purchasing the team. I think we can at least meet him half way. And while we are on the subject of what should be priority in regard to capital improvement projects, does anyone have any insight? Probably not because we are not part of the city council.
Did you read exactly what I said in my original post? Did you see that I acknowledged the Jags are a good thing for Jacksonville and the fact that Khan's buying the team is also a good thing? Did you notice that I also said that I "get the other funding sources" you are alluding to for the stadium? Did you understand that my commentary was about "Richard Clarks" use of legislation in a way that was very smooth in order to accomplish something "he" wanted done? The commentary is not anti Jags, anti Khan and certainly did not allude to him pimping Jax in any way. Come on now. It was about how legislation is manipulated and sold and about priorities when it comes to our Capital Improvement Funds.
Jeeze, it would be so nice if people read what was written in a less defensive mode and then digested it. This is "not" about the value of the Jags or football. Relax! lmao :) :) (notice the smileys, not angry just bemused)
QuoteBy the way didn't we just close some libraries cause we can't afford them? Are we not talking about cuts to the JSO?
From your original post... what does this have to do with Capital Improvements
http://www.coj.net/my-jax-budget/city-budget/capital-improvement-plan.aspx (http://www.coj.net/my-jax-budget/city-budget/capital-improvement-plan.aspx)
You've steered this conversation off course from your so-called point from the get-go. Are you trying to goad a discussion about slick politics or whether the Capital Projects budget should be funneled into pensions and libraries? ???
I know I started the conversation and am attempting to keep people's focus on what the issue really is. If that is steering the conversation, consider me guilty as charged. ::)
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 01:55:19 PM
Are you trying to goad a discussion about slick politics or whether the Capital Projects budget should be funneled into pensions and libraries? ???
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 02:11:07 PM
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 01:55:19 PM
Are you trying to goad a discussion about slick politics or whether the Capital Projects budget should be funneled into pensions and libraries? ???
?????? Not even going to attempt to answer cause you are certainly are not listening. lol
I think the confusion comes in trying to mix snark/sarcasm/humor with fact. Most would like to discuss the issue, but by clouding it with scoreboard talk it gets muddled from the beginning and then blocked or defended before even reading what the real issue is. I usually don't pay attention to the emoticons bc they're so small on my phone I'd need to change to bifocal contacts. Also, I don't really fault Clark. This is a politician playing the game. Just as any other does. Just as we do in our daily lives to get something we want.
Not putting words in your mouth Diane, but is the issue you were aiming for here: "is this a CIP fund project"? To that my opinion is yes, based on the fact that I believe CIP is meant for maintenance and improvements to city owned property/facilities. But I, and I assume many others, don't fully understand the difference between funds as it all comes out of our taxes so what's the difference.
^Thank you for explaining to me what I was aiming for. JB do you think you may just over analyze some commentary? :) I don't disagree with your statements about the CIP but, gosh, golly gee kiddo! Seems like you had the same issue with SC about "do gooders". All things said are not always literal, even is serious conversations. Look to the smilies for direction as to what is and isn't.
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 02:13:42 PM
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 02:11:07 PM
Quote from: Shwaz on August 29, 2013, 01:55:19 PM
Are you trying to goad a discussion about slick politics or whether the Capital Projects budget should be funneled into pensions and libraries? ???
?????? Not even going to attempt to answer cause you are certainly are not listening. lol
OK... well then... when you figure out what is manipulative about adding a capital improvement project to the capital improvement project budget or what libraries & pensions have to do with capital improvement legislation... please let us all know.
^Check out posts 5, 10 and 11 on this thread. None of them by me by the way. Again, reading the thread and then commenting is always a good idea. ;) If you have a problem with any of the other views and commentary about why this should not be a capital funds project, please let those posters know of your view.
Now if this is about wanting "the last word" on the issue, that's fine. Continue to comment and I won't respond to your comments. Then get the last word. Cool beans!
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 02:24:30 PM
^Thank you for explaining to me what I was aiming for. JB do you think you may just over analyze some commentary? :) I don't disagree with your statements about the CIP but, gosh, golly gee kiddo! Seems like you had the same issue with SC about "do gooders". All things said are not always literal, even is serious conversations. Look to the smilies for direction as to what is and isn't.
Guilty as charged, I overanslyze everything (thats actual my first quote on my FB page) which explains why my psychology degree came with ease and why I have such success in finance. I apologize it is just who I am, but always welcome constructive criticism because I am always trying to be better. Keep keeping me straight and I will pay more attention to context ;D
But I truly wasn't sure if that's what you were aiming for, which is why I asked to clarify instead of assuming.
Quote from: JayBird on August 29, 2013, 02:33:07 PM
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 02:24:30 PM
^Thank you for explaining to me what I was aiming for. JB do you think you may just over analyze some commentary? :) I don't disagree with your statements about the CIP but, gosh, golly gee kiddo! Seems like you had the same issue with SC about "do gooders". All things said are not always literal, even is serious conversations. Look to the smilies for direction as to what is and isn't.
Guilty as charged, I overanslyze everything (thats actual my first quote on my FB page) which explains why my psychology degree came with ease and why I have such success in finance. I apologize it is just who I am, but always welcome constructive criticism because I am always trying to be better. Keep keeping me straight and I will pay more attention to context ;D
It's all good. Everyone learns from each other, well at least we hope they do. Makes conversing much easier. :)
Quote from: Cheshire Cat on August 29, 2013, 02:29:30 PM
^Check out posts 5, 10 and 11 on this thread. None of them by me by the way. Again, reading the thread and then commenting is always a good idea. ;) If you have a problem with any of the other views and commentary about why this should not be a capital funds project, please let those posters know of your view.
Now if this is about wanting "the last word" on the issue, that's fine. Continue to comment and I won't respond to your comments. Then get the last word. Cool beans!
I've read the thread... posts 5, 10 & 11 included. My response is still the same as my original post. Yes, it is a priority. It presents a clear opportunity for income through huge events that would also put Jacksonville on a national stage and over a 1/3 of the total cost will be covered by a private tenant.