ATTEND JTA's Plan To KILL RAIL, 4-7 MON.

[tufsu1]

Makes too much sense Ock! Until the City and JTA see the advantages we are doomed to BRT instead of a multiuse mass transit system! Stupid JTA/City Hall!

but CS...a multiuse mass transit system in Jax. should include commuter rail, streetcar, skyway, local bus, AND BRT...the only issue here is in the timing....I would have no problem if they started w/ commuter rail along Philips Hwy followed by BRT.

[buckethead]

but CS...a multiuse mass transit system in Jax. should include commuter rail, streetcar, skyway, local bus, AND BRT...the only issue here is in the timing....I would have no problem if they started w/ commuter rail along Philips Hwy followed by BRT.

As I read it, the issue is that the proposed BRT route runs parallel to our existing rail corridor which will compete with commuter rail in the future. Should the BRT system not feed/disperse commuter rail in an integrated system?

[thelakelander]

^The other issue is timing.  How realistic is it to believe that the feds would fund commuter rail on the FEC to directly compete with a parallel BRT line, also funded by them, anytime soon?

[buckethead]

I find that to be a very reasonable argument. I don't see it happening.

What I find so alarming is that our JTA planners don't seem to consider such issues. Same with the skyway. If we neglect to honor responsible investment in transit, why on earth would daddy give us more transit money?

[tufsu1]

As I read it, the issue is that the proposed BRT route runs parallel to our existing rail corridor which will compete with commuter rail in the future. Should the BRT system not feed/disperse commuter rail in an integrated system?

True BRT systems operate like rail...as a spine, not as a feeder....now, as Lake points out, this is hardly true BRT....but there is nothing wrong with having good bus service paralleling a rail corridor...many cities have just that.

As designed, this route could compete w/ commuter rail...it could also compliment it....the major problem is in asking the Feds for money twice....instead, we should ask FTA for assistance w/ commuter rail and fund enhanced bus service without "New Starts" money

[buckethead]

That makes perfect sense. I believe I recall seeing that definition of BRT (Spine, not feeder) previously. I guess I lost it somewhere in the shallow confines of my mind.

I realize it can be trying for experts when attempting to convey details to the general public (me) so again, thanks for keeping at it.

[thelakelander]

JTA can improve bus service along this corridor without FTA assistance by increasing the L7's frequency from 30 to 15 minutes, having the private sector pay for shelters and using existing buses along this corridor.  The expensive parts of the BRT costs (new buses, queue jumps, TSP, real-time information, etc.) are not a necessity for no-frills reliable bus service on a non congested street (Philips Hwy).

Btw, Los Angeles' Orange Line is a prefect example of BRT being a spine and a feeder.  The Orange Line is a spine for buses traveling between the Red Line (subway) and destinations that aren't along the rail corridors.  However, that bus spine still funnels (feeds) those suburban bus riders into the urban rail spines.



Anyone notice how the heavy rail, light rail and BRT corridors don't parallel each other? This is how rail and BRT should work in Jax.

[CS Foltz]

lake..........I agree with your concept! Multiple systems should not parallel each other! There should be connection points between them where they cross but with BRT paralleling both Skyway and possible rail sections..........they are shooting themselves in the posterior! No vision and I get tired of applying to Uncle Sugar for start up monies! Either way, we the taxpayers, end up footing the bill! A no frills system would be the most cost effective system for start up......but until the lights go on.........we are doomed by JTA's translation of what a mass transit system is!