WWII era Yellow Water Naval Air Gunnery School

[Timkin]

I bet the Florida Memory Photographs may have some pictures of this place from its heyday.

[RMHoward]

Hi Buddy,
Welcome aboard.  Will be glad to have your input on this subject.  I started this post.  You may certainly use any of my photos you wish to.  I am very familiar with your site about the nuclear weapons storage area.  In fact, i was watching some of your videos yesterday.  I referred your site to another contributor of pics on this particular thread (BobS).  He was fascinated with your work, just like i am.  I signed the guest log on your web site maybe a year or so ago.  I think i was requesting info. about the gunnery school that anybody may have had.  Also, based on the trajectory of rounds shot toward the ranges during WWII, i would think that the site for the nuclear magazines would be absolutely littered with errant rounds. 
Thanks alot.
Rick

[bobsim]

  Hey Buddy, 

  Welcome! Let me be the first to start publicly pecking at you for access to the storage facility. So, well......when can we get in?

  You certainly have permission to use any of our photos too.

  Rick gave me the link to your site a while back and I've spent hours enjoying it.Thanks!

[RMHoward]

Bob,
Buddy can correct me on this......but i dont think anyone is getting in there anytime soon.  Since JSO put the "no tresspassing" sign on the entrance a few months ago.  I fear that until JSO is done using the place, we aint gettin in.  I think they have set up a driving course on the old heliport seen in Buddy's videos.
Rick

[RMHoward]

Just for grins,
I downloaded waypoints from my GPS to Google Earth and am posting image below.  When i named waypoints for the Yellow Water area, i start the name with "YW" (to differentiate from my other waypoints).  So, every blue colored push pin indicates somewhere i have been and marked something i have found.  I have to shorten the names because my GPS only allows a certain length for a name.  Note on bottom left of image (cleared area around waypoint "burn pit" is the location of the skeet/trap range where students began their training at the school.  I have two waypoints named "YW tower 1, and 2".  Please note that there are not towers there, just the remnants of the heavy concrete footers where the towers were.  There were a total of four 40 feet towers, but i have only found the locations of two towers so far.  This entire area has recently had the earth scraped clean (contaminated) and removed.  
Rick


In this photo, most of the western part of the school is visible.


In this photo, most of the eastern end of the school is visible, including barracks/administration area.  Also, note
FCCJ campus on right side of image.



In this photo, again, the western end of school.  YW bldg 1, 2, 3 are the large magazines which the current hiking path goes through.  Also note the "YW photo point" waypoint on left side of image. I can't really explain this waypoint.  It is a physical sign right off the path that says "YW photo point 2". Its as if it is indicating an approved photo location.  I can't really say how old this sign is but it would really be amazing to me if this is leftover from WWII.  But this would have been a safe position to film the ranges in use (especially since there were no trees). Also makes me wonder where Photo point 1 is.


This is a closeup of the skeet/trap range.  The waypoint labeled "YW burn pit" is labeled this way because the site was used for burning obsolete ordance at some point after the school closed.  Also, note current Navy Yellow Water base housing at bottom left of picture (triangular shaped).

[subro]

On a somewhat unrelated note, I was looking at this area in Google Earth and adjusting the time slider to see how the landscape has changed over the last twenty years and I noticed that there was a Bigfoot sighting there last year. Details below for those that find this interesting…




Report # 26577  (Class B)
Submitted by witness on Sunday, September 13, 2009.
________________________________________
Brief daylight sighting of a small primate type creature in a pine forest near Jacksonville
________________________________________
YEAR: 2009
SEASON: Summer
MONTH: June
DATE: 18
STATE: Florida
COUNTY: Duval County
LOCATION DETAILS: This is a close military base in an area rumored to have held nuclear arms.
NEAREST TOWN: Jacksonville
NEAREST ROAD: highway 228 and New World Ave.
OBSERVED: Right on the northwest corner of New World Ave. and Normandy Blvd. FSCJ owns approx. 135 acres. When things are slow I take our electric golf cart thru the woods just to look around and maybe spot wildlife as I go. Between the college and the city pool which is west of the college are numerous ponds, wetlands, and pine tree flats on forestry land. There are also alot of training areas left over from the Navy days and a few old roads that are similiar to power line right aways running mostly north and south.

Now to the day in question: We were allowing a contractor to drive thru our property to gain access to the forestry land and I went to talk to them to get an update on the project. It turned out they were not working that day so I was riding around just looking for wildlife. I came up to one of the old roads and when I looked north on the road there was something in the road sitting on it's hunches and it appeared to have one arm in the air and the other was scratching it's side. I was traveling kind of fast and could not stop until I was about 10 feet past the road. I put the cart in reverse to back up and it was not in the road any longer. I looked just past the spot where it was in the road and it was on the side of the road and was bending down a limb from a 4 or 5 foot pine tree peering out at me. This lasted for maybe 3 or 4 seconds and it ran in from what I could tell was an upright position. The small pines hindered my view when it was running but I am fairly positive it was running up right. What ever it was, was about 2 maybe 3 foot tall judging by the trees and was very black and resembled a primate. I worked at the Jax Zoo in maintenance for a few years and one of the exhibits I was responsible for was the Great Apes so I am very familiar with several different primates and it reminded me very much of a bonobo.

I was fairly shaken up and I did not go look for tracks, signs, or anything. Now to present, a few weeks ago forestry had a timber company thinning the pines in the same area, I went back there to talk to the job foreman as they were using our property to gain access. They were two or three hundred yards back in the woods and I did not want to drive my cart back there because of the road. I got maybe thirty yards off the road down the skidder trail and I am not sure what it was but the hair on my neck stood straight. I had a strong sense something was out there watching me. It may have been my imagination but I really believe I was being watched.
TIME AND CONDITIONS: Around 2pm, very sunny and clear
ENVIRONMENT: On a ex military training road between two pine flats. Also near one man made pond and natural creek.
________________________________________
Follow-up investigation report by BFRO Investigator David Wright:
On 9/17/9 I met this witness at his place of employment whereupon we proceeded in a golf cart to the location of his sighting. It was through a locked gate and onto a very large property that is now owned by the City of Jacksonville, Fl. but was formerly Cecil Field, a large USN airbase. The location of the sighting was between a quarter, and a half mile from his work place. The sighting took place as the witness crossed perpendicularly, a cleared right of way that was lined on both sides by slash pine sapling about 3'-5' tall. We walked back to the approximate location of the animal during the sighting. The witness demonstrated how the animal appeared when be backed up and saw it the second time, crouching behind a pine sapling of about 5' in height, bending down a branch, and peering between the needles of the trunk and the bent down branch. He stated this brief "stare down" lasted about 3-4 seconds, whereupon the creature darted to its left and ran into the thick brush. The witness stated that he caught glimpses of it bobbing through the brush as it ran away and had the distinct impression that it was exhibiting bipedal locomotion. The witness did not check for tracks, in that he was somewhat shaken and did not feel compelled to do so.

We then went to the site of the second encounter that occurred a few weeks later, which was between the original sighting and the work place, where he recounted that second experience. During this time the witness stated that on the second encounter, the "feeling" of being watched and the "hair on end" was definitely directional, from behind and to his left. This produced an immediate fear response in him, causing him to look in the direction of the "feeling" where he saw nothing. It should be noted here that no sound whatsoever caused this reaction, but that it was spontaneous and occurred while he was walking. This experience is very common among witnesses, and is particularly interesting in that regard, in that it was spontaneous and without being triggered by a sight or sound out of the ordinary.

Of further particular interest in this report is the fact that the witness was previously employed by the Jacksonville Zoo for several years, prior to his current employment, and worked in the primate area about one day per week, maintaining a temperamental air conditioning system. He stated that he had a particular interest in the primates, and became familiar with their identities as to type, looks, smells, and behaviors. He stated that the subject of his visual encounter was very much like a bonobo, a kind of chimpanzee.

Concerning its observed physical characteristics, the witness could recall the following;

-As the creature appeared to be squatting flatfooted on its haunches with one arm raised in the first view, the arm appeared to be longer in proportion to the torso than that of a human.
-The witness described the creature as being slender.
-While the creature appeared black, no hair or fur could be readily discerned, but he felt sure it was hairy.
-No ears were visible.
- It appeared that the creature’s knees were protruding somewhat away from its torso in the squatting position.

While no adult creatures were seen by this witness, if this was a very young juvenile Sasquatch, it is likely that the mother was very close by. It may very well be that the witness’ second experience involved an adult.

This geographic area borders Jennings State Forest where numerous other sightings have been reported and investigated by this investigator. It would be no far fetch for these properties to be overlapping territories of Sasquatch creatures. They are large wild areas of pine flatwoods, with mosaics of bottomland hardwood swamps, ponds, creeks, and streams interspersed, which support large populations of big game animals, including wild hogs, deer, panthers and alligators.
________________________________________
About BFRO Investigator David Wright:

•   Certified Florida Master Naturalist (U. of Florida)
•   Visual Tracker, Level 1
•   Teaches Biology, A.P. Biology, Ecology, and Environmental Science at a rural high school SE of Jacksonville
•   See local TV interview with D. Wright
•   Participated in the 2007 Private Florida Expedition [Click the video link on that page.], the 2007 South Carolina Expedition, the 2008 South Florida Expedition and assisted with the organization of the 2008 North Florida Expedition. Assisted with the organization of the 2009 Central Florida Expedition.

[RMHoward]

Um, reinforces my prior statement that i should carry some sort of protection in there, or not go in alone.  Have a good friend whom i trust and believe tell me he has seen such a creature in Montana (where he grew up).  So, very interesting.
Every time i go into Yellow Water, I get the sense of being very alone.  Very quiet out there. 
Rick

[bobsim]

  While we were in there Robin commented that some areas were very quiet, no bird noises, just quiet.

  Rick the push pins and Google Earth are neat. You've really covered a lot of ground out there. Our incident with the bees would be at/around Butt #9. Appears to be a lot more to see than we covered on our trip, looking forward to getting out there again.

[Ocklawaha]

I definitely want to go visit this place.. its incredibly cool.

Ock.......... In your extensive collection of photos,,would you have any of Lee Field/ and of  The Airbase Drive-in on Roosevelt? I vaguely remember the Drive in...very well remember the Base.

Is the Bear Catholic? Does the Pope... uh... oh.... AH SHIT!

YES!

OCKLAWAHA

[Timkin]

Does the Bear splash holy water?

[wichita28]

  I was assigned to NAS Jacksonville in 1946 for Aviation Fundamentals School. It was a school which gave us an indoctrination in to all the flying rates. On graduation we next went to Yellowater for gunnery school. Then to whatever "A" school you were assigned. That was 64 years ago so I probably haven't got a lot to add to what you've already dug up. Things I remember, strapping on our leggings and going out in the range to put out fires that we started with tracers. That was an "all hands evolution" and always came in the middle of the night. Also I believe the coldest I have ever been was standing a mid watch on the range with an empty 45 strapped on. Just me and the skunks. Training included several weapons. 45 pistol, M-1 rifle, 12 gage, Thompson Sub machine gun, 30 and 50 caliber machine guns, maybe more, been to long. I do remember we had to field strip and reassemble the 50 blindfolded, over and over and over, closing my eyes I think I could do it today. Remove the butt plate, REMOVE THE RECOIL SPRING, etc   etc. I think we had to do it to all weapons but the 50 sticks in my mind. We fired the 30's from free mounts and twin 50's from a turret mounted on a trailer or truck at sleeves running on rail. Hense the fires. Anyway I surfing the web, places I served and squadrons I was in and came on your site. Excellent site, I look forward to reading all the posts........thank you for your effort

[RMHoward]

Witchita28,
Wow, great to have someone chime in who was actually there during its heyday.  Thanks so much for sharing your memories, and for your service. I wonder if i might ask you to search your memory and answer a few questions i have about this mostly forgotten place.

1.  While you were there, do you remember Yellowater gunnery school as being mostly self-contained?  Or, did you have to go across the street often to Cecil Field for things such as: religious services, exchange purchases, administration, recreations, etc?  

2.  Besides the barracks that students stayed in, was there any housing on the school grounds for stations complement, ie officer housing?  

3.  It seems that most folks who were stationed there did not enjoy their stay too much.  I think in one interview i read, a veteran referred to the place as a "hole".  Was this your impression of the place as well?

4.  Were there any gunnery trainers there that were located inside buildings?  Specifically, i have been wondering if the Navy had a "Waller" trainer located there.  I know this particular trainer required a very large air conditioned building to keep all the electrical equipment cool.  I know the navy and army used them, but from the overhead imagery, i dont see any buildings that would have been the right shape to house one of these. Here is a link to an article about the Waller Trainer:
http://www.in70mm.com/cinerama/archive/gunnery/index.htm


I dont want to over burden you with questions.  But, i would appreciate your input here.  There just is not anything out there with any information about the school.  It was an important part of Navy and Jacksonville history.  Thanks again!

PS i would also be interested to hear about the rest of your Navy career and where you live now.
Rick

[Timkin]

Interesting updates on this topic. Makes me want to see the place even more.

[Ocklawaha]

LEE FIELD NAS GREEN COVE SPRINGS


This is an overview of the once busy base looking from airside toward the river. The streets, plumbing, sidewalks, hangers, towers, apron, taxiway and runways still exist. To the west is miles of dairy farms land, to the south NOTHING but thousands of acres of wilderness preserve, to the north and east, the St. Johns River... WHY isn't the NAVY, GREEN COVE SPRINGS, CLAY COUNTY or STATE OF FLORIDA laying this at the military base commission's feet for the relocation of the Master Jet Base?

OCKLAWAHA

[heights unknown]

I want to visit it too.  As a retired Navy Man, I was stationed at NAS Cecil Field 2 times during my 20 year career and remember Yellow Water very vividly; the gunners mates driving in there to work, the Marines also stationed there and driving trucks in and out of there, etc.  I never went in there because back then it was off limits to anyone that did not work there or had to be there, and I believe you had to have a TOP SECRET clearance or special access clearance to enter, or a good reason, valid reason for visiting or requiring entrance (probably qual's, etc.).

"HU"