High Speed Rail as a Conduit for Sprawl

[tufsu1]

The article is about California's plans, but some feel Florida's HSR plans could have similar effects

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2010/03/high-speed-rail-and-sprawl/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wiredautopia+(Blog+-+Autopia)&utm_content=Google+Reader

[CS Foltz]

Like anything else big guy.............not matter what, two edges or sides to everything! I thought that what "urban planners" took into account?

[tufsu1]

my personal opinion is that the Florida line will likely not lead to sprawl....for me, sprawl is unplanned, haphazard growth (vs. new development in formerly undeveloped areas)....plus the I-4 corridor isn't exactly undeveloped.

By definition, development around rail happens near stations....think about the streetcar and commuter rail suburbs of citie like NYC, Philly Boston, and Chicago...or even Riverside, Avondale, Springfield, etc. here in Jax...so there is plenty of opportunity to plan it right from the start  

[Joe]

Good article. It's a real issue - although I suspect not a very crucial one since these systems probably won't be priced for a daily commute. The most likely candidates for hundred mile+ commutes would be highly paid white collar professionals who can also do work on the train via computer. It probably wouldn't have much of an impact on demographics at a metro or regional level.

That being said, it's always good to note that, yes, even mass transit can cause sprawl. Infrastructure is infrastructure. If you build transit capacity into an underdeveloped area, it's one big fat subsidy for future development. Doesn't matter if it's street or rail. That's one of the reasons why I personally value intracity rail over intercity rail.

[Joe]

for me, sprawl is unplanned, haphazard growth

I have to disagree with you on this one. That's an inaccurate definition of sprawl that's gained traction for political reasons. Some of the worst sprawl has been meticulously planned and organized.

Just looking within Jax's metro area, all those gated communities and suburban DRI's are neither unplanned nor haphazard. They were all heavily planned at the private, municipal, and often state level. They weren't unplanned - they had bad planning. Big difference.

However, I do strongly agree with the point that all greenfield development is not sprawl. Consequently, I think the best definitions of sprawl should revolved around the concepts of density, connectivity, and transit-choice.

[CS Foltz]

Makes sense to me Joe! Transit choice more than anything seems to dictate density! That could change but the mindset would have to change to take advantage of that choice and right now.............got no choice!

[tufsu1]

Some thoughts on sprawl...from Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_sprawl