Drop-In Center for the homeless: Poll

[uptowngirl]

I think we should get aid form other cities/states, as a lot of the homeless DT are not from Jacksonville.

Also, I do not want 200 Portajohns downtown for vistors whether they be homeless or not.

[NotNow]

ESHC,
Just so I understand,  the percentages you gave are based solely on interviews, or the word of the person that you interviewed, correct?  Also, what percentage would you say were "service resistant" and what do you think is the major reason?  Mental illness?  As for the services provided, and a possible day center, what do you think we should ask of the clients, if anything?

[samiam]

From ESHC's post it was stated that Approximately 25 percent of the homeless had served in the U.S. military. It is a shame that we as a country turns our back on someone that gave to there country. Some of these unfortunate souls have seen and lived though thing that the other 99% of the population could not imagine. This is a problem that needs to be addressed. They gave now the rest need to give.

[Dog Walker]

25% may have claimed to have served in the military, but was there documentation?  The homeless  vet bit is a common ploy.  ESCH?

[samiam]

25% may have claimed to have served in the military, but was there documentation?  The homeless  vet bit is a common ploy.  ESCH?

That is true. I should be a crime to claim that you served and you did not. It is easy to document if some one served or not

[NotNow]

It has been my experience that the "homeless" often lie about their background, work history, current employment, or even whether they are really homeless.  They are often just in and out of their parents homes, and have never really acted in an adult manner.  Veteran status is perceived by some to get them a break from police, or benefits from organizations.  That said, there are many homeless individuals, veterans, and families who deserve our help.  Samiam, you are right. It is easy to document veteran status.  It is easy to positively identify people and document what services they have accessed.  It is right and moral to help those that want to help themselves.  It is right and moral to care for those that cannot care for themselves.  It is not right to expect the citizens of Jacksonville to support those that refuse to help themselves.  It is theft to take the resources that are meant for those who are legitimately suddenly unemployed, or legitimately handicapped.  We should be generous in our help, but thorough in our requirement that recipients of our largess are working towards independence.  The mentally ill should not be left to squalor but placed in supervised, clean conditions.  If an individual decides that they want to avoid counseling or employment help... or refuse to maintain the cleanliness and upkeep of the facilities provided by the citizens of Jacksonville, then they should be refused service, and they should be discouraged from panhandling on our streets.  If they have a substance abuse problem and refuse rehab, or several bouts of rehab don't seem to have any effect, then they are abusing our system and either need mental health care if they are endangering themselves or should be refused at the gate to Jacksonville's services.  We are not wrong to demand responsibility from the adults who use our city services.  The private services (non tax supported) can offer what they wish, I am speaking only of taxpayer financed services.

[samiam]

There is a difference between someone that is homeless do to no fault of there own or some bad financial decisions and a vagrant. vagrancy is a crime. the vagrant should be treated as a criminal and should be ran out of town on a rail. As for the mentally ill if the family is unable (if the family is unwilling to care for them they should be prosecuted for neglect) we as a society should care for them with compassion and dignity

[sheclown]

va·grant
   /ˈveɪgrənt/ Show Spelled[vey-gruhnt] Show IPA
â€"noun
1.a person who wanders about idly and has no permanent home or employment; vagabond; tramp.
2.Law. an idle person without visible means of support, as a tramp or beggar.
3.a person who wanders from place to place; wanderer; rover.
4.wandering idly without a permanent home or employment; living in vagabondage: vagrant beggars.
5.of, pertaining to, or characteristic of a vagrant: the vagrant life.

Sam, all homeless are, by definition, vagrant.  This includes the mentally ill, children, and veterans.  If they have no home, they must wander around.

[sheclown]

NotNow,

What are we to do about the mentally ill?  I know that you have had plenty of first hand experience with this, what can be done about this group of homeless? 

If they are Baker Acted, it is only for a short period of time, then they are medicated and sent back out to the streets. 

I don't see a way to get a handle on the homeless problem without adequately dealing with this part of the puzzle.  To me, it is the most frustrating and heartbreaking.

[fsu813]

in the 80's the government closed the doors to many mentally ill facilities.

having them mix with the general homeless population is not helpful to either.

having facilities for mentally ill exclsuively would be ideal, but probably very far-fetched.

[Dog Walker]

FSU, one of the major reasons for the closing of the State's mental health hospitals was rulings by various levels of courts that people could not be held against their will if they had not committed a crime.  There had been lots of abuses in previous years with the wholesale warehousing of people with autism and Down's syndrome or just low IQ's without any treatment.

It's a tough problem and one that probably has no perfect solution.

[NotNow]

NotNow,

What are we to do about the mentally ill?  I know that you have had plenty of first hand experience with this, what can be done about this group of homeless? 

If they are Baker Acted, it is only for a short period of time, then they are medicated and sent back out to the streets. 

I don't see a way to get a handle on the homeless problem without adequately dealing with this part of the puzzle.  To me, it is the most frustrating and heartbreaking.

You are right.  It is shameful that our courts have forced the mentally ill into the streets to survive without the skills needed to do so.  And the increased cost of emergency housing, clothing, and care not to mention incarceration has been passed onto the urban areas taxpayers instead of the State.  We should demand that the State legislature establish a humane hospital system to provide supervised care for those that are diagnosed and prove incapable of independent living.  This is a worth while use of our tax dollars and should be shared among taxpayers statewide, rather than sticking the urban cities with the financial toll as well as the physical toll of the bodies roaming downtown. 

Just my opinion.  I don't advocate for tax money to be used often, but this is a GLARING need. 

[Dan B]

From my personal experience, those who are mentally ill most likely wont seek out the services, even if they exist. The only exception being a few of the more highly operating folks who have moments of clarity, but can you honestly see Jimmy going to a drop in center for a shower? He has been institutionalized, and released so many times ts not even funny.

[NotNow]

Jimmy is a good example of a person who can have a life when properly treated, housed, and supervised.  Released to the street, he becomes a picture of the problem.  There are many, many just like him just in Jax.  Cities with active homeless programs draw individuals who need what services are available, and city centers become de facto homeless camps as well as mental illness wards.  When you think about it, it is a system screaming for change.

[sheclown]

NotNow, I agree.  Jimmy would be so much better off were he in a place where his medication could be monitored and he could be under lock down.  How many times has Jimmy been hit by cars?  Who could argue that it is in his best interest to be institutionalized?  How many times does a man need to walk in front of moving vehicles to prove he is incapable of taking care of himself?

I can think of dozens of other individuals that I know of who fall under this category including the barefoot and often topless woman who wanders up and down Main Street.  Then there is Charles, the skinny man with the blanket and the swinging arms.  

Someone is getting checks for these people, I'm sure, and letting them wander around unmedicated.

If we were to take out the mentally ill from the equation, and the families, we could begin to deal with the rest of the homeless much more easily.

Just my honest opinion.