Downtown Development Update: What's rising, what's delayed

Started by thelakelander, September 29, 2023, 07:54:27 AM

thelakelander

I believe the swap would be for two development pads....east and west of the Main Street Bridge. I'm not opposed to a land swap but can see how someone else who wants the land or a deal would be against it.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life." - Muhammad Ali

Ken_FSU

Quote from: thelakelander on April 17, 2025, 04:23:39 PM
I believe the swap would be for two development pads....east and west of the Main Street Bridge. I'm not opposed to a land swap but can see how someone else who wants the land or a deal would be against it.

Totally see how other developers could be against it, but still seems like a reasonably fair proposal to me.

I might be wrong, but I was under the impression that the East development pad would almost be treated like an incentive/completion grant for the West pad, versus an outright gift.

From my understanding:

1) Once development of the West pad is complete, Gateway would have an exclusive option to acquire the East pad at market or reduced rate. The option would have an expiration date, and if the pad wasn't developed within five years, they'd lose it.

2) What is also interesting to me is that, in the agreement, Gateway would assume the costs of demolition for the Main Street Bridge ramps going over the East property.

A few other notes:

- Gateway estimates that room taxes and HOA fees rendered for the tower could pump $300,000 a year into a programming and maintenance fund for Riverfront Plaza park. Assuming that NOT choosing Gateway Jax pushes the project back five years, which feels like it might even be conservative given our track record with riverfront RFPs, that's $1.5 million in cost savings alone right there.

- Further, I'd LOVE for someone to do an economic impact study laying out the cost of building out Phase 2 of Riverfront Plaza & the private development simultaneously vs. building out Phase 2 of the park, and then closing the east end of the park for two years for construction of the private development.

thelakelander

I drove past Pearl Street earlier today. They appear to be on the second floor of that one now! I'm confident Gateway would get both of those parcels done. Obviously, there's some haters out there. But whatever, let's get this stuff done.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life." - Muhammad Ali

Charles Hunter

Quote from: Ken_FSU on April 17, 2025, 09:25:54 PM
1) Once development of the West pad is complete, Gateway would have an exclusive option to acquire the East pad at market or reduced rate. The option would have an expiration date, and if the pad wasn't developed within five years, they'd lose it.

2) What is also interesting to me is that, in the agreement, Gateway would assume the costs of demolition for the Main Street Bridge ramps going over the East property.


I assume the use of the plural "ramps" is a typo, and only the ramp toward Newnan Street will be removed when the East Parcel is developed. I can't see the Ocean Street ramp being removed, as that would leave nowhere for northbound traffic to go. FDOT does not have the reconfiguration of Main Street to 2-way in their budget.

Will development of the East parking lot (between the Main Street Bridge and the Hyatt) be part of Phase 2 of the Riverfront Plaza project? The potential of offering Parcel 2 to Gateway as an incentive for completion of Parcel 1 implies to me that it will not be simultaneous with developing the Plaza west of the bridge. If so, will it continue to be a parking lot, or will it be a staging area for work to the west? And that means all access to the parking lot will be via Coastline Drive.

heights unknown

#64
Quote from: thelakelander on April 17, 2025, 11:10:15 PM
I drove past Pearl Street earlier today. They appear to be on the second floor of that one now! I'm confident Gateway would get both of those parcels done. Obviously, there's some haters out there. But whatever, let's get this stuff done.
You wouldn't be talking about someone whose last name begins with the letter "S" would you?
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Zac T

The second building in Pearl Square is set to break ground this month

QuoteGroundbreaking is scheduled for the second project in the Gateway Jax development in Downtown Jacksonville.

The Gateway Jax partnership announced May 15 that work would begin May 29 on 425 Beaver Street, a mixed-use building that will include 286 multifamily units, nearly 20,000 square feet of retail space and a parking garage.

https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/may/15/groundbreaking-for-second-gateway-jax-project-set-for-may-29/

Skybox111

Wow groundbreaking was supposed to happen back in April. I guess uf campus is moving slow too

The UF logo could go up as soon as this year on an existing office building on West Bay Street that would be the starting point for the campus. The construction of new campus buildings would have its first grand opening by 2030 or 2031, a second building would open by 2035 and other work does not have any specific dates.

The city would give a 2.36 acre parcel and a 1.22 acre parcel to UF this year for the buildings.
After getting the property, UF would have 24 to 30 months to start construction on the larger parcel and another three years to finish it, according to a memo by Downtown Investment Authority CEO Lori Boyer summarizing the agreement. That would put the grand opening of that building in 2030 or 2031.
UF would have up to seven years to begin construction on the second parcel and would have to finish that building by 2035.

acme54321

I wouldn't get overly concerned about a groundbreaking being delayed a month...

thelakelander

Yeah. They are actually moving pretty quick. The Trio would have been done a decade ago if it moved at the same speed.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life." - Muhammad Ali

heights unknown

Maybe someone should talk Moll/Gateway into taking on the Trio? But he's got so much on his plate right now, but, it appears that Moll/Gateway can more than walk and chew gum. I applaud and am proud of what Moll/Gateway are doing at this juncture (Pearl Street Square); now, they also need to work on the pad on the old Landing site (I hope they come up with something more appealing and taller), and that smaller piece of land to the east of the Landing site. We'll see what happens. But...I am overly pleased and proud of Moll/Gateway.
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Zac T

I'd imagine if the city is successful in foreclosing on the Trio and auctioning it off that we would see a bid from Gateway Jax. It's right across the street from Gateway's offices and JWB's future HQ and they seem focused on helping the DIA activate Laura Street

heights unknown

Quote from: Zac T on May 19, 2025, 11:14:24 PM
I'd imagine if the city is successful in foreclosing on the Trio and auctioning it off that we would see a bid from Gateway Jax. It's right across the street from Gateway's offices and JWB's future HQ and they seem focused on helping the DIA activate Laura Street
Wow...that's good to know and hear, and, I hope THAT'S what happens if the Trio is foreclosed on by the City. We shall see, "Que sera, sera."
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Jankelope

Laura Street Trio, if it had opened in literally 2021 as initially planned, and then 2024 as then planned...would have been such an incredible gem to have open alongside the new landing park, possible gateway tower, friendship fountain park, etc.

City leaders don't have to make every little decision well, but they need to make ALL the big decisions well. They made some bad big decisions in the past 10 years with that property.

thelakelander

#73
Can go back even further. If we had worked with Sleiman on the last Landing renovation plan, it would have been finished almost a decade ago. We'd have significantly higher ped foot traffic in the urban core by now and all the public money spent on the Riverfront Plaza park under construction could have been spent elsewhere, over the last decade, leveraging a lot more than what we see today. That one was a generational setback. We'll overcome it but the process to overcome will be longer than 10 years.

I could make a similar argument for City Hall Annex (demolished), and the Hyatt/convention center talk. Poor decisions made all around on each of these public sites years ago that will take additional years and public money to work themselves out. At this point, we can't get back the past, but we can learn from our mistakes and not make the same ones again.
"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life." - Muhammad Ali

Jankelope

Despite the setbacks, I do feel we are taking "3 steps forward, 2 steps back" or some similar ratio lol. I still feel that the energy is different, the projects with shovels in the ground ARE there, and thank goodness for Gateway Jax, who has the potential to near single-handedly be the spark that drives in-fill development from the river to Springfield downtown.

Also very grateful for VyStar, and despite the controversy...Khan and his companies. There's a few big players that are doing almost everything. Without them, we would be still at square one.

I have a 2 and a 4 year old. We visited Friendship Fountain when the new playground opened, and it just became clear to me how wonderful of an asset this is. All we have to do is follow through with botanical gardens, the rooftop bar/restaurant, the bathrooms, and the Related Tower...and you'll be in really great shape. If only it was combined with the MOSH renovation, which could have already been done!

Looking towards the stadium, the ballpark renovations were great and are already finished. That in tandem with the Zombie DORO apartments, Shipyards West Park, MOSH, Four Seasons, Met Park, and New Stadium is a monumental amount of great things happening on that half of downtown.

I personally do not share the urgency to move the jail. I just do not feel like it is actually a factor on people not going downtown. It will cost so much to move and build a new one. Would you rather spend $1 billion replacing a functional jail to a better location, or spend $1 billion on incentivizing a dozen other complimentary projects? Seems like a no brainer to me.

Lastly, the Emerald Trail and it's connections are transformative and game changing and we HAVE to finish them, even if it means playing hardball with JTA, who have been given so much leeway to go down weird R&D paths that have yet to return anything on their investment.

UF Campus too. Gotta tie that in with new train station and bringing Brightline and Amtrak DOWNTOWN.