FBC threatens lawsuit if not allowed to historic demolish building

[thelakelander]

Shame of FBC's leaders for attempting to make a hardship where one really does not exist, in order to get its way. You should always have a Plan B that doesn't involve a congregation with a dwindling membership base putting itself $30 million in debt. It's a historic structure, so there are grants, incentives programs and tax credits available out there for a building with such rich history.

Kudos to staff for doing their job. Although it's a tall order to ask in a city that has a tradition of not valuing it's own history, hopefully JHPC and Council will make a recommendation based off the established policies in place and not emotion, personal views or political connections.

A Jacksonville Historic Preservation Commission staff report could lead to a local landmark designation for a First Baptist Church building Downtown and halt its demolition.

Church leaders say the move would derail plans to consolidate its 13.7-acre Downtown campus to a single city block.

The report issued Feb. 21 says the 93-year-old, six-story structure at 125 W. Duval St. may meet six of the seven criteria used by the commission to determine landmark status.

First Baptist wants to demolish the building to make way for a welcome center that would serve as a connective space and the primary entrance for the historic 182,000-square foot-Hobson Auditorium, the church administration building and the Ruth Lindsay Auditorium.

"The removal of this structure is not only for the greater good of the church, but also the city district with in which it is located," Novus Principal Jerry Traino wrote. "Should the church not be allowed to remove this building, they cannot do this project and will be forced to use another piece of property, which is not in the city's best interest."

In a Feb. 19 interview, First Baptist Senior Pastor Heath Lambert said if the building is designated a local landmark and the church can't tear it down. "There is no Plan B," he said.

The pastor said Feb. 19 the building layout cannot fit all 3,000 church members inside, although the city's reports found the structure was built to accommodate 3,500 people.

Lambert said he's not predicting the designation will make it through Council but if it does, the church intends to file a lawsuit and challenge the landmark status.

Full article: https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/first-baptist-church-will-fight-local-landmark-designation-for-building-it-wants-to-demolish

[Charles Hunter]

I like the quote in the story from Steve Williams, "If they're going to spend $30 million to build a new visitors center, why can't they use a creative solution to use the existing building?"

[thelakelander]

It's a good one. There are potential other solutions worth exploring. They can include a retrofit of the building, reconfiguring that block of Church Street or also using the open space between this building and the older sanctuary next door. The reality of it is, someone had a vision of a modern structure and that was worked into the concept early on. They also did not consider current policies and their impact on design during this process. I would not expect religious leaders to have this type of knowledge but whoever they hired to design the plan should have known and presented this information early on in the process. Because of this, you have a hardship argument that is self created.

[MusicMan]

Unless I'm missing something, FBC is in a pretty serious downward spiral. Not sure a new $30,000,000 building is gonna correct that trajectory.

[thelakelander]

ACTIONS FOR CHANGE:

#1 SHOW UP ---> Wednesday to the Historic Preservation Committee meeting at 3pm in the Ed Ball Building Conference Room 1002, 1st Floor; 214 North Hogan Street; Jacksonville, FL 32202

#2 REACH OUT TO THE DECISION MAKERS and ask them to stick to the standards and policies we have set for our downtown core.

Write: "Dear_______,
I am one of your constituents in Jacksonville and I am
emailing you about the First Baptist Church Sunday
School Building that the church has made application to
demolish.

My hope is that you will uphold our standards and policies
we have set for our downtown core regarding historic
preservation and deny the application.

Thank you for your consideration and time.

Sincerely,

your name"

Historic Preservation Commission

Commission contacts: Phone: (904) 255-7800 Email: historicpreservation@coj.net

City Planner Supervisor: Christian Popoli Phone (904) 255-7859 Email: CPopoli@coj.net

Downtown Investment Authority

CEO: Lori Boyer Phone: (904) 255-5301 Email: boyerl@coj.net

Mayor Lenny Curry Phone: (904) 255-5000 Email: MayorLennyCurry@coj.net

District Council Members

District 1: Joyce Morgan Phone: (904) 255-5201 Email: JoyceMorgan@coj.net

District 2: Al Ferraro Phone: (904) 255-5202 Email: Ferraro@coj.net

District 3: Aaron L. Bowman Phone: (904) 255-5203 Email: ABowman@coj.net

District 4: Scott Wilson Phone: (904) 255-5204 Email: SWilson@coj.net

District 5: LeAnna Cumber Phone: (904) 255-5205 Email: LCumber@coj.net

District 6: Michael Boylan Phone: (904) 255-5206 Email: MBoylan@coj.net

District 7: Reggie Gaffney Phone: (904) 255-5207 Email: RGaffney@coj.net

District 8: Ju'Coby Pittman Phone: (904) 255-5208 Email: JPittman@coj.net

District 9: Garrett L. Dennis Phone: (904) 255-5209 Email: GarrettD@coj.net

District 10: Brenda Priestly Jackson Phone: (904) 255-5210 Email: BPJackson@coj.net

District 11: Danny Becton Phone: (904) 255-5211 Email: DBecton@coj.net

District 12: Randy White Phone: (904) 255-5212 Email: RandyWhite@coj.net

District 13: Rory Diamond Phone: (904) 255-5213 Email: RDiamond@coj.net

District 14: Randy DeFoor Phone: (904) 255-5214 Email: RDefoor@coj.net

At-Large Council Members

Group 1: Terrance Freeman Phone: (904) 255-5215 Email: TFreeman@coj.net

Group 2: Ronald B. Salem Phone: (904) 255-5216 Email: RSalem@coj.net

Group 3: Tommy Hazouri Phone: (904) 255-5217 Email: THazouri@coj.net

Group 4: Matt Carlucci Phone: (904) 255-5218 Email: MCarlucci@coj.net

Group 5: Samuel Newby Phone: (904) 255-5219 Email: SNewby@coj.net

[Steve]

How is this any different than the claims by the owners of the Bostwick Building (now Cowford Chophouse)? The only difference I see is the Sunday School buildings is in WAY better structural shape. The issues of mechanical systems, etc. are their own issues.

[MusicMan]

Thanks Ennis!

[Bill Hoff]

Sounds like FBC needs a little Biblical inspiration to renovate the building.

"But with God all things are possible." - Mathew 19:26

[I-10east]

^^^Amen!

[heights unknown]

And yes, a hearty, fat, greasy, southern fatback type of AMEN!

[jaxlongtimer]

What if FBC gets their way and membership continues to decline and 5 or 10 years later they want to walk away from this project too?  We lost an historic building over maybe 5 to 10 years use of a replacement? 

As noted, given their trajectory (and maybe even that of Downtown!), this might not be a location FBC will want to continue in for much longer.  Their future might be more in suburbia (a la Church of 11-22) than Downtown.  When is the last time a new church was built Downtown?

I wonder who is overseeing FBC's strategic planning.  Seems this is an awful big bet by their congregation on turning around their Downtown presence.  $30 million would go a very long way in suburbia.  I know, it seems unusual to be pushing someone away from Downtown, but if they are causing harm to the character of Downtown, maybe its not worth fighting to keep them there when there could be superior options for both FBC and Downtown if they just relocated elsewhere.

[thelakelander]

They'd be better off moving to Nocatee. It would be cheaper for them and downtown would benefit from all that property being back on the tax rolls and activated with people and a mix of uses 24/7. It is a big risk for a declining church to spend that much money on a building. Buy an abandoned strip mall in the burbs for a fraction of the costs and spend that saved church money investing in saving souls.

[MusicMan]

There are churches and church properties all over Duval for sale, in many price ranges, but ALL are less than $30,000,000.

[Bill Hoff]

There are churches and church properties all over Duval for sale, in many price ranges, but ALL are less than $30,000,000.

There are three new, giant churches being built directly fronting Beach Blvd. Business must be good in the 'burbs.

[vicupstate]

The thing is they have the cash on hand (or soon will) to do whatever they want. Moving completely out of DT altogether would seem like a defeat and going against a century plus of tradition. I don't doubt that their suburban offshoots will get larger than DT, but they will probably always have a presence DT.