Mass shooting at Jacksonville Landing

[KenFSU]

I work next door at the Times Union PAC. Even the well known musicians must pass through security EVERY DAY. Whether performance or rehearsal, our bags are checked!

Not sure how they did not have basic security at the door (of Chicago Pizza). Maybe they did?

And this is a good thing, trusted people having their shit rifled through daily?

The Landing shooting was the exception, not the rule.

We've had hundreds of thousands of safe events in this city, and there's no reason that every event or establishment in the city needs to have some security goon with a high school diploma feeling up bystanders. Nor could said establishments necessarily afford said goon and security apparatus. Nor, as Parkland showed us, would the goon necessarily do any good in stopping an attack.

This could happen anywhere.

On the road, at the grocery store, in a parking lot, in a park, whatever.

What are we gonna do, put security checkpoints at every public gathering spot in the city?

Do we love our guns so much that the proper solution to gun violence isn't better controlling access to deadly weapons, but rather spending trillions of dollars a year as a country to have our children felt up or searched every time they enter a pizza parlor? For what? So some 18 year old kid can keep his gawd-given right to walk into a corner store and purchase an instrument of murder, juuuuuuuuuust in case the British redcoats decide to return?

Security's not the answer.

Metal detectors at schools and mass gatherings like football games? Fine.

Being inconvenienced and treated like a suspect every time you go somewhere where a few dozen people have gathered?

That's more "UnAmerican" than putting much, much harsher restrictions on who can own weapons and where they can take them.

[Tacachale]

EA announces $1M 'Jacksonville Tribute' donation, community livestream event
Company is setting up a fund for people to contribute to
By Julia Alexander  Aug 30, 2018, 7:28am EDT

Electronic Arts via Polygon

EA has announced a new initiative to support the victims of the Jacksonville Landing mass shooting, and unite the community following the tragedy.

On Wednesday evening, the company announced via its website that it would make a $1 million contribution to the victims' families from EA, as well as hold a livestream play event to celebrate the Madden NFL family.

"First, we're making a $1 million contribution to support the victims of last Sunday's events," the announcement reads. "We're also working to set up a fund where others can contribute alongside our donation, and we will come back very soon with further details. Contributions will go to the victims, including the families of Taylor Robertson, Elijah Clayton, and all those who were affected."

https://www.polygon.com/2018/8/30/17799350/ea-jacksonville-shooting-tribute-donation-livestream-eli-clayton-taylor-robertson-fund

Here's EA's website:

https://www.ea.com/news/the-jacksonville-tribute

[jaxnyc79]

I work next door at the Times Union PAC. Even the well known musicians must pass through security EVERY DAY. Whether performance or rehearsal, our bags are checked!

Not sure how they did not have basic security at the door (of Chicago Pizza). Maybe they did?

And this is a good thing, trusted people having their shit rifled through daily?

The Landing shooting was the exception, not the rule.

We've had hundreds of thousands of safe events in this city, and there's no reason that every event or establishment in the city needs to have some security goon with a high school diploma feeling up bystanders. Nor could said establishments necessarily afford said goon and security apparatus. Nor, as Parkland showed us, would the goon necessarily do any good in stopping an attack.

This could happen anywhere.

On the road, at the grocery store, in a parking lot, in a park, whatever.

What are we gonna do, put security checkpoints at every public gathering spot in the city?

Do we love our guns so much that the proper solution to gun violence isn't better controlling access to deadly weapons, but rather spending trillions of dollars a year as a country to have our children felt up or searched every time they enter a pizza parlor? For what? So some 18 year old kid can keep his gawd-given right to walk into a corner store and purchase an instrument of murder, juuuuuuuuuust in case the British redcoats decide to return?

Security's not the answer.

Metal detectors at schools and mass gatherings like football games? Fine.

Being inconvenienced and treated like a suspect every time you go somewhere where a few dozen people have gathered?

That's more "UnAmerican" than putting much, much harsher restrictions on who can own weapons and where they can take them.

I do think Red Flag Legislation is a step in the right direction.  I believe it makes it easier for family members and law enforcement to petition the courts to bar an individual from obtaining firearms if there is the belief that such person poses a threat to himself and/or to others.  Very often, family members have a clue when someone is off his rocker, and giving them a wide open channel to sound the alarms doesn't solve all the problems, but moves us in the right direction with a very practical solution.  I'd go a step further and say that if the family members or law enforcement sound the alarm, the weapons can be confiscated as well.  In this case, the parents (especially mother) should have been able to petition local authorities in Maryland to not allow David Katz to purchase the weapons, a purchase he made legally.

[Charles Hunter]

Saw some questions on FB that make sense:
How long has the game room been there?  I assume it didn't "pop up" just before the Madden tournament, their website had a 2016 copyright.
https://www.glhfgamebar.com/index.html
Have there been no fire, or any other, inspections during that time?
If so, why weren't any citations issued earlier?

[KenFSU]

I work next door at the Times Union PAC. Even the well known musicians must pass through security EVERY DAY. Whether performance or rehearsal, our bags are checked!

Not sure how they did not have basic security at the door (of Chicago Pizza). Maybe they did?

And this is a good thing, trusted people having their shit rifled through daily?

The Landing shooting was the exception, not the rule.

We've had hundreds of thousands of safe events in this city, and there's no reason that every event or establishment in the city needs to have some security goon with a high school diploma feeling up bystanders. Nor could said establishments necessarily afford said goon and security apparatus. Nor, as Parkland showed us, would the goon necessarily do any good in stopping an attack.

This could happen anywhere.

On the road, at the grocery store, in a parking lot, in a park, whatever.

What are we gonna do, put security checkpoints at every public gathering spot in the city?

Do we love our guns so much that the proper solution to gun violence isn't better controlling access to deadly weapons, but rather spending trillions of dollars a year as a country to have our children felt up or searched every time they enter a pizza parlor? For what? So some 18 year old kid can keep his gawd-given right to walk into a corner store and purchase an instrument of murder, juuuuuuuuuust in case the British redcoats decide to return?

Security's not the answer.

Metal detectors at schools and mass gatherings like football games? Fine.

Being inconvenienced and treated like a suspect every time you go somewhere where a few dozen people have gathered?

That's more "UnAmerican" than putting much, much harsher restrictions on who can own weapons and where they can take them.

I do think Red Flag Legislation is a step in the right direction.  I believe it makes it easier for family members and law enforcement to petition the courts to bar an individual from obtaining firearms if there is the belief that such person poses a threat to himself and/or to others.  Very often, family members have a clue when someone is off his rocker, and giving them a wide open channel to sound the alarms doesn't solve all the problems, but moves us in the right direction with a very practical solution.  I'd go a step further and say that if the family members or law enforcement sound the alarm, the weapons can be confiscated as well.  In this case, the parents (especially mother) should have been able to petition local authorities in Maryland to not allow David Katz to purchase the weapons, a purchase he made legally.

Totally agree that Red Flag legislation should be a no-brainer.

[Tacachale]

Saw some questions on FB that make sense:
How long has the game room been there?  I assume it didn't "pop up" just before the Madden tournament, their website had a 2016 copyright.
https://www.glhfgamebar.com/index.html
Have there been no fire, or any other, inspections during that time?
If so, why weren't any citations issued earlier?

It was in the news and everything when it opened, and they must've gotten a go ahead from the landing. I can't imagine all that could have happened without the city knowing about it.

[Josh]

Saw some questions on FB that make sense:
How long has the game room been there?  I assume it didn't "pop up" just before the Madden tournament, their website had a 2016 copyright.
https://www.glhfgamebar.com/index.html
Have there been no fire, or any other, inspections during that time?
If so, why weren't any citations issued earlier?

Given the fact that it took several years for the fire department to realize Bold City Brewery wasn't even licensed to have customers inside the taproom (despite having inspected them every year and even cited the grill Jolly Mon was using at one point), I wouldn't be surprised this went under the radar.

[ProjectMaximus]

Yeah I remember it being announced a few years back and I thought it was a clever use for a Landing space.

[fieldafm]

The fire marshal did an extensive 'surprise visit' of the Landing the Friday evening before the FL/GA game and shut down many of the outdoor bars setup to serve party goers and denied entry to several hundred paid guests trying to enter the Landing (which is closed to the public and heavily policed with extensive crowd control measures in place during FL/GA weekend) and issued several citations on empty storefronts being used for storage... many appeared bogus and have since been cleared. This visit came just a few days after the City's/Sleiman's competing lawsuits ramped up (isn't that a coincidence?).

Chicago Pizza has been in operation for roughly 10 years. The only change in that time was to replace several dining tables with arcade games and gaming consoles. It can be legitimately argued that the physical occupancy of the space decreased from the permitted occupancy due to these changes. How does replacing a dining booth with an arcade game constitute a fire hazard? 

This is simply the City and State trying to insulate themselves, after the fact, from impending lawsuits. Unfortunately, covering one's backside due to potential legal actions, finger pointing and political grandstanding isn't going to help solve the problem.

Sunday was a real tragedy. The city was marred with violent crimes the entire weekend. Hopefully, the victims of these crimes will find solace and peace soon... and we as a society can do better to respect human life and dignity.

[fieldafm]

I work next door at the Times Union PAC. Even the well known musicians must pass through security EVERY DAY. Whether performance or rehearsal, our bags are checked!

Not sure how they did not have basic security at the door (of Chicago Pizza). Maybe they did?

I have bypassed the security desk several times when visiting the Cultural Council's or SMG's office. Let's not pretend that TUPAC is somehow Fort Knox.

I was at the Landing at approx 10:30am Sunday morning and saw two of the Landing's security officers on site walking the courtyard and two police cruisers parked on the front lawn (there is a police substation inside the Landing).

[MusicMan]

"I have bypassed the security desk several times when visiting the Cultural Council's or SMG's office. Let's not pretend that TUPAC is somehow Fort Knox."

Really?  SMG would probably love to know that, since they are the ones responsible for security.  I'm there a lot. So not sure when you just breezed right past security but not in the last year.  What door are you going in through?  Also they have decent CCTV observing most of the perimeter of the building, indoors as well.  I'm guessing there is no "security" office at The Landing, but I could be wrong.

I hate to break it to you, but even the attorneys who make a living at the court house go through security. 

[fieldafm]

"I have bypassed the security desk several times when visiting the Cultural Council's or SMG's office. Let's not pretend that TUPAC is somehow Fort Knox."

Really?  SMG would probably love to know that, since they are the ones responsible for security.  I'm there a lot. So not sure when you just breezed right past security but not in the last year.  What door are you going in through?  Also they have decent CCTV observing most of the perimeter of the building, indoors as well.  I'm guessing there is no "security" office at The Landing, but I could be wrong.

I hate to break it to you, but even the attorneys who make a living at the court house go through security.

Guess you missed out key elements of my response:

I have bypassed the security desk several times when visiting the Cultural Council's or SMG's office. Let's not pretend that TUPAC is somehow Fort Knox.

I was at the Landing at approx 10:30am Sunday morning and saw two of the Landing's security officers on site walking the courtyard and two police cruisers parked on the front lawn (there is a police substation inside the Landing).

The Landing has private security on site 24/7/365 and a 'security office', in addition to a police substation.

The fact that you are stunned that someone could bypass a security guard making $12/hour, is telling. No firearms are allowed on the Landing property (just as they aren't allowed at TUPAC, the Courthouse or any number of places), yet a tragedy happened Sunday.

I've been the victim of violent crime, and have had loved ones die at the hands of another. It's tough to wrap your ahead around watching someone you love die in front of you.  Bad people do bad things.  I'm interested in learning more about how people make bad decisions like shooting people in cold blood outside of a high school football game, and solutions on how to correct that before it happens. From first hand experience, I'm not entirely sure that more private security guards is the answer to the violent crime epidemic going on in Jacksonville. 

[Josh]

On NPR this morning Melissa Ross said that the original venue for this tournament was going to be the WJCT building, but it was moved due to the Jags playing this weekend.

[KenFSU]

Yes, I don't mind supporting quality journalism. Just not so supportive of paying for basic news that can be found for free elsewhere. At that point, I feel like I'm being taken advantage of.

On top of that, there's also the ethical question as to whether information - particularly local information about things like elections, violence, safety, storms, etc - should be partitioned off from the lower classes. Clearly doesn't apply to things like restaurant reviews and sports commentary, but when there's an active shooting going on, or polls are about to open, or a hurricane is bearing down, it'd be a pretty shitty civic move to pay wall that coverage.

Case in point.

The Times-Union paywalling an article today about free flu shots.

Seriously?