Charter schools are NOT public schools

[Tacachale]

Charter schools are popular in FL because the school districts have been so disfunctional for decades. Locally, that's also why private schools and the bedroom counties have done so well: they're another option. I don't know what the solution is, but the status quo sure ain't it.

the difference is socio economic.  Private schools, even the ones with scholarships, tend to have wealthier families and more committed parents.

The answer to poor resources in public school isn't to siphon their money off.

That also sure aint working.

Possibly, but I'm not sure that's happening here. Plus, charter schools may be helping the county retain students who otherwise would go private or move out of the county. To my knowledge that hasn't been formally studied, but if charters help fight the flight, it could be a net gain for the district.

Charter schools are popular in FL because the school districts have been so disfunctional for decades. Locally, that's also why private schools and the bedroom counties have done so well: they're another option. I don't know what the solution is, but the status quo sure ain't it.

Both Nassau and St. John's Counties public schools are two of the best districts in the state, and I grew up going to very well funded public schools in Chicagoland (which still regularly end up in rankings of top schools in the country). I know it can be done without turning to private organizations to run the schools. The solution is making sure kids have teachers who are paid well and held to high standards, and attend schools with up-to-date technology and infrastructure. The school board just made a 2% reduction in millage (amounting to a few bucks for homeowners but a lot of cash for the district) and then announced they can't afford to expand gifted programs like they want. This is just another example of trying to get good results on the cheap.

Like I said, the successes in St. Johns County and the other bedroom counties is due almost entirely to the state of Duval County schools. These counties attract families where the parents work in Jacksonville but want better school options for their kids. It's classic white flight. I'm willing to bet that those top schools in Chicagoland have a similar relationship with the Chicago Public Schools district, which is similarly not known for high quality.

[benmarcus]

Like I said, the successes in St. Johns County and the other bedroom counties is due almost entirely to the state of Duval County schools. These counties attract families where the parents work in Jacksonville but want better school options for their kids. It's classic white flight. I'm willing to bet that those top schools in Chicagoland have a similar relationship with the Chicago Public Schools district, which is similarly not known for high quality.

Believe it or not, my high school was, and still is, attended by students roughly 50% of whom are on reduced or free lunch. It's also about as racially diverse as you can imagine. The people in that community pay higher property taxes and it's clear the money is being put to good use. Chicago's main issue is the classic too many people, not enough homeowners, situation, combined with severe issues with accountability.

I agree some of it may be a result of "white flight," for surrounding counties, as much as I really dislike that term. St. Johns and Nassau both have slightly higher millage rates, as well. St. John's county charges the maximum allowed by state law.

[Tacachale]

Like I said, the successes in St. Johns County and the other bedroom counties is due almost entirely to the state of Duval County schools. These counties attract families where the parents work in Jacksonville but want better school options for their kids. It's classic white flight. I'm willing to bet that those top schools in Chicagoland have a similar relationship with the Chicago Public Schools district, which is similarly not known for high quality.

Believe it or not, my high school was, and still is, attended by students roughly 50% of whom are on reduced or free lunch. It's also about as racially diverse as you can imagine. The people in that community pay higher property taxes and it's clear the money is being put to good use. Chicago's main issue is the classic too many people, not enough homeowners, situation, combined with severe issues with accountability.

I agree some of it may be a result of "white flight," for surrounding counties, as much as I really dislike that term. St. Johns and Nassau both have slightly higher millage rates, as well. St. John's county charges the maximum allowed by state law.

White flight is the typical term for what's happening here. People, largely white and relatively affluent, moving farther out from the city to escape city problems. Living in St. Johns allows folks to take advantage of Duval County's jobs and infrastructure, while keeping their tax dollars in their own neighborhoods and school district. This is one reason Jacksonville benefits from sales taxes: a lot of it ends up getting paid by commuters.

St. Johns (and Clay and Nassau) have about the same school millage rate as Jacksonville, and have for years. The total millage rate in St. Johns is actually lower than in Jacksonville. The difference is in their respective populations and what they have to spend their money on.

[benmarcus]

St. Johns (and Clay and Nassau) have about the same school millage rate as Jacksonville, and have for years. The total millage rate in St. Johns is actually lower than in Jacksonville. The difference is in their respective populations and what they have to spend their money on.

School millage in St. John's is 7.228. It's 7.117 in Duval, set to go down 2%.

You are correct, however, there is more property ownership, proportionally.

[Adam White]

This is what happens when the private sector is brought in to run something that should be public. Private prisons are another example.

+1

[Tacachale]

St. Johns (and Clay and Nassau) have about the same school millage rate as Jacksonville, and have for years. The total millage rate in St. Johns is actually lower than in Jacksonville. The difference is in their respective populations and what they have to spend their money on.

School millage in St. John's is 7.228. It's 7.117 in Duval, set to go down 2%.

You are correct, however, there is more property ownership, proportionally.

Yes, exactly. The school millage is going down in St. Johns, too. I believe the reductions are mostly statewide and coming from the mandatory state collection, so I'm not sure how it will actually affect the budget. Either way, the difference isn't in the tax rate.

One thing that St. Johns does do is take money for new schools out of impact fees for new development. It's come back to bite them when growth slows down, but for now it's allowed them to greatly expand their system, which is their key attraction.

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

One thing that St. Johns does do is take money for new schools out of impact fees for new development. It's come back to bite them when growth slows down, but for now it's allowed them to greatly expand their system, which is their key attraction.

Kind of off-topic but still relevant (though rhetorical) question:  Why doesn't Jacksonville collect impact fees from developers? 

[benmarcus]

Yes, exactly. The school millage is going down in St. Johns, too. I believe the reductions are mostly statewide and coming from the mandatory state collection, so I'm not sure how it will actually affect the budget. Either way, the difference isn't in the tax rate.

Ah, ok. Well I have an email in to my school board member and the superintendent for an answer about why there was a 2% reduction when there are copious spending needs. Have yet to receive a response, but that's good to know and may be the answer.