Jaguars amphitheater, flex field construction to begin next month

[finehoe]

RattlerGator....what is your response to this?

This:  "Hey, if Big Daddy Shad wants it, I'm all in!"

The fault for this doesn't lie with Shad Khan, or the Jaguars.

Never said it did, just predicting RG's response.

[KenFSU]

RattlerGator....what is your response to this?

This:  "Hey, if Big Daddy Shad wants it, I'm all in!"

The fault for this doesn't lie with Shad Khan, or the Jaguars.

Never said it did, just predicting RG's response.

Sorry! Wasn't my intention to put words in your mouth.

[vicupstate]

And if your only way of getting said concert tickets is to purchase football tickets you don't want, that's gotta be an antitrust violation.

You realize the NFL is a legal monopoly, right?

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

I'm on my phone,  so I'm not going to quote bits and pieces,  but how does this differ from the stadium tickets?   Do you not think that if they could sell every seat in a season ticket package they would?   That would mean zero tickets available for the GP to see games in a publicly financed venue.   This is the same exact thing, only at a smaller scale.   I don't understand the outrage.

Maybe you're looking at the wrong part of the original quote.

No.  I think I get it.  Everbank is a publicly financed stadium.  If the Jaguars sold every seat to season-ticket holders, then there would be ZERO seats available for the general public.  So I'm just a casual fan of football, but don't care for the Jaguars, but now I have to commit to a team I don't care for to be able to go to one game I want?  I see it as the same thing.


And don't mistaken my understanding of the article to imply that I agree with it, but it makes sense to me why/how they're doing what they're doing.  Being a season ticket holder is really no different than buying a sponsorship/membership to the Jax Symphony - you get prioritized seating and early purchase opportunities for every event that aren't available to the GP.

I also agree with Vic that this is being interpreted as a stadium upgrade and not a standalone amphitheater, at least from Aug to Jan. 

[KenFSU]

From the Times-Union:

http://jacksonville.com/sports/2017-01-27/starting-monday-through-feb-28-jaguars-season-ticket-holders-can-renew-without

An added benefit for season-ticket holders will be getting first dibs on buying tickets for events at Daily's Place, which opens May 27.

"It's the way we like to do business – support the people that support us," Lamping said. "We need to do everything we can to make sure, when somebody spends their hard-earned money to buy season tickets for the Jacksonville Jaguars, they get as much value as they can. To some, it might not mean anything; to others, it may mean everything."

It is conceivable diehard music fans may buy Jaguars season tickets for the sole purpose of gaining premium seats to the estimated 30-35 events at the amphitheater.

This is so incredibly wrong, it blows my mind that people don't seem up in arms about this on social media or in the comments.

[RattlerGator]

This:  "Hey, if Big Daddy Shad wants it, I'm all in!"

. . . just predicting RG's response.

And doing a fairly good job of it. My compliments, finehoe [there's something about typing out that name that is . . . agreeable] on this beautiful North Florida winter day.

KenFSU, I've been burdened with a Windows 10 / internet connection issue much of the week -- and trees down from the Sunday Tallahassee storm that was scarier than the damn Hurricane Hermine -- so forgive me if I'm overly short but . . . you? In the Bitch and Moan Brigade? Daayyyuuuummm.

What are the mathematical certainties applicable here, hmmm? Wouldn't it be prudent to see if any actual problems arise, hmmm? Highly unlikely, I suspect.

Mmmm hmmmm.

Lemme see, here: 40+ major events per year, from a wide range of acts young and old. Season ticket holders top off at 50K max, or thereabouts. Very high demand from that group for any one show would very rarely approach 5 percent of total season ticket holders. That means 2500 seats claimed for a *high* demand show. Leaving 3000 damn seats for the general public, right? And I highly doubt if there won't be some algorithm utilized that spreads those first come, first serve seats out throughout the amphitheater and a healthy mix reserved (even if on the down low) for the general public.

Upshot? Calm the hell down, gang. Not to get all Stephen Dare on y'all but this seems like an incredibly provincial response to a major, major positive announcement for our city. Remember, the man (Lamping) was doing something of a sales job in his pitch. You know, bidness.

Serious bidness, in fact.

Quite smart, if you ask me, and not surprising for a world class businessman such as Lamping. Frankly, I'm very pleased I may have a priority shot at some Tedeschi Trucks tickets. Maybe we could have a MetroJax pre-party an ever'thang -- SeeWhutUmSayin' ? ? ? Sure you do. Now, back to my Windows 10 issues.

[remc86007]

I agree with RG. This could very well just be a sales pitch. Let's wait and see if this is actually a problem, as I imagine it will be fairly obvious if it happens.

[KenFSU]

This:  "Hey, if Big Daddy Shad wants it, I'm all in!"

. . . just predicting RG's response.

And doing a fairly good job of it. My compliments, finehoe [there's something about typing out that name that is . . . agreeable] on this beautiful North Florida winter day.

KenFSU, I've been burdened with a Windows 10 / internet connection issue much of the week -- and trees down from the Sunday Tallahassee storm that was scarier than the damn Hurricane Hermine -- so forgive me if I'm overly short but . . . you? In the Bitch and Moan Brigade? Daayyyuuuummm.

What are the mathematical certainties applicable here, hmmm? Wouldn't it be prudent to see if any actual problems arise, hmmm? Highly unlikely, I suspect.

Mmmm hmmmm.

Lemme see, here: 40+ major events per year, from a wide range of acts young and old. Season ticket holders top off at 50K max, or thereabouts. Very high demand from that group for any one show would very rarely approach 5 percent of total season ticket holders. That means 2500 seats claimed for a *high* demand show. Leaving 3000 damn seats for the general public, right? And I highly doubt if there won't be some algorithm utilized that spreads those first come, first serve seats out throughout the amphitheater and a healthy mix reserved (even if on the down low) for the general public.

Upshot? Calm the hell down, gang. Not to get all Stephen Dare on y'all but this seems like an incredibly provincial response to a major, major positive announcement for our city. Remember, the man (Lamping) was doing something of a sales job in his pitch. You know, bidness.

Serious bidness, in fact.

Quite smart, if you ask me, and not surprising for a world class businessman such as Lamping. Frankly, I'm very pleased I may have a priority shot at some Tedeschi Trucks tickets. Maybe we could have a MetroJax pre-party an ever'thang -- SeeWhutUmSayin' ? ? ? Sure you do. Now, back to my Windows 10 issues.

Looking around the 'nets, I'll admit that I'm clearly in the minority in finding priority sales to season-ticket holders so outrageous. It's not my MO to get in a tizzy over public-private partnership. I defended FHP. I've defended the Jags on the stadium improvements, Daily's Place, the Shipyards, and Met Park. But that line from Lamping about season ticket holders potentially purchasing all tickets to a show before they are made available to the general public, to me, flew in the face of the way this project was angled from day one. Others may have interpreted it differently, but the way that I've always understood the $45 million ask was that Jacksonville would get a new publicly-owned events venue, managed by a Jags-appointed production company. The city would have access to shows that have bypassed the market for years, and the Jags would get a cut of event revenue and the opportunity to draw more fans in for long weekends. Instead, it sounds like the publicly owned venue has, for all intents and purposes, been surrendered to the Jags to do with as they please.

It's impossible to know how many season ticket holders will purchase tickets to each event, but I take one issue with your math. It assumes one ticket purchase per season ticket holder. Who goes to a concert alone? Their +1 might be a fellow season ticket holder, or it might be +3 friends who don't own season tickets. I don't even have a problem with your estimate of 2,500 (the Jags financed half of the venue, let them offer up to half of the tickets to season ticket holders), but there's nothing 50/50 about regular events exclusive to season ticket holders. And you're right, it could be no problem at all. But it could also be a very visible, very divisive problem if the biggest shows don't have tickets available to the general public.

I think we, myself included, need more clarity before making a final call.

Here are my main questions:

1) Was the City Council informed of the fact that tickets would be offered up first to season ticket holders prior to agreeing to fund the project? If so, why wasn't this news shared with the community?

2) Will the city to be free to host its own events at the Daily's Place complex, or is Bold now the sole promoter for the venue?

3) How many tickets is each season ticket holder allowed to purchase?

4) is there really no cap on the percentage of tickets that can be pre-sold to season ticket holders?

5) Will there be a mechanism in place to prevent season ticket holders from buying up tickets for high demand shows and selling them on the secondary market?

If the answers to questions #2, 3, 4 and 5 are no, 2+, yes,  and no, then I think we've created a really messy situation.

If the answers are yes, 1-2, <50%, and yes then I take no issue at all.

Not trying to be a hater, I just think the new amphitheater should be a venue readily accessible to all. 5,500 isn't a lot of seats, particularly when you account for boxes, suites, etc.

Also, math is cool, and so is Windows 10

[Westside Guy]

Surely they only mean the concerts on the Saturdays before the games. If that is the case and the Jaguars are paying for all of the expenses, I'm ok with it. But if they start talking about doing this for every event hosted there, we have a serious problem on our hands. There is $45 million of public funds tied up in that building, it should open for everyone to use. But to be honest, I don't think the Jaguars are dumb enough to only let season ticket holders use it year round. They know that would make them enemy number one around these parts.

[Keith-N-Jax]

Yeah, lets wait and see if there's more information.

[RattlerGator]

Well, I'm now dealing with the black screen of death on my desktop -- arrrgggghhh.

But, about this latest: Ken, come on! For real? Come on, man.

First: "It assumes one ticket purchase per season ticket holder." No, I don't think it does. It assumes the season ticket holding fanbase will account for no more than 50 percent of seats purchased for high-demand events. And I think that's a pretty safe presumption. But, even if using your example, you do realize, right, that an individual season ticket holder right now accounts for (on average) 1-4 tickets? So, really, your issue is already factored in via that calculation as well IMHO.

More importantly, the maddening thing about this board are the people who seem to have some default position where the public-private partnership is involved. The public sector practically NEVER has greater expertise than the private sector. Only in very limited situations will this not be true. This should mean the public sector partner is NEVER driving the train. Their role is to have certain protections of the taxpayer's money in place but, otherwise, and yes this is a broad generalization, get the hell out of the way and allow the private sector to do its thing.

Why this is the least bit problematic is beyond me. This instinct for public sector hectoring and micromanaging of these partnerships is bizarre. You don't get into a partnership like this, one designed to do precisely what this partnership has accomplished, to tie the damn hands of the private sector.

Brothers and Sisters of the proletariat, let me assure you of one thing -- if the Jaguars season ticket holders claim every damn one of those tickets for every damn one of those events, that's a very good problem for downtown Jacksonville to have. That means our urban core is HOPPING with thousands more seeking nightlife many more nights of the year.

Quit over-thinking this. Just who in the hell do you think will be purchasing these high-priced tickets anyway? And complaining if they can't get into a 5500 seat venue? Seriously, quit over-thinking this.

Word to the wise: under President Trump, we're going to be seeing a bunch more of these partnerships. You urban core transportation freaks might as well set your outrage meter down and get to figuring out how the urban infrastructure can best take advantage of this historic moment.

[vicupstate]

These private-public partnerships are great opportunities for the public to get the short end of the stick. The city's job is to make sure it gets a return commensurate with the public investment, which in this case is 50%.  The public at large is investing in this facility and the  public at large should damn well better have an opportunity to buy a ticket for events WITHOUT having to buy a Season Ticket for the Jags. Period.

[JaxJersey-licious]

From the Times-Union:

http://jacksonville.com/sports/2017-01-27/starting-monday-through-feb-28-jaguars-season-ticket-holders-can-renew-without

An added benefit for season-ticket holders will be getting first dibs on buying tickets for events at Daily's Place, which opens May 27.

"It's the way we like to do business – support the people that support us," Lamping said. "We need to do everything we can to make sure, when somebody spends their hard-earned money to buy season tickets for the Jacksonville Jaguars, they get as much value as they can. To some, it might not mean anything; to others, it may mean everything."

It is conceivable diehard music fans may buy Jaguars season tickets for the sole purpose of gaining premium seats to the estimated 30-35 events at the amphitheater.

This is so incredibly wrong, it blows my mind that people don't seem up in arms about this on social media or in the comments.

You do realize that companies like American Express that have nothing to do with the building of a performance venue sell exclusive premium seats at venues that were also public-private projects so there is definitely precedent.

But more to your thought, we better tread carefully on this idea of Jaguar season ticket exclusivity. There is the possibility that a popular act willing to perform here can have all their tix purchased by season ticket holder only to release those tix into the highly marked up re-sell market to the detriment of true fans. Hopefully the fan base would see this possibility and lobby the artist and their management to keep this from happening. In an ideal world you can convince said artist to perform a second date at Daily's Place but a more likely unintended consequence is that the touring group will call the theater out on their prick move and go to St. Augustine or bow out of the First Coast altogether. I'm hoping that Lamping was having a Paul Spicer moment sand that he misspoke and that they're still working out ticket plans.

[JaxAvondale]

The Braves have recently started holding concerts at the end of some of their weekend night games. For me, it doesn't bother me if season ticket holders get first dibs being constantly sold out or a high demand for tickets would be a good thing for downtown.

[remc86007]

I know that the amphitheater will be the new hot place to have concerts, but if there are shows coming to town with vastly more demand than 5500 tickets, wouldn't they perform in the arena?