The JTA Skyway: Keep it or dump it?

[strider]

I wonder if by re-purposing and converting to more conventional street car types, would the 38.1 million have to be repaid? Is not the government giving funds out like they did for the people mover but today for street car?  Perhaps it would be a scenario ripe for a deal? Maybe Lake's idea would be the cheapest while actually being the best.

I disagree about the decommissioning cost though.  I read it as 79 million total - it mentions under scenario one that it would cost about 25Million to tear down the system. 

[Chris Hand]

If JTA plans to look at revitalizing the Skyway, I have to assume they will also look at the possibility of extending the system to ensure it covers as much of Downtown as possible.  While we know the cost of a Brooklyn extension since JTA previously applied for a TIGER grant for that potential project, does anyone know if they have estimated the costs for extending the Skyway to Springfield, the sports complex or at least to the eastern part of Downtown (where the Shipyards and former courthouse properties are primed for development)? It may well be that cost, projected ridership, or other reasons make these extensions problematic, but I would think that a major goal of any Skyway reboot is comprehensive intra-Downtown transit.   

[fieldafm]

If JTA plans to look at revitalizing the Skyway, I have to assume they will also look at the possibility of extending the system to ensure it covers as much of Downtown as possible.  While we know the cost of a Brooklyn extension since JTA previously applied for a TIGER grant for that potential project, does anyone know if they have estimated the costs for extending the Skyway to Springfield, the sports complex or at least to the eastern part of Downtown (where the Shipyards and former courthouse properties are primed for development)? It may well be that cost, projected ridership, or other reasons make these extensions problematic, but I would think that a major goal of any Skyway reboot is comprehensive intra-Downtown transit.   

A Brooklyn extension doesn't have to cost what JTA's TIGER grant application called for (which included another elevated platform). TIGER grants have a minimum threshold and a lot of those plans were padded to meet that threshold (nothing you don't already know).

If the Skyway was retofitted with another type of transportation mode, a San Marco extension would offer the next most bang for the buck, particularly if the tracks were dropped down to grade (terminating at Atlantic Blvd). A good chunk of the ROW is attainable and there are TOD opportunities that could help offset the cost. You're essentially then connecting an already vibrant, walkable town center with downtown.

[thelakelander]

^And help fuel additional redevelopment and infill on Kings between the Kings Avenue garage and Atlantic Boulevard.

[spuwho]

All I ask is that when JTA makes the commitment (whatver form it takes)  is that COJ aligns its goals to support it through strat planning and TOD.

I understand peoples skepticism, however, we have a great opportunity to take advantage of our earlier shortcomings.

The fact that Nat Ford is even facilitating these interactions with the civic community is fantastic.

I am for any option that doesnt involve a tear down or conversion to a greenway.

[Charles Hunter]

Wouldn't an at grade streetcar crossing at the FEC have the same problem with schedule as bus crossings?

[Tacachale]

Wouldn't an at grade streetcar crossing at the FEC have the same problem with schedule as bus crossings?

I think the idea is that it would be elevated over the tracks then drop down to grade for the run to Atlantic.

[fieldafm]

^And help fuel additional redevelopment and infill on Kings between the Kings Avenue garage and Atlantic Boulevard.

Which is going to be an attractive redevelopment opportunity to someone that can assemble the land, particularly now that a highway exit will be close by (see Brooklyn/Forrest St).

[I-10east]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqH21LEmfbQ

[Cayotica@icloud.com]

I was very pleased to learn that we were getting on elevated transportation system in Jacksonville but I was disappointed that in reality it didn't go anywhere if we extend this out to the beaches and other parts of  Jacksonville I believe ridership will increase massively.

[AviationMetalSmith]

https://www.youtube.com/v/IL_ztPckuYU

Video from 1992^

[tpot]

Funny video.......1992 looks just like 2015.......an empty mover connecting nothing to nowhere......except now in 2015 JAX has way more vacant overgrown lots in downtown.........ahhhhhh progress........

[nanpowell]

Please don't put more money into this system; it is way too limited and has not proven successful for 20 years, so why do we think it will now?  A few short extensions will not make a difference.  Let's take a page from the High Line in NYC and repurpose the tracks for parks/bike paths/walking paths that can help the city's public spaces.  I know that means buying out the grant, but so be it.  Think Bigger, Jacksonville!

[thelakelander]

Trying to do a poor man's version of the High Line on narrow elevated infrastructure like the Skyway isn't thinking bigger.  It's being the same old Jax. Spending over $50 million in an attempt to further take people off downtown's empty sidewalks is taking steps back.  Looking to NYC for examples of best practices is a great thing and should be encouraged. However, before we start planning elevated parks, lets get some of the many basics right first. This would include better maintenance of existing parks, rightsizing existing streets, getting a few projects like the Trio off the ground, etc.


High Line - "notice the width"


Skyway - "notice the width"

[Thad Crowe]

Several sources (OK, Wikipedia) cite the High Line width as ranging between 30 and 50 feet, which is the same generally as the Skyway. A High Line would be transformative for downtown, who cares if it is derivative, it is a model worth copying. Make it an aerial artwalk & landscape it. Until I walked the High Line I had no idea how it would feel & plug into the city - it is a great feeling to hover mid-level like that.