Children in Prison: Chat With Hank Coxe and Gray Thomas

[ChriswUfGator]

I'm sure you are more than willing to let a child/teenager manage any number of "adult" responsibilities.

Not murdering someone is an 'adult responsibility' okay....

So answer his question.

Is NAMBLA correct and children do have the capacity to make adult decisions, or do you just make these logical equivocations when it empowers you to justify depriving others of their rights? You're making this a light switch issue and it isn't one.

[Stephen]

The bad news about the Juvenile "justice "System in Florida is that so many of the residential facilities are run by for profit companies like G4S, YSI and others which are just there for making money.Abuse is rampant and the accountability is run by a good old boys network which is full of coverups and lies. I have worked in a couple of facilities as a therapist and we therapists used to get into trouble with the administration for calling the DCF hotline to report abuse. To get a good look at this do what they said during Watergate ...."Follow the Money"...

[Stephen]

The administration would not want us to call the DCF Hotline so they would make life difficult for us after we did...Therapists are "mandated reporters " in Florida which means we would have to report suspected abuse or get in trouble but the agencies didn't want us calling..I called several times from home so the call would not be traced to my office..Its all a big mess.

[I-10east]

Is NAMBLA correct and children do have the capacity to make adult decisions, or do you just make these logical equivocations when it empowers you to justify depriving others of their rights? You're making this a light switch issue and it isn't one.

Like I said, murdering people isn't an 'adult decision'. It's even more scarier when kids kill people; Many kids like that are basically 'irreversible' when it comes to being a citizen. Normal kids don't murder people. I'm not 'depriving' anyone dude, they're depriving themselves....

[I-10east]

For the record, I don't think that Christian Fernandez should have been thrown is an adult jail, or that Jax actually has a major problem with young teenage killers (15 or younger) like a Chicago. Hopefully that will kinda calm down the wolfpack of people who is after me....

[Stephen]

The real issue is how incarcerating kids is now a major business and "making a profit" at companies at G4S and Youth Services International is more important than providing good therapy and keeping kids safe.

[JayBird]

^ I disagree. You can say the exact same things about adult facilities (both prisons, state and private, and mental health facilities). Florida has very good whistleblower protection for those whom stand up, it's just easier to hide in the shadows. The reason most of these things don't progress is because the whistleblower backs out before enough proof can be found. Now that may be partially from employer intimidation (though I'd be surprised if more than 10% of complaints were from such actions) but for the most part it's just the individual doesn't have all the info or they don't feel the investigative services are moving quick enough for them.

Just catching up here ... Where did the NAMBLA link come in? Or was that just here in the comments? Because they seem like two different topics.

[Stephen]

I know a nurse who worked for G4S and she reported abuse and the Whistleblower law did not protect her...I remember being told by a Youth Care Worker that if I were ever attacked he wouldn't move too quickly to protect me because I had called the DCF Hotline a few days before. The system is very corrupt.

[JayBird]

^ I don't work in, but I work alongside that same system. There will always be some instances in every industry where there are those whom mistreat others below them. I feel that to blanket the entire industry as you have in your statements is inaccurate and misleading. However, assuming that the "system" is rife with corruption, please forward any such claims to me and I will assure you they will get in the right hands to be handled. I am a firm believer that any government agency must have strong oversight because there is so much possibility for mistreatment. Next time you hear someone make those claims, if you could call me and put me in touch with them I'd greatly appreciate it. A lot has been done to change that "system" you don't like in the last 5 years, And I'll do just about anything to not see that hard work and effort that myself and others battled so hard for be for nothing.

Jason Bird
904-773-3466 cell (24/7)
jebird@ymail.com

[JayBird]

I acknowledged that there are and will probably always be some instances of abuse. However I don't feel it's right to blanket an entire industry with guilt based on the acts of the few. Yes there are bad management practices, and these incidents get brought to the light and are then corrected. Just 10 years ago this story would've never made it even to the facility warden let alone public press, in my opinion that in itself is quite an accomplishment.

Is there an industry, public or private, that has no abuse? No corruption? Yet there are millions of good businesses out there with sound management and high ethics. Those stories just aren't juicy enough for the 5o'clock news.

[JayBird]

I cannot comment on those exact cases because with a little bit of research one would find that I am a moderator for the victims and this is a public forum. What you interpret as specific details, I see are just regurgitated information from press releases that were all released months ago. It should be noted that the most recent case occurred in 2012, and a lot has been changed since then. YSI is by no means innocent, but they are being penalized in what is appropriate in the eyes of the law. Stephen alluded to the fact that these coverups and employee harassment practices are still happening ... Which is why I provided my contact information because that goes against what both sides have been reporting for the past 18 or so months.

[Stephen]

I am not going to say "I told you so" because that would be gloating and we must remember that there are victims involved..I also want you to all know that YSI or Youth Services International was recently awarded the contract for Duval House or as it is now called Duval Academy so this agency is now here in Jacksonville. I would never call Jaybird because I have seen many people offer to help only to be a part of this sick system.
Follow the money.....G4S, YSI and AMIKids are all part of this game.

[Stephen]

I also urge you to Google "Milton Girl's Academy" and you can watch a video of a correctional officer abusing a child. The facility was closed but that is just the tip of the iceberg. DJJ is closing facilities and several YSI facilities have been closed but as I stated YSI was just rewarded the contract at Duval House in Jacksonville a facility that has always had problems. Its new name is now Duval Academy....Follow the money !

[Stephen]

and you all know how our wonder governor made his millions.

[JayBird]

Actually I have testified against YSI specifically and a few others you mentioned. I am not in their corner nor do I feel they do an adequate job. But those are my feelings. They differ from facts. The fact is that's old news. And Duval Academy doesn't even house 30 boys ... I think they only have a capacity of like 25 or so (not 100% positive, but it's extremely small). Follow the money would imply that there is a benefit of monetary funds by not reporting incidents. This was true, however all contracts after September 1, 2012 had that removed. And ALL contracts with YSI and G4S that are currently active came after this date. As a matter of fact, private companies that have reported abuse after a March 1, 2013 enactment to DJJ contracts actually receive monetary benefits for reporting abuse. I will repeat that, if a private company reports abuse the DJJ provides additional funding to finance victim services, replace the offending employee, the local Public Defense Fund is also paid funds from DJJ to help prosecute those offenders, and a payment is made to the managing private company for keeping on top of it. Because the program is barely a year old it is still too early to say if it is working, but if you "follow the money" that will actually take you to the reporting abuse side of things. This didn't happen overnight. And it isn't over, there is still much left to be changed. But keep in mind this all started from a 2006 investigation that revealed that facilities operated by DJJ were some of the worst in the nation. Children were being beat to death, buried and claimed as runaways.  It should also be noted that just last year DJJ finished privatizing all of their facilities, not as a cost saving measure, but because abuse was so much more rampant in those state run facilities. My argument isn't that there is not abuse, there is. But "following the money" is a callous attempt at brushing a big issue under the rug. It is the mentality of the employees whom are responsible for guarding the door that creates the most problems.  On Christmas week I was called into the PDF (the downtown jail) to sit in on a meeting that concerned a 19 year old female prisoner whom was assaulted by a male officer. Where do we follow the money there? In 2012 14% of all state inmates were assaulted by a guard who was found to be in the wrong, compared to less than 1% in private institutions, where do we follow the money there? Here is the situation: when someone gets accused of abuse in a private institution that person is suspended and ultimately terminated. In a state run facility that person is reassigned during investigation and moved to another facility if found at fault.

As for YSI specifically I do not like them, but not for the quality of life they provide, it's because I don't agree with the quality of care they give. Instead of individualized treatment their business plan is more focused on babysitting, collecting the paycheck, and releasing them at the end of the term. Much like the foster care system, educational system and most other institutionalized industries within our country.

I would never call Jaybird because I have seen many people offer to help only to be a part of this sick system.

As for this ... Well all I can say is that if you can sleep at night knowing that someone is being wronged and you have the power to stop it but don't, than good for you. Unfortunately, especially in the private sector people report cases of abuse. They bring in info and people like me feel we have a great case against the agency. Then we find out they embellished a little, or that it was all started not because an act of abuse but because that employee was degraded by their supervisor in front of others or some like situation. That gets discouraging, but it doesn't stop me, the other volunteers, or the state investigative authorities from doing our jobs. Like I said in the beginning, there are feelings and facts. You can hate a company, you can hate an industry, heck we live in a country that allows you to hate whomever you want and actually publicly vocalize that which is why we are a great civilization. But that also means that we live in a country that provides benefit of doubt, innocence until facts prove otherwise, and sometimes the good guys don't win. It is slightly more involved than just saying "follow the money", though I know and understand why that is a sexy tag line, it is also an injustice to those being victimized not by ones seeking profit, but by individuals craving power and dominance over others. And that, in my own opinion is the real problem.