Amtrak: Flagler Line Will Happen

[tufsu1]

Could the cars be moved from the old black waiting room to outside under a temporary structure (if the space were shared for a few years)?

guess that would be up to the local dealers association...but assuming you are suggesting the waiting room get used for Greyhound, where would all the buses park (last night there were at least 10 buses at the Greyhound station when I drove by at 10pm)?

[tufsu1]

It is not so much whether the building could handle conventions, Amtrak, and intercity bus, but whether the convention folks (Visitor Bureau and SMG) will allow multi-use.  Could the Fair Grounds handle the events listed above?

My guess is that they will if the Mayor and Council say they will.

wrong...the out of town conferences and trade shows will go somewhere else

Which conference do you think we would lose? Don't we mostly book traveling shows that want to hit every city they can?

If it is an image thing don't start with local bus service other than a normal bus stop.  Integrate the more choice transit options first.

I do think the logic is flawed.  I love the St. Louis convention center because transit converges there.

Jeffrey...I too like the idea that transit converges at a convention center....but that is different from sharing the same space.

There are many conventions that Jax. routinely hosted in the past that have been lost just due to outgrowing the Prime....one example is the state cheerleading competition....many conventions/conferences like using the grand hall (old train station lobby space) as a banquet area.....if that were once again used for trains, the space wouldn't be available....which might be enough to tilt the scales againt Jax. for some conventions.

Bottom line, Jax. needs to step up to the plate, commit to relocationg the convention center and get a plan in place fast....if that isn't feasible, then add onto the back of the Prime for more convention space.....then convert the front of the Prime back to its original purpose and become the multimodal center.

If, in the meantime, Greyhound has to move.....fine, put them in the block next to the Skyway (between Forsyth and Houston).

[thelakelander]

Could the cars be moved from the old black waiting room to outside under a temporary structure (if the space were shared for a few years)?

guess that would be up to the local dealers association...but assuming you are suggesting the waiting room get used for Greyhound, where would all the buses park (last night there were at least 10 buses at the Greyhound station when I drove by at 10pm)?

I was specifically envisioning Amtrak but if we're talking about Greyhound, I think one of the three blocks on the northside of Bay (between I-95 and Lee Street) could be designed to accommodate their needs while also being integrated with the skyway.

[JeffreyS]

I think we need to do some assessment of what we might lose (conventions and shows that are here or realistic to return) versus what we would gain by moving forward on the proper transit center.  I am not claiming to know if the shows we currently have would be upset or not.  I also don't know if the city garners much benefit from our small amount of convention space business.  I would like to think bundled uses could drive more life into the area.

[tufsu1]

that makes sense and could work for Amtrak....I thought you were talking about Greyhound as that was one of Ock's suggestions earlier in the thread.....I think there is less of a perception problem in Amtrak mixing with a convention center than there is with Greyhound.

[JeffreyS]

that makes sense and could work for Amtrak....I thought you were talking about Greyhound as that was one of Ock's suggestions earlier in the thread.....I think there is less of a perception problem in Amtrak mixing with a convention center than there is with Greyhound.

Yeah maybe one step at a time.

[iMarvin]

I''m happy they finally made a decision. I can't wait until the train is running, and hopefully the station will be downtown.

[Ralph W]

If one of the things worrying certain people is the so-called undesirable element associated with bus stations, or Greyhound bus stations in particular, then forcing mixed transportation to co-mingle at the Prime is a good thing.

Dilution of the stereotyped individuals and consolidation of policing efforts instead of the gross separation now planned will be a cost saving benefit.

Why is it so hard to see that when the traveling public can step easily from one mode of transportation to another, without chasing the ride for blocks and without a route navigation nightmare, everyone benefits and public transportation looses its under class status.

[Jaxson]

I am sending the following email to my city council member ---

Dear Mr. Bishop,
I would like to know where you stand on returning the Amtrak passenger rail station to the historic Union Terminal building at the Prime Osborn Convention Center.  I believe that it is important that our local and state authorities take action to relocate the passenger rail station from Clifford Lane in some form for the following reasons:
1. The current Clifford Lane station is isolated from meaningful modes of transportation and services.  Having traveled by train to other cities, I have a great appreciation of being able to access lodging, retail and ground transportation from stations such as those that are located in Orlando, Tampa, Boston, Washington DC, New York and others.  For example, when I spent my spring break in New York, I was able to arrive at Penn Station and was able to hail a taxi to a nearby hotel for less than $15.  Furthermore, I was able to have lunch at a nearby midtown Manhattan restaurant.  Relocating Amtrak to the Union Terminal would enable rail passengers to access downtown hotels, stores and restaurants.  They would be able to best avail themselves of the Skyway and other means of getting around the immediate area.
2. With plans underway for Amtrak to operate passenger rail lines on the FEC tracks, it would make more sense for a central location for trains to run on CSX and FEC tracks from downtown Jacksonville.  Our local elected leaders have been woefully silent on this issue that has gotten more traction in other cities on the FEC route that have taken action to make their stations more efficient and accessible.
Please contact me with your thoughts.  Thank you and have a nice day.
v/r,
//signed//
John Louis Meeks, Jr.
Constituent

[Jaxson]

As of today, no response from my city council member's office...  DRAT!

[Jaxson]

Here is the reply that I received from City Councilman Bishop...

Mr. Meeks:  I think it would be fantastic if Amtrak relocated back to the former train station/now convention center.  This facility was designed as a train station and it would  be great for the convention center as well.  It is my understanding that Amtrak would like to do this and that it is in JTA's master plan for the multi-modal transportation center at that location.

William Bishop, AIA
Council Member, District 2

[blizz01]

Profound.

[Jaxson]

Indeed.

[Ocklawaha]

Here is the reply that I received from City Councilman Bishop...

Mr. Meeks:  I think it would be fantastic if Amtrak relocated back to the former train station/now convention center.  This facility was designed as a train station and it would  be great for the convention center as well.  It is my understanding that Amtrak would like to do this and that it is in JTA's master plan for the multi-modal transportation center at that location.

William Bishop, AIA
Council Member, District 2

Boing! 

Perhaps it would be better to resend the letter explaining to Mr. Bishop that JTA's pending grant for "A new Greyhound Station" will completely undermine the very concept of a transportation center. 

[Dashing Dan]

Will this project and/or the commuter rail project involve the replacement of the existing FEC RR bridge over the St. Johns River? 

If so, then I'd like to see the existing bridge adapted for re-use by bicyclists and pedestrians. 

It's flat, so it would be an ideal way for non-drivers to get across the river.