Brown's Team Suggests Trolley System in DT; Would It Be Another Skyway?

[peestandingup]

rather than waiting and hoping that my hometown is somehow going to miraculously come to its senses.

Nothing against you personally.. but frankly, this town needs more people that will make it happen and less people sitting around waiting for it to happen.

No matter where you live or what you do in life... you have to be the change you want to see.  No one else is going to do it for you.

True, but if your city leaders & the population in general aren't on the same page, then it's extremely difficult (almost impossible). You can be out there everyday, but if the people don't want it, it'll never happen. And this place is a very "we like things the way they are" city from what I've gathered the last few years of being here.

Jacksonville is so big & spread out now, that unfortunately hardly anyone in the "city of Jacksonville" actually cares about downtown. They have no vested interest in it being a viable place that you would visit (or live in) day to day.

Its a horrible byproduct from our uncontrolled sprawl & growth, that I'm not sure how you fix.

[Tacachale]

There is certainly change we can accomplish. Take a look at Orlando. They have a similar, if not worse, sprawl problem than we do and an even higher percentage of its metro area that didn't care about downtown due to all the other things to do in the area. And they had the additional problem of a significantly higher percentage of their metro area (and therefore their tax base) living outside the city limits and even Orange County. And yet they've managed a very impressive revitalization of their downtown over the last ten years or so, and it's alive at all times of day.

What I'm saying is, don't sell people short. There are enough of us who care to sustain at least a modest revival. If Orlando managed to do it, there is absolutely no reason we can't. Whether or not it's worth it to you to keep fighting the good fight, or to stick around to see the fruit of your labors, it is an attainable goal.

[fieldafm]

True, but if your city leaders & the population in general aren't on the same page, then it's extremely difficult (almost impossible). You can be out there everyday, but if the people don't want it, it'll never happen. And this place is a very "we like things the way they are" city from what I've gathered the last few years of being here.

I am a nobody. I live in a very unassuming house.  I do not come from money.  I have very little of my own frankly and I do not have a namesake becoming of high society.  I am the anti-thesis of the 'good ol boy' network here in town.

But just last week I secured buy-in from local merchants and JSO regarding a street festival in Riverside in September and sparked an introduction that I believe will bring life to a spot downtown that had none before.

All you have to do is try.  If you are motivated, change is actually quite attainable. 

[iluvolives]

But just last week I secured buy-in from local merchants and JSO regarding a street festival in Riverside in September and sparked an introduction that I believe will bring life to a spot downtown that had none before.

Cool- can't wait to hear more about this!

[exnewsman]

I am baffled by the fascination with taking the Skyway to the stadium. There is plenty of on site parking for all the events NOT at the stadium. And there is a viable working system in place to get people to the stadium now in a cost effective manner for the 10-15 days the stadium is actually in use.

If the Shipyards project was in play, or the Fairgrounds property was going to be leveraged for a hotel/condo project or simply anything that has people in that area 365, rather than a dozen days a year - then maybe. But we don't. Longterm if a new Matthews Bridge is built and the Skyway was extended across the river to Regency/Arlington - sure. There are potential riders there.

I'm all for adding to the Skyway IF it goes somewhere where there are people to use it daily - Springfield/Shands; San Marco (although I do wonder about ridership from a SM extension). Perhaps an extension from the SM station to Baptist.

Someone - I think it was Ock - suggested awhile back about putting the streetcar line up the middle of Main St. I still think that's a viable option. Main St. is coming along. Movign in the right direction and a streetcar lien could help development there. Adding a line into Riverside also makes sense.

But I think we need to put this idea of a Skyway extension to the Sports Complex on hold indefinitiely. To me, it just doesn't makes sense (financially or practically). Ride the stadium shuttle - it works just fine and has ever since the Jaguars have been in town. Not to mention save us $100M

[thelakelander]

To me a skyway extension to the stadium begins to make sense if you've invested in pentrating other areas of town with better mass transit first.  If not, you still have the same old problem of driving tons of miles and fighting through what gridlock Jax does have, only to park your car in downtown and take a ride for the last mile.  At that point, you're better off simply driving to the stadium.

[duvaldude08]

Didnt they tear up some old street car tracks on Main street when doing the streetscape project? How would we get a street car down main now since there are medians in the way?

[iMarvin]

Didnt they tear up some old street car tracks on Main street when doing the streetscape project? How would we get a street car down main now since there are medians in the way?

I don't think the median really determines anything. A single line streetcar track could probably be buily in side it. I don't think Main St is wide enough to have a line on both side of the streets, though.

[thelakelander]

They would have to rip Main back up and either rebuild it or place a double track system that shares lanes with cars.  Another option would be to run it a block east up Hubbard.

[blandman]

I am baffled by the fascination with taking the Skyway to the stadium. There is plenty of on site parking for all the events NOT at the stadium. And there is a viable working system in place to get people to the stadium now in a cost effective manner for the 10-15 days the stadium is actually in use.
... Ride the stadium shuttle - it works just fine and has ever since the Jaguars have been in town. Not to mention save us $100M

I rode the shuttle to/from the Eagles/Jags' game last September and can't say I was too impressed.  Easy enough to get there, but took nearly an hour to go the 2.2 miles from the stadium to the drop-off near Prime Osborne afterwards.  Not the worst system in the world, but seems pretty silly to be sitting on a bus in traffic for an hour to go 2.2 miles when Jacksonville has a great system that, if extended 1 more mile, would make that same trip in 5 mins...all the time.

[dougskiles]

The primary benefit of an efficient public transportation (and one that seems to be most overlooked by the opponents) relates to the workforce.  Whenever I ride the skyway, I am one of the few who do so by choice.  Most don't have access to a car or can't drive one.  So, what we seem to be telling them is - don't hang out at Hemming Plaza all day, go get a job!  But when you do, expect to take 2 to 3 hrs to get to and from work.

I met a guy recently on a hot Saturday waiting for the train to cross San Marco Blvd.  He lived on the north side and was working on the south bank.  I asked him why he was on this side of the tracks.  Because it was Saturday, the skyway was not running.  To get to Kings Avenue Station he would have had to go all the way to Regency and back.  So he takes the bus to San Marco Square and then walks back up.  Surely we can do better than that.

[Ocklawaha]

Stories like this are found onboard every bus in town Doug. Bottom line is that JTA is FIRST a highway builder/agency and SECOND a mass transit operator, historically like trying to be a Baptist and Catholic at the same time, similar but often at odds. The highway press never misses a cheap shot at the transit media and transit is microscopic in a side by side compareson. JTA NEEDS TO BE OUT OF THE TRANSIT BUSINESS and TRANSIT NEEDS TO BE A LOCAL CITY AGENCY.

OCKLAWAHA

[thelakelander]

I'm starting to come around with Ock on this one.  The expiration of the gas tax can't come fast enough, imo.  It's going to force a complete change on how roadway building and transit  is handled in this town, which is well overdue.  Can't wait for the debates to go mainstream.

[thelakelander]

I've seen it all now.  A guy has actually made an argument that Portland, San Diego and Charlotte are all transit failures that have not stimulated any TOD.  I guess what I rode on, walked through and photographed last week was pure fantasy.

I guess I photoshopped the San Diego images posted below:

[Tacachale]

Seriously lake, you should submit your concerns in a letter for the opinions page. At least there you have the potential to reach some folks without such deeply entrenched backwardness. You'll get nothing but an ulcer continuing to spar with the simps in the comments section.