SunRail costs up by almost $5 million because of Scott's delay

[Ocklawaha]

The Arthur Ravenel Jr. Bridge in Charleston is 186 feet above mean high water, Bridge of the America's is 190, but a ship of 205 feet (and there will be some) can clear at low water, and it sets the limits on the Post Panamax Ships.

Savannah's Talmadge Memorial Bridge is east of the entire port facility, but it too is 185 feet. The benefits for

Leave it to JTA to ignore the cry's of the entire maritime industry and throw a wrench into the wheels of progress for 1/2 of the state. Dames Point, Captain Broward Bridge, is but 160 feet above mean high water and probably not a hell of a lot more at low tide, since our tides can usually be measured with a yard stick.

Never the less there are benefits in using Jax over all of the others:

Same 2 rail carriers north, south, and west from the port as found in Savannah, Charleston, or Norfolk.

A well developed port facility EAST of the bridge with NO overhead clearence problems.

148 rail miles closer to PANAMA then Savannah
249 rail miles closer to PANAMA then Charleston
672 rail miles closer to PANAMA then Norfolk
and
366 rail miles closer to every point in the USA north of Jacksonville then Miami

Arguably better Interstate and Highway Connections

Higher trade zone population


OCKLAWAHA

[thelakelander]

So, despite the rail assets, we're at a disadvantage to Norfolk, Charleston and Savannah because they can already accommodate panamax ships?

[spuwho]

So, despite the rail assets, we're at a disadvantage to Norfolk, Charleston and Savannah because they can already accommodate panamax ships?

While the Talmadge has the clearance, the Savannah River has a dredging issue for Panamax. To maintain channel depth the dredgers would have to run almost 24x7 to maintain the draft.  IMHO, having Panamax come up the Savannah is almost laughable. The current ships already dwarf the river and tower above the city even though it sits on a bluff.  I saw a cruise dock move up 3 feet when a ship came by as it displaced so much water in such a narrow channel.

Norfolk has no rail disadvantage, it has a distance to port issue. NS has just finished raising or daylighting their tunnels through the Appalachians to clear the double stacks. Charleston has a rail issue as only CSX can service the Navy Yard and they have already admitted that they would have to hump a majority of the containers in Atlanta, already a congested rail freight arterial.

Charleston has already admitted that they will be a prime port for "timed freight", for shippers who need to expedite off loading to make up for the farther to port distance.

Jacksonville is really in a position to be the best of all worlds.

[Ocklawaha]

I agree, something I mentioned to you in the past Lake. Savannah's river channel at the bridge is only 700 feet from shore to shore... AT DOWNTOWN JACKSONVILLE'S MAIN STREET BRIDGE we have a clear 1,250 feet. 

So Panamax in those confines? Well?

Length

Over all (including protrusions): 950 ft (289.56 m) Exceptions:

    * Container ship and passenger ship: 965 ft (294.13 m)
    * Tug-barge combination, rigidly connected: 900 ft (274.32 m) over all
    * Other non-self-propelled vessels-tug combination: 850 ft (259.08 m) over all

I think we win this one by the Grace of God!

OCKLAWAHA

[Jdog]

SunRail Backers Plan to Lobby Rick Scott

Orlando Mayor Buddy Dyer and a host of other Central Florida leaders are trying today to revive the SunRail commuter train stalled by Gov. Rick Scott.

Dyer and the panel overseeing the $1.2 billion project will meet this afternoon to talk about ways to show Scott that the region really wants the 61-mile system built.

Scott, who put SunRail on hold in January, told a Congressional hearing last week that he was studying whether the community supports the train that would link downtown Orlando with Volusia, Seminole and Osceola counties.

Scott, who intends to announce his decision no later than July, previously said he was reviewing the return taxpayers might expect from SunRail.

Dyer, who met last week with Scott to discuss the train, will talk with members of the Central Florida Commuter Rail Commission that he chairs about how to impress the governor enough to get him to approve SunRail.

One way, he is expected to say, is to show the jobs it could create. One study estimates 4,200 construction jobs would be needed to get the train running. Millions of dollars worth of development is planned around the 17 stops, too.

Michael Kidd, vice president of the Greater Orlando Realtors Association, said research his group conducted indicates that property values typically jump in value around train stops. He said double-digit increases were fairly common in cities with trains, including Portland, Ore., Minneapolis, Charlotte, N.C., St. Louis, Tempe, Ariz., and Salt Lake City.

"It's just amazing to see," Kidd said.

Central Florida, he said, is in a real estate "malaise" and SunRail could help the region start climbing out of the development hole triggered by the recession.

He likely will forward his report to Scott. "We want to supply him with the rationale to make the right decision," Kidd said.

The train was supposed to be operating in 2013, but Scott's postponement has placed that startup in jeopardy.

The SunRail meeting, set for 3 p.m., will be held at Metroplan Orlando, One Landmark Center, 315 E. Robinson St., Suite 355.


http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/orange/os-sunrail-support-scott-20110418,0,3919699.story

[Jdog]

From my perspective, two interesting items:

1. The Governor is studying community support
2. Yes, I think we all agree re: the property value benefits, but I like the stress placed on that by the advocates. 

[thelakelander]

Michael Kidd, vice president of the Greater Orlando Realtors Association, said research his group conducted indicates that property values typically jump in value around train stops. He said double-digit increases were fairly common in cities with trains, including Portland, Ore., Minneapolis, Charlotte, N.C., St. Louis, Tempe, Ariz., and Salt Lake City.

"It's just amazing to see," Kidd said.

The majority of these projects were either modern streetcar or LRT.  While i'm a backer of this commuter rail project, I doubt it will stimulate the type of ridership or economic development that streetcar and LRT projects do.

EDIT: - I just reread the article.  Kidd is right in that the property values around Sunrail's train stops will increase.  However, economic development won't be the same as the other cities because the service is more limited with less stations.