"HEIGHTS UNKNOWN" (Garry) here.
Arrived in Jacksonville early Friday evening from West Central Florida (Tampa Bay) region where I now live. It's been two years since I last visited and was eager to see if the improvements iterated in this forum were in fact true or did I see Jax in another different light or way. Keep in mind that what I list below is based on my visits to other major Florida cities and relative to what I left in 1995. That being said, here is my observation and opinion of Jax compared to other major Florida cities and relative to where it was when I left in 1995:
Highways - Highways and streets have improved signficantly since I left in 1995. I came into Jax from I-10 and hit the "quagmire" spaghetti and noodles interchanges (95 to I-10 and vice versa) and got lost (you guys told me I would). I ended up getting lost but got back onto the expressway to whre I needed to go. Though the highways and streets have improved, there are still some streets downtown and in Springfield that need repaving along with landscaping improvements that need to be added. I-95 south of the river is simply beautiful all the way to the interchange that leads to Orange Park and other destinations around the south end of Jacksonville and Duval County. No major changes were noted on I-95 leading north to the Airport. Once you leave the spaghetti/noodles interchange, I-10 is also basically the same heading out west.
Skyline - Simply beautiful skyline as usual. But I try to imagine that I am a newcomer to Jax and what I would think or how I would view our skyline. I would say or think, "what a beautiful skyline so this must be a vibrant city," and would be led to believe that a lot is going on; however, though a few new bars and restaurants have sprung up within downtown proper and the urban core, there still is not much going on save the Landing. Need more to do along with more activity downtown. But Jax's skyline is breathtaking but still falls short compared to Miami, Tampa, or even Fort Lauderdale in my opinion.
Lighting - Compared to other Florida cities, Jacksonville is not well lighted; and I am talking about streetlighting as well as lighting on buildings, signs and skyscrapers. Jacksonville seems to be dark, gloomy, compared to other major Florida cities. There seems to be a lack of adequate and/or proper street lights. Also, more neon signs and lights need to be on our buildings and skyscrapers downtown. When I left Jax, I had not visited a major Florida city in quite some time. When I moved to South Florida, it was evident that Jax was dark, gloomy, and almost devoid of good street lighting as well as lighting for signs and buildings. It has improved, but Jax still appears dark and gloomy compared to other Florida cities.
Springfield - This neighborhood has definitely changed. More nice, renovated and even new constructed homes in that area, but overall it appears that much still needs to be done. However, Springfield is much much better than it was when I left in 1995. The streets are a little better relative to landscaping, paving, etc., and there are more bars, restaurants and stores there than I remember; but much still needs to be done and I understand that Springfield is still a work in progress.
Riverside/Brooklyn - Brooklyn on the River near downtown has definitely changed. The area around Blue Cross/Blue Shield looks good with even more potential for it to get even better. Five Points was a surprise as there were a couple of bars and restaurants open with much acitivity on Friday and Saturday nights. The residential parts of Riverside haven't changed much, and, the lower part of Brooklyn to the west of the river on Riverside Avenue is still an eyesore, though I understand some developments were planned before the economic crash and downturn. Much work still needs to be done in these areas. Hopefully if the economy improves, developments and plans for that area will recommence.
LaVilla - My childhood neighborhood put tears to my eyes. No people, no activity, no bars, restaurants or stores. Shame on the Jacksonville leadership for what they promised for this area but left it a plowed out, razed down moonscape. Drove through there thinking back to my childhood and got kind of angry. Much more could have been done to and for LaVilla. Hopefully, a plan will be initiated which will include residential towers, stores, restaurants, etc. for the rest of LaVilla. What a major disappintment!
San Marco/Southside/Phillips Highway area - San Marco...WALLA! Much activity and buzz the nights I drove around. The southbank looks good with a lot of potential in place if city leaders get off their ass and put out a good plan of development. Something needs to be done with the Phillips Highway area; I am talking landscaping, streetlighting, repaving, more stores, restaurants, and get the prostitutes, pimps, and drug dealers off the streets!
Downtown/Hemming Plaza - Hasn't changed all that much for the exception of the new Courthouse and the buzz of activity in and around Bay Streets relative to bars, restaurants and nightclubs. What's up with the cobblestone streets around the "roundabout" next to the landing? They need to pave that; it is hard on struts, shocks, etc. on the autos. As aforementioned skyline still looks awesome. Could have really used those 3 or 4 skyscrapers that were planned and then axed back in 2008. Still a lot of vacant lots and undeveloped areas within downtown. Downtown still needs "infill" in a lot of areas. All in all, it (downtown) does look better than it did in 1995.
Enjoyed my visit. Got to see old friends, ate at some resturants, etc. Just loved seeing and visiting Jax, my real home. Hope to move back soon but just bought a home in Ellenton in the Tampa Bay area. Still planning to sell and move back at some point. Wish I could have seen more and visited more areas. This is my take on Jax's progress. Progress has been made to the areas I listed but more needs to be done, and I am sure more progress and success has been made in areas I did not list. I love you Jax! Peace everyone!
"HU"
Thanks, HU. I enjoyed that!
The only thing I would say is that much of the planning that was on course or on the drawing board ran into a buzz saw with the economic downturn.
At least I hope that is the case and not due to an inert leadership. :(
Quote from: heights unknown on August 23, 2010, 07:43:58 AMWhat's up with the cobblestone streets around the "roundabout" next to the landing? They need to pave that; it is hard on struts, shocks, etc. on the autos.
They just put that in. I think they are meant as a speed control measure, but they are pretty rough. That said it's better than speedbumps IMO.
The cobblestones are a way to further slow down traffic (in addition to the roundabout itself)....the stones will wear down over time and it will be less rough.
Just imagine what it feels like on a bike :)
It's cool to hear someone elses view, especiallly a previous Jacksonvillians. Thanks! Slowly but surely I think we'll see vast improvements. One statement I strongly agree with you on is lighting. Apparently they are doing something about this, at least along Laura St and a few other downtown streets.
QuoteLaVilla - My childhood neighborhood put tears to my eyes. No people, no activity, no bars, restaurants or stores. Shame on the Jacksonville leadership for what they promised for this area but left it a plowed out, razed down moonscape. Drove through there thinking back to my childhood and got kind of angry. Much more could have been done to and for LaVilla. Hopefully, a plan will be initiated which will include residential towers, stores, restaurants, etc. for the rest of LaVilla. What a major disappintment!
Disappointment indeed.
Your childhood neighborhood is now a moonscape. Reading this paragraph really brought home the impact of the razing of this area. Change will always continue, but outright decimation of a neighborhood is borderline criminal.
From one who rode through this area throughout his youth without giving much thought to the city's proposals, I apologize. Our citizens should have stood together to prevent the razing of LaVilla.
Quote from: buckethead on August 23, 2010, 09:47:42 AM
QuoteLaVilla - My childhood neighborhood put tears to my eyes. No people, no activity, no bars, restaurants or stores. Shame on the Jacksonville leadership for what they promised for this area but left it a plowed out, razed down moonscape. Drove through there thinking back to my childhood and got kind of angry. Much more could have been done to and for LaVilla. Hopefully, a plan will be initiated which will include residential towers, stores, restaurants, etc. for the rest of LaVilla. What a major disappintment!
Disappointment indeed.
Your childhood neighborhood is now a moonscape. Reading this paragraph really brought home the impact of the razing of this area. Change will always continue, but outright decimation of a neighborhood is borderline criminal.
From one who rode through this area throughout his youth without giving much thought to the city's proposals, I apologize. Our citizens should have stood together to prevent the razing of LaVilla.
Somewhat on the subject of LaVilla and it's uprise... any more word on the building across from the LaSOTA where Ray played one of his first gigs. Last I heard the city was buying it off the guy who ran out of funds to preserve it. I know it's in REALLY REALLY bad shape but man would it make a cool Jazz influenced restaurant/bar/museum!
Quote from: tufsu1 on August 23, 2010, 08:19:24 AM
The cobblestones are a way to further slow down traffic (in addition to the roundabout itself)....the stones will wear down over time and it will be less rough.
Just imagine what it feels like on a bike :)
And just imagine trying to cross that area in a wheelchair or walker! Just waiting for an ADA complaint.
There are crosswalks on all sides of it......
Though some businesses have moved into LaVilla, they need to do more with that area and more can be done "people wise" to bring activity back to LaVilla. In my opinion if we add some restaurants, bars, stores, etc., not only would that be a big plus for LaVilla, but it would also put some much needed spark into downtown and especially that end of downtown with the Courthouse possibly also providing a growth catalyst. Jacksonville has so, so much potential its rediculous. What the hell are our leaders thinking or waiting on? People who visit Florida, and trust me on this, are getting tired of Miami, Fort Lauderdale, Orlando, and the Tampa area. Jax also has a warm climate but Jax also has seasons, something people south of Ocala cannot really claim (feeble seasons at best). Jax has so much it can capitalize on and use to its advantage to lure people to it and help it to be the best that it can be!
"HU"
HU...............our leadership is not doing too much of anything! Since we have elections coming up real soon, primary's are on the 24......I am hoping for some real changes to start taking place! At least we have the start!
Quote from: CS Foltz on August 23, 2010, 07:14:53 PM
HU...............our leadership is not doing too much of anything! Since we have elections coming up real soon, primary's are on the 24......I am hoping for some real changes to start taking place! At least we have the start!
Tell me about it. To get a little off topic here, who is the frontrunner? Not because I am black, but I loved what the female black candidate proposed for the city a few months ago in a speech. But who is the one out front right now? Anyone know?
"HU"
Quote from: tufsu1 on August 23, 2010, 08:19:24 AM
The cobblestones are a way to further slow down traffic (in addition to the roundabout itself)....the stones will wear down over time and it will be less rough.
Just imagine what it feels like on a bike :)
If you are into vibrations; I for one am not (LOL)!
"HU"
probably Jim Bailey
Quote from: heights unknown on August 23, 2010, 08:22:11 PM
To get a little off topic here, who is the frontrunner? Not because I am black, but I loved what the female black candidate proposed for the city a few months ago in a speech. But who is the one out front right now? Anyone know?
right now there is no official frontrunner......that said, Rick Mullaney and Audrey Moran have raised the most $....and Mike Hogan has locked up the uber-conservative vote.....those are most likely the top 3
I expect Jim Bailey and Kevin Hyde to drop out over the next few months.
Glorious Johnson (the female black candidate) has raised very little $....she's actually been outgained on the Democratic side by Alvin Brown (relatively unknown here but worked in Clinton White House).
HU, glad you had a good time during your visit back to Jax.
Thanks for offering your perspective HU. It's nice to get input from someone who might pick up on some of the things we miss because we see them everyday. One thing you said stood out to me:
Quote from: heights unknown on August 23, 2010, 06:59:00 PM
Jacksonville has so, so much potential its rediculous. What the hell are our leaders thinking or waiting on? People who visit Florida, and trust me on this, are getting tired of Miami, Fort Lauderdale, Orlando, and the Tampa area. Jax also has a warm climate but Jax also has seasons, something people south of Ocala cannot really claim (feeble seasons at best). Jax has so much it can capitalize on and use to its advantage to lure people to it and help it to be the best that it can be!
I couldn't agree with you more. In my mind, there is ABSOLUTELY no reason why Jacksonville isn't the
premier city in Florida, and on of the top cities in the southeast. It's location is good, the weather is generally very good, most hurricanes avoid us, cost of living is low, we have a good mix of neighborhoods, there's a rich history to the city, and we've got some great beaches very close by. Ultimately, we keep getting in our own way. We're handicapped by the planning mistakes of our past that have divided our city and sent us sprawling. It's such a frustrating city to live in when you know how good things could be yet things stay pretty much the same. And that's just my opinion as someone who is mostly a spectator, I can't imagine how many of the people on here feel, having thrown themselves in to the fold, trying to make things change for the better. It's one of the main reasons I'm probably leaving Jacksonville in a few months.
Quote from: thelakelander on August 24, 2010, 06:42:09 PM
HU, glad you had a good time during your visit back to Jax.
Thanks Lake; and it was good to drive around and think back of good times even when the city wasn't nearly as good as it is now. And boy do I miss the southern hospitality! People actually speak to you (good morning, good evening) regardless of the murder rate (LOL). THIS (Jax) is my city and always will be, but we keep missing the mark thanks to stupid, short sighted leaders that never had a clue, don't have a clue, and never will have a clue. I've come to the conclusion that we need one of the METROJAX people to become Mayor and hire some of the forumers into the administration in order to get our city moving. Pipe dreams y'all. I enjoyed myself and will be back sooner than later next time!
"HU"
Quote from: 9a is my backyard on August 24, 2010, 09:11:48 PM
Thanks for offering your perspective HU. It's nice to get input from someone who might pick up on some of the things we miss because we see them everyday. One thing you said stood out to me:
Quote from: heights unknown on August 23, 2010, 06:59:00 PM
Jacksonville has so, so much potential its rediculous. What the hell are our leaders thinking or waiting on? People who visit Florida, and trust me on this, are getting tired of Miami, Fort Lauderdale, Orlando, and the Tampa area. Jax also has a warm climate but Jax also has seasons, something people south of Ocala cannot really claim (feeble seasons at best). Jax has so much it can capitalize on and use to its advantage to lure people to it and help it to be the best that it can be!
I couldn't agree with you more. In my mind, there is ABSOLUTELY no reason why Jacksonville isn't the premier city in Florida, and on of the top cities in the southeast. It's location is good, the weather is generally very good, most hurricanes avoid us, cost of living is low, we have a good mix of neighborhoods, there's a rich history to the city, and we've got some great beaches very close by. Ultimately, we keep getting in our own way. We're handicapped by the planning mistakes of our past that have divided our city and sent us sprawling. It's such a frustrating city to live in when you know how good things could be yet things stay pretty much the same. And that's just my opinion as someone who is mostly a spectator, I can't imagine how many of the people on here feel, having thrown themselves in to the fold, trying to make things change for the better. It's one of the main reasons I'm probably leaving Jacksonville in a few months.
Thanks for your great post and you're welcome 9a!
I hope you don't leave, but sadly, you're right. We really need to get rid of those "good ole boys" in City Hall, and any others who think they might want to run our city...they just don't have any vision; and yes, if it takes a Yankee visionary with great goals, planning, and VISION, then bring him or her in...and I mean right now!! We've been held back for too long, and Jax (Northeast Florida along with old St. Augustine) is the birthplace of Florida and where Florida began. No one knew anything about Central or South Florida until the late 1800's till around the turn of the Century; and then the focus began to slowly go away from Jax to warmer pastures down south. Hopefully change will come soon, but I would love to see it during my lifetime!
"HU"
Certainly shrewd Jacksonville area promoters sell against evil Miami and Central Florida.
Those that 'tire' from points south would do well to reconsider their move to northeast Florida based on what they simply see...and are sold,considering the tremendous amount of development/changes vested yet presently unseen (all under the banner of happy growth Management of course-even the Beltway is cast as forward thinking.And our recent water war with Evil central Florida coincided with finishing up a decade+ of our own massive area development vesting-a point completely missed by most ).For many newcomers the upcoming changes would be welcome,for others-a rip off,or worse.
What really separates us from evil points south??Certainly the weather-after all there are two separate weather zones below us.Our weather is among the best.And perhaps nature based recreation. If we ignore the fact that south Florida enjoys some of the largest tracts of wild public lands in the country.Our wild lands legacy here is admirable yet still bits and pieces with many lost opportunities.
Many of my native Miami friends have in fact assessed their potential move to Jacksonville-and skipped the region all together.
I admire HU for his zeal and love for Jacksonville.
It is good to like where you live.For some of us-the feeling is imperative.
Where would North Miami move too??? It's a secret-the entire region prefers to keep it that way.
God bless you, Garry--- you said everything so well and to the point, you make this site so important.
Thanks, HU, I enjoyed reading your assessment of Jax.
Quote from: north miami on August 25, 2010, 11:51:57 AM
Certainly shrewd Jacksonville area promoters sell against evil Miami and Central Florida.
Those that 'tire' from points south would do well to reconsider their move to northeast Florida based on what they simply see...and are sold,considering the tremendous amount of development/changes vested yet presently unseen (all under the banner of happy growth Management of course-even the Beltway is cast as forward thinking.And our recent water war with Evil central Florida coincided with finishing up a decade+ of our own massive area development vesting-a point completely missed by most ).For many newcomers the upcoming changes would be welcome,for others-a rip off,or worse.
What really separates us from evil points south??Certainly the weather-after all there are two separate weather zones below us.Our weather is among the best.And perhaps nature based recreation. If we ignore the fact that south Florida enjoys some of the largest tracts of wild public lands in the country.Our wild lands legacy here is admirable yet still bits and pieces with many lost opportunities.
Many of my native Miami friends have in fact assessed their potential move to Jacksonville-and skipped the region all together.
I admire HU for his zeal and love for Jacksonville.
It is good to like where you live.For some of us-the feeling is imperative.
Where would North Miami move too??? It's a secret-the entire region prefers to keep it that way.
Well North Miami...great post. Just so you'll know when I left Jax in 1995 I lived in Fort Lauderdale for the next 9 years, and also bounced around to Hallandale, Hollywood, Dania, and Fort Lauderdale Beach in between. Got to like South Florida while I was down there, heck, it became home. But nothing beats trees, real trees mind you like oaks, sycamores, pecan, plum, and foilage foilage foilage (bushes, vines, etc.), and yes we have palm trees in North Florida, and I will again mention real seasons (winter, spring, summer, fall), hospitality (hi y'all, hello, good morning, good evening, how ya doing, etc.), down home cooking (and not just roast beef, mashed potatoes and gravy; I'm talking yams, collards, just about every part of a pig, fried chicken, mustard greens, lima beans, rice and beans, I'm talking southern cuisine...heck, we can still eat roast beef and mashed potatoes with gravy and still call it southern!), and how about rainfall just about all the time and not here and there with the grass looking burnt up, trees that don't grow very tall, polluted air, and I could go on and on.
One thing I noticed that differentiates North Florida from Central and Southern Florida; just about everyone in North Florida are native Floridians (we have more yankees, midwesterners and westerners moving to Jax than ever before), and in Central and South Florida just about everyone are from the following states: New York, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Massachusetts, Michigan, and a few from other states up north but these are the main ones. Maybe that's why there is more southern hospitality in North Florida versus Central and South Florida.
Yes, North Florida is my home. My roots are from North Florida. Born in Jacksonville, raised in Jasper Florida (Hamilton County), and again raised in Jacksonville before my Mother's Sister talked her into moving to Fort Myers. It could have been the other way around regarding my feelings of North Florida and Jax. I could have grown to hate Jax and loved South Florida; just because you are from somewhere doesn't mean you will always love it; however, I know, that I know, that Jax has the best to offer...not because it is my home, but because I've had the chance to live in other places in Florida and though there might be more to do, and there might be more people, that doesn't mean they are the best places to live. I'd take corn pone anyday over Boston Baked Beans!
"HU"
Quote from: heights unknown on August 25, 2010, 08:03:34 PM
Quote from: north miami on August 25, 2010, 11:51:57 AM
Certainly shrewd Jacksonville area promoters sell against evil Miami and Central Florida.
Those that 'tire' from points south would do well to reconsider their move to northeast Florida based on what they simply see...and are sold,considering the tremendous amount of development/changes vested yet presently unseen (all under the banner of happy growth Management of course-even the Beltway is cast as forward thinking.And our recent water war with Evil central Florida coincided with finishing up a decade+ of our own massive area development vesting-a point completely missed by most ).For many newcomers the upcoming changes would be welcome,for others-a rip off,or worse.
What really separates us from evil points south??Certainly the weather-after all there are two separate weather zones below us.Our weather is among the best.And perhaps nature based recreation. If we ignore the fact that south Florida enjoys some of the largest tracts of wild public lands in the country.Our wild lands legacy here is admirable yet still bits and pieces with many lost opportunities.
Many of my native Miami friends have in fact assessed their potential move to Jacksonville-and skipped the region all together.
I admire HU for his zeal and love for Jacksonville.
It is good to like where you live.For some of us-the feeling is imperative.
Where would North Miami move too??? It's a secret-the entire region prefers to keep it that way.
Well North Miami...great post. Just so you'll know when I left Jax in 1995 I lived in Fort Lauderdale for the next 9 years, and also bounced around to Hallandale, Hollywood, Dania, and Fort Lauderdale Beach in between. Got to like South Florida while I was down there, heck, it became home. But nothing beats trees, real trees mind you like oaks, sycamores, pecan, plum, and foilage foilage foilage (bushes, vines, etc.), and yes we have palm trees in North Florida, and I will again mention real seasons (winter, spring, summer, fall), hospitality (hi y'all, hello, good morning, good evening, how ya doing, etc.), down home cooking (and not just roast beef, mashed potatoes and gravy; I'm talking yams, collards, just about every part of a pig, fried chicken, mustard greens, lima beans, rice and beans, I'm talking southern cuisine...heck, we can still eat roast beef and mashed potatoes with gravy and still call it southern!), and how about rainfall just about all the time and not here and there with the grass looking burnt up, trees that don't grow very tall, polluted air, and I could go on and on.
One thing I noticed that differentiates North Florida from Central and Southern Florida; just about everyone in North Florida are native Floridians (we have more yankees, midwesterners and westerners moving to Jax than ever before), and in Central and South Florida just about everyone are from the following states: New York, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Massachusetts, Michigan, and a few from other states up north but these are the main ones. Maybe that's why there is more southern hospitality in North Florida versus Central and South Florida.
Yes, North Florida is my home. My roots are from North Florida. Born in Jacksonville, raised in Jasper Florida (Hamilton County), and again raised in Jacksonville before my Mother's Sister talked her into moving to Fort Myers. It could have been the other way around regarding my feelings of North Florida and Jax. I could have grown to hate Jax and loved South Florida; just because you are from somewhere doesn't mean you will always love it; however, I know, that I know, that Jax has the best to offer...not because it is my home, but because I've had the chance to live in other places in Florida and though there might be more to do, and there might be more people, that doesn't mean they are the best places to live. I'd take corn pone anyday over Boston Baked Beans!
"HU"
"HU"-
Your zeal and happiness with Jacksonville is great to see and something evident through your posts over time.
My parents were natives of another certified idyllic place;Charlevoix Michigan.They moved to South Florida in the early 50's.My dad used to joke that he wished the car had broken down in Jacksonville.
When we moved to Jacksonville & environs in the mid 70's fireplaces,stacks of fire wood and woodsmoke in the winter neighborhood air was a delightful discovery.
I will always argue that Id rather stay in Jacksonville than anywhere else in Florida. We might not have a "night life", but when it comes down to it, that's not what pays the bills. Ive always wondered why people are concerned about " there's nothing to do." There is SOO much to do, we just dont promote it like we should. EVERY person that has visited Jacksonville and hung out with me, had such a good time they are considering moving here. Actually my friend in central florida is thinking about packing up and heading here. To me life isnt just a "party". There's much more to it. I think Jacksonville is more of a city for someone who's laid back and goal oriented, and just parties every so often. ( I just descirbed myself.) I dont need a whole lot to do in order for me to be entertained.
Last fall had a visit from friends of ours who live in Tallahassee (He's a famous professor of criminology at FSU.) He and his wife are originally from Chicago. We had dinner in 5 Points then drove down Riverside Ave and St. John's to Marina Mile then took a slow evening cruise out of the Ortega River through downtown to the Mathews Bridge and back.
The whole way on the drive and the cruise they kept exclaiming that they didn't know Jacksonville was like this. "It's beautiful! Look at the wonderful houses and the trees! Wow, what a downtown!" (from the river at night it's lovely)
They had been to Jacksonville before, but just to go to the airport or to UNF or to drive through to St. Augustine.
We just need to get people off of I-95.
Quote from: Dog Walker on August 26, 2010, 02:25:32 PM
Last fall had a visit from friends of ours who live in Tallahassee (He's a famous professor of criminology at FSU.) He and his wife are originally from Chicago. We had dinner in 5 Points then drove down Riverside Ave and St. John's to Marina Mile then took a slow evening cruise out of the Ortega River through downtown to the Mathews Bridge and back.
The whole way on the drive and the cruise they kept exclaiming that they didn't know Jacksonville was like this. "It's beautiful! Look at the wonderful houses and the trees! Wow, what a downtown!" (from the river at night it's lovely)
They had been to Jacksonville before, but just to go to the airport or to UNF or to drive through to St. Augustine.
We just need to get people off of I-95.
The Marina Mile Yacht Brokerage business draws customers from all over the country who through the course of a vessel purchase end up on the River for survey trial run,post closing orientation,cruising and all exclaim how wonderful the immediate environs are.
Nearby,spontaneous nature based recreation is a Jacksonville strong point,as is the weather.