The 1992 Downtown White Paper: Catastrophe
(http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/photos/934938552_JvRdj-M.jpg)
In 1992 five years had passed since the 1987 plan which reformulated the 1972 Master Plan.
In the twenty that had passed since the '72 Plan was implemented, most of the elements of that strategy had been executed.
Massive redevelopment of the Hemming Park area, the implementation of the ASE, the reconstruction of the Riverfront, the installment of the "Loop System" and the deliberate creation of "Pedestrian Malls".
The Result: Complete, crashing failure at the expense of a billion dollars of taxpayer money. The renovations obliterated the retail district, the loop system stifled connectivity and confused downtown patrons, the Skyway was a non starter connecting nothing directly to nothing, right through the middle of nothing. By 1992 it was apparent that the new riverfront development, the Jacksonville Landing, was headed for trouble.
Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2010-jul-the-1992-downtown-white-paper-catastrophe
The major problem here was and still is a lack of understanding on the importance of urban connectivity. Whether its cultural, conventions, mass transit, retail or entertainment, no connectivity means no synergy. No synergy equals no vibrancy plain and simple. We've invested hundreds of millions into DT since then and many of the things already implemented would have had a stronger impact if properly coordinated and integrated with their surroundings and complementing uses. Quite frankly, everything else is a side show.
Here is a great example of bad connectivity:
QuoteMany cities in the country derive significant economic benefit from hosting conventions and group meetings. Convention planners require the host city to have sufficient meeting space and hotel rooms to accommodate their groups. Equally important, are the attractiveness, security and cultural and entertainment opportunities of the host city. During the early and mid-1980s, the City made significant strides toward increasing convention business through the construction of the Prime Osborn Convention Center and development of the Omni Hotel, Jacksonville Landing and the initial leg of the ASE. In particular, the Jacksonville Landing has provided an attraction that the City did not have before â€" one that takes advantage of our principal natural resource, the St. Johns River. However, the deterioration of the core city surrounding the Landing and Omni complex and the relative isolation of the Prime Osborn Center are presently negative factors in obtaining convention business.
No connectivity. A convention center without an adjacent hotel and entertainment uses is just as effective as a Buckman Bridge ending at a cul-de-sac instead of tying into the rest of the roadway network. Like the skyway, with this issue we started on the wrong path and then cry when things don't turn out the way we originally envisioned two decades ago. Also, its a bad idea to build a redevelopment scheme around any one trick pony. Build it around the holistic idea of community connectivity and walkability. Jax should try this. It works and it's affordable.
Quote from: stephendare on July 19, 2010, 08:34:23 AM
Do you think that they addressed any of that in their summary of issues Lake?
No. This problem still hurts us today. In fact, one can make an argument that we're worse off today than back in 1992.
Quote from: stephendare on July 19, 2010, 08:50:20 AM
Do you agree with the statement that the city made 'significant strides toward increasing convention business through the construction of the Prime Osborn Convention Center and development of the Omni Hotel, Jacksonville Landing and the initial leg of the ASE'?
No, I don't agree with this statement. This statement suggests that the entire plan was flawed from the beginning. A competitive convention center should not have to rely on the ASE to connect guests to a hotel, shopping and entertainment a mile away. These things should all be located directly adjacent to each other.
(http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/photos/563005154_KEGSo-M.jpg)
Above: Nashville's convention center - Where would you rather book a convention? One where the entertainment, hotels and retail are next door or where they are a mile away?QuoteI think it might have made significant strides within a plan to increase convention business, but there havent been numbers to bear out that it actually increased convention business.
I don't think so. All they did was build an isolated box on the edge of downtown without the necessary components to make it work like it is supposed to. If anything, this move saved a significant historic structure from demolition, which is respectable. However, before worrying about increasing market share you first have to take advantage of what you have by getting better utilization out of your investments. Fix the things that kill and chase existing economic opportunities away and you'll find additional businesses and opportunities will also present themselves.
In a conservative city like Jax, the arguments regarding the relative cost effectiveness versus sprawl are your most effective arguments. To me, the appeal of a vibrant downtown is almost intuitive and common sense. For instance, why build new infrastructure if that infrastructure is in place already? It's just wasteful, and if you can demonstrate this to general public in a simple way then I think you would see a lot more support downtown revitalization.
Same thing with the historical reasons for revitalization. Appeal to the public sentimentality of bringing back a downtown the "way it used to be" and once again you get support of the everyday Joe Lunchbox crowd.
Or how about the environmental reasons? I remember moving to Jacksonville and being amazing about seeing all these people wearing RealTree camo to the market and how fishing was a regular part of so many people's day to day. Hunting and fishing is a way of life for a lot Jacksonville residents. Has anyone ever made an effective appeal to them showing how sprawl and the policies that allow it eat up land and hurts the water quality?
Many of the people who oppose downtown revitalization do because they don't see how it affects them. They think revitalization is just a waste of money cooked up by a bunch of liberal yuppies or some business suit trying to make an extra buck on the backs of other people.
A key driver behind sprawl and I don't believe noted in the White Paper has been not only the attraction and demands for development in Duval county but also neighboring Clay & St. Johns,propelled by a pervasive,militant anti Duval theme.
Jacksonville mayors should have to live downtown
Here is the main missing element in all of these points: CONNECTIVITY!
With CONNECTIVITY all of these points can help bring synergy and vibrancy. Without it, all you have is a heap of isolated investments in a dead urban environment.
For many Jacksonville residents, downtown has always been dead. Young people and newcomers do not have the same perspective as the natives and old timers.
This is one reason why metrojacksonville.com is a great forum. We get the chance to see a city that once was and the potential for what it can be.
QuoteI think it might have made significant strides within a plan to increase convention business, but there havent been numbers to bear out that it actually increased convention business.
I used to work with a business that ran car shows in convention centers. We held events twice at Prime Osborn. Mind you, I had traveled around to probably around 30 different convention centers around the country.
The space(or lack thereof, especially considering $/sq ft issues) and having no adjacent hotels is a
big detriment to Jacksonville's convention business.
It just seems that it was deliberate to kill our downtown.
I actually like their assessment. While it does not solve anything, it is the best fighting chance we have of convincing suburbanites here why "their" tax payer money should go to support downtown. I know we dismiss the FTU blog, but whenever there is an article highlighting any project downtown, half of the posters are quick to complain that "their" tax money is being wasted. This sticks it to them by proving that actually there downtown tax money is being wasted on THEM. I have always thought that, but this confirms it.
I think we also have to keep in mind that this may actually be pretty "progressive" thinking for their time. The 80s and early 90s are before I can remember anything going on with people's mentality toward urban development and rehabilitation, but it would seem that they were a few years before their time (still in suburb hype). They even talk about pollution as if it is 2010 (well I guess this is shortly after the Montreal Protocol and shortly after amendments to Clean Air and Clean Water).
The only thing missing is what you have mentioned: what to do. I guess I will have to read part2? Or is it left out entirely.
Quote from: stephendare on July 21, 2010, 10:26:48 AM
No mention of the end users, no discussion about what made suburban districts more competitive, no examination of the underlying taxation policy that charged the shit out of downtown business owners but not the suburban businesses.
The tax comments struck me immediately. They describe the downtown as a high-tax district and then wonder why everyone is relocating away from downtown. I'm no Tea-Partier, but I know what high taxes do to businesses and workers.
Quote from: Timkin on July 20, 2010, 01:39:41 AM
It just seems that it was deliberate to kill our downtown.
I keep wondering about that myself - is what we are seeing (or not seeing) downtown the result of stupidity and incompetence on a massive scale (F5) or the result of an incredibly clever and devious plan to kill downtown...
Quote from: Gunnar on April 22, 2015, 04:16:02 PM
Quote from: Timkin on July 20, 2010, 01:39:41 AM
It just seems that it was deliberate to kill our downtown.
I keep wondering about that myself - is what we are seeing (or not seeing) downtown the result of stupidity and incompetence on a massive scale (F5) or the result of an incredibly clever and devious plan to kill downtown...
While I love a good conspiracy theory as much as the next person, what possible motive would one have for killing downtown? My vote is on massive, substantial, and sustained incompetence, as well as that all too well "Good ole boy" network.