Former Passenger Rail Station to Reopen
(http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/photos/498497418_JJMD2-M.jpg)
After much consideration, the City of St. Augustine has selected the former FEC rail station, north of downtown, as its official preferred station site for passenger rail's return to the city.
Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2010-jul-former-passenger-rail-station-to-reopen
It will be interesting to see how they lay the new siding there, since there appears to be a pond and a shopping center that wasn't there in 1960 that now lies where the bulk of the station used to be.
How far is the old station to downtown/the fort? Is it walkable? God I hope so. I wish the new site got approved but you could def see it would have cost a lot more. Also with it being out of the way let's go for high speed rail between jax-stA
Unfortunately, it's a mile or two north of the fort so there will need to be an additional transit service created to make the connection between the two.
Quote from: thelakelander on July 14, 2010, 07:53:05 AM
Unfortunately, it's a mile or two north of the fort so there will need to be an additional transit service created to make the connection between the two.
St. Johns County does operate a small transit service...and the portion of US 1 where the station will be is served by 4 routes....that said, there is an understanding that some of the routes may be restructured to better serve rail passengers, as the station will likely become a "transit center".
To the fort would be about a 2 mile walk through a mostly retail district. Downtown would be another 1/4 to 1/2 mile. Not unreasonable but not right across the street either.
Quote from: Pottsburg on July 14, 2010, 07:39:42 AM
How far is the old station to downtown/the fort? Is it walkable? God I hope so. I wish the new site got approved but you could def see it would have cost a lot more. Also with it being out of the way let's go for high speed rail between jax-stA
I think the plan is to use this station for the time being until the new one can be built. That location is much better for a tourist type stop. It would be much more walkable. Do you think anyone would actually ride to St A for the day and walk 2 miles to town in the summer?
a little landscaping and removing that paneling from the inside and they will be ready to go! This site may also be able to accomodate a commuter rail stop.
Many of the guidelines for TOD seem like generally good guidelines for creating a pedestrian friendly neighbor assuming that effective transit options are in place. I would like to see some of these guidelines implemented in areas of DT. Although in the near term, I would make free or cheap parking available because the transit options in our area are piecemeal, so most people are commuting in cars more by necessity than choice.
QuoteIs It Really TOD? (Patrick Siegman, in Tumlin and Millard-Ball, 2003)
What’s the difference between a true transit-oriented development, which will deliver promised social and economic benefits, and a transit-adjacent development? A true TOD will include most of the following:
• The transit-oriented development lies within a five-minute walk of the transit stop, or about a quarter-mile from stop to edge. For major stations offering access to frequent high-speed service this catchment area may be extended to the measure of a 10-minute walk.
• A balanced mix of uses generates 24-hour ridership. There are places to work, to live, to learn, to relax and to shop for daily needs.
• A place-based zoning code generates buildings that shape and define memorable streets, squares, and plazas, while allowing uses to change easily over time.
• The average block perimeter is limited to no more than 1,350 feet. This generates a fine-grained network of streets, dispersing traffic and allowing for the creation of quiet and intimate thoroughfares.
• Minimum parking requirements are abolished.
• Maximum parking requirements are instituted: For every 1,000 workers, no more than 500 spaces and as few as 10 spaces are provided.
• Parking costs are “unbundled,†and full market rates are charged for all parking spaces. The exception may be validated parking for shoppers.
• Major stops provide BikeStations, offering free attended bicycle parking, repairs, and rentals. At minor stops, secure and fully enclosed bicycle parking is provided.
• Transit service is fast, frequent, reliable, and comfortable, with a headway of 15 minutes or less.
• Roadway space is allocated and traffic signals timed primarily for the convenience of walkers and cyclists.
• Automobile level-of-service standards are met through congestion pricing measures, or disregarded entirely.
• Traffic is calmed, with roads designed to limit speed to 30 mph on major streets and 20 mph on lesser streets
So streetcars from the station down to the Fort and create a turnabout/depot there. Make stops along the way and that retail corridor is spruced right back up. Placement would also be pretty good for the airport if/when it becomes a bit more viable.
Quote from: St. Auggie on July 14, 2010, 09:40:42 AM
So streetcars from the station down to the Fort and create a turnabout/depot there. Make stops along the way and that retail corridor is spruced right back up. Placement would also be pretty good for the airport if/when it becomes a bit more viable.
Well put St Auggie! Sounds like a good plan now if they could only deliver.
+1
Also I just remembered you can check ur bike as luggage on Amtrak. Last Thursday I took the 5 something train to DC (arrived 7:35am Friday). The person infront of me was checking their bike. I think they have racks for them in the luggage car. I could def see people ridding their bike to the old terminal downtown catching the Amtrak to St. Augy then ridding ur bike into town. You could def pull that off in summer or winter. Now let's get this project started.
The station has a cool mid-century modern look. I hope they don't mess it up with "renovations".
I am surprised it is not in worse condition. It must have been kept up or out of operation for a short period.?
FEC still uses it for maintenence staging and stuff I believe, which is why its still in good shape.
Quote from: Fallen Buckeye on July 14, 2010, 09:06:26 AM
• Major stops provide BikeStations, offering free attended bicycle parking, repairs, and rentals. At minor stops, secure and fully enclosed bicycle parking is provided.
• Roadway space is allocated and traffic signals timed primarily for the convenience of walkers and cyclists.
[/quote]
True multi-modal transportation has the ability to carry on a bike. If you ride a bike to a station you should have the capabilities to be able to ride away from your destination.
Quote from: Pottsburg on July 14, 2010, 11:07:10 AM
Also I just remembered you can check ur bike as luggage on Amtrak. Last Thursday I took the 5 something train to DC (arrived 7:35am Friday). The person infront of me was checking their bike. I think they have racks for them in the luggage car. I could def see people ridding their bike to the old terminal downtown catching the Amtrak to St. Augy then ridding ur bike into town. You could def pull that off in summer or winter. Now let's get this project started.
Pottsburg, no one is ever going to go thru the hassle of completely dismantling (removing of wheels, pedals and headset) their bike and boxing it up to go to St. A., just to have have to reverse the process once they arrive and then go thru the same procedures for the return trip. Also Amtrak does not have special racks for the transport of boxed bikes. Bicycles because of their size are usually loaded first and then everything gets stacked on top of them. I can't count the number of times I have or have heard from others that arrived at a destination only to find that their bike has been severely damaged due the stress put upon them during transit.
What is the status of the Jacksonville Amtrak Station Downtown??
"Amtrak Going Bike-Friendly: Bike to the Train, and Vice Versa!"
http://www.infrastructurist.com/2010/07/12/amtrak-going-bike-friendly-bike-to-the-train-and-vice-versa/
Quote from: TheProfessor on July 14, 2010, 12:30:56 PM
What is the status of the Jacksonville Amtrak Station Downtown??
That is a good question. Other than Ock and me, it seems like there is little buzz about moving the Amtrak station from its current dump...er...location.
Downtown Jacksonville Railroad Station?
It's coming SOON!
Commuter Rail to St. Augustine?
I'd bet the farm on it, SOON!
Amtrak from downtown and on the FEC?
Also Coming Soon!
Streetcar in Jacksonville?
It WILL happen SOON!
STREETCAR in St. Augustine?
Maybe not soon but it HAS been talked about recently! Let's just ask, "Does the Pope ride streetcars?" 450 Y'all!
OCKLAWAHA
I hope so, Ock. We have been waiting for too long and it has been frustrating to see such apathy in our community about finally moving things forward.
Quote from: Jaxson on July 14, 2010, 01:11:08 PM
Quote from: TheProfessor on July 14, 2010, 12:30:56 PM
What is the status of the Jacksonville Amtrak Station Downtown??
That is a good question. Other than Ock and me, it seems like there is little buzz about moving the Amtrak station from its current dump...er...location.
the wheels are still in motion...but moving slowly....remember, it is a very big project
Yes they do have bike racks Bike Mike. I traveled on Amtrak last Thursday 7/8. there was a guy with a bike that was not taken all apart. Plus you are traveling one stop down the tracks why the hell would they put a bike that is getting off at the next stop at the bottom of a pile????????????
"Some trains have tie-down equipment in the baggage car or other areas designated for checked baggage. Where such equipment is available, you can check your bike without a box or other container"
"On some Amtrak trains you can roll your bike up to the train and secure it in a bike rack, unboxed. On board bike space is limited and is not available on all trains. On some trains you can check your bike as baggage. Not all stations or trains have checked baggage service."
Quote from: tufsu1 on July 14, 2010, 02:01:25 PM
Quote from: Jaxson on July 14, 2010, 01:11:08 PM
Quote from: TheProfessor on July 14, 2010, 12:30:56 PM
What is the status of the Jacksonville Amtrak Station Downtown??
That is a good question. Other than Ock and me, it seems like there is little buzz about moving the Amtrak station from its current dump...er...location.
the wheels are still in motion...but moving slowly....remember, it is a very big project
I understand that it's a huge undertaking, but we don't have any city leaders who are making public statements. It's like they are afraid of standing for something other than more roads and freeways. Or like they own stock in the airlines...
Our city leaders are shamefully asleep at the switch. It's like they are ignorant to the potential benefits of moving the train station from its current trash can to downtown. Oy, vey!
Wheels of progress turn real real slow for sure! Simple upgrade of tracks would raise track speeds to something more of what should be rather than what is! Kudo's to St Augustine for getting a "Rail Station".......now if the bovines in charge in Jacksonville would see the light.........lets get some more studies/consulting done and do something everyone can use! If the "Nifty Fifty" went to a private car like Corneileus and those ilk ....they even might consider stepping aside........maybe not, but one could ask! If not, then run them the heck over and lets "Giter done"! tufsu................I never thought I would say it, but your 101% correct!
That train station is horrible. :-\ Even if you go to Savanna or Jesup Ga things are better. They use the old time station theme. Now the DC station is super nice of course. Not only does the city need to pick it up, Amtrak needs to get in the game. Offer some incentives for the city. You know it would be a huge boost for them. But then again anything that may upset one of their union employees is out of the question.
Quote from: Ocklawaha on July 14, 2010, 01:42:10 PM
Downtown Jacksonville Railroad Station?
It's coming SOON!
Commuter Rail to St. Augustine?
I'd bet the farm on it, SOON!
Amtrak from downtown and on the FEC?
Also Coming Soon!
Streetcar in Jacksonville?
It WILL happen SOON!
STREETCAR in St. Augustine?
Maybe not soon but it HAS been talked about recently! Let's just ask, "Does the Pope ride streetcars?" 450 Y'all!
OCKLAWAHA
* Fingers crossed ...Annie Lytle Transit Terminal ??? :)
I just thought of an idea for Annie Lytle. How about a youth hostel? Riverside would be an ideal place for a youth hostel. Inexpensive lodging for young people who want to stay in Jacksonville.
Quote from: Jaxson on July 14, 2010, 02:07:03 PM
I understand that it's a huge undertaking, but we don't have any city leaders who are making public statements. It's like they are afraid of standing for something other than more roads and freeways. Or like they own stock in the airlines...
actually I've personally heard the Mayor mention it at least 3 times this year...once just last week
Quote from: Jaxson on July 14, 2010, 02:52:20 PM
I just thought of an idea for Annie Lytle. How about a youth hostel? Riverside would be an ideal place for a youth hostel. Inexpensive lodging for young people who want to stay in Jacksonville.
Jackson, If you can show me how we can pay for renovations to the tune of $6 million dollars with a hostel or even pay back a note for that amount with revenues, we will be all over it.
Its a great idea Jaxon... But about the only way I see that happening is if someone with extremely deep pockets, wanted to do it as a grant or a gift . I wish some idea would surface which could return the huge investment on the building.
Quote from: finehoe on July 14, 2010, 11:26:25 AM
The station has a cool mid-century modern look. I hope they don't mess it up with "renovations".
I with you on this one, I love the architecture of this building.
I like it too.. its in really nice shape. Even St. Auggy has a better mindset about saving buildings than Jax. But then they ARE the Nation's Oldest City.
Sat in that patio for hours waiting for that last train to pull in headed for Jacksonville... Due to crowds, cry's, farewell's and funeral bunting, it showed up VERY late. I boarded the first class tavern lounge car with one other passenger. We had it all to ourselves. On arrival in Jax, Conductor Fields told me to wait with him in the car, and when he finally told me okay, let's get off, I would be the very last passenger on the FEC! I love the station just like it is.
No problem coming off the mainline with a spur that swings near the station and back into the mainline again without taking out the shopping center. BTW, the old mainline left the back of the station and headed right up to US-1, the shopping center would have been back in the railroad yard/shops which once called St. Augustine home. The whole mainline was rerouted after the last passenger train to make more commercial land accessible from the highway.
OCKLAWAHA
Quote from: Ocklawaha on July 15, 2010, 01:04:51 AM
The whole mainline was rerouted after the last passenger train to make more commercial land accessible from the highway.
OCKLAWAHA
Sounds to me, Nifty Fifty were allready pulling strings to slant things in their favor! But that one stretch of track is one less to upgrade to current standards...............FEC should be able to do something to enhance rail for that route and points south!
yep CS...the Nifty Fifty of Jacksonville were the deciding factor in closing down an entire passenger rail line all the way to Miami.
Quote from: tufsu1 on July 15, 2010, 08:22:21 AM
yep CS...the Nifty Fifty of Jacksonville were the deciding factor in closing down an entire passenger rail line all the way to Miami.
When I rode that last train, most of those "Nifty Fifty" were still at there mothers breasts!OCKLAWAHA
I wonder where the original St. Augustine rail station was?? I believe my grandma used to take the FL East Coast Rail up from St. Auggie to Jax Union Station, then trolley over to downtown.
Quoteyep CS...the Nifty Fifty of Jacksonville were the deciding factor in closing down an entire passenger rail line all the way to Miami.
lol, thanks I needed that!
Quote from: Pottsburg on July 14, 2010, 02:15:01 PM
That train station is horrible. :-\ Even if you go to Savanna or Jesup Ga things are better. They use the old time station theme. Now the DC station is super nice of course. Not only does the city need to pick it up, Amtrak needs to get in the game. Offer some incentives for the city. You know it would be a huge boost for them. But then again anything that may upset one of their union employees is out of the question.
It might be retro, but its better then NO station. I am happy that St. Augustine is on track for getting passenger rail back. I dont like the location of the existing station as much as the planned one in downtown St. Augustine. However it will do fine till they get that one built. Now Jacksonville needs to get them a station downtown, I am hoping they can just use the existing Jacksonville Terminal downtown, but that would require moving the Convention Center (which needs to be done, but we dont have the money) or they could maybe have them both in the same spot... dunno about that.
Savannah's Amtrak station is actually closer in style to that of St. Augustine. It is nice that Jesup is restoring their vintage station, and it is more historic than those in Savannah or St. Augustine.
P.S. - I think that the St. Augustine station has a unique style that reflects its time period.
Agree Jaxson! It looks like it has been well-maintained even if not in use as a station.
http://staugustine.com/news/local-news/2010-07-19/airport-board-opposes-rail-site
Read the comments!
When did St. Augustine's airport change its name to Northeast Florida Regional Airport?
The airport authorities say they have two names:
1) The St. Augustine and St. Johns County Airport and 2) The Northeast Florida Regional Airport at St. Augustine.
The renaming was just a couple of months ago ... and is said to be a name that could attract business ...
News:
http://staugustine.com/news/local-news/2010-04-27/airport-gets-new-name
Editorial:
http://staugustine.com/opinions/2010-04-25/airport-name-change-requires-substance-order-succeed
Well if Savannah and a Podunk place like Jessup can upgrade their stations............why can't Jacksonville? I can understand all about the economics dictating just what is done and where but WTF? You prune any service to a bare minimun and then wonder why it does not flourish? Common sense would say..........why the heck could we not have that kind of service! If you build it, they will come and since track is already in place and just a matter of scheduling plus engines and car's there is a possibility......so I would have to ask why not?