Metro Jacksonville

Quote from: stephendare on March 12, 2010, 04:38:25 PM
You know, my friend Kortland believes we should all return to an absolute monarchy.  Something about the lower classes obviously not being able to govern themselves.

Perhaps he could be persuaded to weigh in.

I can be, actually. First, I will admonish Stephen. He has done you a disservice, Zoo, by mocking you for not understanding the things you're citing without taking the time to explain them to you. I think some more civil discourse may clear the air (and before you accuse me of not existing, run a search on Jacksonville.com; the number of people I see accused of being Stephen on these forums whom I have personally met is frankly absurd).

I think it would be amazing if SPAR behaved like the East Lake Foundation that you referenced. The East Lake Foundation improved their community by improving community services for its low-income residents, which included cradle-to-college educational support for the children of low-income parents. I think this would be an excellent first initiative for SPAR to take up if it wants to be more like the East Lake Foundation. Your interest seems to be primarily in the mixed-income building projects they undertook, which integrated the community by providing both low-income housing and mid-income housing. This means that when you build mixed-income housing, half of what you're building is the low-income housing that many in the "cunning linguist" faction seem to be advocating. Building low-income housing and providing services for low-income people in predominately low-income communities doesn't, as the experts you've cited would certainly agree, bring more low-income people into the community, as you seem to fear, but rather serves the people already there, the ones you said you didn't take issue with. When these programs are managed well, they improve education, lower crime, and cause the percentage of low-income vs. mid-income people in the community approach the 50%-50% balance you've advocated. By improving education and other community services for low-income residents, you break the cycle of poverty and reduce crime, which attracts more higher-income people to the neighborhood resulting in gentrification. Gentrification is after all about people moving in, so it relies on increased density. I think it's wrong-headed to discourage anyone from moving to Springfield or opening a business there. The Memphis study on section 8 vouchers is interesting in that it's the opposite of what East Lake did: Memphis tore down its low-income housing, while East Lake improved its low-income housing (by expanding it into mixed-income housing), with drastically different results.

I encourage you to re-watch the video you posted, perhaps at the next SPAR meeting, and discuss with SPAR what aspects of the East Lake Foundation program SPAR can implement or encourage. I don't know what action you've actually been proposing so far (these salient points seem to get lost in the name-calling on these forums quite a bit), but I'm sure no cunning linguists will oppose any of the programs specifically mentioned in the video (although they may get a kick out of the opening praising Woodrow Wilson while oh so conveniently not mentioning that president's own views on integration http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woodrow_Wilson#Civil_Rights). I really think the cradle-to-college program alone would do wonders for getting Springfield to the 50% mid-income mark you hope to see. More on what a program like that entails, in this case the efforts of Geoffrey Canada in Harlem, can be heard here: http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/364/Going-Big. It's a massive undertaking, and not really SPAR's purview, but that's the kind of program Springfield could really use, rather than squabbles over carwashes.

I look forward to any forthcoming news of this bold change of course for SPAR.

Do not judge by color but by actions and attitude.

Thanks Kortland.

Maybe now would be a good time to start that new thread we talked about a couple of days ago, where we could discuss East Lake and not focus on past disagreements??????

Miss Fixit, I am still waiting for this to be answered.

QuoteAnd I note that you have ignored trying to answer how SPAR Council and yourself can possibly correlate embracing the ideas in the studies you have recently posted with the attacks against the very people who are accomplishing what the studies are about.  And how do you make this work with your current commercial development polices?

I fear that Zoo does not really want a true discussion as it won't go her way. I would be happy to be proved wrong.

Stephen, yes you did agree! I was relying on you to start the new thread - not sure exactly what the protocol is when spinning off from an existing one.

I'm doing some research before I give you a complete answer, Stephen, but my initial reaction is that (as both you and Kortland have pointed out already) this type of project is beyond the purview of an organization like SPAR.  I'm not suggesting it isn't something that the SPAR board should consider supporting - it certainly is.  However, it requires a LOT of money, and a benefactor (such as your robber barons or a Mr. Buffett) or a basically good hearted developer who is required to provide low to moderate income housing in conjunction with another project and actually takes his responsibility seriously.

What organizations in Jacksonville are positioned to spearhead a project like this?

The truth is, no other organization is actually needed.  If you look around, you can certainly see where smaller groups are indeed doing at least a small part of this already.

North Shore school, while currently rated "F" by the FCAT system of judgment, is a great idea that simply needs some additional support.  It’s mission certainly fits right into the East lake ideals. The School exists as it is today at least partially due to Metro North's efforts.  Which brings us to Metro North and its past and future initiatives.  Both seem to be taking Metro North down the path that Eastlake has followed.  Their planned development also located by North Shore school at 48th street certainly fits.

The ”cradle to grave” idea not only involves education of the young, but also perhaps trying to correct the types of role models for those young.  It goes without saying that you must help the parents of the young, but it also means you must help the aunts and uncles as well.  To that end, we have Operation New Hope.  They have programs that help those individuals getting out of prison get their lives more back on track.  We have Prisoners of Christ who try to accomplish the same thing through different means. 

Even those with addiction issues need to be helped if you wish to try to break the cycle.  By getting them back to a productive life and getting them back with their families, you are even helping the next generation perhaps avoid some of the pitfalls of the earlier generations.

So we do have organizations that are obviously trying to accomplish the Eastlake ideals.  Metro North and Operation New Hope are also trying to accomplish the housing aspects.  We could also include the private sectors as some of the privately owned  higher density housing has been greatly improved over the past several years and are certainly of a high enough standard to be desirable to mid-income level residents.

And, just to list a few of the organizations, The Bridge, the Boys and Girls Club, the Liberty Center (Pastor Lockets?),  The Service Center, the Alco House, the …well the list of small organizations all trying to do their part is long.

It all must be a package, one part will not succeed long run without the other.  Some of what is being done is making forward progress in small little baby steps, but perhaps that is the ultimate way to success.  It is also how one can be culturally sensitive while trying to accomplish those goals.

So, what can one of the Springfield organizations do?  They can publicly support helping North Shore and help get it’s FCAT score up rather than the more exclusive “let’s get a charter school” idea being floated around.  Utilize the existing resource rather than spend the time, energy and money to start from scratch.

Springfield can work together with the small organizations that are helping with the issues rather than against those organizations.  SPAR Council can join forces with Metro North and Operation New Hope to have programs that are inclusive and work towards the ideals illustrated by East Lake.  Again, using and coordinating the existing resources rather than reinventing the wheel. 

Overall, this is not rocket science and  you do not necessarily need one large benefactor.  The funding can come from many varied sources and through many varied outlets.  You just need to use common sense and have the real desire to accomplish it.

Quote from: strider on March 14, 2010, 10:48:02 AM
The truth is, no other organization is actually needed.  If you look around, you can certainly see where smaller groups are indeed doing at least a small part of this already.

North Shore school, while currently rated "F" by the FCAT system of judgment, is a great idea that simply needs some additional support.  It’s mission certainly fits right into the East lake ideals. The School exists as it is today at least partially due to Metro North's efforts.  Which brings us to Metro North and its past and future initiatives.  Both seem to be taking Metro North down the path that Eastlake has followed.  Their planned development also located by North Shore school at 48th street certainly fits.

The ”cradle to grave” idea not only involves education of the young, but also perhaps trying to correct the types of role models for those young.  It goes without saying that you must help the parents of the young, but it also means you must help the aunts and uncles as well.  To that end, we have Operation New Hope.  They have programs that help those individuals getting out of prison get their lives more back on track.  We have Prisoners of Christ who try to accomplish the same thing through different means. 

Even those with addiction issues need to be helped if you wish to try to break the cycle.  By getting them back to a productive life and getting them back with their families, you are even helping the next generation perhaps avoid some of the pitfalls of the earlier generations.

So we do have organizations that are obviously trying to accomplish the Eastlake ideals.  Metro North and Operation New Hope are also trying to accomplish the housing aspects.  We could also include the private sectors as some of the privately owned  higher density housing has been greatly improved over the past several years and are certainly of a high enough standard to be desirable to mid-income level residents.

And, just to list a few of the organizations, The Bridge, the Boys and Girls Club, the Liberty Center (Pastor Lockets?),  The Service Center, the Alco House, the …well the list of small organizations all trying to do their part is long.

It all must be a package, one part will not succeed long run without the other.  Some of what is being done is making forward progress in small little baby steps, but perhaps that is the ultimate way to success.  It is also how one can be culturally sensitive while trying to accomplish those goals.

So, what can one of the Springfield organizations do?  They can publicly support helping North Shore and help get it’s FCAT score up rather than the more exclusive “let’s get a charter school” idea being floated around.  Utilize the existing resource rather than spend the time, energy and money to start from scratch.

Springfield can work together with the small organizations that are helping with the issues rather than against those organizations.  SPAR Council can join forces with Metro North and Operation New Hope to have programs that are inclusive and work towards the ideals illustrated by East Lake.  Again, using and coordinating the existing resources rather than reinventing the wheel. 

Overall, this is not rocket science and  you do not necessarily need one large benefactor.  The funding can come from many varied sources and through many varied outlets.  You just need to use common sense and have the real desire to accomplish it.

I love that guy.

Thanks, Strider - that's just what I was looking for: organizations that are already in place that with additional support could accomplish even more.

Interesting coincidence:  today's Florida Times Union includes a column about CDCs - including Operation New Hope - on the front page of the Business section.

I don't quite understand why SPAR should be everything for all people. In my opinion SPAR should focus on the purpose it was founded for.
I like the ideas Strider has pointed out and we already seem to have organizations with ideas from this thread in mind. So if someone likes what they do, then why not support them rather than blame SPAR for not doing these things.

Quote
From SPAR's Articles of Incorporation

Article II. - PURPOSE

Said Corporation is organized exclusively for charitable and educational purposes, the making of distributions to organizations which qualify as "exempt organizations" under section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Code).

The further purposes of the corporation shall be:

a. to promote the preservation, restoration, and revitalization of the neighborhood known as Springfield, located in the city of Jacksonville, Duval County, Florida

b. to advertise and speak of Springfield in such terms as to encourage non-Springfield persons to seek homes in Springfield

c. to offer to current and potential Springfield residents assistance in regard to financing, restoration, and in either field which would contribute to the betterment of Springfield

d. to serve as a liason between the various governmental bodies and agencies which are concerned with the neighborhood and the members of the corporation

e. to coordinate the activities of the corporation and the various government and private agencies concerned to achieve the maximum benefit and the minimum of overlap of effort

f. to offer education to the membership of the Corporation with regard to any program or activities which would affect them in either a positive or negative manner

g. to offer education to the various agencies, both government and private, with regard to the neighborhood, the preferences of the members of the Corporation on specific questions and the desires of the members of the Corporation on specific requests

h. to provide, without profit, referrals to any person of properties within the neighborhood

i. to make use of available funds, both grants and contributions, to make physical, legal and psychological improvements to the neighborhood

j. to publish a periodic newsletter which promotes the neighborhood and the activities of the Corporation

k. to gather for preservation, historic documentation and information as it pertains to Springfield and to maintain an archive of said materials

l. to promote a spirit of cooperation and good will among all citizens of the neighborhood

m. to promote efforts to achieve "historic district" status for the area known as Springfield

AlexS, SPAR Council’s mission statement is fine and if they followed it, I do not think anyone would complain.  The issue with the leadership of SPAR Council is that they have overstepped what the mission of SPAR Council should be and are into areas and polices that are not their business nor their expertise.  Often, even when they are trying to follow their mission, they are doing so in a way that is ultimately harmful to the community.

So, on one hand, you are right.  There are other organizations out there that are doing what needs done and doing it reasonably well.  In theory, this would allow SPAR Council do worrying about it’s mission and nothing else.  But the reality is much different.  All of the organizations need to work together for the community to be truly successful.  SPAR Council has not proven that it can play well with others, which I believe is due to their poorly thought out policies as much as anything.

All that being said, reading their mission statement does give an indication that they could certainly step up to the plate and truly be the organization that helps unify the other organizations efforts and still be well within the mission statement.  However, SPAR Council is too busy fighting against those that are helping or wanting to help all of the residents being discussed on this thread rather than helping or even trying to help anyone but perhaps themselves.