Rethinking Regency Mall
(http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/photos/782192040_CkifY-M.jpg)
With Regency Mall's owners now contemplating demolishing the struggling shopping center's west wing, it's time to take a closer look at "Rethinking Regency" and the surrounding area.
Full Article
http://www.metrojacksonville.com/article/2010-feb-rethinking-regency-mall
Maybe I'm not reading this correctly, but it appears they're advocating the bulldozing of everything there (Mall, office buildings, existing retail, Theater, apartments) and rebuilding. How is that even feasible?
I could get behind the razing of the mall, but the BofA and Crowley buildings, Home Depot and Target, etc., etc.; not to mention temporarily displacing the residents of a number of existing apartment complexes in the area? Why not come up with designs that incorporate and enhance what already exists? The entire area simply cannot be reduced to a blank canvas and rebuilt in the manner laid out above.
It looks great on paper, though.
well lets just go bulldoze it all like we did downtown and then wonder why we did it because it never got rebuilt because no one could or would get financing to rebuild it.
In a Vision, you don't usually confine ideas with things like right of way, existing buildings, etc....no boundaries!
I think were all jumping the gun here. Its just a "vision". The only thing they will be "demolishing" would be the west wing of the mall.
If you ask me, the west wing demolition couldn't come soon enough. Right now the best thing that side of the mall has to offer is when a carnival sets up in the parking lot.
The overall vision for the area is very nice. Very ambitious, but nice.
I agree that this is 'Vision', but at some point, vision has to be matched with reality, otherwise it is just an exercise in fantasy architecture. I would assume these consultants will be doing that.
Quote from: vicupstate on February 12, 2010, 11:26:06 AM
I agree that this is 'Vision', but at some point, vision has to be matched with reality, otherwise it is just an exercise in fantasy architecture. I would assume these consultants will be doing that.
I agree. Im sure everything that is existing will be incoporated when all is said and done.
As long as the Dillard's clearance center is safe.... I like it.
(http://lh6.ggpht.com/_bQsuhPJduqQ/S3V-ip2KEpI/AAAAAAAAB3w/ZsezWgT_-H4/s800/Regency.jpg)
From a walkability standpoint, the transit "hubs" should be located in the center of the complex. The idea of having it on the edge is a direct product of our autocentric thinking.
Southside Bl at Arlington Expressway is no doubt the number one traffic junction, but Atlantic Boulevard at Arlington Expressway is the walkable center.
So WHAT transit choices? Walk or don't walk? Seems to me the best first phase for a Jacksonville "Interurban" Light Rail Line.
OCKLAWAHA
That whole area is a mess and reminds me of the lesser parts of NJ. If only there was a way to properly re-do the whole thing I'd be for it.
This charette appears to just bulldoze everything. Pictures looks nice bu this is not functional. Regency mall needs to be updated, but GGP, the owner, is bankrupt. Kendall Town Center has some better bones, perhaps they could mimic that or Tapestry park in the redesign process of the the Mall's exterior. The nice sign of growth is the new Publix and Marriott they built in Arlington. The bad thing is that people do not like going to this mall when St. Johns Town Center is right up the street, but the neighborhood is still alive!
I certainly give this vision my stamp of approval. :) and Ock, the transportation hubs are at the end of the rebuilt pedestrian corridor. They do not have to the centerpiece as a courtyard/fountain etc could be. I think they are positioned very well and this vision actually looks very well thought out. Remember the transportation options have to compromise with what infrastructure is already laid out and what building layout makes the most sense, and unless we build underground we cannot just plop these stations wherever we willy nilly want; their locations have to compromise with existing ROW and infrastructure and the planning of physical structures.
I'm looking at it from a railroad planner standpoint. Having once lived at Regency Lakes Apartments, and used JTA to and from my job as a Trailways supervisor, I have more then a passing interest in this. I love the plan overall, let's do it, get to work even! But, the old Mall is a LONG walk on a 98 degree summer day, or today for that matter. End to end it's over a mile of traffic dodging, horn honking, light watching fun. By piercing the heart of the zone, no one walks more then 1/2 of that distance. Add several hundred riders per day. Having a local looper round the Regency Shopping district, then Town Center, every 10 minutes all day 10:00 am - 10:00 pm and every half hour until the theaters close, might do the trick too. I would envision an articulated, low floor, serving only scheduled stops with ticket vending machines. NO FARE COLLECTION ON BOARD, NO EXTRA STOPS!
Light rail could come over a new Matthews bridge/tunnel but it should be built heavy enough to allow freight movement during the night. This would not only subsidize operations, it would make warehousing and clean industrial competitive in zones all the way to Mayport, where the line could no doubt serve DOD purposes.
OCKLAWAHA
Well, at some point, if the current buildings can't bring in enough rent to upgrade or even maintain them, it may be possible to demolish many or all of them to unlock the land value if that is great enough.
In OP, during the boom, they tore down an entire 5 to 10 year old apartment complex near OP mall to redevelop it with a Home Depot shopping center. In Mandarin, they tore down an approximately 10 year old strip of stores adjacent to Albertsons (now Publix) at I-295 and San Jose to build a Target.
On the other hand, they mostly rehabbed substantially, rather than demolish, Phillips Mall.
Roosevelt Mall is a hybrid, part rehab, part demolition replaced by new construction.
In the end, it just depends on the economics of the situation. Half of Regency is now 40 years old, another 1/2 is almost 30 years. Maybe, for their purposes, the buildings have achieved enough of their useful lives to be replaced. Only the land owner knows for sure at this point. But, nothing should be ruled out. The biggest nut today would be getting financing for something like this. Right now, no matter how good the project, that may be next to impossible.
The surrounding centers off of Atlantic and Arlington Expressways may be harder to add in, being they have many different property owners.
It is hard for me to tell from the drawings, but I think creating an overpass of Southside Blvd. over Atlantic Blvd. and removing the grade level intersection at Monument and Atlantic should be looked at. There is just too much mixing of through traffic with local/neighborhood traffic in the Regency Square area making no one happy. More separation would help both and may make it easier to accommodate rail transit corridors through the area.
Some kind of tax incentive improvement district may also serve as a catalyst if this is a priority project.
Tear down the West Mall? Taking it back to the original size?
BRING BACK ANNIE-TIQUES!!! :D
Wishful thinking. Leave everything as is and reconstruct or modernize to fit whatever new scheme they come up with for Regency once the mall is history.
"HU"
And who would pay for this project?
^Tearing down Regency? Either the current owner or a development group that would purchase the property from them.
Unfortunately malls are old-fashioned. This area is built around a mall. It has cool history. Maybe it could return to the 60s mall it was and be kitschy.
Retro Mall.
I'd miss sears, maybe they'd move somewhere else in the mall, like that empty furniture store. I'll say this, parking at regency is much better than SJTC, which I work less than a mile from and avoid like the plague.
Retro mall...
Id go to it!
Too bad we can't get "Retro Rail" involved in it also!
Simon Properties, owner of the Avenues, SJTC, OP Mall, and the Outlet Malls in St. Augustine is now offering to buy the bankrupt owner of Regency, literally cornering the Jax area mall market:QuoteSimon Property Group Inc. offered to buy General Growth Properties Inc. for about $10 billion as the world's largest shopping-mall operator seeks to absorb the No. 2 mall owner in the U.S. as it grapples with bankruptcy.
Although shopping-mall real-estate investment trusts have been struggling with declines in consumer spending, Simon is viewed as one of the healthiest. It reported better-than-expected quarterly results last month, and although Simon's business was still hurt by write-downs and lower occupancy rates, it predicted brighter days for 2010.
Meanwhile, Simon raised several billion dollars in the latter part of 2009 looking for opportunities to take advantage of woes in the commercial real-estate sector. Simon had said earlier this month it wasn't in active negotiations with General Growth.
The Chicago-based owner of 200 U.S. malls, filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection in April, taking 166 of its malls into the case with it. Since then, it has restructured and extended the due dates of $11.6 billion in mortgages on its malls. But it still needs to reach similar deals with holders of another $3 billion of mortgages and to pay its $7 billion of unsecured debt with either cash or equity.
Simon said Tuesday its proposed deal would accelerate General Growth's emergence from bankruptcy court. The offer gives creditors about $7 billion in considerations by providing a 100% cash recovery of par value plus accrued interest and divided to holders of various debt and securities.
General Growth shareholders would receive more than $9 as share, including $6 in cash plus assets valued at more than $3 a share. It is also prepared to offer Simon common shares instead of cash to General Growth holders interested in owning Simon stock.
Secured debt on General Growth's portfolio would remain in place.
A General Growth spokesman wasn't immediately available to comment.
Simon Property's stock closed Friday at $72 and wasn't active premarket.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704804204575069081644845898.html?mod=WSJ_HomeAndGarden_sections_Commercial
Well, if they can purchase the property and do something constructive and/or creative with it, then so be it. Deep down and in theory, I'm not necessarily a fan of one group having a monopoly on all the malls, but I don't knowhow big a deal it really is.
Hopefully something good comes out of it.
Or they'll just shut it down to send the remaining customers to their existing properties?
Quote from: thelakelander on February 16, 2010, 09:26:53 AM
Or they'll just shut it down to send the remaining customers to their existing properties?
There's that, too. With an extinct and empty shell, there's no worry of business displacement and such a revamp can occur that much more easily, no? At least, in theory?
Sure, as long as Simon allows it.
In some ways, a Simon takeover of Regency may increase the likelihood of a quicker redevelopment. If Simon drove all the tenants to its other malls, it would still keep most of the business it acquired. Meanwhile, it would have total freedom to extract new value out of the buildings and real estate remaining at the Regency site. Kind of a cake and eat it too proposition.
Only Simon could really pull this off given their position in our market. Any other owner would likely have to attempt to salvage their investment by trying to keep the tenants at Regency and poaching a few from Simon as opposed to writing off the whole mall and starting over.
I find it hard to believe that Simon or any company, would simply destroy or allow a slow death to a property that it spent so much to buy, just to eliminate competition. That just too much money to devote to something like that.
Quote from: vicupstate on February 16, 2010, 09:25:15 PM
I find it hard to believe that Simon or any company, would simply destroy or allow a slow death to a property that it spent so much to buy, just to eliminate competition. That just too much money to devote to something like that.
Vicup, first, Simon is buying a portfolio of 200 malls. Regency is just one of many. They aren't spending $10 billion just to take over all of Jax area malls and specifically eliminate competition in lil' ol' Jax. They have a global strategy. However, within that strategy, I am sure they will customize a unique strategy for each property. Some of the 200 malls may be redeveloped and Regency is not immune.
I am suggesting that because they have little to no mall competition in this particular market, that mall shoppers and stores could be consolidated into their existing properties here without Simon missing a beat - just as many companies buy competitors and do the same thing. Simon gets added value because they collect more rent from fewer properties saving lots of overhead.
Then, they turn around and redevelop Regency, perhaps in a new retail - mixed use concept as suggested in this thread. The rents from repositioning Regency plus the efficiencies of consolidating existing mall revenues is a home run any corporate chieftain would salivate over. Eliminating competition is good for Simon but here the real story is it may act as a catalyst for them to do some things no other Regency owner could accomplish.
I just read that the owners of Regency declined the offer by Simon, and say they may reconsider once they are out of bankruptcy.
I noticed the Bennigan's building on Atlantic and Southside has been torn down. There is a 'Coming Soon' sign for a Fifth Third Bank.
I miss that Bennigans. Always great for a Monte Cristo sandwich or a Kilkenny's Country Chicken Salad.
That said, I'm glad something's coming to take its place as infill. Baby steps.
It's a positive step. There are so many empty spaces in that immediate area. The car dealership, Lazy Boy, Barnes & Noble, Circuit City, Applebees, Babies R Us.
On a side note, I saw a Bennigan's that was still open outside of Charlotte.
The Wendy's in front of the Target on Roosevelt near NAS was torn down close to a year ago. A similar sign advertising a Fifth Third Bank "coming soon" has stood in its place ever since. No dirt has yet turned.
I am thinking there has also been a sign in front of the Publix on Beach/Kernan for a Fifth/Third for over a year.
Malls are dead, they just don't know it. All old malls will either become commercial office space, such as Emerson did in the 90s, or they will become churchs. Shoppers want new, Regency is NOT new nor is Orange Park Mall.
Throw up new walls in Cecil Field and people would probably flock to it, because there is nothing until 295 along Normandy from Baldwin/Maxville.
Regency Square considering additional usesQuoteby David Chapman
Staff Writer
Entertainment options. Office space. Even space for area universities or the medical community.
Those are possibilities for vacant areas within Regency Square Mall, said Helen Ciesla, the mall’s general manager.
“We’re not ruling anything out,†she said after her Wednesday presentation to the Southside Business Men’s Club.
A slow retail economy coupled with growing competition in the last 20 years led to a higher mall vacancy, she said. The mall does not report its vacancy rate to the public.
But she said the center, with its anchors and 130 small shops, employs about 2,000 people.
While vacancies, especially in the west end of the mall, have opened up possibilities for outside-the-box opportunities, Ciesla said the main goal remains the same.
“Our goal is to retain tenants first and foremost,†she said.
Ciesla also briefed the group on Regency Square’s 42-year history and the remodels and additions that made the mall a destination.
She said The Avenues and St. Johns Town Center entered the market and provided both healthy competition and saturation, but she also credits the Town Center for helping put Northeast Florida on the shopping map.
“The reality is they offer retail that wasn’t offered here,†said Ciesla.
Regency Square doesn’t aim to go head-to-head with either venue, she said, but instead will focus on value-oriented sales. She said Regency also carries a perception of crime and lack of safety that comes with appealing to shoppers with lower incomes. Security cameras and strict loitering policies haven’t changed the perception, she said, even with crime statistics being low and “very positive.â€
“Unfortunately, perception is reality,†she said. “It’s a very difficult perception to change.â€
The mall averages around 10 million to 12 million customers a year, though last year it dropped by half a million, something Ciesla called significant.
Medical offices, a community center and entertainment venues are all up for discussion for vacant space at the mall, as is the idea of hosting a business expo. “We’d be a viable venue for that event,†she said.
The mall will continue its attempt to fill the vacancies and Ciesla is confident Regency Square will be an asset to Jacksonville for the long haul.
“I can tell you we’re here to stay,†she said.
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=530663
there is also a Fifth/Third "Coming Soon" sign at the corner of Townsend and Merrill. They demolished the BP station and Hollywood Video about a year ago and nothing has happened. I just hope once they do start construcion that they save all the mature live oak trees remainig from the previous developments.
Fifth Third has about 6 lease options around town(at really good intersections too) that they have yet to exercise. They could become a big player in Jax once they're ready to continue their expansion into this market.
Regency is a victim to the poor planning and zoning in the city.
SJTC, while a good design and layout for today, was allowed to be too close to the Avenues and Regency. While Regency was already on the downward spiral, when they opened the new shopping area at I-95/Duval Road by the airport, that cutoff the remaining ad-hoc shopping market for them. The Arlington area is inadequate to maintain a mall of such size. It was designed to be a regional mall, but the "region" it serves has shrunk to near nothing.
The only thing keeping it alive now is the anchors, namely JC Penney and Belk. The Sears is a shell of itself, and Dillards is merely finishing out its lease with an outlet center. The only interior store with significant foot traffic was Old Navy and they have left now. (at SJTC now) The only ones who can afford the leases now are athletic shoe stores and jewelry stores.
Even the Avenues felt the impact of SJTC as 4 stores closed up once they opened duplicate stores at STJC.
Baffles me how the city fathers in the planning department thought having 3 large malls within 15 minutes of each other was somehow going to benefit the region. It's as if they already *knew* Regency was a goner when they approved SJTC.
Avenues will always have a market until the Nocatee Town Center fully opens, then they will get the squeeze as the St Johns County crowd either goes south, or up the new 9B to SJTC.
If you don't see the pattern yet (squeeze out old regional style malls for town center style malls), then that puts Avenues on the clock. Parisian has not been replaced yet as an anchor and I am guessing it never will.
Since the Baymeadows Mall has already been turned into a junior college, and there is already a campus on Beach, no political savior for Regency other than a full scraping.
I still can't figure, with Jacksonville's density, how they can justify 3 Super Targets, 2 Wal-Mart's, 2 Publix, 2 Winn-Dixie, all within 10 driving minutes of my locale. 5 more minutes gets me to Regency. Another 5 gets me to the Avenues.
It's complete planning madness. The city is trying to gorge on sales tax revenue, but in the end it is self defeating as one steals from another until one dies.
I think St John's Town Center did Regency Square in....or at least helped.. by expressway its a couple of minutes away.. it is much newer...it has so much more to offer than RS. I think if they do with Regency what they did in Orlando with Winter Park Mall... Demolish all but one building and build a similar development to SJTC .. That is what happened to Winter Park Mall.. it was totally dead... and after the redevelopment , it is thriving. Most likely the same will eventually have to come to pass with Orange Park Mall.
We should refashion the mall and its massive parking lot into a New Urbanist community. Just tear the roof off of the middle and make it into a main street. Put facades on the storefronts and parking garages above the stores (like SoDO). The parking lot can become a neighborhood of townhouses. Everyone will want to live there.
Not a bad plan !
Quote from: gridsketch on June 28, 2010, 09:54:36 PM
We should refashion the mall and its massive parking lot into a New Urbanist community. Just tear the roof off of the middle and make it into a main street. Put facades on the storefronts and parking garages above the stores (like SoDO). The parking lot can become a neighborhood of townhouses. Everyone will want to live there.
visioning study for that has already been done...check this out
http://www.jaxpride.org/uploads/Charrette-Rethinking_Regency.pdf
Sweet! It mentions in the study , the before and after of Winter Park Mall ....Now Winter Park Village.. which is stunning !!! :)
There needs to be a stop there on the light rail that goes from downtown to the beaches. This will encourage transit oriented development. One day!
Agree... If light rail were in place in many areas of town, I would use it as opposed to my own car. After a 25 year career which required a LOT of driving , it would not bother me at all :)
Quote from: tufsu1 on June 28, 2010, 10:12:25 PM
Quote from: gridsketch on June 28, 2010, 09:54:36 PM
We should refashion the mall and its massive parking lot into a New Urbanist community. Just tear the roof off of the middle and make it into a main street. Put facades on the storefronts and parking garages above the stores (like SoDO). The parking lot can become a neighborhood of townhouses. Everyone will want to live there.
visioning study for that has already been done...check this out
http://www.jaxpride.org/uploads/Charrette-Rethinking_Regency.pdf
I wanna be in a charrette. Someone put me on a list!
Right? I love the renderings !!
Quote from: Timkin on June 28, 2010, 10:26:55 PM
Agree... If light rail were in place in many areas of town, I would use it as opposed to my own car. After a 25 year career which required a LOT of driving , it would not bother me at all :)
The light rail stops have to be to real destinations not just shopping and strip malls. There has to be existing work/shop/home places or at least the potential for future work/shop/home places.
I understand that
Regency has the potential to be a destination again. It has the semigridded fabric of Arlington adjacent to it with many sidewalks and is right between downtown and the beaches.
It's sort of a chicken and the egg situaiton. Rail would be the egg I hope :)
I used the light rail in Baltimore in the 1990s and it was awesome.
Quote from: gridsketch on June 28, 2010, 10:28:53 PM
I wanna be in a charrette. Someone put me on a list!
contact JaxPride
Quote from: TheProfessor on June 28, 2010, 10:19:08 PM
There needs to be a stop there on the light rail that goes from downtown to the beaches. This will encourage transit oriented development. One day!
right now the downtown-beaches corridor is planned to be served by BRT (as there is no existing rail line)...but yes, Regency is a major stop/transfer location
I looks like Jacksonville is moving more permanently towards a decentralized multinodal city like Los Angeles. If we remade old shopping/strip malls (Regency, Orange Park, Normandy) like this wouldn't it accelerate the demise of downtown? If these old malls became were truly urban places would the death of downtown be so bad? I'm mostly thinking out loud here. Or perhaps commercial/residential satellite towns with a cultural/civic/residential city center in downtown.
You are asking some very good questions. Mall building did have a negative effect on downtown.
Remade the old malls? That is nuts, look at St. Johns Town Center, that works, its new and its decentralized with people walking outside the mall, call it crazy, I hate it when it rains, but it is working and with all the space for each, it would make better sense to raze the old buildings and build a model of SJTC on the space that they consume. Avenues has 4 new stores, but Simon is a much better operator than most.
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2013/06/03/4083489/bold-visions-compete-for-eastland.html
Two redevelopment plans submitted for a now-closed mall in Charlotte that is very similiar to Regency. Long-range plans for the site include a streetcar stop.
Why does everyone like the design of a shopping area that reminds me of the little neighborhood shopping centers of the nineteen fifties?
I probably am out of it, but I believe it rains for a good part of 200 days a year here. Additionally, it is hotter than eighty most of the year. There was a reason why malls rose to dominate commercial shopping complexes. It got you out of the weather!
Because of this, the incredibly sprawling nature of the town centers, the fact that these are really cow pasture centers, the ridiculous parking, and the inadequate store size, I avoid the town centers like the plague. They have to be in the center of a town to be a town center, but there is not a town in sight of SJTC, RPMC, or Nocatee Town Center.
St. Augustine has a true town center, but, because it is more than four hundred years old, the shops are too small to attract A class retailers. In many cases, this is a good thing as it seems to encourage some creativity on the part of the shop owners. At least in St. Augustine they had to finally break down and do a part of the right thing after they had tried everything else: They built a huge and proximate parking garage to get parking lot sprawl out of the equation and they ran the tour trams to it.
Roosevelt Mall was originally roofed, but when Regency opened, Roosevelt Mall air conditioned rapidly. The problem was it was not big enough to compete. When the Avenues opened, Regency and Orange Park had to enlarge.
I think that a big part of the problem is that retailers don't want to pay the gross sales gouge that mall operators demanded in addition to rent. Top end stores were frequently excused from the gouge as they were needed as "anchor" stores by the developers.
Thinking about all of these things, I believe that the problem with retail centers, as a whole, are not the design or lack of it, the management of the centers, or the lack of viable community planning: it lies in the lack of vision of the retailers.
Looks like Regency Square Mall has a buyer, just not sure who yet
http://jacksonville.com/business/2014-01-23/story/sharing-wealth-has-not-been-good-regency-square-mall
Regency Square has been an anchor for shopping in Jacksonville since 1967. Those of that us that work over by the mall and have for many years still support and love shopping here. There are definitely enough people living around the mall (more to come thanks to Lennar Homes) and street traffic to more than support the mall. If you look at surrounding shopping and restaurants it's a clear indication that the area is safe and vibrant. We are looking forward to the NEW Regency Square !
I agree. I live within 4 miles of Regency Square and would love to see some semblance of the old mall's glory days return. Excellent location and constant traffic, good mixed-use retail area, safe and clean neighborhoods. I'm sure it will rise again, either as one big retail center or a split-purpose facility.
Yep - this is huge news and hopefully will breathe new life in to the mall. As the article states, most everything around the mall is doing quite well. There's all kinds of people that live in the area (from 6 figures to low-income) and the demand is definitely there.
Im one that will admit, without an once of shame that I still love Regency and the area, and want to see the mall bounce back. Being a 80's baby, I have ALOT of memories Regency Square in its hey days. Just running around being a kid, movie hopping (paying for one movie, and seeing three LOL). Lots of fun. I hope they do something with it
That article mentioned an amusement park being built there. That'd be a great place to put one. 15 minutes or less to the beach, downtown, and the airport. That would really boost the area.
I don't think it's big enough, especially for something like wild adventures. I still think it could be a huge retail outlet again, however, it would be at the cost of the SITE.
An amusement park is definitely possible and honestly it would be a pretty sweet location. As mentioned above it's about 15 minutes from downtown / SJ Town Center, 20 minutes to the beaches, there are plenty of Hotels within 5-15 minutes. AND there's a great water park about 20 minutes away that people tend to forget about... Adventure Landing in Jax Beach.
Also, keep in mind an amusement park doesn't have to be MASSIVELY sprawled out like a "theme park." If it's focused on rides and attractions, rather than fake buildings and plywood fake cities, the 110 acre plot would be perfect. There's already a really nice zoo 20 minutes away so no need for the extra acreage like Wild Adventures and Bush Gardens use. I think the biggest complaint I heard growing up was that the Florida theme parks are pretty boring. Sure it's fun to go once or twice, but each park only has 2-3 roller coasters so it's get's pretty old fast. There's also a good crowd that would be willing to drive 45 minutes - 1 hour to get here vs the 2-3 hours it would take to get to Orlando / Tampa. It could still be themed, but more focused on rides...Maybe sports related, "NFL Play 60 Park of Jacksonville"? (fast acrobatic roller coasters, a higher end go kart track ala Ocala GP, Zip lining, base jump, human foosball, human bowling, bumper boat football). If the Jaguars or NFL would sponsor the park it would be a win / win for the team, league and city.
The property is better suited than the shipyards as well for noise pollution reasons, since there are fewer residences immediately near by / no water for sound to travel over.
Some Popular Parks by acreage:
Disney California Adventure: 67 acres
Islands of Adventure: 110 acres
Universal Studios, FL: 125 acres
Disney's Magic Kingdom: 107 acres
Disney's Hollywood Studio's: 135 acres
Silver Dollar City: 61 acres
Holiday World: 80 acres
I personally would like to see an amusement/theme park go somewhere else, and Regency given a second chance as a shopping mall. It not like this city doesn't have a shortage of land. Most theme parks tend to be in suburban areas, that way they are free to expand, with no noise complaints from neighbors, etc.
Wild Adventures is a young theme park in the middle of nowhere; I wouldn't be scared of building a med/large scale theme park here in Jax somewhere. The common statement that some say is "We can't compete with Orlando, therefore that will lead to failure" We don't have to compete with Orlando, as it would appeal to a regional crowd; No different than SJTC, and RCMP appealing to a regional crowds. It would be wise to stay away from expensive sponsors; There are definitely lessons to be learned from the old ill-fated Hard Rock Park/Freestyle Music Park in Myrtle Beach.
Gaylord's Opryland Nashville is a good example of a resort that gave up the theme park roots and focused on convention center work and large group hosting.
I would say tear it down and make it a resort/convention center with all new retail attached in the vein of The Mills Company does (Gurnee Mills, St Louis Mills), but its not well connected with the city. Has poor connectivity to the airport.
Wild Adventures: 166 acres including zoo, 116 acres w/o zoo...
There really is plenty of room there already. And When you consider the amount of traffic that drives near there (295, Arlington Expressway, Atlantic Blvd, Southside Blvd) it kind of seems like a no brainer as far as being pretty centralized and well connected. Bush Gardens is basically built in the middle of a neighborhood in Tampa off of 75. It's fed by a similar road conglomeration as well.
Ashame it couldn't just be turned into a casino. Clearly gambling is already doing good business in the area.
Quote from: duvaldude08 on January 24, 2014, 03:49:58 PM
Im one that will admit, without an once of shame that I still love Regency and the area, and want to see the mall bounce back. Being a 80's baby, I have ALOT of memories Regency Square in its hey days. Just running around being a kid, movie hopping (paying for one movie, and seeing three LOL). Lots of fun. I hope they do something with it
Yall are getting me all nostalgic and sh*t, LOL. I remember when Regency had three video game stores (Electronic Boutique, Babbage's, and Game Stop) and either two or three arcades, with Camelot's being across the street in Regency Court and Tilt being in the mall, fun times as a kid. Screw Reg being torn down, and reinvisioned into something else; Here's to RSM's new renaissance still as a mall!!! :)
Quote from: spuwho on January 25, 2014, 05:19:12 PM
Gaylord's Opryland Nashville is a good example of a resort that gave up the theme park roots and focused on convention center work and large group hosting.
Thrill seekers in Nashville are still yearning for a theme park too. There really isn't any theme/amusement parks in the entire state besides Dollywood and Lake Winnie (in Georgia) near Chattanooga.
Quote from: FSBA on January 25, 2014, 06:02:20 PM
Ashame it couldn't just be turned into a casino. Clearly gambling is already doing good business in the area.
Are there any Timucua Native Americans still around? Make an old tribal claim?
Quote from: jaxjaguar on January 25, 2014, 05:21:51 PM
Wild Adventures: 166 acres including zoo, 116 acres w/o zoo...
There really is plenty of room there already. And When you consider the amount of traffic that drives near there (295, Arlington Expressway, Atlantic Blvd, Southside Blvd) it kind of seems like a no brainer as far as being pretty centralized and well connected. Bush Gardens is basically built in the middle of a neighborhood in Tampa off of 75. It's fed by a similar road conglomeration as well.
Yep. And a nice regional amusement park would help redevelop the entire area. A Six Flags/Cedar Fair type park would attract people from all over Florida, SE Georgia, and southern South Carolina. There's nothing like it in Florida.
I could understand some people wanting Regency to stay around as a shopping destination because of its history, but like the article said, there's just too much retail in the area. It can't all be successful. Something new to the region would refresh that entire neighborhood.
When I moved to Jax in 2003, one of the first design projects I worked on was a proposed theme park in Brunswick, GA that was going to be called Steamboat City.
QuoteFor millions of motorists that stream along Interstate 95 every year, there are stretches in Georgia where the only scenery is pines and palmettos.
By the summer of 2006, developers said Wednesday, there will be a $150 million theme park on 800 acres north of Brunswick that will prompt many to pull off the exit and stay a while.
Steamboat City, a theme park planned at Exit 42 north of Brunswick, could open by the summer of 2006. The park would include rides, including a roller coaster, shows and displays of coastal Georgia's history and culture. Provided by WG Pitts Co.
William G. Pitts, president of WG Pitts Co. of Jacksonville, and officials from Powers Design of Ponte Vedra Beach announced their plans, including rides, shows and displays of coastal Georgia's history and culture.
Steamboat City is planned at Exit 42, about midway between Savannah and Jacksonville and is designed have a variety of family attractions from the relaxed (a petting zoo, horse-drawn trolley and railroad) to the thrilling (a haunted plantation and roller coaster), the developers said.
full article: http://jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/040804/geo_15293887.shtml
We got pretty far in design and even attended a theme park convention to hook up with ride and gaming manufacturers and suppliers. However, the financial numbers never came together to get it off the ground. The property was threatened with foreclosure in 2012. I'm not sure how it all turned out but the land is still undeveloped today.
QuoteBRUNSWICK, Ga. - A Dollywood-style theme park developers had sought to build in northern Glynn County for over a decade may be gone for good.
Park Avenue Bank, which has headquarters in Valdosta, announced in a Jan. 9 newspaper ad it would hold a foreclosure sale next month on the 900-acre parcel owned by Steamboat City Development Co.
Will Pitts, a Jacksonville developer and general partner for the company, hopes it won't come to that.
"Our hope is the foreclosure won't be executed," Pitts said. "They just filed the formal notice that they're required to under Georgia statute ... The note was due."
Plans for the ambitious theme park stretch back to 1998, when Mutual of Omaha's Jim Fowler first envisioned a free-roaming animal park for what was then 2,000 acres at the Georgia 99-Interstate 95 interchange.
Full article: http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/2010-01-17/story/steamboat_city_project_in_south_georgia_may_be_stalled_for_good#ixzz2rT7Cweuh
With that said, how many theme parks have been built from scratch in the US over the last 10 years?
Quote from: thelakelander on January 25, 2014, 09:45:52 PM
With that said, how many theme parks have been built from scratch in the US over the last 10 years?
16 if you count every amusement park opened in the US over the last 10 years... This includes places that only have 1 ride though. If you base it on places with more than 1 ride it would be:
2004: Amusement Park Drive In (Laurel, Montana, USA), 2 Rollercoasters
2006: Western Playland (Sunland Park, New Mexico, USA), 3 Rollercoasters
2009: O.D. Pavilion and Amusement Park (North Myrtle Beach, South Carolina, USA), 2 Rollercoasters
2010: Miracle Strip Pier Park (Panama City Beach, Florida, USA), 2 Rollercoasters
2011: Legoland (Legoland, Florida, USA), 4 Rollercoasters
^^^ I'll call many of those places 'family fun centers' rather than 'amusement parks' (with one kiddie coaster, and mini golf, etc). 'Amusement Park Drive In' is basically a family fun center with one operational kiddie coaster (the other bigger coaster operating from 2009-2011) If that's the case, then Jax Beach has an 'amusement park' (Adventure Landing, with the Wacky Worm coaster). :)
Technically Adventure Landing is an amusement park ^_^
http://rcdb.com/5821.htm (http://rcdb.com/5821.htm)
Quote from: thelakelander on January 25, 2014, 09:45:52 PM
When I moved to Jax in 2003, one of the first design projects I worked on was a proposed theme park in Brunswick, GA that was going to be called Steamboat City.
I was very disappointed when that project unraveled. If Jax was to get an amusement park, I would like to see it in an similar highway-side spot right by I-10 or I-95; Now you're talking about instantly appealing to US interstate traffic, along with the local crowd.
Quote from: jaxjaguar on January 25, 2014, 10:30:44 PM
Quote from: thelakelander on January 25, 2014, 09:45:52 PM
With that said, how many theme parks have been built from scratch in the US over the last 10 years?
16 if you count every amusement park opened in the US over the last 10 years... This includes places that only have 1 ride though. If you base it on places with more than 1 ride it would be:
2004: Amusement Park Drive In (Laurel, Montana, USA), 2 Rollercoasters
2006: Western Playland (Sunland Park, New Mexico, USA), 3 Rollercoasters
2009: O.D. Pavilion and Amusement Park (North Myrtle Beach, South Carolina, USA), 2 Rollercoasters
2010: Miracle Strip Pier Park (Panama City Beach, Florida, USA), 2 Rollercoasters
2011: Legoland (Legoland, Florida, USA), 4 Rollercoasters
Out of this list, Legoland Florida is the only bonafide amusement/theme park. All of the others are essentially what gets set up at the fairgrounds and Regency Square's parking lot every year.
I grew up less than five miles from Legoland Florida and purchased deeply discounted annual passes for my kids the first year it was open. It wasn't built from scratch. They kept and repurposed most of Cypress Gardens including a rollercoaster, the water park, the "main street" area, Island-In-The-Sky, the botanical gardens and the water ski pavilions. Now that I think of it, all they really did is add more rides, reconfigure the parking lot/entrance and a ton of landscaping.
Quote from: jaxjaguar on January 25, 2014, 11:23:54 PM
Technically Adventure Landing is an amusement park ^_^
http://rcdb.com/5821.htm (http://rcdb.com/5821.htm)
Okay true. A Family Entertainment Center is technically a 'small amusement park' but please don't use that term very loosely. When you're going to a FEC, expect to see laser tag, arcade, mini golf, and go-carts, moreso than a looping steel coaster, a dark ride, and a looping starship. Hell, Boomers down there in South Florida had a large wooden coaster (Dania Beach Hurricane) and it was known as a FEC. :)
Quote from: I-10east on January 25, 2014, 11:28:14 PM
Quote from: thelakelander on January 25, 2014, 09:45:52 PM
When I moved to Jax in 2003, one of the first design projects I worked on was a proposed theme park in Brunswick, GA that was going to be called Steamboat City.
I was very disappointed when that project unraveled. If Jax was to get an amusement park, I would like to see it in an similar highway-side spot right by I-10 or I-95; Now you're talking about instantly appealing to US interstate traffic, along with the local crowd.
I left the firm that was working on that project in 2008. By that time, we had spent at least two or three years coming up with alternative master site plan concepts. Everything from mixed use developments to industrial parks and single family home subdivisions. During the design development process, I remember looking at the rides (on paper) and thinking it would be a place most would visit once and never come back. Nevertheless, everything people say about pulling drivers off I-95 and serving North Florida/Southern Georgia, etc. was the same type of thinking behind Steamboat City. At the end of the day, the numbers didn't work well enough for it too break ground.
Quote from: I-10east on January 25, 2014, 11:41:02 PM
Quote from: jaxjaguar on January 25, 2014, 11:23:54 PM
Technically Adventure Landing is an amusement park ^_^
http://rcdb.com/5821.htm (http://rcdb.com/5821.htm)
Okay true. A Family Entertainment Center is technically a 'small amusement park' but use that term very loosely. When you're going to a FEC, expect to see laser tag, arcade, mini golf, and go-carts, moreso than a looping steel coaster, a dark ride, and a looping starship. Hell, Boomers down there in South Florida had a large wooden coaster (Dania Beach Hurricane) and it was known as a FEC. :)
Yes, technically Adventure Landing is an amusement park. However, I think we can all agree that Adventure Landing is a far cry from what most envision when they talk about a Six Flags/Wild Adventures size park opening in Jax.
^^^I personally would never call Adv Landing an 'amusement park'. In the amusement biz, it's definitely known as a Family Entertainment Center. When I think of 'small amusement park' I think of Lake Winnie, Lakeside (Denver), or Family Kingdom in Myrtle Beach.
I would say with the current rides and attractions at AV it's right on the cusp of FEC & AP. The water park there has really become great. If they added another major water ride and a real roller coaster it could be a small amusement park.
^^^ No doubt the water park is the real McCoy at Adventure Landing, but the dry attractions are VERY FEC-esque. It basically personifies a FEC. I doubt that it would expand much (if any) more than it already is, as it's cut off by a neighborhood, and Beach Blvd.
Fun Spot America in Orlando made that FEC to amusement park transition though, as it added three coasters, and some other flatrides.
www.rcdb.com/10346.htm
Quote from: thelakelander on January 25, 2014, 11:47:35 PM
During the design development process, I remember looking at the rides (on paper) and thinking it would be a place most would visit once and never come back.
I don't blame you, I probably would've went one time too. I guess that I was kinda naive, as I was caught up in the novelty of Steamboat City, thinking that it would hopefully expand in the future, LOL. That proposed 'phase one' was definitely boring, as I recalled I believe, one wooden coaster, a log flume, and a merry-go-round. That's all that I remembered. Usually bigger parks, and highways go hand and hand, and the smaller parks would be in a more intimate setting.
Before everyone buys sunblock and walking shoes, I wanted to point out the person in the article suggesting that an amusement park would be a good idea has no ownership in the property. He was just saying if he owned it, it is something he would consdier:
Quote"I said a few years ago that if it were my listing, I think someone should sell it to Wild Adventures and try to put an amusement park with roller coasters and water slides," he said. "That was tongue in cheek, but it might make sense if someone could buy the dirt cheap enough. You need some kind of destination there."
^Yes. I caught that. I think a theme park on that site is a pipe dream in reality. Regency is still a viable site as a mall. It just doesn't need to be as big as it currently is. With that said, they may want to do something about the Belk situation. Losing the remaining anchors it does have could be a death blow.
Quote from: Charles Hunter on January 25, 2014, 06:47:39 PM
Quote from: FSBA on January 25, 2014, 06:02:20 PM
Ashame it couldn't just be turned into a casino. Clearly gambling is already doing good business in the area.
Are there any Timucua Native Americans still around? Make an old tribal claim?
All Timucua groups have been dead since the 18th century. It would be possible for the Seminole (or Miccosukee) to buy property here and open a casino. It may also be possible for other tribes from outside Florida to do it, but the issue isn't settled. Otherwise there won't be any casinos because of the state's compact with the tribes.
I agree, losing Belk would be pretty bad especially since it's in the center of the mall. I wish belk would just come out and say their intentions already. I don't think Sears will go anywhere. I've heard a few things to they own the building to if they tear the mall down it'll be a standalone building (like Melbourne and Fernadina).
I'm looking forward to hearing more about what the potential buyer has in mind for the massive property. There's a lot of potential there, and as we all know, more housing/residents are coming.
Quote from: coredumped on January 26, 2014, 06:00:21 PM
Before everyone buys sunblock and walking shoes, I wanted to point out the person in the article suggesting that an amusement park would be a good idea has no ownership in the property. He was just saying if he owned it, it is something he would consdier:
Quote"I said a few years ago that if it were my listing, I think someone should sell it to Wild Adventures and try to put an amusement park with roller coasters and water slides," he said. "That was tongue in cheek, but it might make sense if someone could buy the dirt cheap enough. You need some kind of destination there."
Well said Core. Herschend Family Entertainment (which is the actual company, not Wild Adv like he said) are very cautious and business savvy; They aren't exactly into the 'building theme park from scratch' business, as they invest their time into established parks.
Regency Square is under contract, and could close next week. Wow!
www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2014/02/10/regency-square-mall-under-contract-to.html
Karen Brune Mathis from the Jax Daily Record states the buyer is a joint venture between Namdar Realty Group and Mason Asset Management Inc., both of Great Neck, NY.
http://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/showstory.php?Story_id=542212