Metro Jacksonville

QuoteNov. 19, 2009

By Isaac Babcock
Observer Staff

Sen. Paula Dockery is coming to Winter Park on Monday to update the City Commission on renewed plans for commuter rail, with rumors swirling that she may try to dissuade the city from helping push a modified SunRail plan forward.

Meanwhile Orlando Mayor Buddy Dyer is talking up a commuter rail deal patterned after one that passed this year in Massachusetts.

But a Winter Park city commissioner says that the deal has no teeth to stop cities and counties involved in SunRail from being hit with large liability lawsuits if an accident occurs.

That deal in Massachusetts between the state and CSX included stricter liability provisions that would place more of the financial burden for rail accidents on CSX than the company had attempted to negotiate in Florida earlier this year. But that would only leave CSX liable if it were found intentionally negligent in causing an accident.

That's difficult to prove, said Commissioner Beth Dillaha, and if the SunRail plan follows similar language, it could be functionally nearly identical to the old commuter rail deal, which broke down earlier this year.

"It's like Groundhog Day," Dillaha said. "It's just the same thing over again."

The panel pushing the development of SunRail met Friday to discuss plans for a special legislative session on Dec. 7. Dyer, the panel's chairman, has long been a proponent of commuter rail in Central Florida. He estimated that a supermajority could be possible in a potential upcoming Senate vote on a deal between the state and CSX to buy up rail tracks and help move CSX's rail routes.

But Dillaha said that positive talk could be hiding the truth behind the renewed push for SunRail. She said the plan is too similar to past plans, and too flawed to work.

"Why should there be a special session for a project for the third time in a row with the same bad terms?" she asked, calling the project expensive and risky. "If a project is so bad that it's been defeated twice and they have to misrepresent a lot of the facts to the public, you've got to question the motivation behind it."

http://wpmobserver.com/WPMObserver/article.asp?ID=2674

I hear a lot of talk about the new CSX deal, but in the same breath it's said that there still isn't anything in writing. I wonder why?

Its nice to see you back!  Here is an article you quoted in an old thread back in April.  During that discussion, you bolded a quote about the Massachusetts deal as an example of Florida to follow. 

Am I right in assuming you're against this type of liability agreement as well?  If so, what type of agreement would put you on the Sunrail bandwagon and is there an example of an existing similarly design commuter rail system running with that type of agreement currently?

Quote from: FayeforCure on April 19, 2009, 11:01:11 PM
Kind of a funny take on the Central Florida Commuter Rail:

QuoteTracking the CSX Rail Journey


Published: Sunday, April 19, 2009 at 12:01 a.m.
Last Modified: Saturday, April 18, 2009 at 11:34 p.m.
The Coffee Guzzlers Club members were waiting for our waitress, S. Lois Molasses, to clear the table. Meanwhile, Nevermore, the club's pet raven and mascot, had been going through the archives and had found a CGC column from a year ago this month.

It was about the ongoing battle in the Legislature to win approval for a $1.2 billion commuter-rail project that would bring a SunRail system to the greater Orlando area while paying hundreds of millions of dollars for CSX Corp. railroad tracks.

In addition, the state would have to agree to be financially responsible for any accident involving CSX equipment - whether the railroad caused the accident or not.

That April 2008 column cited a quote from Mike Thomas, a columnist for The Orlando Sentinel. He wrote … oh, wait, Nevermore wants to recite it.

Quoth the Raven: According to Thomas, "It's not surprising that the leading foe of our commuter rail is state Sen. Paula Dockery from Lakeland. Normally that wouldn't be a problem, because our Sen. Dan Webster can beat up their Sen. Paula Dockery."

At the end of the session, I summed up the outcome of the railroad deal this way: "When anyone last looked, Webster had ended his 28-year legislative career flat on his back, with little birdies twittering above his head. Isn't that 'our' Sen. Dockery, in the red trunks, looming over 'their' Sen. Webster?"

At least Thomas was fair enough in another column last week to admit the CSX supporters had come up against a formidable opponent who had some perfectly valid objections to the deal.

As it turned out, this is not a boxing match. It is tag-team wrestling - at least for the CSX team. The railroad simply pulled Webster from the ring and brought in U.S. Rep. John Mica, R-Winter Park. "The project is alive and well," he said.

It has, however, began to look a little sickly recently. Oh, it has managed to get by some committee hearings - but those have been stacked with the project's supporters.

The upcoming budget has a $5.5 billion hole in it, programs are being slashed around the state, and the House version is handing education a 20 percent cut in many programs. So the CSX deal creates a pretty big blip on anybody's radar screen.

Moreover, Dockery has done some fact-checking on claims made by CSX supporters. And the answers she obtained from the Federal Transit Administration have been at variance with those statements.

And in just the last 10 days, something really strange happened. The Lakeland Chamber of Commerce came out in support of the CSX/SunRail commuter project.

Say what? It's backing a plan that will greatly increase the number - and substantially increase the length - of freight trains coming through town?

Yep. "In an e-mail sent Wednesday [April 8]," The Ledger reported, "Lakeland Area Chamber of Commerce's Katie Daughtrey asked members to pressure lawmakers for passage of the bill."

Daughtrey said she was "asking/begging everyone to contact the members of the Transportation and Economic Development Appropriations Committee and voice your support of SB 1212."

That bill was heard by committee on Wednesday where it stalled. "Members, I don't have to tell you that from a local standpoint this is important," the sponsor, Sen. Lee Constantine, R-Altamonte Springs told the committee. "But from a statewide perspective it's incalculable how important this is … "

Now that's funny: The entire deal was negotiated in secret. Executive directors of planning agencies in Polk County and other areas of the state had no idea that the commuter-rail system was being proposed until it was announced. Now it is supposedly part of some sort of statewide grand plan?

Chamber President Kathleen Munson said that the promise of money in the budget to study and plan alternate freight routes around Lakeland and the promise of commuter rail through Lakeland made it advantageous to support the bill.

Surely the chamber folks must have nodded off when CSX officials said they weren't interested in looking at a new railroad path from their standpoint. And they added that even if such a thing would be paid for by state and federal dollars, getting it permitted and rights-of-way acquired could take much more than a decade.

Did chamber officials miss out on the fact that CSX is demanding the taxpayers of Florida take financial responsibility for ANY accident caused on the tracks, even if CSX employees were negligent? Do they know state officials in Massachusetts have refused to approve such an agreement with CSX because they don't want their taxpayers on the hook for such an expense?

Billy Townsend, a former Ledger editor who now writes opinion pieces for the Lakeland Local (www.lakelandlocal.com) Web site, had this take on the chamber speaking up at the last minute and literally begging for the bill's passage:

"Well, you know what that means: Break out the champagne, my fellow deal opponents. If you've lived here for a while, you know that every Lakeland political imbroglio has its chamber stage, the point at which the chamber rushes in on the losing side."

They sure can pick 'em.

[ Lonnie Brown, The Ledger's associate editor, is interlocutor of the Coffee Guzzlers Club. The club motto this week is: "Sen. Dockery may just be The Little Engine that Could." ]

http://www.theledger.com/article/20090419/COLUMNISTS/904195007?Title=Tracking-the-CSX-Rail-Journey

http://www.metrojacksonville.com/forum/index.php/topic,4629.msg74490.html#msg74490

Quote from: thelakelander on November 19, 2009, 02:47:10 PM
Its nice to see you back!  Here is an article you quoted in an old thread back in April.  During that discussion, you bolded a quote about the Massachusetts deal as an example of Florida to follow. 

Am I right in assuming you're against this type of liability agreement as well? 

For now, as I said in my original post, it's all smoke and mirrors. They keep claiming tha CSX might be willing to use the Mass. language, but nothing is in writing. The second vote took place without any changes,.........it may be that they are going to try for a third vote without any changes,..............why else hasn't CSX committed in writing to the liability changes?

Quote from: FayeforCure on November 19, 2009, 03:58:57 PM

Quote from: thelakelander on November 19, 2009, 02:47:10 PM
Its nice to see you back!  Here is an article you quoted in an old thread back in April.  During that discussion, you bolded a quote about the Massachusetts deal as an example of Florida to follow. 

Am I right in assuming you're against this type of liability agreement as well? 

For now, as I said in my original post, it's all smoke and mirrors. They keep claiming tha CSX might be willing to use the Mass. language, but nothing is in writing. The second vote took place without any changes,.........it may be that they are going to try for a third vote without any changes,..............why else hasn't CSX committed in writing to the liability changes?

The fact that there has been so much resistance all along to making the deal more transparent and pallatable, is a major cause for concern.

Faye,

Would you be on-board w/ SunRail if the parties agreed to something very similar to the Massachusetts liability agreement?

Can someone explain the Liability agreement as well as the issues with CSX? (In terms a layperson such as myself can comprehend)

I have to agree with Ms Faye on this one...........all smoke and mirrors and just lip service. CSX has not committed to much of anything other than what some people are saying and I don't buy it! This is just more lip service to the public from people who think they know what the public wants to hear! Bull puckey and then some!

CSX as I understand it has agreed in principle to concessions on the liability issue. When I bought my house from the time that we had an agreement to having it all written up was 2 months.  We shouldn't judge how good or bad the agreement is until it is in writing.  That said to not have it all written out in contract form day one is not at all suspicious.
If you are screaming about it already you are just spinning.

Quote from: CS Foltz on November 19, 2009, 05:36:13 PM
I have to agree with Ms Faye on this one...........all smoke and mirrors and just lip service. CSX has not committed to much of anything other than what some people are saying and I don't buy it! This is just more lip service to the public from people who think they know what the public wants to hear! Bull puckey and then some!

Why should CSX commit when the state can't commit?

tufsu1 that is my point.........state can not or will not commit and CSX is doing the same! Liability issue's can be corrected and we could get moving on this......as you pointed out "We got to start somewhere"! SunRail has the chance to blossom and this could lead to other systems whether they be local in nature or interconnected to other cities........options and possibilities limited by imagination and funds!

I just think it is funny the split second it looks like CSX is may be making some concessions we start hollering it must be corrupt if the finalized documents are not ready for review right......... wait for it.................not yet........now.  Too late late I knew it was all smoke and mirrors.

So as I agree it should be in writing before the legislature votes on it didn't this news break yesterday.

Quote from: JeffreyS on November 20, 2009, 08:56:45 AM
I just think it is funny the split second it looks like CSX is may be making some concessions we start hollering it must be corrupt if the finalized documents are not ready for review right......... wait for it.................not yet........now.  Too late late I knew it was all smoke and mirrors.

So as I agree it should be in writing before the legislature votes on it didn't this news break yesterday.

Hmmm, most likely they want to push the deal through WITHOUT any changes ( under the banner "third time's the charm"), THAT is why there isn't anything in writing:

QuoteSunRail backers are willing to vote for the surcharge if Tri-Rail proponents support the insurance policy for its project.

That deal was offered last year, but the South Florida contingent largely balked at it, in part because of a caveat that the surcharge would have to be approved by a voter referendum no later than 2014. So Tri-Rail went home without its subsidy, and SunRail had no liability pact.

But now the federal Department of Transportation is dangling the possibility of awarding up to $2.5 billion to Florida for a high-speed train that would link Orlando with Tampa. But there is a caveat here, too. To be eligible, the Legislature first must prove it supports mass transit by getting Tri-Rail its dedicated funding and SunRail the liability agreement.

And I couldn't agree more with State Sen. Jeremy Ring, D-Margate:

Quote

"If we are going to move forward, we are not going to move forward by reinvigorating the past," he said.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/os-sunrail-tri-rail-20091121,0,2028313,print.story

Yup, I was right. The same bad Sunrail deal is being shoved down our throat:

QuoteNovember 27, 2009
SunRail the same old bad deal?

As a special session seems likely on rail issues, opponents of the proposed SunRail commuter system say it's the same old bad deal. The issues: cost, liability for taxpayers and federal protections for railroad workers on the tracks the state wants to buy from CSX for Central Florida commuter rail.

Will taxpayers be liable if CSX, which will continue to operate on the taxpayer-owned lines, causes an accident? Who knows? FDOT isn't producing any documentation showing what the deal is. Lakeland Sen. Paula Dockery has had to put in a public records request to find out. No response so far. What will the cost of the deal be? Who knows? FDOT isn't saying. Will railroad workers, who enjoy federal railroad protections, lose their labor rights? Who knows? FDOT isn't saying.


Yet we're going to have a special lawmaking session next week on the matter, anyway. And the fate of Tri-Rail funding hangs in the balance. So, potentially, does the state's application for high-speed rail money, which partly depends on the state showing more support for rail. AFL-CIO President Mike Williams just wrote a letter asking lawmakers to scuttle the SunRail deal. Expect the unions to make their case in Washington as well, where a certain president owes Big Labor a few favors and where mistrust is high of a Republican-led Legislature that went out of its way to once stop a bullet train plan that they now claim is a must for Florida.

Below is Williams letter. We asked FDOT for comment. Nothing in response. All aboard!


“The Florida AFL-CIO has worked tirelessly over the past few weeks in an effort to play a meaningful and constructive role in crafting a compromise among all interested parties that would enable the SunRail project to move forward, the Tri-Rail system to have a dedicated funding source and high speed rail to move forward.  It was our goal to achieve a compromise that would allow broad-based support of this legislation that included a wide, bi-partisan coalition of Republicans and Democrats interested in advancing Florida’s public rail system, while at the same time assuring such system created the highest-quality job force and safety conditions possible.  In fact, we believed based upon the good faith efforts of the Florida Senate that we were very close to achieving such a compromise.  But due to a lack of cooperation or compromise from FDOT, the Administration and the Florida House, the legislation being considered for the proposed special session next week fails Florida workers by continuing to enable FDOT to have unfettered authority to fire railroad workers subject to federal railroad protections and safeguards and replace them less qualified, less experienced transit employees not subject to federal railroad protections or safeguards.”   

“Therefore, the Florida AFL-CIO and our half-million members across Florida must reiterate our strong opposition to the CSX/SunRail transaction and the implementing legislation currently being considered for a special session.  As it has from its conception, this transaction remains nothing short of government-enabled union busting by FDOT, a move that threatens vital protections for thousands of workers and, by extension, the safety of the riding public.”

“While we respect and commend the goal of bringing commuter rail to Greater Orlando, we oppose this transaction and future transactions authorized by any implementing legislation that will give FDOT unfettered authority to enter into future projects that destroy federal railroad worker protections and railroad worker jobs.”

“It has become clear that FDOT’s primary purpose of the current SunRail deal is to ensure that federal railroad worker protections including, but not limited to, federal collective bargaining rights, federally-protected pension plans and federal railroad worker’s compensation protections become unavailable to workers in all future state-acquired rail corridors. FDOT’s goal here is, put simply, to decimate federal railroad protections in Florida’s railroad system, putting the jobs of thousands of railroad workers, their families’ livelihoods and the safety of the riding public in jeopardy.  The Florida AFL-CIO has no choice but to fight aggressively against the SunRail enabling legislation as long as getting around federal railroad worker protection laws remains a component of the deal.”

“Today, we began a concerted and aggressive outreach to our friends and allies in the Florida Senate to oppose this legislation and to characterize it for what it is:  a direct attack on organized labor.  We have asked them to stand with us against the implementing legislation, against a special session being called and against this deal until such time that a legitimate, meaningful compromise has been achieved on the labor issue.  Unfortunately, that time has not yet arrived and a special session on SunRail is premature. Should one occur next week, we will be asking our friends in the Senate to vote against the implementing legislation.”

“The Florida AFL-CIO stands strongly in opposition to the SunRail transaction and will continue to fight for the Florida’s railroad workers until such time that their issues are addressed.  We will fight for their jobs, their benefits, their rights and their dignity.” 


-- Marc Caputo

Posted by Times Editor at 02:26:14 PM on November 27, 2009

http://blogs.tampabay.com/buzz/2009/11/sunrail-the-same-old-bad-deal.html

FAYE, what a freaking drama queen... This isn't the "Same Old Deal," but a mere part of some sort of package that the writer admits hasn't been presented yet. I've never seen anyone more willing to rip the floor from under our representatives then offer an apology that you know more then we, what is good for us. Just your record on Railroads here in this site has been all over the board, going from "we need jobs now," to "we don't need THESE jobs," "Tri Rail is good," "SunRail is bad," "High Speed Rail anywhere, anytime, is good."  Not speaking for yourself is like a cut and paste ransom note, you stay in complete anonymity, while thrusting your tilted agenda in our faces. It all comes down to making the choice that fits us the best. You can't imagine how thankful we are to have you making these choices for us and eagerly await the day when you can make those choices for us too. And now, excerpts from Faye's latest copy of "The Daily Worker." 

QuoteWho knows? FDOT isn't producing any documentation showing what the deal is. Lakeland Sen. Paula Dockery has had to put in a public records request to find out. No response so far. What will the cost of the deal be? Who knows? FDOT isn't saying. Will railroad workers, who enjoy federal railroad protections, lose their labor rights? Who knows? FDOT isn't saying.

This is nothing more then Big Labor trying to play CYA and force a right-to-work state (Florida) to hire only from the brotherhood. Maybe they have an advance copy of the FDOT bill, but the writer and you Faye, make it sound like it's the darkest hour since the Khmer Rouge overthrew the government in Cambodia.

QuoteIn fact, we believed based upon the good faith efforts of the Florida Senate that we were very close to achieving such a compromise.  But due to a lack of cooperation or compromise from FDOT, the Administration and the Florida House, the legislation being considered for the proposed special session next week fails Florida workers by continuing to enable FDOT to have unfettered authority to fire railroad workers subject to federal railroad protections and safeguards and replace them less qualified, less experienced transit employees not subject to federal railroad protections or safeguards.”

The TRUTH is Faye, this is the same old "special interest," group always supported by the far left because they intend to create a cradle to grave, government panacea.  You won't have to choose, just count on Washington, is another way of saying do it our way or you don't do it at all. In the rest of the world this type of thing is quickly identified as Socialism. Sad Faye, because people like you know it has failed to produce the fuzzy karma most expected. In fact, our own left, (that would be you Faye) has no problem looking us straight in the eye and telling us, it failed there because it wasn't America that did it. You know that sort of blind militant patriotic socialism is called fascism, aka: National Socialism. Now your trying to peddle this drivel on Jacksonville and Florida, fat chance. The last Fascists that landed here (at Vilano Beach) were rounded up and hung.

When the day comes that you and your kind enforce wages, living standard, health care, transportation and commerce, based on your will and not ours is the day America dies. But then who cares right? We'd be marching in lock step with our beautiful new world a world that has written a legacy of blood by these same caring, know all, be all, think all, fools. The idea that Washington must force FDOT to hire only "approved" union workers reeks of despotic dictatorships. Communist, Socialist or Fascist, just tell us which one are you Faye.

By the way Faye, if you really want that high speed "Rat Rail" project to have any success, you better pray for cheap labor, your going to need it.

laissez-faire Comrade, it's the American way

OCKLAWAHA

Ock, that was quite a diatribe!!

It seems that you favorite activity is to label any policy you don't like as socialist or fascist without knowing the clear meaning of the two words.

Many of the policies you don't like are policies that have worked out great in other civilized capitalistic societies that also believe in government of the people, by the people and for the people.

Remember we are not the only ones with capitalistic democracies.

There isn't only our system and socialism.

For example China is an interesting case, because it has a capitalistic society without a democracy.

So within our own framework of a capitalistic democracy, we can certainly make changes that make our system more civilized and less prone to to the excesses that caused the economic collapse that led to our current recession.

Well then, hell Faye, how about you buy my son a new car, after all he works hard, and hail wrecked his last one, he deserves it. Besides Faye, OUR socialists are better then THEIR socialists.

OCKLAWAHA
"Das Capital"

I thought that "Socialists" were Republicans in drag!

Quote from: CS Foltz on November 29, 2009, 07:30:41 AM
I thought that "Socialists" were Republicans in drag!

Now that sounds interesting!

As in privatize the profits and socialize the losses.

For sure Republicans seem to like corporate welfare and redistribution up to enrich the top 1% who already own more than the bottom 95% combined.

I agree with that sentiment, Faye. It applies to democrats as well.

In light of the second stimulus package, It applies three fold.

Taken from a letter from Sen. Jeff Atwater to his fellow senators in preparation for this week's special session....

"I am pleased to report that over the last several weeks FDOT has been negotiating an improved
liability contract. Under the proposed legislation, the freight rail operator will pay anytime their
acts cause damages to people or property under certain circumstances, this includes those
accidents that most commonly occur on the nation’s rails today. Additionally, if a freight train
and commuter train collide, and punitive damages are awarded, the private rail operator will be
responsible for the willful and wanton acts by its employees."

also legislation will do the following...

FLORIDA RAIL ENTERPRISE
Creates Florida Rail Enterprise within DOT, modeled after the existing Florida Turnpike
Enterprise, that will be responsible for passenger rail systems, including high speed rail

PASSENGER RAIL COMMISSION
The Passenger Rail Commission is created to advise FDOT in designing, building, operating,
financing, and maintaining passenger rail systems. It will also monitor the efficiency,
productivity, and management of SFRTA and future rail systems such as Sun Rail, TBARTA, and
High Speed rail.

DEDICATED FUNDING TO PASSENGER RAIL â€" DOCUMENTARY STAMP PROCEEDS
Consistent with a statewide rail vision, this provision creates a dependable, sustainable funding
source for future rail projects.

   Provides the foundation for growing passenger rail and a source for future systems to
   tap into for development and construction of those new systems.

   First $60 million of TRIP funds dedicated to passenger rail to be administered by the
   Florida Rail Enterprise

Cool.  Is this new found source of dedicated funding something that Jax can tap into for its proposed commuter rail system?

Will the Passenger Rail commission monitor the efficiency of the Skyway.

Quote from: tufsu1 on November 30, 2009, 08:52:10 PM
Taken from a letter from Sen. Jeff Atwater to his fellow senators in preparation for this week's special session....

"I am pleased to report that over the last several weeks FDOT has been negotiating an improved
liability contract. Under the proposed legislation, the freight rail operator will pay anytime their
acts cause damages to people or property under certain circumstances, this includes those
accidents that most commonly occur on the nation’s rails today. Additionally, if a freight train
and commuter train collide, and punitive damages are awarded, the private rail operator will be
responsible for the willful and wanton acts by its employees."

also legislation will do the following...

FLORIDA RAIL ENTERPRISE
Creates Florida Rail Enterprise within DOT, modeled after the existing Florida Turnpike
Enterprise, that will be responsible for passenger rail systems, including high speed rail

PASSENGER RAIL COMMISSION
The Passenger Rail Commission is created to advise FDOT in designing, building, operating,
financing, and maintaining passenger rail systems. It will also monitor the efficiency,
productivity, and management of SFRTA and future rail systems such as Sun Rail, TBARTA, and
High Speed rail.

DEDICATED FUNDING TO PASSENGER RAIL â€" DOCUMENTARY STAMP PROCEEDS
Consistent with a statewide rail vision, this provision creates a dependable, sustainable funding
source for future rail projects.

   Provides the foundation for growing passenger rail and a source for future systems to
   tap into for development and construction of those new systems.

   First $60 million of TRIP funds dedicated to passenger rail to be administered by the
   Florida Rail Enterprise

Really cool for sure,............ I wonder how the dedicated funding source will do,.........what is the expected revenue?

Thanks tufsu1, that sounds really good!!

The dedicated funding source is doc stamp revenues....my understanding is that a ceratin amount of that will be set aside for rail projects throughout the state (not just TriRail).

Its just one more example of a strong change in philosophy at FDOT

Quote from: JeffreyS on November 30, 2009, 10:37:02 PM
Will the Passenger Rail commission monitor the efficiency of the Skyway.

I doubt it...I think local transit will still be handled through FDOT's Public Transit Office....although they may be reorganizing that and other "offices" to put them all under the rail enterprise umbrella

Quote from: tufsu1 on December 01, 2009, 08:11:58 AM
The dedicated funding source is doc stamp revenues....my understanding is that a ceratin amount of that will be set aside for rail projects throughout the state (not just TriRail).

Its just one more example of a strong change in philosophy at FDOT

I meant,......will there be enough revenue from the doc stamps, to be a legitimate dedicated funding source?

Or is it just lip service AGAIN?

Pardon my cynicism, but I'd like to know the expected revenue from the doc stamps before I totally cheer this development.

Yes please do not under fund rail if you are going to do it do it right. I do not mean it has to have all the bells and whistles up front but let's not have it doomed off the bat by too much skimping. I hope they allow locals to have additional funding with rental cars surcharges if they choose.

Quote from: CS Foltz on November 29, 2009, 07:30:41 AM
I thought that "Socialists" were Republicans in drag!

Naw, you got it all mixed up CS, Socialists are far left Dems and Nazi's (National Socialists) are REPUBLICANS... If I had to choose? Damn? I'm not either?

NAZI, because I don't like wearing green PJ's and their uniforms were cooler.

OCKLAWAHA

The industry press is full of "High speed through incremental expansions," articles. Expect the money coming from DC to reflect this idea. The AAR (Association of American Railroads) and the "Shortline Railroad Association," along with the NARP, (National Association of Railroad Passengers) have all issued a statement supporting capacity and track improvements to raise speeds. Some of these are pretty big, North Carolina, is saddled with miles of 45 MPH track, which would be raised to 86, while our own would run in the 90 - 110 MPH range.

Good news indeed TUFSU...

Meanwhile on my train-set, Brasil and Colombia are jointly funding our Ferrocarril Carrie, and have signed an intent to the rebuilding of FC De Antioquia from Puerto Berrio to Bolombo, giving us back the Atlantic-Pacific capabilities lost to rocks, water and mud! Watch for this last one to effect both sugar and coffee prices in a positive way for consumers.


OCKLAWAHA

Quote from: JeffreyS on December 01, 2009, 09:39:15 AM
Yes please do not under fund rail if you are going to do it do it right.

Please we underfund everything else in this state...why should rail be any different.

tufsu1 .....I have no choice but to agree with you! That right there is the underlying hitch in any progressive visionary mass transit system...........a severe lack of funding! Until that issue is addressed we are going to be hindered no matter which way the transportation vessel moves. It is bad enough the public servants seem to have their heads up their drawers but it is a double whammy when the funding issue is not addressed at the same time. Current administrations across the board suffers from the same affliction without exception!

I know I started the negative talk about the funding but I do want to offer kudos for finding a dedicated funding source. This really is a big state wide step forward.

Quote from: JeffreyS on December 01, 2009, 09:39:15 AM
Yes please do not under fund rail if you are going to do it do it right. I do not mean it has to have all the bells and whistles up front but let's not have it doomed off the bat by too much skimping. I hope they allow locals to have additional funding with rental cars surcharges if they choose.

Thank you JeffreyS. I see no downside to the rental car tax that tourists would pay. That would be a revenue source I can really believe in. What the heck is the hold up?!?!

Quote from: FayeforCure on December 01, 2009, 10:39:15 PM

Quote from: JeffreyS on December 01, 2009, 09:39:15 AM
Yes please do not under fund rail if you are going to do it do it right. I do not mean it has to have all the bells and whistles up front but let's not have it doomed off the bat by too much skimping. I hope they allow locals to have additional funding with rental cars surcharges if they choose.

Thank you JeffreyS. I see no downside to the rental car tax that tourists would pay. That would be a revenue source I can really believe in. What the heck is the hold up?!?!

I sure as hell do. Car rental taxes (fees) and gas taxes are a declining sum every year for the past several years. If the fuel crunch gets worse, which it WILL, these sources will all but run dry. We need something else to handle the revenue needed to fund rail and rail transit projects in the State. I don't think it's helping with the Federals, that we are going counter to the industry pundits and chasing the poorly routed HSR "Mickey Rail" project. AMTRAK and INCREMENTAL are the key words in this argument. A rail board to oversee a fund for rail transit projects is fine by me, just get those projects on a solid funding, and don't chase rainbows.

(http://i196.photobucket.com/albums/aa111/Ocklawaha/CRITICAL%20Special%20Effects%20Images/lightningandTRACTION-1-1.jpg)

Quote from: Ocklawaha on December 01, 2009, 10:56:50 PM
I sure as hell do. Car rental taxes (fees) and gas taxes are a declining sum every year for the past several years. If the fuel crunch gets worse, which it WILL, these sources will all but run dry. We need something else to handle the revenue needed to fund rail and rail transit projects in the State.

Oh really? Seems tourism in particular from Europe is increasing and thus car rental revenues. Besides there will always be enough car rental revenue from tourists to function as a dedicated funding source.

QuoteIn Sarasota County, hotels and condos reported revenues from rentals rose 2 percent in September, led by big gains on Siesta Key and in Venice, the first overall increase since August 2008.

News from Manatee County was even brighter, with rentals up 15 percent.

Fueled by stimulus spending from Washington and a bull market in stocks, consumers are finally loosening up enough to take a vacation.

"We are definitely beginning to see a recovery," said Walter Klages, a Tampa tourism consultant who does research for both Manatee and Sarasota County convention and visitors' bureaus. "The trend for the first time since 2007 is up."

Hedging the optimism is that September is traditionally one of the slowest tourist months. And in Sarasota, businesses are still slashing room rates to attract visitors. But in Manatee, room rates increased in September for the second time in four months.

Still, the latest numbers are among signs that one of Florida's biggest economic engines is no longer running in reverse. The real barometer will be January through March, the months that make or break hotels, restaurants and bars in Southwest Florida.

"We are here for the busy season, and the season pays for the rest of the year," said Danielle Boyer, co-owner of Siesta Key Parasailing.

The boost seems to be coming from both dollar-conscious Floridians driving here and Europeans taking advantage of the Euro and the British pound strength versus the struggling dollar.

Quotetourism to return to the robust levels of 2007-08

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20091117/ARTICLE/911171075/-1/FRONTPAGE?Title=Tourism-numbers-br-give-a-lift

I see no indication that car rental fees are declining every year, please source your unsubstantiated statement.

Ms Faye.............last hard figures that I saw was on CNBC and nationwide motel/hotel bookings were still down from last year about 23%............there appears to be a downward trend for the past yr and a half! Travel is down but that was nationwide..............program said nothing at all about oversea's visitors. Magic Kingdom attendance figures were down so to me taking all of that into account it would seem reasonable to assume "Rental Vehicles" would be down also! I would like to see something else along with that proposed $2 Dollar Fee to ensure what blossoms can survive over the long term!

why does everyone think that rental car taxes are only paid by tourists....many Floridians rent cars for in-state business travel....or even when their car is in the repair shop.

Quote from: tufsu1 on December 02, 2009, 08:31:56 AM
why does everyone think that rental car taxes are only paid by tourists....many Floridians rent cars for in-state business travel....or even when their car is in the repair shop.

tufsu1, under the law Florida residents would be exempted from paying the tax. So if your car is in for repair, you don't pay the $2.

BTW would you mind paying an extra $2 per day anyway,.......it doesn't even buy you a coffee!

I like the doc stamps idea for a state wide dedicated fund. I would just like the red tape cleared up on the rental car surcharge that could be used at a more local level.

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3179/2736147864_3a40ee0cb7.jpg)
Abandoned AVIS building, Long Island, NY

QuoteBusiness Travel Magazine

Car Rental Cos. Decelerate In Fourth Quarter

MARCH 03, 2009 -- Slowing demand, soft pricing and increasing fleet costs resulted in fourth-quarter losses for all three major publicly traded car rental companies.

Hertz Global Holdings last week reported a $1.21 billion loss for the fourth quarter of 2008, with revenue down 16 percent for the quarter to $1.8 billion. "Unfortunately, the progress we made in many areas during 2008 was outweighed by the severe impact on the overall falling demand, competitive pricing and higher fleet costs as residual baggage declined in the car rental business as well as the more significant downturn in our highly profitable rental segment," Hertz chairman and CEO Mark Frissora said in a statement.

U.S. pricing was down by 6 percent at airport locations and by 2 percent at off-airport locations, according to Hertz, as the company was unable to sustain a price increase announced in late October.

Avis Budget Group reported a $121 million loss for the quarter, citing what CEO Ronald Nelson called an "unprecedented set of challenges." The company enacted an aggressive cot-cutting plan during the quarter, eliminating more than 2,100 positions, closing 27 locations and reducing expenses, including those of its loyalty program.

Car rental revenues for the quarter were down 9 percent, driven by a 6 percent decrease in rental days and a 6 percent decrease in time and mileage revenue per day, Avis Budget reported. Fleet costs, meanwhile, were up 11 percent.

Quote
2009 Business Travel Survey: Car Rental Firms At Crossroads As Demand Lags
By Chris Davis

JUNE 01, 2009 -- Damaged not only by a global economic recession and sharply reduced demand but also by the crippling financial maladies of the Big Three U.S. automakers, the rental car industry finds itself at a crossroads in 2009. Competition for remaining business is fierce, and a decimated resale market is leaving the rental companies with lots of cars to rent, but fewer corporate travelers to rent them.

Nevertheless, rental car executives showed signs of what passes for optimism in 2009, offering hopes that perhaps the bottom of the car rental downturn has been reached and conditions might not worsen further.

Just 2 of hundreds of examples, you are really funny Faye, guess you think I make all the transportation stuff up? NOT!  Its a trend, it's just not a consistant revenue stream, we can't run trains just in good economic months. ...and you were saying?


OCKLAWAHA

Update on the rail session

QuoteFla. lawmakers open special session on rail

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. (AP) -- Senate President Jeff Atwater says he's confident his chamber will reverse its prior opposition to legislation that would clear the way for a commuter rail system in central Florida.

Identical House and Senate bills being considered at a special legislative session that begin Thursday also include up to $15 million each year in additional state money for the financially troubled Tri-Rail commuter line in South Florida.

Atwater, R-North Palm Beach, said the bills respond to at least some issues that twice before doomed similar proposals in the Senate after they'd been passed in the House.

One difference is the rail legislation now is being sold as a step for possibly obtaining $2.6 billion in federal stimulus money to also build a high-speed system between Tampa and Orlando with a possible future link to Miami.

"My conversations with members over the last week have been that they wanted to see something bigger and bolder," Atwater said. "When they have a chance to hear all of the bill and see the elements of this bill that we're looking bigger, farther down the road."

Atwater and other rail advocates argue the bills (HB 1B, SB 2B) also would establish a framework for future commuter service in other urban areas by creating two new entities.

The proposed Statewide Passenger Rail Commission would advise the Department of Transportation and the Florida Rail Enterprise would oversee development of commuter lines as well as a high-speed system.

Gov. Charlie Crist said he, too, is confident the legislation will pass because it would create thousands of new jobs desperately needed in a state with an 11.2 percent unemployment rate.

"Voting against this would be absolutely catastrophic," Crist said.

The legislation faces stiff opposition from labor unions that argue 95 union rail workers would lose their jobs or take pay cuts. That's because the plan calls for the state to purchase existing rail lines from freight hauler CSX, which now employs those workers. The state would hire contractors to fill the jobs.

The number of workers affected could grow into the thousands as additional commuter systems are developed, said Florida AFL-CIO spokesman Rich Templin.

Atwater said he's met with the unions and that talks will continue on seeking an accord.

"I don't know that there is any one particular agency, branch, piece of our Legislature that is throwing down a gauntlet," Atwater said. "You'll have to wait until the end to see whether or not we can find comforting language."

The unions are a key constituency for Democrats, who could hold the legislation's fate in their hands. Republicans have solid majorities in both chambers, but past opposition has been bipartisan.

Senate Democratic Leader Al Lawson of Tallahassee said he didn't want to dismiss the unions' concerns but is supportive of the legislation because it would put thousands of Floridians to work building, maintaining and operating the SunRail commuter system in the Orlando area.

Some lawmakers also have questioned the sufficiency and cost of liability provisions that call for the state to purchase $200 million in insurance coverage for any major crashes involving the Sunrail commuter trains and CSX freight trains that would share the track.

The legislation is moving first in the House, which will begin floor debate Friday and take a vote Monday. The Senate is scheduled for a vote Wednesday.

If the Senate accepts the House version, the bill then would go to Crist, an outspoken supporter of the legislation. If not, the chambers will have through next Friday to resolve their differences.

The session began with 34 of the 120 representatives and 11 of the 40 senators absent. Most were Democrats who had been excused to attend the annual meeting in Fort Lauderdale of the National Black Caucus of State Legislators.

House Speaker Larry Cretul rejected a Democratic request to delay the special session until next week. The Ocala Republican said lawmakers needed to begin this week to make sure they finish by Dec. 11 - the first day of Hanukkah.

"It is our job not only constitutionally but personally to be sure that we don't inconvenience and neglect what we're here for," Cretul said.

This is the second special session of the year. Lawmakers started 2009 with a nine-day special session in January to pass a budget deficit-reduction package before returning to Tallahassee in March for their regular 60-day session.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/F/FL_XGR_SPECIAL_SESSION_FLOL-?SITE=FLJAJ&SECTION=SOUTHEAST&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

I am somewhat confused to say the least...........Why do we have to have a "Special Session" to handle this rail issue.............was it not important enough to care of during the regular session? This is just extra money out of the coffers that could have been handled long before now!

Actually this is the third session in two years.  This anti-rail state just keeps shutting it down instead of coming up with a solution.  Btw, judging from the events of yesterday, it appears this round will be a shaky one too.

It looks like the SunRail and high speed rail projects are being confused.

QuoteJacksonville lawmaker could be key vote in rail debate

...

In mentioning his support of workers, Hill is referring specifically to the AFL-CIO's opposition to the SunRail project, a passenger rail line along the I-4 corridor.  In a statement, the union said that it had concerns that federal regulations that govern rail workers would be removed, thus freeing the Florida Department of Transportation to fire rail workers and replace them with non-union employees.

...

A look at the high speed rail map put together by the U. S. Department of Transportation has to leave many North Floridians wondering what exactly is in the deal for them.

The SunRail proposal currently being pushed in the Legislature will only provide for rail along the I-4 corridor, along with additional money for South Florida.  North Florida, however, is completely left out of the mix.  In fact, the map shows Jacksonville disconnected from the rest of the state, leaving the area dependent on Georgia lawmakers to seek funding to run a high speed line from Jacksonville to Savannah.

So what does North Florida get out of the deal besides sending our tax dollars south?  Well, I'm sure money isn't the only thing south and central Florida want from us -- they'd like our water as well.

http://jacksonville.com/interact/blog/abel_harding/2009-12-04/jacksonville_lawmaker_could_be_key_vote_in_rail_debate

Definitely sounds like confusion.  Somebody send Abel over here so he can learn how North Florida benefits. 

For Jax to see any money in rail, the Sunrail deal and/or Orlando MUST work. We need some success to prove to the Feds that Florida is for real. Without success, this is just a collosal waste of time.

^In addition to that, Jax directly benefits from these projects.  Here are five benefits for starters.

1. The FEC/Amtrak corridor project from Jax to Miami will potentially be a "HSR" funded project.  It is a part of Florida's HSR application.

2. Sunrail, results in a significant of freight traffic being taken off the tracks paralleling Roosevelt.  This should improve traffic flow on the westside and increase to possibility of future commuter rail between DT and Orange Park/Clay County.

3. CSX is a local Fortune 500 company.  They stand to make a ton of money off the Sunrail deal.  A local company doing good in a recession can't be a bad thing for Jax.  Especially one headquartered in DT.

4. Another Jax-based company will be building Sunrail.  More jobs or at least job preservation for locals.

5. CSX has said it intends to use a chunk of their Sunrail profits to pay for the Springfield bypass and Jax port rail improvements.  This helps enhance the attractiveness of our port, which is really one of our few economic engines still buzzing.

Yes lake............there are positives for sure! You forgot the "Tax" situation where hopefully the City will get some to keep from Feeing us to the poor house. My biggest issue with the Orlando/Tampa region is everything is revolving around that Mickey Mouse Feeder system being up and running! I don't see an actual benefit in hard dollars other than the construction/maintenance and operations. Not to mention CSX receives a pot full of dollars and no liability issue's stemming from useage of their tracks! I still do not believe that region is the best showcase for what should be a "World Class Mass Transit System"!

This is the problem CS...you want rail, but when handed a project that is good for Central Florida, you find fault with it!

The only reason SunRail is being attached to HSR right now is that seems to be the only way to get the Legislature to even consider approving it....clearly SunRail doesn't need HSR to be successful.

CS, I think we ALL AGREE with every point you've made. I don't think there is one of us (besides Faye) that really believes the HSR as planned is going to carry any volume.

As for myself, it's going to be another case of Florida blowing it so bad, people in every state will cringe when they see the billion dollar amusement park train lose it's ass, thus damaging exclusive high speed rail for many years. Wrong segment, wrong route, wrong terminals, wrong traffic plan, wrong access to cities.

The flip side is, we get a box of toys for Northeast Florida, and Orlando will get a long needed commuter rail system. The positives out weigh the negatives as in a originating and terminating state like Florida, with some sort of attraction at every stop, we may be done with HSR for a lifetime. "BYE!" Maybe we can convince them the Skyway is HSR (it will do 55 mph after all). I see the REAL HSR taking off North and West of Jacksonville, with higher speed rail working better South of town.

So what are we waiting for, let's get our own rail projects done, while we have a 50 yard line seat to watch Tallahassee, Orlando, Miami, Tampa, and West Palm, jump off the cliff and commit suicide. HA! HA! HA!

OCKLAWAHA

An update from Friday's Session:

QuoteHouse Debate Focuses on Job Creation

By GARY FINEOUT
TALLAHASSEE CORRESPONDENT


Published: Friday, December 4, 2009 at 11:05 p.m.
Last Modified: Friday, December 4, 2009 at 11:05 p.m.

TALLAHASSEE | Florida legislators have called this week's special session to set up a comprehensive rail system in Florida a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to change forever how residents move around the state.

But whether the GOP-controlled Legislature winds up approving the sweeping proposal may boil down to something else: jobs. And whether or not tapping into additional government spending is the key to creating jobs in a state with more than a million Floridians out of work.

One state agency contends the proposal over time could create up to 14,000 jobs, and Gov. Charlie Crist has said the prospect of those jobs is why it would be "indefensible" to scuttle the proposal.

That figure, however, is drawing some skepticism, especially from Republican politicians critical of the overall federal stimulus package.

"We should be wary of all the promises floating around Tallahassee about how much this latest round of government spending will create lasting jobs and prosperity," said former House Speaker Marco Rubio in a statement provided by his campaign.

Rubio, who is challenging Gov. Charlie Crist for the U.S. Senate, supported the controversial SunRail commuter rail project for Central Florida back in 2008 when he was speaker. But his comments Friday show the delicate balancing act that legislators will have to confront in the next few days.

The first two days of the special session have been filled with questions, and rhetoric about the potential economic impact of setting up both the 61-mile SunRail project and a high speed train linking Orlando and Tampa. Legislative leaders say Florida needs to act now on commuter rail in an effort to convince the federal government it should hand the state $3.2 billion from the federal stimulus package for various rail projects.

On Friday, the Florida House began debate on the proposal and much of it centered on jobs. House Democrats wanted to add requirements that any spending generated by the plan go primarily to Florida-based companies or Florida workers.

But the Democrats' efforts were shot down by GOP legislators who said the provisions would likely violate federal law and could derail the ongoing effort.

"While it's a great intent to specify that Florida's workers are given preferential treatment … it has the risk of having the opposite effect," said Rep. Gary Aubuchon, R-Cape Coral and the House sponsor of the bill. "Instead of putting people to work they will be sitting on the sidelines."

The back-and-forth over jobs is expected to heat up even further next week when both the House and Senate are supposed to take a final vote on the rail proposal, which also calls on the state to spend more money on the Tri-Rail system in South Florida. Several House Democrats said Friday it is unlikely they would stand in the way of the legislation because it calls on trying to tap into stimulus money to help Florida.

"I want that money to come to this state. We want jobs here," said Rep. Keith Fitzgerald, D-Sarasota.

Republicans nationwide have derided the $787 billion stimulus package passed by Congress. In Florida, Rubio has roundly criticized fellow Republican Crist for supporting the stimulus.

Sen. Paula Dockery, R-Lakeland and an outspoken critic of the rail proposal, also questioned the job projections Friday and said that only the high speed rail portion of the legislation could potentially generate as many jobs as promised.

But House Majority Leader Adam Hasner, R-Boca Raton, said that while Republicans may think the stimulus was a bad idea it doesn't mean Florida shouldn't try to get the money that has already been set aside.

http://www.theledger.com/article/20091204/NEWS/912045064/1134?Title=House-Debate-Focuses-on-Job-Creation

Another update from Tallahassee...

Success of rail deal is far from certain

QuoteWith a Monday House vote, the legislation passes to the Senate, where its fate is far from certain.
Senate President Jeff Atwater, R-North Palm Beach, needs 21 votes. The defection of a key Republican, former transportation chairman Carey Baker of Mount Dora, nearly derailed the session. Supporters also appeared to lose the vote of Sen. Larcenia Bullard, a Miami Democrat who reportedly suffered a heart attack and will be unable to cast a final vote next week.

Rep. Greg Evers, R-Baker, cites the same objections as Baker. Evers said he supports commuter rail but that the legislation has grown into something much larger.

Senate Democratic Leader Al Lawson of Tallahassee has been working behind the scenes with labor leaders, trying to broker a deal that would include protections for union rail workers. Without that, Lawson said he's not sure he can deliver as many as 13 Democratic votes.

AFL-CIO Florida president Mike Williams spent much of Friday meeting with lawmakers and talking with Florida Department of Transportation officials, but he said he was making little headway. The House is the problem, Williams said.

Full Article: http://www.tallahassee.com/article/20091205/CAPITOLNEWS/912050327/Success-of-rail-deal-is-far-from-certain?GID=32gIBJ8clbY0p0YS1Pa/HcNsQLSTVK3ZZBG0PxeVJXo%3D

Gentlemen.............I just hate the waste of resources! State Legislators still have not funded squat other than talk which is real easy for any Politician to do. I have not seen or heard of any Plan B for Funding and unless any system is funded properly it will go down the sewer pipe! A $2 Dollar tax on rental cars won't go far unless the rental end of things picks up substantially so they better have a Plan B and C available! I hope it fly's like all get out but I have reservations guys!

I could be wrong, but I don't think the funding source they are pushing at this point is a $2 tax on car rentals.  I thought they were shifting funds from somewhere else.

I agree CS, and Lake, I believe you are correct. Time will tell what, if anything, we get... FDOT is suffering from too many "Fast-Train-Faye's" and not enough Railroaders!

OCKLAWAHA

Now I am really getting concerned! Last time I looked into it, State is suffering from a drastic loss of revenue which is supposed to curtail alot of projects, education and expenditures so where are they going to be getting money from? Fed's do not have unlimited resources and people are starting to notice just how much the Deficit is growing, so what funding sources are they looking at? I have not seen or heard about any other dedicated source being discussed? No matter where any system goes, it must be funded correctly or down the tubes it will go!

the money will be coming from the transportation trust fund....apparently they are now predicting is an unexpected increase in gas tax revenues.

Quote from: tufsu1 on December 06, 2009, 09:25:23 AM
the money will be coming from the transportation trust fund....apparently they are now predicting is an unexpected increase in gas tax revenues.

In other words consumption will be way down and the price sky high, $10 dollar a gallon gasoline will certainly return more taxes then $3 dollars a gallon will. It is the only logical way they can expand this base, and even gas taxes will have a ceiling after which even JACKSONVILLE RESIDENTS WILL USE MASS TRANSIT. I'd really rather see a flat transportation tax assigned to all residents in their licences or tags, payable each year. Such a tax would be very stable and predictable each quarter. Taxing fuel is just going to encourage another runaway price disaster, with no incentive to curtail the expenses.

OCKLAWAHA

actually Ock, sadly the high price of gas only has a negative impact on tax collections....remember that the tax is a set # (i.e, $0.22) not a %....and when the price of gas goes up like it did last year, people drive less and collections for federal, state, and local govt goes down

This editorial from the Tampa Tribune:

QuoteDecision point on commuter rail

The Tampa Tribune
Published: December 6, 2009

The state's transportation future will be shaped this week by one clear, difficult choice. If modern passenger rail service is to come to Florida any time soon, the Legislature must pass a new law in special session that sets up a statewide structure to oversee and help pay for regional and city-to-city trains.

The decision can't wait for a better bill, a stronger economy or a longer period for debate. Florida is at a crossroads. To reject the proposal pulled together by Senate President Jeff Atwater, a Republican from North Palm Beach, would send two damaging signals.

One message would go to the White House and say that Florida does not support rail transit, so forget about giving us $2.5 billion to build a super-fast train from Tampa to Orlando and eventually Miami. It may be unfair and somewhat irrational that commuter rail lines and long-distance trains are so tightly linked. The fact is they are in the minds of federal rail officials, who have made no secret of their thinking.

The second signal would be to urban areas. Tampa, Orlando and other cities would get the message that if they want an alternative to jammed highways, they're on their own to figure out what to do.

The bill would create a new rail agency within the state Department of Transportation. It would be called Florida Rail Enterprise and bring coherence to statewide rail planning and financing. It would require no new taxes or affect existing programs. A portion of undesignated revenue from the documentary stamp on real-estate transactions would eventually fund the effort. The decision to build a first rail line is always controversial, so state leadership is essential, just as it is in the construction of major highways.

The current piecemeal approach pits one region against another and raises serious doubts about state participation, which is needed to attract federal dollars.

Tri-Rail in Southeast Florida is struggling to survive, and SunRail can't get off the drawing board, despite a pledge by local governments to help pay for it. Rail for Hillsborough County goes to a vote next year with opponents raising doubts about state and federal assistance. The bill being considered in Tallahassee would for the first time in Florida treat rail projects as assets worthy of permanent financial support, just like highways.

The majority of Tampa's legislative delegation is leaning against supporting the rail bill. If they help kill it, they would reduce the chances of success for local rail. If the bill passes over their united opposition, Tampa could find itself at the bottom of the state's priority list for new transit projects. Reprisal would be unfair, but that's politics. The bullet train might go from Orlando to Miami first, and never to Tampa.

If the bill passes with a reasonable level of support from West-Central Florida, the future for rail here would be much brighter. The first truly high-speed rail line in the Western Hemisphere might be built straight into downtown Tampa, and it could link to Hillsborough County's proposed light-rail line. Surrounding counties would have a big incentive to join, either with express buses or their own rail projects.

The liability issue with CSX freight trains sharing state-owned tracks would be resolved for the Orlando train in a way that could be repeated in other parts of the state. The private company would accept a share of the responsibility for accidents. That's a big improvement over the original proposal that made the state to blame for anything that went wrong.

Sen. Paula Dockery of Lakeland, who deserves credit for leading the successful fight against that bad deal last session and forcing the revisions, is not satisfied by the new terms. But she should recognize that it's virtually impossible to achieve a flawless deal and the stakes are too high to walk away from legislation that finally would enable Florida to develop a diverse transportation system, one the Republican leadership and most business groups are certain will be the foundation of an economic renaissance.

We understand that some rail advocates overstate the benefits of trains. We understand the principled opposition against big-government projects. But we can't understand the vision of some lawmakers who seem to think Tampa, Orlando, Miami and Jacksonville need the same transportation policy that works for Macon, Moultrie, Valdosta and Waycross.

Florida must begin spending more of its tax revenue on transit, as is done in other urban states, and it need not increase taxes statewide to do that. Circumstances require the state to either adopt a modern rail policy right now or be left far behind for decades, if not forever.

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2009/dec/06/co-decision-point-on-commuter-rail/news-opinion-editorials/

We have to start somewhere..............so do our Legislators! It is time to do it now!