QuoteJACKSONVILLE, Fla. — Duval County Public Schools leaders are considering a major move for the district's headquarters as they work to address a billion-dollar budget shortfall. At their September board meeting, members are expected to vote on selling the current Southbank central office and relocating to the Prominence Office Park in Baymeadows.
The proposed move would take DCPS headquarters roughly 20 minutes from its current Southbank location to an office space owned by Jacksonville developer and Dream Finders Homes CEO Patrick Zalupski.
While the relocation is part of the district's plan to reduce costs, some community members are raising concerns about accessibility for families.
https://www.actionnewsjax.com/news/local/duval-schools-plan-move-southbank-baymeadows-raising-accessibility-concerns/QSPVLG4E6NFLXKBYZ5WGY22YAA/
^ Now, even government is leaving the Downtown area? DCPS is a big part what is left standing.
Let's see, the FBI moved to the burbs. JSO to Brooklyn. Citizens to the burbs. The State is still "Downtown" but not really with its fortress-like suburban-style edge campus not walkable to anything.
That leaves City offices, JEA, the IRS and Federal/State courts/attorney offices as the last major Downtown government tenants. Did I leave anyone out? Maybe UF, but when in significant numbers?
JFRD still in DT
Because the proposed location doesn't have an appropriate space to hold large public meetings, I believe the proposal also includes using the Schultz Center in the St. Nicholas area for school board meetings.
Not as good for public access as a true central location, but definitely better access than Baymeadows.
The Baymeadows location effectively disenfranchises many parents from areas north and west of the river. How many employees in the DCPS HQ live north or west of the river? Their commute will be 20-30 minutes longer.
According to Jax Today
Quote
Documents provided to Jacksonville Today by board member Melody Bolduc show Duval Schools expects to sell its current building for $20 million and pay $14 million for the new one. According to the documents, provided to the board in advance of Tuesday's meeting, the district received 10 offers for the current building on Prudential Drive and selected one with the help of its real estate team, Trinity Commercial Group. It's been on the market for several months.
Do they have a firm offer at $20 million for the current HQ?
How much will the relocation consume of that anticipated $6 million 'profit'?
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on August 18, 2025, 10:53:33 PM
^ Now, even government is leaving the Downtown area? DCPS is a big part what is left standing.
Let's see, the FBI moved to the burbs. JSO to Brooklyn. Citizens to the burbs. The State is still "Downtown" but not really with its fortress-like suburban-style edge campus not walkable to anything.
That leaves City offices, JEA, the IRS and Federal/State courts/attorney offices as the last major Downtown government tenants. Did I leave anyone out? Maybe UF, but when in significant numbers?
JSO to Brooklyn is still Downtown. If DCPS proposed moving from the Southbank to Brooklyn, no one would say they were "leaving Downtown"
Quote from: fsu813 on August 19, 2025, 11:14:27 AM
Because the proposed location doesn't have an appropriate space to hold large public meetings, I believe the proposal also includes using the Schultz Center in the St. Nicholas area for school board meetings.
Not as good for public access as a true central location, but definitely better access than Baymeadows.
Have they explored working with a developer to revamp the present property? They could put a nice new building on that big surface parking lot they own, with them being development partner in the project.
This sheep like office movement to the Southside is pathetic, even more so from public entities. Shame on them actually.
Quote from: thelakelander on August 19, 2025, 02:21:51 PM
Quote from: fsu813 on August 19, 2025, 11:14:27 AM
Because the proposed location doesn't have an appropriate space to hold large public meetings, I believe the proposal also includes using the Schultz Center in the St. Nicholas area for school board meetings.
Not as good for public access as a true central location, but definitely better access than Baymeadows.
Have they explored working with a developer to revamp the present property? They could put a nice new building on that big surface parking lot they own, with them being development partner in the project.
Quote from: landfall on August 19, 2025, 03:15:55 PM
This sheep like office movement to the Southside is pathetic, even more so from public entities. Shame on them actually.
Completely agree with both points. If $20M is really the purchase price, and they are spending $14M to go elsewhere... there was certainly a (more complex) solution where they stayed in a new smaller footprint while still selling the majority of the property. Can't imagine the intended uses there will have 100% parking occupancy during work hours.
Worked at SEG. They spent a ton to retro fit the office for the needs of the business back in 2015. Is it a fit for DCPS? Yes and No.
They'll still have retrofit it to their needs. There's no fixed auditorium for meetings, it's a flex space used primarily as a cafeteria. There's a big test kitchen and a little grab and go area for snacks/drinks. Not sure if those two components would be needed.
The lobby needs to be re-worked to be more secure for a public building.
Floors 2-4 are all open floor plan with a bunch of workspaces and a bunch of meeting rooms, etc.
But DCPS shouldn't consider a move to burbs, a central location is paramount where it doesn't disenfranchise the northside/westside/oceanway/arlington or flip side if it found a location say by the airport.
If this building was available in the DT area, no brainer.
Where were the rejected bids located? Any near downtown? What were their costs?
Not likely included in the $14 million are transaction, due diligence, retrofit, moving and business disruption costs.
I spoke with someone who worked in facilities at DCPS last time this came up and they said the numbers for a move didn't compute and they couldn't understand the drive to move from a financial standpoint. The School Board subsequently tabled this discussion.
I doubt much has changed since so moving likely still makes no financial sense. It has to be cheaper to clean up the current building and, as others suggest, rent out excess space and/or co-develop the remaining property.
Regarding sharing the building and security, if the Federal Reserve Bank can find a way to rent out its excess space in one of the most secure buildings in Jax and JSO can share the Florida Blue tower with others, I think that DCPS could find a way to share space securely too.
Lastly, I don't see peak demand at this time for their Southbank property given the undeveloped land around them. So, I wonder if they would get substantially more appreciation by sitting on the property for a while longer.
Maybe the mystery buyer is the developer next door adding to their holdings? or Gateway ;)?
Well looks like fleet landing will buy the dcps building and demolish it and build a senior living community.
https://youtu.be/iUE6DSjk5Mw?si=PnZ4QeYDUZSZQJol (https://youtu.be/iUE6DSjk5Mw?si=PnZ4QeYDUZSZQJol)
I would not normally say this about a senior living facility, but this could be a big get for Downtown. Fleet Landing isn't an ordinary retirement community. It's primarily geared towards retired naval officers. The Fleet Landing in Atlantic Beach has a great resident profile of retired naval officers with high net worth's and disposable income. I believe there are several admirals that live there.
Could potentially be a great addition to Jax and draw retired naval officers from all over the country...but that still doesn't make the Baymeadows situation ok.
If Fleet Landing builds something substantial if not bigger like they are planning on doing in Nocatee, it's a win.
Interested to see if they had any conversations with the neighboring RiversEdge before eyeing the DCPS property. Just wondering when we will see the first vertical development outside of infill townhomes and public spaces.
I hope this Fleet Landing will allow for public access of the grounds given this location. They are usually exclusive to members.
Nothing is likely to materialize at RiversEdge (beyond townhomes/public spaces) for the next several years. There are no active/pending civil plans nor any DDRB applications to approve the individual buildings.
Hmmm....Fleet Landing has a retirement home exemption from the state. So this property stays off the tax rolls, generating zero for the Southbank Tax Increment Fund. Plus we a 146,000-square-foot suburban office building also goes off the tax rolls. This gets more fiscally irresponsible from a Duval County Taxpayer perspective.
Quote from: thelakelander on August 22, 2025, 01:10:49 PM
Hmmm....Fleet Landing has a retirement home exemption from the state. So this property stays off the tax rolls, generating zero for the Southbank Tax Increment Fund. Plus we a 146,000-square-foot suburban office building also goes off the tax rolls. This gets more fiscally irresponsible from a Duval County Taxpayer perspective.
Good point and agreed. The whole idea of getting government buildings off the river was to get the valuable land on the tax rolls. If that isn't happening, what is the point of all this? The move is already is questionable from a financial standpoint, regardless, and this just adds to the worthlessness of doing this. More Jax silliness for the optics, not the substance. Just like U2C. And, taxpayers screwed again.
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/aug/25/report-fleet-landing-wants-to-buy-duval-schools-headquarters-for-retirement-community/
Not sure how I feel about swapping one tax exempt entity for another in this location. I could be swayed depending on what they are proposing.
It is not a lot of land.
3+ acres of CCBD zoning, on the River, is a lot of land. Have to remember that they can qualify for every incentive that any project in Lavilla can qualify for.
Quote from: Jax_Developer on August 25, 2025, 10:51:59 AM
3+ acres of CCBD zoning, on the River, is a lot of land. Have to remember that they can qualify for every incentive that any project in Lavilla can qualify for.
Yes and no. If they are property tax exempt, they aren't eligible for REV grants (property tax abatement). Also, because there will be no additional property tax revenue generated, COJ could factor that in to the incentive process and not offer them a completion grant or give a substantially smaller one.
The Related Group tower is getting a 75% REV Grant ($19.8 million) based on the new ad valorem taxes generated over 15 years and a $39 million completion grant. That indicates that there is a lot of intangible value to COJ in simply getting middle to upper income residents to live downtown.
The property tax exemption is just a more valuable benefit than what the REV grant incentive would allow. It still gets access to every other incentive available - which some are by-right. I think your logic on the completion grant likely goes the other way. They will argue the REV grant is irrelevant to their use as an argument for more incentives elsewhere.
As you mentioned earlier, Fleet Landing has a great reputation & connections locally. I can't imagine them not getting a 'deal' here. Probably already somewhat negotiated.
With that being said, I wouldn't get my hopes up on it being a tower - though we need more. I'd expect more of the same stick figures we've seen them produce in their previous projects. Not that they are bad communities, because they look good. Just not for dt. But who am I to argue? This will bring much needed residents and possibly kick some momentum into RiversEdge.
I believe the Nocatee Fleet Landing has a 9-story tower. Could be stick over platform, I guess. Not sure if it phased in but does show on the renderings and is not bad looking.
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on August 25, 2025, 01:07:56 PM
With that being said, I wouldn't get my hopes up on it being a tower - though we need more. I'd expect more of the same stick figures we've seen them produce in their previous projects. Not that they are bad communities, because they look good. Just not for dt. But who am I to argue? This will bring much needed residents and possibly kick some momentum into RiversEdge.
The Nocatee location has a midrise component. My guess is that they would propose something like that here.
IMO they should put @heights unknown in charge of the design; I think he'd make a good proposal. Nothing less than 20 stories with a rooftop venue!
Quote from: thelakelander on August 22, 2025, 01:10:49 PM
Hmmm....Fleet Landing has a retirement home exemption from the state. So this property stays off the tax rolls, generating zero for the Southbank Tax Increment Fund. Plus we a 146,000-square-foot suburban office building also goes off the tax rolls. This gets more fiscally irresponsible from a Duval County Taxpayer perspective.
Do we know if it is going to be a nursing home or retirement home? Or both?
The property appraiser website has one of the large Fleet Landing Parcels in Atlantic Beach with an assessed value of $56 million, a $16 million state exemption, and total taxable value of $40 million. This parcel and some others are for independent living and are on the tax rolls. However, one of their Atlantic Beach parcels is coded as nursing and has a $14 million value that is entirely exempt.
Quote from: CityLife on August 25, 2025, 03:41:30 PM
Quote from: thelakelander on August 22, 2025, 01:10:49 PM
Hmmm....Fleet Landing has a retirement home exemption from the state. So this property stays off the tax rolls, generating zero for the Southbank Tax Increment Fund. Plus we a 146,000-square-foot suburban office building also goes off the tax rolls. This gets more fiscally irresponsible from a Duval County Taxpayer perspective.
Do we know if it is going to be a nursing home or retirement home? Or both?
The property appraiser website has one of the large Fleet Landing Parcels in Atlantic Beach with an assessed value of $56 million, a $16 million state exemption, and total taxable value of $40 million. This parcel and some others are for independent living and are on the tax rolls. However, one of their Atlantic Beach parcels is coded as nursing and has a $14 million value that is entirely exempt.
This makes sense. When nonprofits engage in "businesses" that are not for the overall community good, but rather mimic for-profit activities, tax authorities (including the IRS) typically will deem those activities "taxable" just like if they were operated by a for-profit.
Running a "retirement" home for only those that can afford to pay is not a charitable function, so I would expect that portion of activity to be taxable.
I'm 95% sure that Fleet Landing (now expanded) has a model similar to Cypress Village in that they have independent-living rental property on their grounds that allow access to their full amenities. That use is generally not tax-exempt property. Cypress Village did it fee-simple. Fleet Landing did it as a multi-family space.
The entire original point of DCPS moving off the riverfront is null and void with this deal. Seems like the goal post has been moved.
I get it if DCPS wants the $20 million. There's a plus in that idea by itself. The positives drop big time when the financially broke district then turns right around and spends all the money buying and taking a suburban corporate headquarters office building right off the tax rolls, along with 650 jobs out of downtown.
Quote from: urban_ on August 25, 2025, 02:33:13 PM
IMO they should put @heights unknown in charge of the design; I think he'd make a good proposal. Nothing less than 20 stories with a rooftop venue!
Hee hee...LOLOL...you got that right!
Who's in the Charles Bennett building now, if the IRS really is being dissolved? On the other hand, there are a couple of buildings off Belfort Road in the office park across from St. Vincent's hospital that are available.
Quote from: thelakelander on August 25, 2025, 06:35:45 PM
The entire original point of DCPS moving off the riverfront is null and void with this deal. Seems like the goal post has been moved.
The entire original point of DCPS moving off the riverfront is null and void with this deal. Seems like the goal post has been removed.
FIFY
Quote from: sandyshoes on August 29, 2025, 09:54:49 AM
Who's in the Charles Bennett building now, if the IRS really is being dissolved? On the other hand, there are a couple of buildings off Belfort Road in the office park across from St. Vincent's hospital that are available.
The IRS is still in that building
As assumed when the news came out, the board votes to move forward with the sell and move to the burbs:
QuoteIn two Sept. 2 votes, the Duval County Public Schools board authorized Superintendent Christopher Bernier to negotiate the sale of the DCPS central administration building on the Southbank Downtown and the purchase of new offices in Baymeadows.
With the 6-1 votes, the board took a step toward moving from the current school board headquarters at 1701 Prudential Drive to a proposed location at 8928 Prominence Parkway in Prominence Office Park.
Board Chair Charlotte Joyce, Vice Chair April Carney and board members Reginald Blount, Melody Bolduc, Cynthia Pearson and Anthony Ricardo voted in favor of both motions. Board member Darryl Willie voted against both.
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/sep/02/school-board-approves-advancing-negotiations-to-sell-its-downtown-headquarters/
Dissapointing.
$20 mm plus millions more for demo costs seems like a lot to pay for 3 acres. It's not like there isn't other riverfront property literally next to this location.
The value is largely a function of the incentives - for which the Development next door has already had that fleshed that out and likely will not be as strong as a package compared to what Fleet Landing will be able to negotiate. Moreover, senior & assisted living communities can pay top of market for mid-sized parcels. The different code requirements for parking exclusively reduces their per unit costs by $30k per unit easily but more importantly space/building height.
Related purchased their 3 acres for $10M... so $20M really isn't that surprising. 390 less parking spaces is easily $10M in dollars saved.
So, with incentives to reimburse a developer/Fleet Landing, the City is effectively paying the School Board to move. Those dollars should be subtracted from the $20 million offered. Regardless of the source, City or School Board, it's all taxpayer dollars.
On First Coast Connect today they also noted that the first of two payments won't cover the purchase price of the Baymeadows building so the School Board is going to have to bridge finance the difference plus pay moving, renovation, Realtor commissions, etc. And, depending how far out the second payment is, it should be present value discounted which likely brings the value of the deal down below $20 million.
Like U2C, another unexplainable action by local officials. How do voters keep voting for such incompetency?
Everyone basically makes money off the backs of the taxpayers. Straight highway robbery.
The financial flaws in this deal are obvious. I love the 'yeah no need to counter, lets just rip this offer' attitude from DCPS. Very little public information about the building's condition they are purchasing also. What's the capital investment there?
- If recent DIA Completion Grants remain consistent, this city is looking at a $30M+ Completion Grant
- Dream Finders purchased the entire Prominence Parkway for $22M in in June 2024, now are going to sell one of the several buildings in the entire office park for $14M? (Do I even need to say it?)
- As Lake mentioned, questions around what percentage of the Fleet Landing Site will ever pay property tax but I doubt they will pay any due to the combo of their assisted living & REV grants available
- The $7.5M second payment is really worth $6.9M in 2025 dollars as well. So not crazy, but another $600k in "profit" instantly gone
- DCPS needing to get a loan to buy the Baymeadows building first (LOL) another $500k to a $1M in profit is also instantly gone
I also love how this move is due to like ~$6M in 'profit' that would earned by moving buildings... I want to meet the genius that said "You can save $6M by moving from a 1980's built, 122k sf building to a 1990's built, 165k sf building." I mean... you can't make this stuff up. Does anyone really believe the new building's operating costs will have any meaningful savings?
Unknown you will love this me too
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/sep/09/fleet-landing-releases-renderings-of-proposed-southbank-project/ (https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/sep/09/fleet-landing-releases-renderings-of-proposed-southbank-project/)
;D
Quote from: Skybox111 on September 09, 2025, 08:58:39 PM
Unknown you will love this me too
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/sep/09/fleet-landing-releases-renderings-of-proposed-southbank-project/ (https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/sep/09/fleet-landing-releases-renderings-of-proposed-southbank-project/)
;D ;D ;D
First ballot, Rendering Hall of Fame
Quote from: Skybox111 on September 09, 2025, 08:58:39 PM
Unknown you will love this me too
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/sep/09/fleet-landing-releases-renderings-of-proposed-southbank-project/ (https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/sep/09/fleet-landing-releases-renderings-of-proposed-southbank-project/)
Oh to be a fly on the wall at Unknown's house to see his reaction
This is clearly not a non-profit venture as confirmed in the article with the admission it will be subject to property taxes. Wonder if this will impact Related's project, adjacent Rivers Edge development, or proposed towers on the Northbank and who, if anyone, gets out of the ground first. Can Jax absorb multiple such projects in a short period?... I am not so sure based on our history.
There is also this word of caution at the end of the article for those enamored by renderings (so typical of Jax):
QuoteThe renderings are conceptual and provided for illustrative purposes only. Final design, scale, and features are subject to change pending approvals and further development planning, Fleet Landing said.
This is a win win win. 20 and 30 story towers added to the skyline, city gets taxes, and the downtown residential population grows. It's aesthetically pleasing to look at also. Has what seems to be restaurants with views of the St. Johns. Let's get this done like now! Maybe this will kick some gear into Riversedge and Related to get moving. This is exactly what DT Jax needs.
I'm still not wooed. There is literally nothing that can be proposed for this property that would justify DCPS moving nearly 1,000 taxpayer funded positions out of downtown and taking a major suburban commercial property off the tax rolls. The point with downtown revitalization (if that's something this community is truly trying to do), is to retain what we have and add to it. So sure, bring in Fleet and everyone else. But DCPS, you stay too.....especially when you can only operate by living off tax money.
Can't wait for the property tax item to be the focus of this deal when we all know they will be getting a 20+ year 75% REV grant anyway...
Quote from: copperfiend on September 09, 2025, 09:25:05 PM
First ballot, Rendering Hall of Fame
Still can't top Sea Glass Tower.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/2013/12/13/1000-foot-high-observation-tower-envisioned-help-develop-shipyards/15805799007/
Quote from: Jax_Developer on September 10, 2025, 10:19:57 AM
Can't wait for the property tax item to be the focus of this deal when we all know they will be getting a 20+ year 75% REV grant anyway...
Was thinking the same thing.
Wow. My "tall" and "height" juices are once again flowing; on the flip side, here we go again with these "pie in the sky" renderings and proposals. Hope they materialize and come to fruition.
Quote from: fsu813 on September 10, 2025, 10:30:37 AM
Quote from: copperfiend on September 09, 2025, 09:25:05 PM
First ballot, Rendering Hall of Fame
Still can't top Sea Glass Tower.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/2013/12/13/1000-foot-high-observation-tower-envisioned-help-develop-shipyards/15805799007/
Wasn't the Seaglass Tower proposal on the Northbank? This is proposed to be on the Southbank; or does it matter where they build this?
"pie in the sky" - great name for a restaurant on top of that gleaming tower in the clouds
Quote from: thelakelander on September 10, 2025, 12:08:33 AM
I'm still not wooed. There is literally nothing that can be proposed for this property that would justify DCPS moving nearly 1,000 taxpayer funded positions out of downtown and taking a major suburban commercial property off the tax rolls. The point with downtown revitalization (if that's something this community is truly trying to do), is to retain what we have and add to it. So sure, bring in Fleet and everyone else. But DCPS, you stay too.....especially when you can only operate by living off tax money.
Agreed. Why doesn't Fleet build on River's Edge next door? Probably cheaper since no buildings there presently and Rivers Edge should be desperate for a signature project to jump start what appears to be a very slow moving development.
This point has been made before... lots of vacant lots in "Downtown" so why do we keep removing existing and functional buildings for "potential" developments that mostly never materialize?
I feel like this game of doing something that is against public good and trying to pacify everyone with generic tower renderings gets old. This is all bs and will never materialize.
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on September 12, 2025, 08:38:54 AM
I feel like this game of doing something that is against public good and trying to pacify everyone with generic tower renderings gets old. This is all bs and will never materialize.
Be careful jc; you might motivate them and it will get built (yeah right...pipe dreams).
Wish that was all it took
From DCPS board member Cindy Pearson:
"Neighbor to neighbor, let's talk about the proposals to sell 1701 Prudential Drive (current DCPS administration building) and purchase a building at Prominence Parkway (former Southeastern Grocers headquarters).
The school board is scheduled to vote on two contacts on Tuesday, October 7. I appreciate the work of staff in negotiating both the sale and purchase contracts, but I am concerned that these are not good deals for DCPS.
I support DCPS moving the administration building to make way for development on the Southbank WHEN THE DEAL MAKES SENSE FOR DCPS. I have concerns that the proposed transactions are BAD DEALS for DCPS (and taxpayers).
-the proposed purchase price for 1701 Prudential is $20,000,000. Good price. However, DCPS would receive $12.5 million at closing and $7.5 million 3 years later. That would necessitate DCPS taking out a loan to make the Prominence Parkway building purchase, proposed renovations to Schultz Center and related moving costs. DCPS would be paying interest on that loan but not receiving any on the $7.5 million delayed payment from the purchaser. Any excess funds that DCPS would realize between the sale of 1701 Prudential and the purchase of the Prominence Parkway building would be delayed for three years.
-the proposed purchase price for the Prominence Parkway building is approximately $13,000,000 for the building and $600,000 for the furniture. The building does not have a natural space for an auditorium to hold monthly school board meetings. The proposal is to hold those meetings at the Schultz Center (off of Beach Blvd), which will require renovating that space to accommodate a dais, IT/audio-visual capacity and enhanced security.
In addition, the Prominence Parkway property (located near Baymeadows and I-95) would come with an annual property owners association fee of $42,000.
-the timing of the contracts would have DCPS closing on the purchase of the Prominence Parkway building by Dec 31, 2025. The district's goal is to move staff to the new location by July 2026.
The closing date for the sale of 1701 Prudential would be in the third quarter of 2026. DCPS would own two administration buildings for 6-8 months before closing with the 1701 Prudential buyer. DCPS would be fully moved into a new building before closing on the sale of 1701 Prudential.
-DCPS considers these transactions as favorable because it accomplishes the goal of moving off of the river, it will consolidate additional staff into one building (allowing DCPS to sell other property) and it will reduce operating costs (not considering loan repayment and an annual association fee).
-The lack of alignment in closing dates, the split payment on the sale of 1701 Prudential, the Prominence Parkway location at Baymeadows and 95 (including the plans to develop most of the former office park into residential units), the plan to split staff between Prominence Parkway and Schultz Center and the awkwardness of holding board meetings at Schultz Center leads me to believe that the negatives outweigh the positives.
My preference is that DCPS remain at 1701 Prudential while actively looking for a more central location for the administration building and negotiate a set of sale/purchase deals with terms that better serve the district's (and the taxpayer's) interests.
Please email me with your thoughts (positive or negative) about the contracts."
I agree. DCPS should stay where it is until moving makes financial sense for Duval County taxpayers. No reason to move forward the sake of moving or be pushed into thinking a deal must be rushed through now. When you do deals from desperation or being rushed, you generally end up on the bad side of a deal.
Quote from: thelakelander on October 03, 2025, 03:22:31 PM
I agree. DCPS should stay where it is until moving makes financial sense for Duval County taxpayers. No reason to move forward the sake of moving or be pushed into thinking a deal must be rushed through now. When you do deals from desperation or being rushed, you generally end up on the bad side of a deal.
That reminds me of my situation buying an AC when ours died in the middle of August one year. A normal ass house doesn't need a unit that could refrigerate the Pentagon, but that's the first thing the companies show you!
Quote from: thelakelander on October 03, 2025, 03:22:31 PM
I agree. DCPS should stay where it is until moving makes financial sense for Duval County taxpayers. No reason to move forward the sake of moving or be pushed into thinking a deal must be rushed through now. When you do deals from desperation or being rushed, you generally end up on the bad side of a deal.
And I also agree. What's the rush rush?? Why haw tail it without carefully and thoughtfully thinking this move through, for the taxpayers and the School Board, and end up with a bad deal that ultimately hurts and harms all concerned? Appears to me someone didn't really think everything through relative to this move and the purchase of a new location.
Quote from: thelakelander on October 03, 2025, 03:22:31 PM
I agree. DCPS should stay where it is until moving makes financial sense for Duval County taxpayers. No reason to move forward the sake of moving or be pushed into thinking a deal must be rushed through now. When you do deals from desperation or being rushed, you generally end up on the bad side of a deal.
I agree to an extent, but it is possible some other buyer would buy the new (Prominence Parkway) building if they don't follow thru. Meaning the school board would need to find a similar appropriate building that is for sale or build new, either of which could be more expensive.
Hopefully another buyer will buy it and keep it on the tax rolls. That would be a huge win for the Duval County taxpayer. That building is much larger than the school board needs, is not centrally located and an expense that DCPS does not "have" to make. To buy that building under the fear that someone else will get it, when the numbers are so questionable, would be the definition of desperation, imo.
Ms. Pearson is spot on. I have met her in the past and she is very grounded and centered, truly focused on getting the best education for our kids. Not trying to score political points by grandstanding on culture wars or other divisive issues like some other DCSB members.
As such, I hope other board members give her heed and don't just go the opposite way because....
Yea! School board unanimously votes down selling their building to Fleet Landing and moving to Baymeadows. Common sense prevails for once. A rare outcome but much appreciated.
Apparently there was much concern about the deal falling apart and DCPS being caught in a jam if that were to happen. Deal was just too risky to approve. Add, the public pushback and the plan died, at least for now.
There really is no urgency to doing a deal. There is plenty of riverfront available for development for now. Given the volume of land, currently, and for the foreseeable future, oversupplied, selling the Board's building would be selling at a depressed price that won't cover the cost of moving elsewhere. Wait until there is a true shortage to meet development needs and then, maybe, get a premium price that makes another location worth considering. Likely, at least several more years out.
QuoteDuval School Board rejects plans to leave downtown for Baymeadows, leaving uncertain future
Twin deals to sell Duval County Public Schools' Southbank headquarters and move to Baymeadows were unanimously rejected by the School Board Oct. 7, stalling again a years-long goal of moving government offices off the downtown riverfront....
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/education/2025/10/07/duval-school-board-votes-down-plans-to-leave-downtown-for-baymeadows/86570821007/?tbref=hp
I second that "Yea!"
I wonder if there will be some conversations between the Board Chair and Supt. Bernier about "transparency" and sharing information with the Board?
This quote from the Jax Today article doesn't surprise me, after listing the reasons Board members voted No on the two items,
Quote
Tony Ricardo did not give a reason for his votes.
Sadly, he is my SB member.
It looks like Fleet Landing is off the table, leaving it up to Chase Properties to make this project happen. They're reportedly considering either a land swap involving the Suddath building plus around $5 million, or an outright purchase for roughly $17 million. Is the Suddath building even vacant? It's still fairly new, and details are limited. If they go with the $17 million buyout, that raises another question — where would DCPS relocate? Lots of uncertainty here.
I'm also not entirely confident in Chase Properties. According to their website, they were behind the original "Healthy Town" concept at the old JEA site, which later became the Rivers Edge project. Outside of the townhomes and park, not much has materialized there. They're also responsible for those hideous townhomes proposed behind the Toll Brothers section at Rivers Edge. On top of that, they're planning a hotel, 600 residential units, and retail space on the current DCPS site—if it gets approved. It's certainly ambitious, but I'm not holding my breath.
^Interesting. Where did you get this info?!
Quote from: thelakelander on October 22, 2025, 12:04:36 AM
^Interesting. Where did you get this info?!
Mostly Action News report.
https://www.actionnewsjax.com/news/local/fleet-landing-drops-out-bid-dcps-hq-board-considers-chase-offers/PGDQHDC7WNCA7GMVFZ5N3XFIW4/ (https://www.actionnewsjax.com/news/local/fleet-landing-drops-out-bid-dcps-hq-board-considers-chase-offers/PGDQHDC7WNCA7GMVFZ5N3XFIW4/)
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/feb/05/trailview-a-53-unit-town-home-community-planned-for-downtown-southbank/ (https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/feb/05/trailview-a-53-unit-town-home-community-planned-for-downtown-southbank/)
https://www.chaseproperties.com/ (https://www.chaseproperties.com/)
Why would they need to swap anything with so much undeveloped land on the south bank?
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on October 22, 2025, 07:51:00 AM
Why would they need to swap anything with so much undeveloped land on the south bank?
I mean it's close to their current site. Not sure the specifics, I would think an appraisal would be needed from both since it's city related and a that there's a fair deal. But seems bigger, nicer, newer, parking garage, and off the river with a more central location next to a park. Plus almost 5M to renovate. Does Suddath have tenants?
Where would they go if they did sell and buy somewhere else? Leasing has to be off the table. That's like burning money with no return. In the future they'll be worse off - it's a waste of money. If the plan is to lease Florida Blue temp and get land near the courthouse to build the big beautiful building they proposed years ago, I'd be fine with that.
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on October 21, 2025, 11:47:59 PM
It looks like Fleet Landing is off the table, leaving it up to Chase Properties to make this project happen. They're reportedly considering either a land swap involving the Suddath building plus around $5 million, or an outright purchase for roughly $17 million. Is the Suddath building even vacant? It's still fairly new, and details are limited. If they go with the $17 million buyout, that raises another question — where would DCPS relocate? Lots of uncertainty here.
I'm also not entirely confident in Chase Properties. According to their website, they were behind the original "Healthy Town" concept at the old JEA site, which later became the Rivers Edge project. Outside of the townhomes and park, not much has materialized there. They're also responsible for those hideous townhomes proposed behind the Toll Brothers section at Rivers Edge. On top of that, they're planning a hotel, 600 residential units, and retail space on the current DCPS site—if it gets approved. It's certainly ambitious, but I'm not holding my breath.
"... the Suddath building [is] still fairly new" - I'm not sure what you consider "fairly new," but the building was there in the mid-1970s when I worked in a nearby building on the Southbank. Back then, 50 years ago, it was the IBM Building.
"If they go with the $17 million buyout, that raises another question — where would DCPS relocate?"From this
Quote
That swap would keep district headquarters in the urban core, while the other option would move operations to Prominence Parkway in Baymeadows, a newer and larger space that could consolidate more departments.
I take it that with the cash purchase, DCPS would still move to the Baymeadows site.
From the ActionNews article
Quote
Other members, like Melody Bolduc, shared concerns that the Suddath building didn't offer enough parking space for employees and room for expansion at the Suddath site.
True, there is no room to expand the Suddath building, with Treaty Oak Park next door. But, why would the existing parking deck be inadequate?
I agree, more details are needed.
What is the square-foot comparison between the current building and Suddath?
Where would the Board meet?
Would the $5 million fully cover renovation and relocation?
To get to Ms Bolduc's concern, what is the head-count comparison between DCPS and the Suddath Building (at full use)?
DCPS should buy back the Shultz Center in Midtown Park off Beach. It is well located, has all kinds of meeting and training facilities originally designed for DCPS. The office park is half empty and older so they can buy adjacent land and build-to-suit the office building of their dreams or renovate one of the larger empty ones in the Park with lots of parking on the cheap. Probably the best deal close to Downtown regarding location, pricing, suitability, and available land. The Shultz Center was already incorporated in their Baymeadows plans so they already are half way there.
Oh !!!! Look at this here:
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/nov/04/divided-duval-county-school-board-votes-to-sell-southbank-hq-to-chase-properties/
I'm happy they are moving off the riverfront, disappointed that another major employer is leaving downtown yet again...
QuoteDivided Duval County School Board votes to sell Southbank HQ to Chase Properties
A divided Duval County School board voted Nov. 4 to sell its headquarters along the Downtown Southbank and buy a building in Baymeadows that will become the district's new administrative home.
In a 4-3 vote, the board approved selling its riverfront building at 1701 Prudential Drive to Chase Properties Inc. for $17.2 million.
Board Chair Charlotte Joyce, Vice Chair April Carney and board members Reginald Blount and Melody Bolduc voted in favor. Board members Cynthia Pearson, Anthony Ricardo and Darryl Willie voted no.
The vote on the proposal to purchase the building at 8928 Prominence Parkway in Baymeadows for $13.65 million fell along the same split, with Joyce, Carney, Blount and Bolduc in favor and Pearson, Ricardo and Willie against.
Carney called for the vote after about an hour of discussion of topics that already were covered at the board's Oct. 7 meeting when a proposal to sell the 1701 Prudential Drive property to retirement community developer Fleet Landing and purchase the building in Baymeadows were both unanimously rejected....
...On Oct. 5, Chase submitted a proposal to the school board that Balanky described as a "visionary development plan" for the Prudential Drive property.
The plan for the condos, apartments and commercial uses was developed by Balanky. Sleiman Enterprises President and CEO Toney Sleiman and Steven Suddath, chairman of the board of Suddath Companies.
The proposal cited the partners' decades of experience in redevelopment and mixed-use, retail and high-rise projects....
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/nov/04/divided-duval-county-school-board-votes-to-sell-southbank-hq-to-chase-properties/
The deal with Chase should have been voted down for the same reasons as Fleet Landing... it doesn't make economic sense for the School Board and the taxpayers. And, Chase, like Fleet Landing, could build on other available riverfront properties that currently stand completely empty.
I note that in the 4 to 3 vote, all 4 of the "for-s" were the MAGA contingent. No surprise there.
Looking at Chase's rendering, the buildings proposed, once again, don't appear to be all that exciting. And, they are high rises closely approaching the edge of the river, another out of scale waterfront development. Hoping Chase tears up this concept and starts over but knowing Jax developers, we are likely going to end up with a strictly "cost effective" structure.
(https://media.yourobserver.com/img/photos/2025/11/04/chase_southbank_rendering_t850.jpg?94beabde1e982a4eee8f83697e93b1d92468de7c)
I get the lament about losing the office workers but this is a win overall. 600 residences and 200k of retail/commercial space makes up for it. The office workers will return once DT is a vibrant population center. The board is getting more money than the new building costs and the new development will pay property taxes.
Getting this up will help get things moving at the JEA site.
Office vacancy rates are killing downtown Jax right now... this does not help in the short term...
The only way I would be impressed is if Chase properties can move as quickly as Gateway Jax to get things moving on this site.... The key is breaking ground, turning soil, getting cranes in the air as quickly as possible.....
We've seen too many buildings demolished and beautiful renderings released that never actually materialize — I am hopeful, but a little skeptical until I see dirt moving and cranes in the air.
Does anyone know the status of The related group's high rise project at the former River City Brewery company site adjacent to friendship fountains? That's just one of many examples downtown where demolition and big announcements didn't lead to visible progress. Hopefully, this new project with Chase properties bucks that trend...
Don't even get me started on the old Duval County Courthouse site on Bay Street that sits as a vacant and empty lot 6/7 days of the week and only being used for parking by Deccalive on weekends....
Maybe we will finally get those gondolas across the River! https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2018/mar/20/balanky-plans-southbank-tower-with-gondolas-across-st-johns/
Yea, I am going to put this guy in the Developer of Renderings pile (see Atkins), instead of the Developer of Buildings pile (see Gateway). I hope he proves me wrong.
Lack luster to say the least. It fits in well with the current waterfront structures we currently have. However, there's nothing to differentiate what has been developed over time. Hoping DDRB sends them back to the drawing boards to come up with a better more up to date modern rendering. This looks like towers that were built in the 2000s. It needs more curves imo, something that you can add lights to in the night to stand out.
Quote from: Jones518 on November 05, 2025, 06:56:42 AM
Office vacancy rates are killing downtown Jax right now... this does not help in the short term...
The only way I would be impressed is if Chase properties can move as quickly as Gateway Jax to get things moving on this site.... The key is breaking ground, turning soil, getting cranes in the air as quickly as possible.....
We've seen too many buildings demolished and beautiful renderings released that never actually materialize — I am hopeful, but a little skeptical until I see dirt moving and cranes in the air.
Does anyone know the status of The related group's high rise project at the former River City Brewery company site adjacent to friendship fountains? That's just one of many examples downtown where demolition and big announcements didn't lead to visible progress. Hopefully, this new project with Chase properties bucks that trend...
Don't even get me started on the old Duval County Courthouse site on Bay Street that sits as a vacant and empty lot 6/7 days of the week and only being used for parking by Deccalive on weekends....
Regarding the tower on the Southbank (Related Group), I believe the next step is turning dirt/soil and cranes in the air. The City, from what I have dug up, has expressed urgency, as has Related, to start construction. If this is true, regarding urgency of starting construction by both sides, I, and most of us are wondering what in the world is the holdup. Maybe we'll see super news after the new year (hopefully). Site preparation and construction should begin soon.
Quote from: heights unknown on November 05, 2025, 05:15:26 PM
Quote from: Jones518 on November 05, 2025, 06:56:42 AM
Office vacancy rates are killing downtown Jax right now... this does not help in the short term...
The only way I would be impressed is if Chase properties can move as quickly as Gateway Jax to get things moving on this site.... The key is breaking ground, turning soil, getting cranes in the air as quickly as possible.....
We've seen too many buildings demolished and beautiful renderings released that never actually materialize... I am hopeful, but a little skeptical until I see dirt moving and cranes in the air.
Does anyone know the status of The related group's high rise project at the former River City Brewery company site adjacent to friendship fountains? That's just one of many examples downtown where demolition and big announcements didn't lead to visible progress. Hopefully, this new project with Chase properties bucks that trend...
Don't even get me started on the old Duval County Courthouse site on Bay Street that sits as a vacant and empty lot 6/7 days of the week and only being used for parking by Deccalive on weekends....
Regarding the tower on the Southbank (Related Group), I believe the next step is turning dirt/soil and cranes in the air. The City, from what I have dug up, has expressed urgency, as has Related, to start construction. If this is true, regarding urgency of starting construction by both sides, I, and most of us are wondering what in the world is the holdup. Maybe we'll see super news after the new year (hopefully). Site preparation and construction should begin soon.
The Related Group they are super active down in South Florida right now. I don't think they are very focused on this site here in NE Florida... I would not be surprised if they come up with some other lousy excuse to ask for more tax incentives or even scratch the project altogether.... Projects up here in Northeast Florida are often secondary priorities for them unless local conditions make it really favorable (like big tax incentives, city partnerships, or guaranteed pre-leasing).
A lot of these developers are just smoke and mirrors.... I wish the news stations would stop giving them time any of day until they start putting their money where their mouth is in the form of turning dirt and putting cranes in the air.
The tower was taken off related's site. I think it is dead
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on November 09, 2025, 12:06:53 PM
The tower was taken off related's site. I think it is dead
Not surprised!!!
The city of Jax has to do a better job at vetting developers and holding developers like that accountable....
We lost one of the few riverfront restaurants to a developer who demolished the RCBC building with false promises of bringing something bigger and better... talk about a vibrancy killer...
Despicable!!
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on November 09, 2025, 12:06:53 PM
The tower was taken off related's site. I think it is dead
THAT doesn't surprise me either. I noticed I didn't see it anywhere but was hoping. Hope we didn't give them any incentives, and yes, hold all of them accountable, legal by contract, to not dole out money or too much money until construction is 75% complete or finally complete. I like the twin residential towers on the DPSC site; I hope that comes to fruition. I was wondering why the Related Tower was taking so long; they silently decided not to move forward. I'll bet they asked the City for more money and the City said no.
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on November 09, 2025, 12:06:53 PM
The tower was taken off related's site. I think it is dead
REGARDING THE RELATED TOWER ON THE SOUTHBANK (From Co-Pilot/AI): Here is an excerpt from a question I posed to CO-PILOT regarding the Related Group Tower - MY QUESTION: "The Related Tower that was to be built on the Southbank of Downtown Jacksonville has been taken off/removed from the Related Group's website out of Miami; does this mean that the tower has been cancelled and is a "no go?" CO-PILOT/AI'S ANSWER - "No, the Related Tower project on the Southbank of Downtown Jacksonville has not been cancelled. In fact, it received final approval from the Jacksonville City Council in October 2024 and is moving forward.
Project Status: Still Active
Final approval granted: On October 8, 2024, the Jacksonville City Council voted 17-0 to approve a redevelopment agreement and an incentive package totaling $58.79 million for the project.
Project scope:
A 25-story residential tower on the former River City Brewing Co. site
An eight-story apartment building
A nine-story parking garage
A riverfront restaurant and public space improvements
Why It Might Be Missing from the Website
Website updates: The Related Group may have temporarily removed the project from its site due to redesigns, rebranding, or internal marketing decisions.
Not indicative of cancellation: Removal from the website does not mean the project is scrapped—especially given the recent public funding approval and redevelopment agreement.
The AI is concluding that the lack of a definitive "cancel" statement means the project is not canceled. Is the AI aware of Jacksonville's history as Rendering City?
Consider local partisan politics, higher interest rates, substantially higher building costs, an economy on the downhill slide due to tariffs, government shutdown, layoffs, etc. With all that, who would want to build a big dollar high end project in Jacksonville where absorption rates for their type of urban core project may be unproven adding substantial risk?
No one seems to want to go first. Maybe Gateway (are they building condos or just apartments?) or the Four Seasons shows the way.
I would guess that Related Group are waiting to see what shakes out with Downtown's office vacancy rate, UF's campus, the MOSH site, and leasing rates of One Riverside, Rise, etc. Those aren't the same market, but probably are a good indicator for RG.
Probably too many unknown's for them at this point and they have plenty of other projects in their pipeline elsewhere and don't have to take any big risks.
From the start, it's felt like Related bought the land as a long-term investment while positioning it to the city as a shovel-ready short-term project. Let's not forget that Related has been showing renderings for the property since 2021, and has already gone through a full first cycle of extensions and project cancellation. When the city mentioned exercising it's contractual right to buy back the River City property from Related at purchase price ($10 million), Related came back with this latest set of renderings, and again appears to be stalling out the clock. Economy and tariffs clearly aren't helping anyone break ground at the moment, and I believe the city had to finish bulkhead work before Related could even hypothetically break ground, but I'm starting to lose faith in these guys as being serious about the project anytime soon.
Y'all, there's no slowdown with the Related project. In fact there could be equipment moving in by January from what I hear. And there are absolutely no hurdles coming from the city side; the incentives package got DIA and council approval last year and the... related public works projects in the area are on track.
I'll also say, as someone who was publicly somewhat critical of the initial plan, previous delays here aren't really the fault of DIA. They made deals but were kind of shooting in the dark due to lack of communication and infrastructure support from the previous mayoral administration. The current deal is certainly more realistic than a lot of the "Renderingville" proposals we've lived through in the past.
Of course, no one can predict the future, but this one's chugging ahead. And worse comes to worse, we have the diversity of other projects in various stages still moving ahead.
Quote from: Tacachale on November 10, 2025, 01:10:46 PM
Y'all, there's no slowdown with the Related project. In fact there could be equipment moving in by January from what I hear. And there are absolutely no hurdles coming from the city side; the incentives package got DIA and council approval last year and the... related public works projects in the area are on track.
I'll also say, as someone who was publicly somewhat critical of the initial plan, previous delays here aren't really the fault of DIA. They made deals but were kind of shooting in the dark due to lack of communication and infrastructure support from the previous mayoral administration. The current deal is certainly more realistic than a lot of the "Renderingville" proposals we've lived through in the past.
Of course, no one can predict the future, but this one's chugging ahead. And worse comes to worse, we have the diversity of other projects in various stages still moving ahead.
Glad to hear the positive update, Bill! I don't believe there's been any public update on the project in over a year. To be clear, wasn't faulting the DIA for the delays. If anything, the DIA package should be accelerating this guy. $40 million in cash on the table if they complete it. My only critique with the deal and plan is the restaurant getting moved to the back of the development on the river. Loved the original plan with the restaurant directly overlooking and providing energy to Friendship Park, but less worried about it if we feel good that the DIA's separate plan for the restaurant in Friendship Park is in the pipeline.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 09, 2025, 08:29:19 PM
Consider local partisan politics, higher interest rates, substantially higher building costs, an economy on the downhill slide due to tariffs, government shutdown, layoffs, etc. With all that, who would want to build a big dollar high end project in Jacksonville where absorption rates for their type of urban core project may be unproven adding substantial risk?
No one seems to want to go first. Maybe Gateway (are they building condos or just apartments?) or the Four Seasons shows the way.
Off topic but I'd be really surprised if any of Gateway's tall stuff is for sale. HOA fees on mid/high rise stuff is through the roof since Surfside (laws changed a little too extreme IMO). Jump on Zillow and peek at the condos for sale and their HOA fees.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on November 10, 2025, 02:26:20 PM
Quote from: Tacachale on November 10, 2025, 01:10:46 PM
Y'all, there's no slowdown with the Related project. In fact there could be equipment moving in by January from what I hear. And there are absolutely no hurdles coming from the city side; the incentives package got DIA and council approval last year and the... related public works projects in the area are on track.
I'll also say, as someone who was publicly somewhat critical of the initial plan, previous delays here aren't really the fault of DIA. They made deals but were kind of shooting in the dark due to lack of communication and infrastructure support from the previous mayoral administration. The current deal is certainly more realistic than a lot of the "Renderingville" proposals we've lived through in the past.
Of course, no one can predict the future, but this one's chugging ahead. And worse comes to worse, we have the diversity of other projects in various stages still moving ahead.
Glad to hear the positive update, Bill! I don't believe there's been any public update on the project in over a year. To be clear, wasn't faulting the DIA for the delays. If anything, the DIA package should be accelerating this guy. $40 million in cash on the table if they complete it. My only critique with the deal and plan is the restaurant getting moved to the back of the development on the river. Loved the original plan with the restaurant directly overlooking and providing energy to Friendship Park, but less worried about it if we feel good that the DIA's separate plan for the restaurant in Friendship Park is in the pipeline.
Yeah Bill, thanks for the positive, upbeat and encouraging news; we don't need no more "pie in the skies" that come crashing down. We do need to "press on" with the developments that are now coming to fruition and giving us momentum downtown that we haven't seen in ages!
Quote from: Steve on November 10, 2025, 07:27:13 PM
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 09, 2025, 08:29:19 PM
Consider local partisan politics, higher interest rates, substantially higher building costs, an economy on the downhill slide due to tariffs, government shutdown, layoffs, etc. With all that, who would want to build a big dollar high end project in Jacksonville where absorption rates for their type of urban core project may be unproven adding substantial risk?
No one seems to want to go first. Maybe Gateway (are they building condos or just apartments?) or the Four Seasons shows the way.
Off topic but I'd be really surprised if any of Gateway's tall stuff is for sale. HOA fees on mid/high rise stuff is through the roof since Surfside (laws changed a little too extreme IMO). Jump on Zillow and peek at the condos for sale and their HOA fees.
Correct, the only project Gateway has publicly stated will be condos is their Riverfront Plaza project. Pearl Square is all for rent (both traditional apartments and short-term rentals)
Quote from: Tacachale on November 10, 2025, 01:10:46 PM
Y'all, there's no slowdown with the Related project. In fact there could be equipment moving in by January from what I hear. And there are absolutely no hurdles coming from the city side; the incentives package got DIA and council approval last year and the... related public works projects in the area are on track.
I'll also say, as someone who was publicly somewhat critical of the initial plan, previous delays here aren't really the fault of DIA. They made deals but were kind of shooting in the dark due to lack of communication and infrastructure support from the previous mayoral administration. The current deal is certainly more realistic than a lot of the "Renderingville" proposals we've lived through in the past.
Of course, no one can predict the future, but this one's chugging ahead. And worse comes to worse, we have the diversity of other projects in various stages still moving ahead.
I hope so...fingers crossed... doesn't feel too promising though... as someone said earlier, it's been over a year since the public has gotten any updates on the project. And I'm typically more bullish on downtown development projects...I do hope if it continues to move forward that the restaurant faces the river.... We shall see...
Drove by Gateway today after picking my work up from Moca. They are actively breaking ground on N8. Trucks on site.
That's a big deal-N8 is the 22 story building, across the street from N4 which is coming out of the ground, and N5 which is the parking garage they're adding retail to the bottom of.
Really well done cluster there. Dude, it's happening.
Garage looks like it is about to start with fencing. Can't see the Publix not happening with the name. Also, looked like site work happening at Beaver and Davis. Not sure if it is anyrhing.
I am guessing Gateway realizes that, to be successful, they need to create their own self--contained ecosystem and it needs to all come together at once. They certainly are not going to get much of a boost from the rest of Downtown's poorly managed ecosystem on all levels.
Depending on the rest of Downtown to keep pace is a death knell as it has been for most every other proposed or actual project over the last few decades. Thank you, lousy City leadership, visioning, planning, consistency, creativity, transit and infrastructure investment and execution.
Great optimism Ritz Carlton residence or St. Regis. I hope it comes true but looks a little more modern. And according to this report, yes the Related Group project is still on track per the vid above the article.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/education/2025/11/12/when-duval-school-board-leaves-downtown-heres-whats-taking-its-place/87152607007/ (https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/education/2025/11/12/when-duval-school-board-leaves-downtown-heres-whats-taking-its-place/87152607007/)
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on November 12, 2025, 03:06:42 PM
And according to this report, yes the Related Group project is still on track per the vid above the article.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/education/2025/11/12/when-duval-school-board-leaves-downtown-heres-whats-taking-its-place/87152607007/ (https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/education/2025/11/12/when-duval-school-board-leaves-downtown-heres-whats-taking-its-place/87152607007/)
I couldn't find a date for the video you refer to. Is it recent or from quite awhile back? If the latter, it won't be all that meaningful today.
Quote from: jcjohnpaint on November 11, 2025, 12:25:38 PM
Drove by Gateway today after picking my work up from Moca. They are actively breaking ground on N8. Trucks on site.
Last week I noticed the same thing; trucks in and out and other machinery smoothing out N8. However, I don't think that they have as of yet officially broke ground. Maybe what we saw was some type of preliminary site preparation.