https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2024/jul/15/berkman-ii-property-sold-at-auction-to-third-party-bidder/
So what are they, or he going to do with the Berkmann II property? Sit on it? Do nothing with it? Keep it undeveloped in hopes that someone buys it, making them rich?
Sit on it until the jail moves. Wait for everything to happen around it. Then re-appraise the land and roll that into your stack. It could realistically be worth $15M+ in 5-10 years. All depends on a lot of if's though. Waiting for a higher-end market to materialize is the goal here.
Quote from: Jax_Developer on July 16, 2024, 07:57:44 AM
Sit on it until the jail moves. Wait for everything to happen around it. Then re-appraise the land and roll that into your stack. It could realistically be worth $15M+ in 5-10 years. All depends on a lot of if's though. Waiting for a higher-end market to materialize is the goal here.
Aerosmith, 1972 song I believe called, "DREAM ON" (dream until your dreams comes true and through). With Jax, that might be never. I'll be dead, and most of you will be old and rickety in 10 to 15 years.
Yup they will either look smart or we will see this for sale again sometime in the next 5 years. There's a lot of headaches with these properties downtown, so you need someone that really knows what they are doing for permits/designs etc. They are going for a homer.
It looks to me like the purchase price was based on their unpaid lien on the property and was not strictly related to its market value. I don't think there were any other bidders. They basically paid themselves if no one else was willing to bid more. They obviously believe the land is worth at least this much on a bad day. Not much downside for them given their history with it to-date.
The biggest risk to this property would appear to be resiliency/flooding. Anything going on it will need to be elevated at some cost. Wouldn't be so bad if the City added it to our downtown green spaces along the river ;D.
Quote from: Jax_Developer on July 16, 2024, 09:42:45 AM
Yup they will either look smart or we will see this for sale again sometime in the next 5 years. There's a lot of headaches with these properties downtown, so you need someone that really knows what they are doing for permits/designs etc. They are going for a homer.
Not at all, no.
Choate was the GC when the original Berkman II garage collapsed 17 years ago. The property was tied up in various lawsuits over about a 12-year period. Choate is simply protecting the judgement they won from David Berkman so they can recoup all of their unpaid costs all these years later. How they escaped their OSHA fines or wrongful death liability is puzzling, but the legal system worked in their favor.
If you honestly think that the Sheriff's Office is coming off the existing jail site or police HQ site when either move, then you are sadly mistaken. JSO does not dispose of properties, nor do they give up any assets or accept lower budgets, insert ____ else here. The FDLE property a few blocks away is a great example of that. JSO moved out, and it still sits empty and decrepit. This city has very perverse incentives when it comes to publicly-owned properties- particularly downtown.
Unfortunately, Berkman II has had nothing but a sad corral of shysters circling the site even before the first doomed concrete columns were poured... recently including but not limited to the still-very-strange Stewart Family/Brian Hughes connection and perennial loser Park Beeler (who couldn't even drive his own car to his press conferences) that was bailed out by emergency demo orders signed by the former Mayor's office after he came up with some rinky-dink partial demo scheme to save money that he never had to begin with.
No actually, I don't think the jail will move, nor do I think they will sell off their assets. Just like the city placing a blanket 'easements' across 40+ acres of the Sports District, we aren't capable of addressing the real detriments to DT infill. There's still discourse on if the jail even has negative externalities & there's zero discourse around the parking item (lol).
The fact remains that, they didn't need to purchase this property at auction, nor were they forced. I'm sure there would have been someone there at a sales price with a $3 at the front. 215 N Market (a worse parcel) is likely under contract at near or for more than that amount. They wouldn't be made whole, but they wouldn't be sinking more time & $$ if they didn't have a plan with it beyond what has previously happened. They probably have more than $250k worth of reports/plans alone for that parcel.
Jaxlongtimer is right though. There won't be a high-rise market here for quite some time, which is this parcel's only private market end-use.
Quote from: Jax_Developer on July 16, 2024, 03:56:24 PM
The fact remains that, they didn't need to purchase this property at auction, nor were they forced. I'm sure there would have been someone there at a sales price with a $3 at the front. 215 N Market (a worse parcel) is likely under contract at near or for more than that amount. They wouldn't be made whole, but they wouldn't be sinking more time & $$ if they didn't have a plan with it beyond what has previously happened. They probably have more than $250k worth of reports/plans alone for that parcel.
That's not how the process works. Choate was the original GC on the Berkman site. They already held a $5.1MM lien on the property. They didn't pay $5MM cash last week, the property reverted back to them.
215 N Market is not under contract. It already went through an auction process in the 1st quarter of this year with no bidders.
Quote from: fieldafm on July 17, 2024, 07:14:49 PM
Quote from: Jax_Developer on July 16, 2024, 03:56:24 PM
The fact remains that, they didn't need to purchase this property at auction, nor were they forced. I'm sure there would have been someone there at a sales price with a $3 at the front. 215 N Market (a worse parcel) is likely under contract at near or for more than that amount. They wouldn't be made whole, but they wouldn't be sinking more time & $$ if they didn't have a plan with it beyond what has previously happened. They probably have more than $250k worth of reports/plans alone for that parcel.
That's not how the process works. Choate was the original GC on the Berkman site. They already held a $5.1MM lien on the property. They didn't pay $5MM cash last week, the property reverted back to them.
215 N Market is not under contract. It already went through an auction process in the 1st quarter of this year with no bidders.
Well, goto the actual foreclosure page. It states it was sold to a third party bidder. If you were correct, it would say "Sold to Plantiff" instead. They placed a bid above their stated amount. You're not proving anything. The fact remains they placed a bid for the property, because they have a 'plan.' The idea that they placed a bid without a plan is an ignorant opinion.
215 N Market? Also once again, incorrect.
https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/215-N-Market-St-Jacksonville-FL/30168842/
As the Berman turns... 8). What could be next for this property? Maybe the tower planned for the Landing site could go here instead.
Quotehttps://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/jul/28/berkman-ii-property-on-downtown-northbank-sold-for-73-million/
Berkman II property on Downtown Northbank sold for $7.3 million
The deal ends decades of involvement in the failed condo project by Choate Construction Co.
The Berkman II property on the Downtown Northbank at 500 E. Bay St. has a new owner.
The 2.02-acre site along the St. Johns River is west of the USS Orleck Naval Museum and across Bay Street street from the Duval County Jail.
Atlanta-based Choate Construction Co. sold the property July 18 to Curtis D. Hodgson of Addison, Texas, for $7.3 million.
Hodgson is the founder and director of Legacy Housing Corp. in Bedford, Texas. Legacy says it builds, sells and finances manufactured homes and "tiny houses."
Also on July 18, Hodgson entered into an exclusive option agreement for the property with Florida Innovation Capital 500 E Bay Street Parent LLC of Jacksonville.
Florida Innovation Capital is managed by Jacksonville developer Michael Munz and was created in April. On his LinkedIn page, Munz says he is the founding partner and CEO. He says it is a " venture capital fund focused primarily on startups in the state of Florida."
Hodgson said he provided financing for the sale personally, not through Legacy, and was not involved in any development plans for the property.
"I'm just the money man," he said. "I'm holding it until they get their ducks in a row."
Munz and Peter Rummell worked for years to develop what is now called RiversEdge: Life on the St. Johns on the Downtown Southbank. Preston Hollow took control of that project in 2020. Munz also was an executive at the Dalton public relations firm.
Munz, contacted by text message July 28, said he was traveling and asked to be reached another time.
The sale ends decades of involvement in the Berkman II by Choate.
The Berkman II was a condominium development where construction was halted in December 2007 after the parking garage for the building collapsed, killing one worker and injuring others.
It left a ruin along the riverfront that stood for decades.
After years of litigation, Choate, one of the building's contractors, acquired it in a foreclosure auction and secured the property for $100 in April 2014.
Failed development efforts led to Choate acquire the property in another foreclosure auction in July 2024 for $5.13 million.
The city condemned and demolished the Berkman II in 2022. Its lot remains empty.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy6tmVv_vdo&pp=ygVbRm91ciBTZWFzb25zLCBSaXZlcmZyb250IFBsYXphIGFuZCBNZXRybyBQYXJrOiBUaGUga2V5IGNvbnN0cnVjdGlvbiBwcm9qZWN0cyBtYWtpbmcgaGVhZHdheQ%3D%3D (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy6tmVv_vdo&pp=ygVbRm91ciBTZWFzb25zLCBSaXZlcmZyb250IFBsYXphIGFuZCBNZXRybyBQYXJrOiBUaGUga2V5IGNvbnN0cnVjdGlvbiBwcm9qZWN0cyBtYWtpbmcgaGVhZHdheQ%3D%3D)
Interesting vid. But in it, Mike talks about some of the projects that are underway, legal hurdles with LSTrio, as well as future projects. It's hard to tell, but seems as though Berkman II will potentially be a hotel. Not definite by any means. Also not definite is the closing statements - he did hint at wanting to host another Super Bowl(2032?) ???. Probably a long shot until the core has been built out a bit more and has more entertainment. Hotel count has to rise also. With the minimum 30% stadium of cap hotel rooms needed. We are right on the line. But I'll save that for another thread.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on July 29, 2025, 12:14:46 AM
As the Berman turns... 8). What could be next for this property? Maybe the tower planned for the Landing site could go here instead.
Quotehttps://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2025/jul/28/berkman-ii-property-on-downtown-northbank-sold-for-73-million/
Berkman II property on Downtown Northbank sold for $7.3 million
The deal ends decades of involvement in the failed condo project by Choate Construction Co.
The Berkman II property on the Downtown Northbank at 500 E. Bay St. has a new owner.
The 2.02-acre site along the St. Johns River is west of the USS Orleck Naval Museum and across Bay Street street from the Duval County Jail.
Atlanta-based Choate Construction Co. sold the property July 18 to Curtis D. Hodgson of Addison, Texas, for $7.3 million.
Hodgson is the founder and director of Legacy Housing Corp. in Bedford, Texas. Legacy says it builds, sells and finances manufactured homes and "tiny houses."
Also on July 18, Hodgson entered into an exclusive option agreement for the property with Florida Innovation Capital 500 E Bay Street Parent LLC of Jacksonville.
Florida Innovation Capital is managed by Jacksonville developer Michael Munz and was created in April. On his LinkedIn page, Munz says he is the founding partner and CEO. He says it is a " venture capital fund focused primarily on startups in the state of Florida."
Hodgson said he provided financing for the sale personally, not through Legacy, and was not involved in any development plans for the property.
"I'm just the money man," he said. "I'm holding it until they get their ducks in a row."
Munz and Peter Rummell worked for years to develop what is now called RiversEdge: Life on the St. Johns on the Downtown Southbank. Preston Hollow took control of that project in 2020. Munz also was an executive at the Dalton public relations firm.
Munz, contacted by text message July 28, said he was traveling and asked to be reached another time.
The sale ends decades of involvement in the Berkman II by Choate.
The Berkman II was a condominium development where construction was halted in December 2007 after the parking garage for the building collapsed, killing one worker and injuring others.
It left a ruin along the riverfront that stood for decades.
After years of litigation, Choate, one of the building's contractors, acquired it in a foreclosure auction and secured the property for $100 in April 2014.
Failed development efforts led to Choate acquire the property in another foreclosure auction in July 2024 for $5.13 million.
The city condemned and demolished the Berkman II in 2022. Its lot remains empty.
Turns out, they had a plan! $2M in a year is pretty good.
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on July 29, 2025, 12:51:22 AM
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy6tmVv_vdo&pp=ygVbRm91ciBTZWFzb25zLCBSaXZlcmZyb250IFBsYXphIGFuZCBNZXRybyBQYXJrOiBUaGUga2V5IGNvbnN0cnVjdGlvbiBwcm9qZWN0cyBtYWtpbmcgaGVhZHdheQ%3D%3D (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Fy6tmVv_vdo&pp=ygVbRm91ciBTZWFzb25zLCBSaXZlcmZyb250IFBsYXphIGFuZCBNZXRybyBQYXJrOiBUaGUga2V5IGNvbnN0cnVjdGlvbiBwcm9qZWN0cyBtYWtpbmcgaGVhZHdheQ%3D%3D)
Interesting vid. But in it, Mike talks about some of the projects that are underway, legal hurdles with LSTrio, as well as future projects. It's hard to tell, but seems as though Berkman II will potentially be a hotel. Not definite by any means. Also not definite is the closing statements - he did hint at wanting to host another Super Bowl(2032?) ???. Probably a long shot until the core has been built out a bit more and has more entertainment. Hotel count has to rise also. With the minimum 30% stadium of cap hotel rooms needed. We are right on the line. But I'll save that for another thread.
I would suggest a riverfront hotel that caters to future UF guests (maybe UF hosts lots of conferences/symposiums here?) topped by condos with retail/restaurants on the ground floor/facing a riverwalk which might be a best-of-all-worlds model. Multi-use to hedge one's bets. Does this property also have marina rights with the existing Berkman or to add later?
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on July 29, 2025, 12:51:22 AMIt's hard to tell, but seems as though Berkman II will potentially be a hotel. Not definite by any means. Also not definite is the closing statements - he did hint at wanting to host another Super Bowl(2032?) ???. Probably a long shot until the core has been built out a bit more and has more entertainment. Hotel count has to rise also. With the minimum 30% stadium of cap hotel rooms needed. We are right on the line. But I'll save that for another thread.
Not at liberty to go into specifics, but what's rumored, assuming it comes to fruition, would be very different, but equally as much of a "get" as the Four Seasons.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on July 29, 2025, 12:26:01 PM
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on July 29, 2025, 12:51:22 AMIt's hard to tell, but seems as though Berkman II will potentially be a hotel. Not definite by any means. Also not definite is the closing statements - he did hint at wanting to host another Super Bowl(2032?) ???. Probably a long shot until the core has been built out a bit more and has more entertainment. Hotel count has to rise also. With the minimum 30% stadium of cap hotel rooms needed. We are right on the line. But I'll save that for another thread.
Not at liberty to go into specifics, but what's rumored, assuming it comes to fruition, would be very different, but equally as much of a "get" as the Four Seasons.
Fuddruckers?
Quote from: Joey Mackey on July 29, 2025, 02:50:20 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on July 29, 2025, 12:26:01 PM
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on July 29, 2025, 12:51:22 AMIt's hard to tell, but seems as though Berkman II will potentially be a hotel. Not definite by any means. Also not definite is the closing statements - he did hint at wanting to host another Super Bowl(2032?) ???. Probably a long shot until the core has been built out a bit more and has more entertainment. Hotel count has to rise also. With the minimum 30% stadium of cap hotel rooms needed. We are right on the line. But I'll save that for another thread.
Not at liberty to go into specifics, but what's rumored, assuming it comes to fruition, would be very different, but equally as much of a "get" as the Four Seasons.
Fuddruckers?
With a rooftop CVS.
Lol Fuddruckers would be cool. @Ken, so waldorf astoria is ok with building across from the jail?
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on July 29, 2025, 03:51:44 PM
Lol Fuddruckers would be cool. @Ken, so waldorf astoria is ok with building across from the jail?
Tiffany & Co. has agreed to serve as a buffer between the Waldorf Astoria & the jail.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on July 29, 2025, 12:26:01 PM
Quote from: MakeDTjaxGre@tAgain on July 29, 2025, 12:51:22 AMIt's hard to tell, but seems as though Berkman II will potentially be a hotel. Not definite by any means. Also not definite is the closing statements - he did hint at wanting to host another Super Bowl(2032?) ???. Probably a long shot until the core has been built out a bit more and has more entertainment. Hotel count has to rise also. With the minimum 30% stadium of cap hotel rooms needed. We are right on the line. But I'll save that for another thread.
Not at liberty to go into specifics, but what's rumored, assuming it comes to fruition, would be very different, but equally as much of a "get" as the Four Seasons.
What would equal the "get" of the Four Seasons is... Four Seasons #2! Shad is making so much $$$ on the first one, thanks to the City's largesse, that, why not do it again down the street 8). Downtown Jax will have a total of 8 seasons, catching up to Seasons 52 at Town Center.
https://seminole.hardrock.com/
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on July 29, 2025, 07:19:32 PM
Shad is making so much $$$ on the first one, thanks to the City's largesse, that, why not do it again down the street 8).
Oh boy. The facebook commenters have invaded the Jaxson. Violent crime in downtown comments incoming...
From the article:
QuoteAtlanta-based Choate Construction Co. sold the property July 18 to Curtis D. Hodgson of Addison, Texas, for $7.3 million.
Hodgson is the founder and director of Legacy Housing Corp. in Bedford, Texas. Legacy says it builds, sells and finances manufactured homes and "tiny houses."
Also on July 18, Hodgson entered into an exclusive option agreement for the property with Florida Innovation Capital 500 E Bay Street Parent LLC of Jacksonville.
Florida Innovation Capital is managed by Jacksonville developer Michael Munz and was created in April. On his LinkedIn page, Munz says he is the founding partner and CEO. He says it is a " venture capital fund focused primarily on startups in the state of Florida."
Hodgson said he provided financing for the sale personally, not through Legacy, and was not involved in any development plans for the property.
"I'm just the money man," he said. "I'm holding it until they get their ducks in a row."
Quote from: Captain Zissou on July 30, 2025, 10:12:30 AM
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on July 29, 2025, 07:19:32 PM
Shad is making so much $$$ on the first one, thanks to the City's largesse, that, why not do it again down the street 8).
Oh boy. The facebook commenters have invaded the Jaxson. Violent crime in downtown comments incoming...
Happy to make your day . Don't know about those FB comments... maybe you share a few to make my day :).
Quote from: thelakelander on July 30, 2025, 11:27:56 AM
From the article:
QuoteAtlanta-based Choate Construction Co. sold the property July 18 to Curtis D. Hodgson of Addison, Texas, for $7.3 million.
Hodgson is the founder and director of Legacy Housing Corp. in Bedford, Texas. Legacy says it builds, sells and finances manufactured homes and "tiny houses."
Also on July 18, Hodgson entered into an exclusive option agreement for the property with Florida Innovation Capital 500 E Bay Street Parent LLC of Jacksonville.
Florida Innovation Capital is managed by Jacksonville developer Michael Munz and was created in April. On his LinkedIn page, Munz says he is the founding partner and CEO. He says it is a " venture capital fund focused primarily on startups in the state of Florida."
Hodgson said he provided financing for the sale personally, not through Legacy, and was not involved in any development plans for the property.
"I'm just the money man," he said. "I'm holding it until they get their ducks in a row."
Hodgson said he provided financing for the sale personally, not through Legacy, and was not involved in any development plans for the property.
"I'm just the money man," he said. "I'm holding it until they get their ducks in a row."
Hodgson is the founder and director of Legacy Housing Corp. in Bedford, Texas. Legacy says it builds, sells and finances manufactured homes and "tiny houses."
Doesn't sound like they do highrises or major projects. Is he holding it for legacy to get their ducks in a row or choate who he holding it for
So he's holding it hostage for another 20 years to keep it vacant and hope it appreciates more than the taxes he'll owe. Got it.
Very (Jacksonville) ;)
Quote from: fsu813 on July 29, 2025, 08:09:12 PM
https://seminole.hardrock.com/
Nice call!
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/local/2025/07/31/hard-rock-hotel-downtown-jacksonville-talks/85423450007/
Quote from: jaxjaguar on July 30, 2025, 02:14:05 PM
So he's holding it hostage for another 20 years to keep it vacant and hope it appreciates more than the taxes he'll owe. Got it.
He's holding it for Michael Munz to get a group of investors together and line up financing. Based on his previous endeavors at Healthy Town/The District/Rivers Edge, that could take a while. Four Seasons will do a lot to prove out higher ADRs and high residential price per square foot for branded residences. Gateway and Related provide further support at lower tier brands or unbranded (assuming Related switches to condos). At that point, this will clear a path for investors and financing on this project. I don't expect a quick timeline for this to go vertical.
Quote from: Joey Mackey on July 31, 2025, 09:32:18 AM
Quote from: fsu813 on July 29, 2025, 08:09:12 PM
https://seminole.hardrock.com/
Nice call!
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/local/2025/07/31/hard-rock-hotel-downtown-jacksonville-talks/85423450007/
Almost happened in 2018. Hard Rock was very bullish on the Berkman 2 site when the USS Adams and Shad Khan's initial Shipyards proposals were on the table. When those plans fizzled, so did their interest. With the Four Seasons, Shipyards West, MOSH, and Orleck all rising up, hopefully it comes across the finish line this time.
Weren't they part of one of the Ford on Bay proposals?
I was actually open to incorporating this site into Shipyards West Park, especially if an equivalent site might well eventually materialize across Bay Street once the jail thing eventually happens. But if these guys are actually ready to move quickly then maybe just leaving decent space for the Riverwalk is sufficient.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on July 31, 2025, 10:14:58 AMFour Seasons will do a lot to prove out higher ADRs and high residential price per square foot for branded residences. Gateway and Related provide further support at lower tier brands or unbranded (assuming Related switches to condos).
The Gateway hotel at Riverfront Plaza is an interesting one to me. Gateway's planning a five-star hotel (JW Marriott seems like the most likely fit). Hard Rock would obviously serve a different type of traveler, but wondering if a market exists for two five-star(ish) hotels along the river with the Four Seasons right down Bay Street.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/local/2025/07/31/hard-rock-hotel-downtown-jacksonville-talks/85423450007/ (https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/local/2025/07/31/hard-rock-hotel-downtown-jacksonville-talks/85423450007/)
Quote from: Ken_FSU on July 31, 2025, 11:11:51 AM
Quote from: Joey Mackey on July 31, 2025, 09:32:18 AM
Quote from: fsu813 on July 29, 2025, 08:09:12 PM
https://seminole.hardrock.com/
Nice call!
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/local/2025/07/31/hard-rock-hotel-downtown-jacksonville-talks/85423450007/
Almost happened in 2018. Hard Rock was very bullish on the Berkman 2 site when the USS Adams and Shad Khan's initial Shipyards proposals were on the table. When those plans fizzled, so did their interest. With the Four Seasons, Shipyards West, MOSH, and Orleck all rising up, hopefully it comes across the finish line this time.
Looks like it might be actually.
What I get out of the article is no one knows for sure yet but they're trying to get a developer. It appears they are, and were working it. Hopefully, maybe, might, "fingers crossed;" y'all know how that goes. I for one hope it happens.
Hard Rock?
One near Miami looks like a big guitar. What could the Jacksonville Hard Rock look like?
- Drum?
- Keyboard?
- Tambourine? (ooh, could be a big ferris wheel)
- Guitar Pick?
Quote from: Charles Hunter on July 31, 2025, 06:44:42 PM
Hard Rock?
One near Miami looks like a big guitar. What could the Jacksonville Hard Rock look like?
- Drum?
- Keyboard?
- Tambourine? (ooh, could be a big ferris wheel)
- Guitar Pick?
I played around with AI a bit. This came up.
(https://i.postimg.cc/5tTgbV3P/Unknown-4.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/50z3tRKf/Unknown-3.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/brjRS94k/Unknown-2.jpg)
(https://i.postimg.cc/pdpCwTDh/Unknown.jpg)
Pretty interesting. https://deepai.org/machine-learning-model/text2img (https://deepai.org/machine-learning-model/text2img)
^ Does AI also structurally engineer some of those concepts ;D? Today, they seem to be able to build almost anything, but at what cost? To another post on this thread, is Jax able to create enough demand presently to support everyone's wishes?
Does Hard Rock bring a casino with every hotel? If not, other than riding back and forth on the world breaking U2C amusement ride, what will attract all these people to Downtown? Do we have enough shows, bars, dance spots, tourist attractions, etc. now or on the drawing board to entertain the crowds? For the foreseeable future, it would appear we need sightseers. Our older and smallish convention center isn't going to draw much and, with the Downtown office vacancy rate, business travelers are not likely going to be much either.
Keep in mind, the (built for Super Bowl) Adams Mark/Hyatt went bankrupt twice, at last count, before finding away to stay afloat. Other Downtown area hotels have revolved through a long list of brands/flags indicating some instability in the market.
Quote from: Charles Hunter on July 31, 2025, 06:44:42 PM
Hard Rock?
One near Miami looks like a big guitar. What could the Jacksonville Hard Rock look like?
- Drum?
- Keyboard?
- Tambourine? (ooh, could be a big ferris wheel)
- Guitar Pick?
Cowbell or bust.
Quote from: jaxoNOLE on July 31, 2025, 08:36:24 PM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on July 31, 2025, 06:44:42 PM
Hard Rock?
One near Miami looks like a big guitar. What could the Jacksonville Hard Rock look like?
- Drum?
- Keyboard?
- Tambourine? (ooh, could be a big ferris wheel)
- Guitar Pick?
Cowbell or bust.
Hmmm ... a boob shaped hotel ...
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on July 31, 2025, 07:59:23 PM
Does Hard Rock bring a casino with every hotel?
No, and definitely no casino here, fortunately or unfortunately, depending on which side of the gambling debate you fall on. Wouldn't be legal in Jax, as we saw when the Jags and the Curry squad were quietly kicking the tires on something at the Fairgrounds. Seminoles are only allowed to operate casinos in designated tribal lands, far south of Jax.
(https://images.500nations.com/img/maps/mapFlorida2018.png)
Quote from: Charles Hunter on July 31, 2025, 06:44:42 PM
Hard Rock?
One near Miami looks like a big guitar. What could the Jacksonville Hard Rock look like?
- Drum?
- Keyboard?
- Tambourine? (ooh, could be a big ferris wheel)
- Guitar Pick?
The Miami hotel is almost 650 rooms. I think a more realistic scenario for Jacksonville, particularly given the footprint, would be 150-200 rooms, possibly under the Reverb Brand, like the 195-room Hard Rock Reverb in Atlanta:
(https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/m23ccLxUAsmPR36HMcWg_Yxh0dg=/0x0:1200x520/1200x800/filters:focal(406x152:598x344)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/60953387/Reverb.0.jpg)
Can't imagine it would be the full Hard Rock experience, but I think it'd be a big win if it included the classic Hard Rock Hotel pool & bar setup along the river and/or a Live Music venue & Restaurant.
Here's what the previous Berkman 2 Hard Rock render looked like, when it had a larger footprint that included a portion of the Shipyards:
(https://i.postimg.cc/cCzjZrrN/IMG-9699.png)
And here's what the Hard Rock Reverb looked like that was part of Southeast's failed bid for Ford on Bay.
(https://i.postimg.cc/8CsZk1gp/Screen-Shot-2025-08-01-at-12-04-52-AM.png)
Quote from: Ken_FSU on August 01, 2025, 12:13:01 AM
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on July 31, 2025, 07:59:23 PM
Does Hard Rock bring a casino with every hotel?
No, and definitely no casino here, fortunately or unfortunately, depending on which side of the gambling debate you fall on. Wouldn't be legal in Jax, as we saw when the Jags and the Curry squad were quietly kicking the tires on something at the Fairgrounds. Seminoles are only allowed to operate casinos in designated tribal lands, far south of Jax.
(https://images.500nations.com/img/maps/mapFlorida2018.png)
Quote from: Charles Hunter on July 31, 2025, 06:44:42 PM
Hard Rock?
One near Miami looks like a big guitar. What could the Jacksonville Hard Rock look like?
- Drum?
- Keyboard?
- Tambourine? (ooh, could be a big ferris wheel)
- Guitar Pick?
The Miami hotel is almost 650 rooms. I think a more realistic scenario for Jacksonville, particularly given the footprint, would be 150-200 rooms, possibly under the Reverb Brand, like the 195-room Hard Rock Reverb in Atlanta:
(https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/m23ccLxUAsmPR36HMcWg_Yxh0dg=/0x0:1200x520/1200x800/filters:focal(406x152:598x344)/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/60953387/Reverb.0.jpg)
Can't imagine it would be the full Hard Rock experience, but I think it'd be a big win if it included the classic Hard Rock Hotel pool & bar setup along the river and/or a Live Music venue & Restaurant.
Here's what the previous Berkman 2 Hard Rock render looked like, when it had a larger footprint that included a portion of the Shipyards:
(https://i.postimg.cc/cCzjZrrN/IMG-9699.png)
And here's what the Hard Rock Reverb looked like that was part of Southeast's failed bid for Ford on Bay.
(https://i.postimg.cc/8CsZk1gp/Screen-Shot-2025-08-01-at-12-04-52-AM.png)
To clarify, the Seminole could theoretically buy property if they wanted. That's where the Tampa casino came from — they purchased the land after a cemetery was discovered there back in the 80s. However, that's not what this deal is exploring. It would be a licensed hotel, not a casino.