Just in the last five days:
3-year-old among 3 dead after 4 people shot on Southside
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/09/24/3-year-old-among-three-dead-after-4-people-shot-on-southside-jso/ (https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/09/24/3-year-old-among-three-dead-after-4-people-shot-on-southside-jso/)
One dead after shooting near Jacksonville Beach Pier
https://www.firstcoastnews.com/article/news/crime/one-dead-after-shooting-near-jacksonville-beach-pier/77-5cedf321-7d33-4973-846e-f9ab91741991 (https://www.firstcoastnews.com/article/news/crime/one-dead-after-shooting-near-jacksonville-beach-pier/77-5cedf321-7d33-4973-846e-f9ab91741991)
6 people hurt in Moncrief shooting
https://www.firstcoastnews.com/article/news/local/6-people-hurt-in-moncrief-shooting/77-bb395e81-12cd-49ce-962c-80f4e8806c7c (https://www.firstcoastnews.com/article/news/local/6-people-hurt-in-moncrief-shooting/77-bb395e81-12cd-49ce-962c-80f4e8806c7c)
6-year-old killed in triple shooting that also injures adult, 12-year-old
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/09/27/absolutely-heartbreaking-6-year-old-killed-in-triple-shooting-that-also-injures-adult-12-year-old/ (https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/09/27/absolutely-heartbreaking-6-year-old-killed-in-triple-shooting-that-also-injures-adult-12-year-old/)
While not discounting all of the socioeconomic elements of crime, it's almost, ALMOST like we should make it a little more difficult to obtain deadly weapons in this country.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 10:45:53 AM
While not discounting all of the socioeconomic elements of crime, it's almost, ALMOST like we should make it a little more difficult to obtain deadly weapons in this country.
You assume these weapons were obtained legally by persons legally able to purchase them?
Quote from: BridgeTroll on September 27, 2023, 12:28:23 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 10:45:53 AM
While not discounting all of the socioeconomic elements of crime, it's almost, ALMOST like we should make it a little more difficult to obtain deadly weapons in this country.
You assume these weapons were obtained legally by persons legally able to purchase them?
Statistically, probably not. I think it's something like less than 15% of gun violence is committed by the legal owners of said firearms. But it's also far too easy to get your hands on weapons illegally in this country. Answer to me is less about repealing the 2nd amendment, and more about fully vetting legal buyers and penalizing the shit out of illegal gun ownership, irresponsible gun ownership and illicit weapon sales. Can't ban alcohol to help stop DUIs, but you can make the consequences of driving under the influence (or selling to minors, for example) so prohibitive that it deters people from doing it.
13 people shot by bullets in Jacksonville in one week certainly points to a problem. No shortage of different, valid ways to help combat it.
3D printing will continue to change the landscape. Can basically print anything minus the actual receivers. Not sure if you have heard of switches, but they are the most popular byproduct of this. A lot easier to smuggle a simple piece than the entire gun. Going to make any form of gun control that much more difficult as materials get better for the actual "gun" component.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 01:18:52 PM
Quote from: BridgeTroll on September 27, 2023, 12:28:23 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 10:45:53 AM
While not discounting all of the socioeconomic elements of crime, it's almost, ALMOST like we should make it a little more difficult to obtain deadly weapons in this country.
You assume these weapons were obtained legally by persons legally able to purchase them?
Statistically, probably not. I think it's something like less than 15% of gun violence is committed by the legal owners of said firearms. But it's also far too easy to get your hands on weapons illegally in this country. Answer to me is less about repealing the 2nd amendment, and more about fully vetting legal buyers and penalizing the shit out of illegal gun ownership, irresponsible gun ownership and illicit weapon sales. Can't ban alcohol to help stop DUIs, but you can make the consequences of driving under the influence (or selling to minors, for example) so prohibitive that it deters people from doing it.
13 people shot by bullets in Jacksonville in one week certainly points to a problem. No shortage of different, valid ways to help combat it.
I mean, the fact that the US is the only "developed" country with this issue should be enough evidence that guns are the problem, but I guess that would make too much sense.
Just another example of American exceptionalism ruining the country.
Quote from: iMarvin on September 27, 2023, 02:49:25 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 01:18:52 PM
Quote from: BridgeTroll on September 27, 2023, 12:28:23 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 10:45:53 AM
While not discounting all of the socioeconomic elements of crime, it's almost, ALMOST like we should make it a little more difficult to obtain deadly weapons in this country.
You assume these weapons were obtained legally by persons legally able to purchase them?
Statistically, probably not. I think it's something like less than 15% of gun violence is committed by the legal owners of said firearms. But it's also far too easy to get your hands on weapons illegally in this country. Answer to me is less about repealing the 2nd amendment, and more about fully vetting legal buyers and penalizing the shit out of illegal gun ownership, irresponsible gun ownership and illicit weapon sales. Can't ban alcohol to help stop DUIs, but you can make the consequences of driving under the influence (or selling to minors, for example) so prohibitive that it deters people from doing it.
13 people shot by bullets in Jacksonville in one week certainly points to a problem. No shortage of different, valid ways to help combat it.
I mean, the fact that the US is the only "developed" country with this issue should be enough evidence that guns are the problem, but I guess that would make too much sense.
Just another example of American exceptionalism ruining the country.
I both agree and disagree. I think the problem is the current climate. Everyone's angry. Mental illness is everywhere. More people than ever are chemically medicated. Income inequality has never been worse. The educational system is poor, and tailored to the elite. Politics have infiltrated everything. Social media has added a never before seen level of toxicity to the culture. Mainstream, fairly straight news has been replaced by increasingly fragmented echo chambers. Society is somehow becoming more racist. Instagram, and runaway rent inflation, and endless porn has made everyone insecure. And JTA is building a network of clown cars.
Guns are just metal and plastic.
Toss the 400 million guns on our streets into a powder keg like modern American society, though, and bad shit is gonna needlessly happen.
Kerosene on a fire.
I don't think they're inherently
the singular problem, but I also think it's disingenuous to say having a gun at every street corner doesn't make things a hundred times worse.
Wouldn't shed a tear personally to see guns banned entirely, but can also respect responsible gun owners acting under their Constitutional right to possess a weapon.
I don't believe there's much debate among the American people --forget the twittersphere and talk shows -- that universal background checks, better mental health resources, and actual enforcement of existing "lie and try" and straw purchase laws should be implemented.
I'd like to see these happen before more extensive measures are considered. It's horrible policy to add new regulations when existing laws are poorly enforced. To that end, enabling better policing and prosecution of gang activity coupled with youth interventions (a la Jax Journey) would likely do far more to reduce gun deaths than assault weapons bans, red flag laws, or background checks for each individual ammo purchase. But the boring, dirty tedium of regular enforcement doesn't grab headlines, rouse the base, or make for a flashy stump speech, so we offer thoughts and prayers and carefully exploit every tragedy to fit a narrative that conveniently involves no actual action.
Another one last night.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/09/29/pregnant-woman-shot-twice-by-2-men-with-masks-on-outside-jacksonville-music-studio-jso/
Pregnant woman hanging in the parking lot of a music studio when two dudes in ski masks jumped out of a van and lit her up.
Wild.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 01:18:52 PM
Quote from: BridgeTroll on September 27, 2023, 12:28:23 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 10:45:53 AM
While not discounting all of the socioeconomic elements of crime, it's almost, ALMOST like we should make it a little more difficult to obtain deadly weapons in this country.
You assume these weapons were obtained legally by persons legally able to purchase them?
Statistically, probably not. I think it's something like less than 15% of gun violence is committed by the legal owners of said firearms. But it's also far too easy to get your hands on weapons illegally in this country. Answer to me is less about repealing the 2nd amendment, and more about fully vetting legal buyers and penalizing the shit out of illegal gun ownership, irresponsible gun ownership and illicit weapon sales. Can't ban alcohol to help stop DUIs, but you can make the consequences of driving under the influence (or selling to minors, for example) so prohibitive that it deters people from doing it.
13 people shot by bullets in Jacksonville in one week certainly points to a problem. No shortage of different, valid ways to help combat it.
I see recurring themes in all of these instances, unfortunately.
How are you going to balance the argument against mass incarceration when it results in a much higher percentage of black men in prison with your desire for greatly increased penalties for illegal gun ownership if caught? You won't be able to have both arguments work in one direction.
Here's the solution and it isn't easy or pretty, or politically correct, but I believe it's correct.
Unwritten 1. God God God...we have abandoned Him and look at the results. He has teachings in sacred scripture that are supposed to guide our lives, and so it's not just about praise and worship music on an occasional Sunday, He has the guidebook for life worth living. We've gone full blown apostasy in our western civilization though, and the inner cities are so far gone in this regard it's just hard to watch.
1. Education reform so that children are getting educated, for real for real. Right now most kids coming out of public schools, particularly inner city schools, don't know how to read, write, perform arithmetic, etc and they've all been taught some things that just aren't good for societal cohesion. Almost like no education at all would honestly be better, but we need to fix this. The teachers' unions are disastrous, and there is no longer any accountability for schools.
2. Personal accountability and a cultural change in the cities. If I were being honest with my thoughts, this would be #1. I see and bear witness to plenty of people taking personal responsibility for matters into their own hands (including their children's schooling as I know plenty who are homeschooling now and making sacrifices to do so), and anyone can do the same. Inner city culture is also just rotten to the core (just look at rap music, and now other music too, it's just so rotten). Unfortunately we can all witness some challenging parenting out in public and it's not something easy to ignore. If we never call it out, it will never get fixed, and a lot of this is due to bad culture and this paralysis about discussing it because you're deemed racist if you do. That trick doesn't work on me anymore.
One difference between say the Asian cultures and other cultures in inner cities is priorities - Asians really value their education and are willing to make lemonade out of lemon schools, whites to a lesser degree, and blacks and Hispanics to a much lesser degree. I think that's a cultural thing...it's a stupid "rule" that we can't say that. I've met Asians coming out of bad inner city schools and with language barriers who made it to top tier universities (even if they had to transfer in sophomore or junior year) purely on merit. I think with that going on, these excuses made for other groups don't work. It's a cultural thing.
3. ENFORCE THE LAWS ALREADY ON THE BOOKS and actually penalize people according to the law. There are tons of laws on the books already regulating guns, ownership, use, etc. Law-abiding gun owners are committing near 0% of the gun related crime in this country and you can look that up.
Finally, yes crime is on the rise here and there and during moments in time, but it is concentrated. There are whole swaths of Jax where you can live and work and never encounter crime or see evidence of it. It's an inner city, primarily black issue. And it's never going to be fixed until people are honest about it. My $0.02
Quote from: simms3 on September 29, 2023, 03:17:53 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 01:18:52 PM
Quote from: BridgeTroll on September 27, 2023, 12:28:23 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 27, 2023, 10:45:53 AM
While not discounting all of the socioeconomic elements of crime, it's almost, ALMOST like we should make it a little more difficult to obtain deadly weapons in this country.
You assume these weapons were obtained legally by persons legally able to purchase them?
Statistically, probably not. I think it's something like less than 15% of gun violence is committed by the legal owners of said firearms. But it's also far too easy to get your hands on weapons illegally in this country. Answer to me is less about repealing the 2nd amendment, and more about fully vetting legal buyers and penalizing the shit out of illegal gun ownership, irresponsible gun ownership and illicit weapon sales. Can't ban alcohol to help stop DUIs, but you can make the consequences of driving under the influence (or selling to minors, for example) so prohibitive that it deters people from doing it.
13 people shot by bullets in Jacksonville in one week certainly points to a problem. No shortage of different, valid ways to help combat it.
I see recurring themes in all of these instances, unfortunately.
How are you going to balance the argument against mass incarceration when it results in a much higher percentage of black men in prison with your desire for greatly increased penalties for illegal gun ownership if caught? You won't be able to have both arguments work in one direction.
Here's the solution and it isn't easy or pretty, or politically correct, but I believe it's correct.
Unwritten 1. God God God...we have abandoned Him and look at the results. He has teachings in sacred scripture that are supposed to guide our lives, and so it's not just about praise and worship music on an occasional Sunday, He has the guidebook for life worth living. We've gone full blown apostasy in our western civilization though, and the inner cities are so far gone in this regard it's just hard to watch.
1. Education reform so that children are getting educated, for real for real. Right now most kids coming out of public schools, particularly inner city schools, don't know how to read, write, perform arithmetic, etc and they've all been taught some things that just aren't good for societal cohesion. Almost like no education at all would honestly be better, but we need to fix this. The teachers' unions are disastrous, and there is no longer any accountability for schools.
2. Personal accountability and a cultural change in the cities. If I were being honest with my thoughts, this would be #1. I see and bear witness to plenty of people taking personal responsibility for matters into their own hands (including their children's schooling as I know plenty who are homeschooling now and making sacrifices to do so), and anyone can do the same. Inner city culture is also just rotten to the core (just look at rap music, and now other music too, it's just so rotten). Unfortunately we can all witness some challenging parenting out in public and it's not something easy to ignore. If we never call it out, it will never get fixed, and a lot of this is due to bad culture and this paralysis about discussing it because you're deemed racist if you do. That trick doesn't work on me anymore.
One difference between say the Asian cultures and other cultures in inner cities is priorities - Asians really value their education and are willing to make lemonade out of lemon schools, whites to a lesser degree, and blacks and Hispanics to a much lesser degree. I think that's a cultural thing...it's a stupid "rule" that we can't say that. I've met Asians coming out of bad inner city schools and with language barriers who made it to top tier universities (even if they had to transfer in sophomore or junior year) purely on merit. I think with that going on, these excuses made for other groups don't work. It's a cultural thing.
3. ENFORCE THE LAWS ALREADY ON THE BOOKS and actually penalize people according to the law. There are tons of laws on the books already regulating guns, ownership, use, etc. Law-abiding gun owners are committing near 0% of the gun related crime in this country and you can look that up.
Finally, yes crime is on the rise here and there and during moments in time, but it is concentrated. There are whole swaths of Jax where you can live and work and never encounter crime or see evidence of it. It's an inner city, primarily black issue. And it's never going to be fixed until people are honest about it. My $0.02
Will just say that, I'm barely 40 years old, and my parents grew up in an era of segregated schools. We're one, maybe two generations removed from Jim Crow and redlining. To me, calling gun violence in Jacksonville a "primarily black issue" or a "primarily inner city" issue unfairly assigns blame to things like race and geography while ignoring the root cause of why these groups/geographies are different than the "whole swaths of Jax where you can live and work and never encounter crime or see evidence of it." Culture is as much something you're born into as it an active choice.
Well, not to say segregation was a good time because obviously that's a horrific time (that's now quite removed by time), but I doubt in those times you had black students acting like this on a daily basis in the schools (or really anyone):
https://twitter.com/libbyemmons/status/1707788076817215776
Unfortunately, that was from yesterday, and pretty much every day there are videos like this that come out from around the country. It's really bad. And now we are long since integrated. Although as I mentioned, in my church community there are plenty of young families of all stripes who can't afford private school but they choose to make sacrifices to homeschool so that their kids aren't having to deal with that.
That's obviously an inner city school, but you can see an Asian (mixed?) and white student in the foreground just trying to mind their business while a bunch of black girls scream and curse and throw a metal chair at the teacher (knocking her out). Recently even here locally you had the black student that pummeled the crap out of his teacher (sending her to the ER) for confiscating his phone in class. I'm not saying it's only black students acting this way, but the vast vast majority.
There's very clearly a bad culture and a culture of violence, and yes, that permeates out into the streets. It ain't my fault as a random guy living my life as far away from that violence as I can get. I live in Avondale where I have quite a few black neighbors. Looks like they're doing the same thing I am, avoiding the dangerous parts and not contributing to the violence. So it's yes, a localized inner city mostly black problem.
I actively choose not to listen to rap music or really most pop music, which is all vile trash these days (*and promotes violence*). And for all who say it just isn't possible to leave the inner city and be successful, that's not true, there are TONS of role models to look to. Unfortunately the black community would simply never try to promote people like Dr. Ben Carson, the first doctor to ever separate conjoined twins and later a politician.
You are your choices and unfortunately the sad truth is that it's really not necessarily society's fault that there is plain bad and violent culture in the inner cities. People are always trying to help in the inner city - there is so much charity always happening. I think the welfare state and in my opinion, certain leftist policies have contributed immensely to the problem, but it's also a culture that the inner city community is going to have to examine and work on itself because it has really created this culture for itself.
What it isn't is my legal ability to own my own firearms for sport, pleasure and self defense. No way, has nothing to do with the 2nd Amendment or legal gun ownership. The trigger doesn't pull itself. And in the event some inner city crime comes to my doorstep, I would like to be able to meet force with force and not wait for the cops to find my family's dead bodies later.
Quote from: simms3 on September 29, 2023, 03:17:53 PM
One difference between say the Asian cultures and other cultures in inner cities is priorities - Asians really value their education and are willing to make lemonade out of lemon schools, whites to a lesser degree, and blacks and Hispanics to a much lesser degree. I think that's a cultural thing...it's a stupid "rule" that we can't say that. I've met Asians coming out of bad inner city schools and with language barriers who made it to top tier universities (even if they had to transfer in sophomore or junior year) purely on merit. I think with that going on, these excuses made for other groups don't work. It's a cultural thing.
I'm Black and I will tell you that this is not true. I'm saying this as someone who knows, was raised and lives my culture. Living my culture made me have a desire to go to a HBCU, which I'd bet my house that no HBCU is on the list of "top tier universities". I'd rate a HBCU over a PWI every single time, but that's the perspective based on how my culture values these educational facilities. Doesn't make either above or below another.
I'd say that there's a huge difference between culture and and stereotyping based on skin color. We can't really loop any of us into a box, regardless of race. Gullah culture is very different from Creole or Bahamian culture, despite skin color being the same. We also can't throw half the world into a box because a group of people happen to have Spanish as a first language, despite being from various countries and cultures. There are a ton of systemic, economic, and environmental issues at place that lead to certain outcomes in various pockets of the country. Our issues are way more complex than skin color.
Quote from: simms3 on September 30, 2023, 08:02:20 AM
Well, not to say segregation was a good time because obviously that's a horrific time (that's now quite removed by time), but I doubt in those times you had black students acting like this on a daily basis in the schools (or really anyone):
https://twitter.com/libbyemmons/status/1707788076817215776
Skipping the link, I'll provide my parent's opinion on this, since they grew up and graduated high school prior to desegregation.
They believe that Black children and historic Black neighborhoods were better off during segregation. First, let me specify the Black people and communities they're referring too. This is the population that were the descendants of enslaved in the U.S. and subjected to a century of racial terror during Jim Crow, redlining, living in the Deep South and having a bunch of other environmental shit thrown their way against their will, simply because the color of their skin. Now Black people are global, so someone else that has the same color but not that historical generational experience of dealing with this in the U.S. specifically may have a completely different cultural story altogether.
Now, getting back to growing up in Jim Crow Florida. During that time there was a vested interest in the community to see that the next generation was better off than their generation. The teachers were from the neighborhood, more educated, looked like the kids they were teaching, shared a similar culture, knew their families and parents, attended church together and were just as invested in every kid's success and education, as their own parents. All of this, despite being totally discriminated against and being forced to have second class infrastructure, used books, substandard school buildings, etc. Much of our local cuisine, music like jazz, blues, rock n roll, etc. all have their roots and origins in this space. To me, that's the true definition of turning lemons into lemonade.
With desegregation, most of those Black teachers, despite being more educated at the time, were laid off, the Black neighborhood schools were closed and kids were bussed out to schools and taught by people.....many of which could care less about their future. To make matters worse, housing projects were built in many of these neighborhoods, expressways were intentionally built in their economic hearts as payback for the civil rights fights (Ashley Street and Sugar Hill are local examples that Haydon Burns promised to take out). All of this resulted in those with the economic means, moving out to greener pastures where they were once not allowed to live.....furthering economically crushing districts like Myrtle Avenue, Kings Road, APR, Moncrief Road, etc. Now we're dealing with some serious pockets of hopelessness, poverty, and lack of economic opportunity.
Growing up being bussed, having teachers tell me that I would never amount to anything in life, and later supported by my own research and the research of several others, I 100% believe them. While we can't change the past, we can change the future, so that's what I spend much of my focus, effort and energy on. For me, it's not the time to finger point at various groups of people. We can simply acknowledge the history of how we've arrived to 2023 and work on the things (modifying systemic public policy and investment, in my space of expertise) to make society truly economically inclusive for everyone.
I reside within Duval County in a neighborhood full of guns ......and No Gun " Violence" .
The vast majority of guns in the area apparently well behaved.
Why??
Quote from: Florida Power And Light on October 01, 2023, 08:32:03 PM
I reside within Duval County in a neighborhood full of guns ......and No Gun " Violence" .
The vast majority of guns in the area apparently well behaved.
Why??
Another poorly behaved gun in Jax tonight.
9 year old shot multiple times by a 6 year old.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/crime/2023/10/01/police-say-9-year-old-jacksonville-boy-might-have-been-shot-by-sibling/71025305007/
This makes three children under 10 shot in three separate incidents in Jacksonville, all in just the past week. The other two died but this 9 year old seems to not have life threatening injuries.
I cannot remember shootings this close to each other and involving victims this young.
Another man in his 20s dead by gunfire, with a second man shot.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/morning-show/2023/10/03/man-in-20s-dead-another-injured-after-double-shooting-in-northwest-jacksonville-jso-says/
Guess what happened in Jacksonville last night?
More people got shot with guns.
One man dead after being shot by police because he was recklessly playing with a gun in a strip mall parking lot:
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/04/one-person-dead-after-officer-involved-shooting-on-jacksonvilles-westside/
A teenage boy, and I presume his father, were shot by four men robbing their house:
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/04/man-teen-shot-during-robbery-in-jacksonvilles-paxon-neighborhood/
Though it's overly simplistic to pin all the blame on the guns, and it's overly simplistic to blame all of the violence on education, poverty, and culture, it's pretty clear that in the absence of guns, all of these situations in the last week may have turned out much differently.
Guess what happened in Jacksonville this morning?
Another kid (14 years old) shot.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/05/14-year-old-shot-several-cars-burglarized-in-springfield-thursday-morning/
I am stuck with Atlanta local tv news. Violence is off the charts in Atlanta... most of the news telecast is about the shootings. Police beg for cooperation to arrest the perps but silence from " the community ". Mostly gang and drug related with innocent people in the crossfire.
Shows the big rift and lack of trust the authorities have with their respective communities. Many are afraid of the criminal element, the police and potential retribution. The current way of things doesn't work. Time to try something new that begins to tackle the cause, as opposed to focusing primarily on the outcome.
Man, there is something in the air lately that I just haven't seen before in Jacksonville.
Was outside of Publix at Kernan and Beach earlier today and a homeless dude approached me. Said that he wasn't a bum, but that he couldn't get a job because he'd done ten years in jail for second degree murder for shooting his ex-girlfriend's secret boyfriend in the head. He asked me for money. When I told him I didn't have any cash, he said he goes from 0 to 60 when people lie to him, and motioned to his hip like he had a gun in his pants. Gave him some change from my car, and the store manager called it in.
Was back at the same Publix tonight. Five cop cars and two fire trucks outside. Cashier refused to sell some crazy dude beer and he lost his mind, ran through the store threatening people, ripped off all of his clothes, and started running naked through the parking lot.
Just bonkers out there.
Quote from: thelakelander on October 06, 2023, 02:50:23 PM
Shows the big rift and lack of trust the authorities have with their respective communities. Many are afraid of the criminal element, the police and potential retribution. The current way of things doesn't work. Time to try something new that begins to tackle the cause, as opposed to focusing primarily on the outcome.
Great. Just what are these new ways of doing things? We have been trying " new things " for decades. Old things...like cooperating with police works in other communities. Protecting criminals because snitching is taboo is getting people killed and letting criminals repeat and repeat and repeat... generally killing and robbing the very people who protected them from arrest.
^Same stuff that's been said for years. Investing in communities and stimulating them inclusively economically and educationally. It took us a long time to get to this point and it will take us a long time to get out of it. Policing is only one small component of it. Building trust in communities where trust has never been (and for a variety of reasons, if we're willing to go back, dive into and understand their histories with these same entities) is something that won't come without getting serious and transparent about the other component. You have to also fight crime with economics, respect and transparency.
For every step moved forward, there are two steps moved back when people see kids looking like this after an arrest....and this took place in the Southside. Those who don't fully acknowledge the history or downplay it, see things one way, while others on the short end of the stick of history, see it in a different fashion. The result, combined with a lot of other things we still need to address, is a lack of trust:
https://www.firstcoastnews.com/article/news/local/after-viral-arrest-video-naacp-legal-defense-fund-doj-probe-jso-gang-unit-closed/77-25f470ab-e7c9-433c-98b0-701388a3d8eb
I happen to be in Atlanta right now. I know this is a big issue of contention between city leaders, law enforcement and the Atlanta community:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2023-10-04/-cop-city-referendum-aims-to-repeal-planned-atlanta-police-training-center
Two more dead last night.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/07/2-men-found-shot-to-death-in-car-near-moncrief-road-jso/
Quote from: thelakelander on October 07, 2023, 07:14:22 AM
^Same stuff that's been said for years. Investing in communities and stimulating them inclusively economically and educationally. It took us a long time to get to this point and it will take us a long time to get out of it. Policing is only one small component of it. Building trust in communities where trust has never been (and for a variety of reasons, if we're willing to go back, dive into and understand their histories with these same entities) is something that won't come without getting serious and transparent about the other component. You have to also fight crime with economics, respect and transparency.
For every step moved forward, there are two steps moved back when people see kids looking like this after an arrest....and this took place in the Southside. Those who don't fully acknowledge the history or downplay it, see things one way, while others on the short end of the stick of history, see it in a different fashion. The result, combined with a lot of other things we still need to address, is a lack of trust:
https://www.firstcoastnews.com/article/news/local/after-viral-arrest-video-naacp-legal-defense-fund-doj-probe-jso-gang-unit-closed/77-25f470ab-e7c9-433c-98b0-701388a3d8eb
Sooo... nothing new. You say so yourself. We have been doing all you listed for decades. Apparently more money must be thrown on the wall. Getting serious and transparent requires introspection from ALL communities. Everyone needs to be held accountable to solve this... even the ones that got the short end of the stick.
I am not hopeful nor encouraged....it is far easier to blame the guns...rofl...
No, we haven't truly addressed systemic issues in many of our communities. I'm currently working to help the Eastside with a culturally appropriate zoning overlay now. Lisc has been recently helping several neighborhoods finally tackle heirs property. Both will help significantly with economic opportunities and the ability to stimulate generational wealth. That's just two small examples of things that should have been done five decades ago. Neither involve money outside of removing policies that take money from the poor and leave them with less opportunity to generate income. Let's sit down for coffee one day. We can dive into the details behind the things most people ignore, don't know or choose not to see.
I would love to have coffee with you Ennis! Unfortunately I now live 6 hours north of Jax. Perhaps in December?
It's been a violent two days so far in Jacksonville.
Two masked men shot someone near UNF:
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/12/1-person-shot-near-unf-campus-police-looking-for-two-masked-individuals/
14 year old shot in Springfield after trying to break into a car:
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/14/man-accused-of-attempted-murder-after-shooting-14-year-old-who-was-of-breaking-into-his-car-in-springfield-jso/
Two men shoot each other after a dice game goes south:
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/14/2-men-shot-after-argument-possibly-over-a-dice-game-at-northside-apartment-homes-jso/
One dead after shooting in Orange Park tonight:
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/15/one-person-is-dead-after-shooting-in-orange-park/
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/05/14-year-old-shot-several-cars-burglarized-in-springfield-thursday-morning/
Your post is related to the same incident from last week. Still bad, but not new.
Also the 2 masked men used different cars, but there's a very similar incident that you posted last week where a woman was hit. The recent article did not say that the two incidents were connected, but unless that's a very common MO then I think it's likely it's the same people.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on October 16, 2023, 10:10:28 AM
Also the 2 masked men used different cars, but there's a very similar incident that you posted last week where a woman was hit. The recent article did not say that the two incidents were connected, but unless that's a very common MO then I think it's likely it's the same people.
I'm pretty sure that both of these shootings, and possibly the one on Moncrief, are tied to the Ace/Foolio rap beef and each side's respective gang. Foolio survived an attempt on his life a week or two back (he got shot in the leg), and it seems like it's caused all kinds of chaos from both sides. Won't pretend to be an expert, but you can find out more about some of the violence in the city on the DuvalCounty drill subreddit than you can in local media (trigger warning for language and violence, tough to see some of this stuff, but also important to understand how bad things actually are on our streets).
https://www.reddit.com/r/DuvalCounty/top/?t=month
P.S. Three more shootings in the last 24 hours.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/16/1-killed-in-3-shootings-in-jacksonville-in-just-over-24-hours/
Jasper Avenue on Sunday afternoon, man shot in the chest with life-threatening injuries.
Turtle Creek last night, man dead after domestic dispute.
3:30 AM this morning, a bicycler on Norwood robbed and shot in the leg.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 11:01:18 AM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on October 16, 2023, 10:10:28 AM
Also the 2 masked men used different cars, but there's a very similar incident that you posted last week where a woman was hit. The recent article did not say that the two incidents were connected, but unless that's a very common MO then I think it's likely it's the same people.
I'm pretty sure that both of these shootings, and possibly the one on Moncrief, are tied to the Ace/Foolio rap beef and each side's respective gang. Foolio survived an attempt on his life a week or two back (he got shot in the leg), and it seems like it's caused all kinds of chaos from both sides. Won't pretend to be an expert, but you can find out more about some of the violence in the city on the DuvalCounty drill subreddit than you can in local media (trigger warning for language and violence, tough to see some of this stuff, but also important to understand how bad things actually are on our streets).
https://www.reddit.com/r/DuvalCounty/top/?t=month
So why do rappers have gang's and why do they want to kill each other
Quote from: BridgeTroll on October 16, 2023, 07:13:59 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 11:01:18 AM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on October 16, 2023, 10:10:28 AM
Also the 2 masked men used different cars, but there's a very similar incident that you posted last week where a woman was hit. The recent article did not say that the two incidents were connected, but unless that's a very common MO then I think it's likely it's the same people.
I'm pretty sure that both of these shootings, and possibly the one on Moncrief, are tied to the Ace/Foolio rap beef and each side's respective gang. Foolio survived an attempt on his life a week or two back (he got shot in the leg), and it seems like it's caused all kinds of chaos from both sides. Won't pretend to be an expert, but you can find out more about some of the violence in the city on the DuvalCounty drill subreddit than you can in local media (trigger warning for language and violence, tough to see some of this stuff, but also important to understand how bad things actually are on our streets).
https://www.reddit.com/r/DuvalCounty/top/?t=month
So why do rappers have gang's and why do they want to kill each other
If you've got the time, this is a shockingly well produced deep dive into the local situation.
https://youtu.be/DyIO3B5EFpM?si=ZM5rW1gKsOg8eHti
Atlanta currently has a bunch of rappers on trial as gangsters under RICO laws and of course multiple murders. Rapper and extreme violence seems to go together...
Jacksonville Bumper Sticker:
Leaving Jacksonville? Take A Lucky Friend!
NFL $ Crime White Flight Consolidation Strange
Hey!...... you are At least Twenty Years Behind!
I-95 Southbound closed near World Golf Village as the result of a late morning shooting on the highway.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/17/traffic-alert-all-sb-lanes-of-i-95-just-south-of-cr-210-in-sjc-are-closed-due-to-incident/
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 17, 2023, 12:41:41 PM
I-95 Southbound closed near World Golf Village as the result of a late morning shooting on the highway.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/17/traffic-alert-all-sb-lanes-of-i-95-just-south-of-cr-210-in-sjc-are-closed-due-to-incident/
All lanes are open now.
Double shooting last night, leaving one dead and critically injured.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/18/double-shooting-inside-jacksonville-home-leaves-man-dead-another-critically-injured/
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 07:19:43 PM
If you've got the time, this is a shockingly well produced deep dive into the local situation.
https://youtu.be/DyIO3B5EFpM?si=ZM5rW1gKsOg8eHti
I'm halfway through this and other than the guy's weird hairpiece it's very interesting and well done. One of my biggest takeaways is how inept JSO has been throughout the whole thing. These are the crimes they use to justify their budget and personnel increases and yet they make almost no effort to arrest these guys who are taking credit for the events in their songs and social media posts. Only when the "wrong" people get hit do they intervene.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on October 18, 2023, 11:42:25 AM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 07:19:43 PM
If you've got the time, this is a shockingly well produced deep dive into the local situation.
https://youtu.be/DyIO3B5EFpM?si=ZM5rW1gKsOg8eHti
I'm halfway through this and other than the guy's weird hairpiece it's very interesting and well done. One of my biggest takeaways is how inept JSO has been throughout the whole thing. These are the crimes they use to justify their budget and personnel increases and yet they make almost no effort to arrest these guys who are taking credit for the events in their songs and social media posts. Only when the "wrong" people get hit do they intervene.
It's bonkers (almost as bonkers as the hairpiece) how open both sides are about the killings, and how little the local media or even police department seem able or willing to connect the dots with some of these crimes that are reported and covered as though they are random, isolated incidents rather than part of a larger situation. You've got to wonder whether they don't know, or they just don't care.
Quote from: Charles Hunter on October 17, 2023, 03:46:44 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 17, 2023, 12:41:41 PM
I-95 Southbound closed near World Golf Village as the result of a late morning shooting on the highway.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/17/traffic-alert-all-sb-lanes-of-i-95-just-south-of-cr-210-in-sjc-are-closed-due-to-incident/
All lanes are open now.
Wonderful!
All Those Fleeing Florida have an Opening.
Quote from: Florida Power And Light on October 21, 2023, 08:24:22 PM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on October 17, 2023, 03:46:44 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 17, 2023, 12:41:41 PM
I-95 Southbound closed near World Golf Village as the result of a late morning shooting on the highway.
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2023/10/17/traffic-alert-all-sb-lanes-of-i-95-just-south-of-cr-210-in-sjc-are-closed-due-to-incident/
All lanes are open now.
Wonderful!
All Those Fleeing Florida have an Opening.
Uh ... if you are "fleeing Florida" by heading south on I-95, you have bigger problems.
Uh ... if you are "fleeing Florida" by heading south on I-95, you have bigger problems.
[/quote]
For some, heading to South Florida is a Step In Fleeing.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 07:19:43 PM
Quote from: BridgeTroll on October 16, 2023, 07:13:59 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 11:01:18 AM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on October 16, 2023, 10:10:28 AM
Also the 2 masked men used different cars, but there's a very similar incident that you posted last week where a woman was hit. The recent article did not say that the two incidents were connected, but unless that's a very common MO then I think it's likely it's the same people.
I'm pretty sure that both of these shootings, and possibly the one on Moncrief, are tied to the Ace/Foolio rap beef and each side's respective gang. Foolio survived an attempt on his life a week or two back (he got shot in the leg), and it seems like it's caused all kinds of chaos from both sides. Won't pretend to be an expert, but you can find out more about some of the violence in the city on the DuvalCounty drill subreddit than you can in local media (trigger warning for language and violence, tough to see some of this stuff, but also important to understand how bad things actually are on our streets).
https://www.reddit.com/r/DuvalCounty/top/?t=month
So why do rappers have gang's and why do they want to kill each other
If you've got the time, this is a shockingly well produced deep dive into the local situation.
https://youtu.be/DyIO3B5EFpM?si=ZM5rW1gKsOg8eHti
Foolio was assassinated last night, on his 26th birthday, after broadcasting his location on Instagram.
Either gonna make things a whole lot better, or a whole lot worse, depending on the response from both sides.
That's unfortunate. Life has so much more to offer.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on June 23, 2024, 11:00:26 AM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 07:19:43 PM
Quote from: BridgeTroll on October 16, 2023, 07:13:59 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on October 16, 2023, 11:01:18 AM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on October 16, 2023, 10:10:28 AM
Also the 2 masked men used different cars, but there's a very similar incident that you posted last week where a woman was hit. The recent article did not say that the two incidents were connected, but unless that's a very common MO then I think it's likely it's the same people.
I'm pretty sure that both of these shootings, and possibly the one on Moncrief, are tied to the Ace/Foolio rap beef and each side's respective gang. Foolio survived an attempt on his life a week or two back (he got shot in the leg), and it seems like it's caused all kinds of chaos from both sides. Won't pretend to be an expert, but you can find out more about some of the violence in the city on the DuvalCounty drill subreddit than you can in local media (trigger warning for language and violence, tough to see some of this stuff, but also important to understand how bad things actually are on our streets).
https://www.reddit.com/r/DuvalCounty/top/?t=month
So why do rappers have gang's and why do they want to kill each other
If you've got the time, this is a shockingly well produced deep dive into the local situation.
https://youtu.be/DyIO3B5EFpM?si=ZM5rW1gKsOg8eHti
Foolio was assassinated last night, on his 26th birthday, after broadcasting his location on Instagram.
Either gonna make things a whole lot better, or a whole lot worse, depending on the response from both sides.
I'm betting on a uptick in drivebys... probably some dead and wounded
https://www.news4jax.com/news/local/2024/06/24/we-wont-tolerate-revenge-sheriff-paying-close-attention-to-clashing-groups-after-jacksonville-rapper-killed-in-tampa/
https://www.complex.com/music/a/markelibert/yungeen-ace-do-it-julio-foolio-murder
That's sad. These guys aren't going to stop till they're all dead.
It seems like Youtube is funding these guys.
Murder the 'opps' -> release music video on monetized youtube channel -> profit.
Looking at the comment section, you may be right!
I am certain these guys have other streams of income than YouTube.
These trends are all related to a sub-genre of rap called "drill." A rapper named Chief Keef from Chicago really popularized the music that you now see as mainstream rap back in 2010-2012.
When he started making music, he had a friend use a cheap handheld recorder, they uploaded videos on Youtube. They made a ton of money with the ad's placed on those songs and he went multi-platnium. Drill rap focuses on drills, which you can look that up if you want to learn more. The point is, he really invented a way to circumnavigate the traditional route to fame that musicians had gone through for decades. Not only did they make money through the internet, but now they were able to gain social followings & become 'real' artists with millions of income. Most of the big-time rappers under the age of 30 right now all got their start this way & while some get out of the lifestyle, some of course stay in it.
This trend has basically reached Jacksonville as of 2017-ish, and so we are in the middle of "that." The very cruel side of the entire situation, is that Chief Keef originally did this with no way of knowing what would unfold 10+ years later. Now, the lifestyle is commoditized, with commentators/news outlets making millions of reporting on these situations. The same reporters that usually get these same folks killed by making their lives something to idolize. The list of dead drill rappers is so incredibly long, but the industry stays propped up because of that death. A sickening cycle.
RIP to all the victims of drill. Especially the innocent.
Quote from: Tacachale on June 25, 2024, 01:05:53 PM
I am certain these guys have other streams of income than YouTube.
Certainly lol. But YT money is legal & easily able to be reinvested. Drug money requires a lot more sophistication to make clean.
Quote from: Tacachale on June 25, 2024, 01:05:53 PM
I am certain these guys have other streams of income than YouTube.
Certainly not as much money as they like to portray. Foolio was killed driving around in the exact same car he had been shot in before.
Jacksonville's lineup is not on the national stage. Goto Atlanta or New York and those guys can make several millions a year at 18. In fact, the reason why Jacksonville & Memphis have the popularity they do with drill, is because our market is perceived to be more dangerous.. hence why Foolio's death went viral.
Atlanta...
https://www.vulture.com/article/ysl-young-thug-gunna-arrest-charges-explained.html
QuoteEverything We Know About YSL's RICO Case
So many are so happy to have moved away......
^Bye
Yeah I got out in 2011, best decision I made. go back and visit family occasionly, holy crap the city exploded and not in a good way
Deaths on monumental decline: Jacksonville's homicides are on pace for fewer than 100:
QuoteFor two decades, no matter who's been in charge, Jacksonville's sheriff has been embattled with trying to overcome the city's reputation as "the murder capital of Florida." They've stood at podiums in front of TV cameras addressing the violence year after year — 162 homicides, 177, 129, 168 and 157, and that's just in the last five years, according to unofficial Times-Union data.
Well, this year's different. At the halfway mark of 2024, the city is unofficially at 46 homicides — a 31% decrease from the 67 at the same time last year. So Jacksonville is on pace to have fewer than 100 homicides for only the third time in the 21 years since the Times-Union has chronicled the city's death toll.
QuoteIn a 30-minute interview a few days prior to the midway point, Sheriff T.K. Waters asked his own question: "Why is the media so bent on ruining the reputation of Jacksonville by calling Jacksonville the most violent city or the murder capital of Florida? Because it's not," he said citing other areas. "... Jacksonville is a really great place and a really great city. The perception that's being presented is problematic ... it's almost a celebration when we reach 100 homicides. It's crazy to me."
He also noted in the mid- to late-'80s the city had homicide rates of 200-plus with a population that was much lower and now don't even get close to that.
In the early 2000s, the Times-Union regularly chronicled how Duval County led the state per-capita murder rate for 10 years running. Hence the city was dubbed "the murder capital of Florida" and media and community leaders piled on.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/crime/2024/07/02/jacksonville-is-on-pace-for-fewer-than-100-homicides-in-over-a-decade/74012408007/
I am seeing a concerted Move Out...... some long established property owners/ families. Even water front properties- folks headed out after decades of living There....
Cedar River..... elsewhere....
^ tell us again about population decline in Jacksonville
It's not the Decline.... It is about who has moved Out.
But for some, Who Cares!! We Be Growin!!!!!
Paul Kersey recent review of Milwaukee Violent Crime could apply to Jacksonville.
This is only a matter of interest to a small minority.
Quote from: Florida Power And Light on July 06, 2024, 10:10:56 PMPaul Kersey recent review of Milwaukee Violent Crime could apply to Jacksonville.
*Michael J. Thompson, not Paul Kersey.
"Paul Kersey" is the pen name Thompson hides behind when spewing white supremicist trash, like his unhinged catchphrase "No blacks, know peace. Know blacks, no peace" or his openly racist website, "Stuff Black People Don't Like." Dude openly advocates for reintroducing legalized racial segregation into America under the guise and justifcation that blacks are genetically inferior to whites. Same dude who calls black Americans "America's greatest liability, dragging down western civilization to the black mean wherever they are found."
Wake me up when your "source" has the balls to actually sign his own name to his bullshit Klan fan-fiction.
https://www.rightwingwatch.org/post/hiding-in-plain-sight-the-white-nationalist-who-toiled-inside-a-right-wing-media-powerhouse/
Nice. Thanks Ken. >:(