Where to even begin? What is the hold up? It's been done for months now and the most recent news article lists safety inspections being done. The only other thing I've seen is a spring opening, but there's nothing.. Anywhere.. to suggest this. It's almost as if they're waiting for the under the bridge project to be completed before a Grand opening. It's frustrating, but what's new with Jacksonville?
Yep, it's ridiculous. It's been 95% complete for like 2 years. I think they are slow rolling it while the contruction at Palm Ave and under the bridge over there is still ongoing to whatever extent.
From what I hear, there is a desire for a ribbon cutting with dignitaries. I'm sure this will be strategically timed with either the second round of the Mayoral election or perhaps something from the Governor.
There was a celebration planned for December 17th, but that got scrapped and it has not been rescheduled. It looks 100% complete now, but I don't know what the holdup is. It's definitely not worth having the Governor join, so I hope that's not what is holding it up. They already made a ridiculous name and logo for a sidewalk, so that's as much overdoing as I can handle.
^It has a name and logo?!
Quote from: thelakelander on March 18, 2023, 02:04:44 PM
^It has a name and logo?!
Wingard made/donated a basic logo out of the letters SUP. I believe FDOT is going to hang banners on the light poles featuring the logo.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 18, 2023, 02:04:44 PM
^It has a name and logo?!
What better way to make everyone forget FDOT vehemently opposed this at one point than by FDOT branding it like the whole thing was their idea?
Lol this sounds so silly. Just open the damn thing already.
Quote from: thelakelander on March 18, 2023, 11:07:25 PM
Lol this sounds so silly. Just open the damn thing already.
Ennis has spoken. Good grief, I did not expect to read what's been posted above. I'm surprised no one hasn't hung posters up yet asking "2023 OPENING, OR NAH?" on it yet.
It is insane. Lenny might be delaying it so he can have something to add to "his legacy" as he leaves one office [for another]...
Just infuriating to go to RAM every weekend, see people asking about if they can use the new path, and having it still barricaded after all these months. This is peak season to allow people to use the pedestrian path, and it's just being pissed away with no sign of any work being done or any valid reason they can't just push aside the barriers and let people enjoy the amenity.
7 years to fix a bulkhead. 4 years to build a one mile long pedestrian pathway. 3 years to fix a fountain. 15 years to level the Berkman. 45 years to build the I-95/I-10 intersection. Crushing it!
Quote from: WarDamJagFan on March 28, 2023, 05:20:02 AM3 years to fix a fountain.
Article from two years ago, talking about how the project was already a year behind schedule:
https://news.wjct.org/first-coast/2021-04-15/one-year-late-renovation-to-begin-on-southbanks-friendship-fountain
Article from a year ago, saying the project would open by the end of last summer:
https://www.news4jax.com/features/2022/03/25/vegas-or-jacksonville-friendship-fountain-shows-off-new-bells-and-whistles/
It's absurd.
Like the shared use path, this is a public space that should be active and being enjoyed by the public, but no one tasked with bringing vibrancy to the urban core seems to view it as an urgent priority.
Sometimes I feel like I'm irrationally hard on the DIA, but there was no reason to close Friendship Park to the public for over THREE YEARS if you're not going to actively work on it and commit to a reasonable timeline. Driving over the Main Street bridge, I haven't seen significant work going on at Friendship Park for ages.
For fun, projects that were completed by other cities, or by private entities, faster than Jacksonville can restore Friendship Fountain:
Mercedes Benz Stadium (< 3 years)
Madison Square Garden (1 year)
the Jags Sports Performance center (~1 year)
FIS Headquarters (<2 years)
Yet every project under the purview of this city drags on for YEARS, with no sense of urgency, while economic cycles come and go and our sister cities develop at a rapid pace.
The most irritating thing to me in terms of sites like Friendship Park, the Landing, River City Brewing, the Mixed Use Path, etc is the arrogance and disregard it takes to needlessly remove active sites from use for YEARS without having a gameplan and concrete timeline in place for bringing them back online.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on March 28, 2023, 12:56:53 PM
Quote from: WarDamJagFan on March 28, 2023, 05:20:02 AM3 years to fix a fountain.
Article from two years ago, talking about how the project was already a year behind schedule:
https://news.wjct.org/first-coast/2021-04-15/one-year-late-renovation-to-begin-on-southbanks-friendship-fountain
Article from a year ago, saying the project would open by the end of last summer:
https://www.news4jax.com/features/2022/03/25/vegas-or-jacksonville-friendship-fountain-shows-off-new-bells-and-whistles/
It's absurd.
Like the shared use path, this is a public space that should be active and being enjoyed by the public, but no one tasked with bringing vibrancy to the urban core seems to view it as an urgent priority.
Sometimes I feel like I'm irrationally hard on the DIA, but there was no reason to close Friendship Park to the public for over THREE YEARS if you're not going to actively work on it and commit to a reasonable timeline. Driving over the Main Street bridge, I haven't seen significant work going on at Friendship Park for ages.
For fun, projects that were completed by other cities, or by private entities, faster than Jacksonville can restore Friendship Fountain:
Mercedes Benz Stadium (< 3 years)
Madison Square Garden (1 year)
the Jags Sports Performance center (~1 year)
FIS Headquarters (<2 years)
Yet every project under the purview of this city drags on for YEARS, with no sense of urgency, while economic cycles come and go and our sister cities develop at a rapid pace.
The most irritating thing to me in terms of sites like Friendship Park, the Landing, River City Brewing, the Mixed Use Path, etc is the arrogance and disregard it takes to needlessly remove active sites from use for YEARS without having a gameplan and concrete timeline in place for bringing them back online.
Been saying that the price tag for "planning" has to be reaching 8-figures for the riverfront. Truthfully people are a little too excited/optimistic that the City won't overpromise and under deliver the riverfront space. I also refuse to excuse the excess money that already has and will be hastily flung maintaining these almost zero revenue generating parcels. I'll continue to be critical of the city taking more projects on until the city can actually deliver on what they say, or at least be close. Public $$ should be able to produce private investment.. how can you bet on those private investments without any ability to deliver? How can a park take longer than an entire building?
Leah Shields from First Coast News got a statement (https://twitter.com/becksthewrecks/status/1640736148485021701?s=20) from FDOT.
QuoteFDOT Officials performed a safety inspection in late January to identify outstanding safety items related to the shared use path before opening it to the public. As a result of the inspection, crews have been [working] to address the safety items that include the mitigation of tripping hazards, incomplete safety lighting, removal of exposed materials and completing handrails to current standards. Due to ongoing supply chain challenges across the industry, certain materials (namely the handrails) require additional procurement time.
We appreciate the public's understanding and patience as the safety items are expected to be completed in the next several weeks, unforeseen circumstances permitting.
A ribbon-cutting ceremony will be scheduled once the safety-related items are sufficiently addressed and cleared for public use.
^I'll believe it when I see it.
FDOT's language, excuses, and promises on this have become a broken record.
In April 2021, FDOT said it would be open by the Fall:
https://news.wjct.org/first-coast/2021-04-09/video-last-beam-laid-for-new-fuller-warren-bridge-pedestrian-bicycle-path
In Fall 2021, FDOT said weather and "unforeseen circumstances" pushed the opening to early 2022:
https://www.reddit.com/r/jacksonville/comments/oj12em/why_is_the_mixed_use_path_for_the_fuller_warren/
In early 2022, FDOT said that "barring unforeseen circumstances," the project would be open by Fall 2022.
In late Summer 2022, FDOT said that they were "anticipating a fall opening for the shared-use path, weather and unforeseen circumstances permitting.":
https://residentnews.net/2022/09/07/excitement-builds-across-the-river-as-fuller-warren-shared-use-path-nears-completion/
In Fall 2022, 7 months ago, the FDOT said that striping and railing still needed to be finished and "construction on the project is expected to be completed in the next few months, weather and unforeseen circumstances permitting":
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/traffic/2022/10/19/10-i-95-work-almost-done-jacksonville-florida-and-fuller-warren-bridge/10468742002/
In January 2023, the goal posts moved to "prior to the Spring."
https://www.wokv.com/news/local/safety-inspections-underway-new-pedestrian-path-across-fuller-warren-bridge/XQJNJ5LZRVG3FP762G2JQSHEVY/
And now, here we are, nearly April 2023, and we're getting:
"We appreciate the public's understanding and patience as the safety items are expected to be completed in the next several weeks, unforeseen circumstances permitting."
New York finished the first two sections of THE HIGH LINE in the amount of time it's taken FDOT & Jax to complete a bicycle path alongside the highway.
Looking forward to the next update over the summer, barring unforeseen circumstances.
Even with supply chain problems, it's hard to believe it takes 2 to 3 years to get handrails. Any inspection during the years of construction should have identified lighting and tripping issues, removal of "exposed materials" (what does that mean?) etc. long ago. Maybe FDOT is one of those construction customers who says just call me when you think you are finished and then I will tell you what I really think so you can start all over again. Someone hasn't done their job properly.
If a private business worked this way they would be out of business. Some delay is reasonable but not years, especially for a glorified sidewalk that FDOT builds by the miles since it came into existence. Interestingly, the much more complex roadwork is finished but not a measly sidewalk 8).
Just another prime example of the level of incompetence at City Hall. No sense of urgency with any government-run project. "Oh you say it'll be another year probably after all these years? That's fine. Take your time. We're in no hurry here".
Even if this finishes in the next 3 weeks, it will take another 3 weeks to plan and implement a grand opening/ribbon cutting. That puts this opening in mid-May when the temps will be in the mid 80s at least. They missed their window to really kick this off with great weather and mild temps.
What opens first? The Fuller Warren shared use path or the Whataburger on Atlantic and Kernan?
Quote from: pierre on March 29, 2023, 11:06:23 AM
What opens first? The Fuller Warren shared use path or the Whataburger on Atlantic and Kernan?
Fuddrucker's at the Landing.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 29, 2023, 09:58:53 AM
Even if this finishes in the next 3 weeks, it will take another 3 weeks to plan and implement a grand opening/ribbon cutting. That puts this opening in mid-May when the temps will be in the mid 80s at least. They missed their window to really kick this off with great weather and mild temps.
Yo. Do you have a problem with a 4th of July ribbon cutting? Why do you hate America?
Quote from: fsu813 on March 29, 2023, 08:15:26 PM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 29, 2023, 09:58:53 AM
Even if this finishes in the next 3 weeks, it will take another 3 weeks to plan and implement a grand opening/ribbon cutting. That puts this opening in mid-May when the temps will be in the mid 80s at least. They missed their window to really kick this off with great weather and mild temps.
Yo. Do you have a problem with a 4th of July ribbon cutting? Why do you hate America?
Have a "soft" opening... just open the gates. Celebrate with a ribbon cutting whenever... who ever heard of one for a sidewalk anyway ;D.
And with that, Florida Bike Month 2023 comes to a close. Ah well, maybe they can hit it for '24.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on March 29, 2023, 09:25:52 PM
Quote from: fsu813 on March 29, 2023, 08:15:26 PM
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 29, 2023, 09:58:53 AM
Even if this finishes in the next 3 weeks, it will take another 3 weeks to plan and implement a grand opening/ribbon cutting. That puts this opening in mid-May when the temps will be in the mid 80s at least. They missed their window to really kick this off with great weather and mild temps.
Yo. Do you have a problem with a 4th of July ribbon cutting? Why do you hate America?
Have a "soft" opening... just open the gates. Celebrate with a ribbon cutting whenever... who ever heard of one for a sidewalk anyway ;D.
RAP and RAM are very interested in making a thing of the opening. I get that it will be an added benefit to RAM and it connects it to the southbank, but it is just a sidewalk after all.
Ribbon cutting on April 6 at 11am at RAM according to Randy Defoor.
So, after all that they pick a Thursday when RAM isn't open?
Quote from: Steve on March 30, 2023, 11:06:17 AM
So, after all that they pick a Thursday when RAM isn't open?
one issue back in December was a debate of Friday vs Saturday - apparently some dignitaries didn't want to "work" on the weekend
Quote from: Live_Oak on March 30, 2023, 10:58:30 AM
Ribbon cutting on April 6 at 11am at RAM according to Randy Defoor.
confirmed - I got an email at 10:45am this morning
Quote from: tufsu1 on March 30, 2023, 11:11:04 AM
Quote from: Steve on March 30, 2023, 11:06:17 AM
So, after all that they pick a Thursday when RAM isn't open?
one issue back in December was a debate of Friday vs Saturday - apparently some dignitaries didn't want to "work" on the weekend
So get with RAM and make it a "beer" day at RAM in conjunction. They'd have come out for that.
Here's the media release, with a link to a video of the SUP
Quote
For Immediate Release
March 30, 2023
Contact: Daryl Goss
(386) 984-5392 | Daryl.Goss@dot.state.fl.us<mailto:Daryl.Goss@dot.state.fl.us>
FDOT to Host Grand Opening and Ribbon-Cutting Ceremony for the Fuller Warren Shared Use Path
JACKSONVILLE, Fla. - FDOT will host a ribbon-cutting ceremony to mark the grand opening of the Fuller Warren Shared Use Path (SUP) on Thursday, April 6 at 11 a.m. The ribbon-cutting ceremony will be held at the Riverside Arts Market, 715 Riverside Avenue, Jacksonville, FL 32204. FDOT plans to host media for a tour of the Shared Use Path prior to opening; more details will be announced soon.
In keeping with FDOT's goals of improving safety and enhancing mobility, the Fuller Warren Shared Use Path will serve the residents and visitors of Jacksonville by providing pedestrian and bicycle connections between the Riverside and San Marco communities. Joining the Main Street Bridge and the Acosta Bridge, the Fuller Warren SUP will become the third point of access for pedestrians and bicyclists to cross the St. Johns River in Jacksonville.
https://vimeo.com/813149382/440c5e196f
Spanning the St. Johns River at 4,654 feet long and 12 feet wide, the Fuller Warren SUP includes two 6-foot lanes for east/west traffic and features two rest/observation areas featuring panoramic views of the St. Johns River. Users can access the SUP from Riverside Avenue in Riverside, from Palm Avenue in San Marco or from the sidewalk adjacent to the river behind Nemours Children's Hospital.
The Fuller Warren SUP is part of the $126 million operational improvements project at I-10 and I-95.
Amazing how "opening in the next several weeks" turns to opening in 6 days once the pressure ratchets up.
Handrails and safety looks fine in the marketing video they shot.
I wonder how long this thing has actually been pedestrian ready for.
If it's ready, we should all meet this afternoon to cut the ribbon ourselves.
Thousands of people unable to use the path this weekend because the goons want their photo op/opportunity to publicly pat themselves on the back for finally completing a bike path that's been funded since Obama was in office.
Congrats, fellas.
Broken record, but really is hilarious.
The gal and foolishness required to hold a self-congratulatory ribbon cutting ceremony for a pedestrian bridge that was supposed to open in 2021.
Quote from: Steve on March 30, 2023, 11:23:19 AM
Quote from: tufsu1 on March 30, 2023, 11:11:04 AM
Quote from: Steve on March 30, 2023, 11:06:17 AM
So, after all that they pick a Thursday when RAM isn't open?
one issue back in December was a debate of Friday vs Saturday - apparently some dignitaries didn't want to "work" on the weekend
So get with RAM and make it a "beer" day at RAM in conjunction. They'd have come out for that.
some officials from Jax you may be thinking of, likely yes.
some officials from Tallahassee who may be looking for good pub, probably not.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on March 30, 2023, 01:00:21 PM
Broken record, but really is hilarious.
The gal and foolishness required to hold a self-congratulatory ribbon cutting ceremony for a pedestrian bridge that was supposed to open in 2021.
I've been reading all your posts in this thread and laughing, thank you for that. Ridiculous doesn't even begin to cover how foolish this is and you said it best.. for something that should've been in use already for the past 2 years. I'm so thankful this soapbox exists for us all to discuss the misfortune we suffer through while living in Jacksonville
Opening April 6, 2023.
Quote from: Jagsdrew on March 31, 2023, 11:31:48 AM
Opening April 6, 2023.
Checks Weather: high of 91 degrees. Just in time for everyone to melt as they crest the span of bridge.
Quote from: Jagsdrew on March 31, 2023, 11:33:39 AM
Quote from: Jagsdrew on March 31, 2023, 11:31:48 AM
Opening April 6, 2023.
Checks Weather: high of 91 degrees. Just in time for everyone to melt as they crest the span of bridge.
Even the date of the ribbon cutting is hilarious.
Cutting the ribbon on April 6th at RAM - a Thursday - when the taxpayers are working and RAM isn't even open.
It's just so wildly tone-deaf.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on March 31, 2023, 12:55:32 PM
Quote from: Jagsdrew on March 31, 2023, 11:33:39 AM
Quote from: Jagsdrew on March 31, 2023, 11:31:48 AM
Opening April 6, 2023.
Checks Weather: high of 91 degrees. Just in time for everyone to melt as they crest the span of bridge.
Even the date of the ribbon cutting is hilarious.
Cutting the ribbon on April 6th at RAM - a Thursday - when the taxpayers are working and RAM isn't even open.
It's just so wildly tone-deaf.
RAP/RAM/and SMPS all found out about the opening yesterday. Everyone is scrambling to throw something together for Saturday the 8th, but it's going to be last minute due to the surprise announcement. There was supposed to be at least 2 weeks notice. This is classic COJ right here.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 31, 2023, 01:33:21 PM
RAP/RAM/and SMPS all found out about the opening yesterday. Everyone is scrambling to throw something together for Saturday the 8th, but it's going to be last minute due to the surprise announcement. There was supposed to be at least 2 weeks notice. This is classic COJ right here.
Did we stir the pot?
Quote from: duvaltilidie on March 31, 2023, 10:42:53 AM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on March 30, 2023, 01:00:21 PM
Broken record, but really is hilarious.
The gal and foolishness required to hold a self-congratulatory ribbon cutting ceremony for a pedestrian bridge that was supposed to open in 2021.
I've been reading all your posts in this thread and laughing, thank you for that. Ridiculous doesn't even begin to cover how foolish this is and you said it best.. for something that should've been in use already for the past 2 years. I'm so thankful this soapbox exists for us all to discuss the misfortune we suffer through while living in Jacksonville
Thanks dude!
Was blocked again today at RAM.
Was hoping for a soft opening for the public ahead of the politicians getting their bullshit photo op in, but no dice.
Quote from: Captain Zissou on March 31, 2023, 01:33:21 PM
RAP/RAM/and SMPS all found out about the opening yesterday. Everyone is scrambling to throw something together for Saturday the 8th, but it's going to be last minute due to the surprise announcement. There was supposed to be at least 2 weeks notice. This is classic COJ right here.
you mean FDOT?
At the grand opening FDOT should be required to state that they hated the idea and fought it every step of the way.
Watching the video: https://vimeo.com/813149382/440c5e196f
It doesn't look like the SUP has lane lines, or anything to keep opposing traffic apart, or faster (bikes) and slower (pedestrians) traffic apart. Is there a pool on when the first bike vs ped collision occurs?
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 02, 2023, 11:16:57 PM
Watching the video: https://vimeo.com/813149382/440c5e196f
It doesn't look like the SUP has lane lines, or anything to keep opposing traffic apart, or faster (bikes) and slower (pedestrians) traffic apart. Is there a pool on when the first bike vs ped collision occurs?
There's a dividing line but that's it. The northbank doesn't even have a dividing line coming down the ramp from the corkscrew and I'm not aware of any major accidents with cyclists and pedestrians. The landings there keep peoples speed down though.
Quote from: acme54321 on April 03, 2023, 12:36:30 PM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 02, 2023, 11:16:57 PM
Watching the video: https://vimeo.com/813149382/440c5e196f
It doesn't look like the SUP has lane lines, or anything to keep opposing traffic apart, or faster (bikes) and slower (pedestrians) traffic apart. Is there a pool on when the first bike vs ped collision occurs?
There's a dividing line but that's it. The northbank doesn't even have a dividing line coming down the ramp from the corkscrew and I'm not aware of any major accidents with cyclists and pedestrians. The landings there keep peoples speed down though.
It will certainly be up to the bicyclists who use this SUP to not bomb the descent on each side, as they should on the Riverwalk ramp & Acosta/Main Street Bridges sidewalks. I Could however see something more informative being added on much later. Having watched a vlogger out of NYC named Terry Barentsen on his YouTube channel, the bridges there still have pedestrians walk on both sides of the path, no matter what.
A parade? Really? Bicyclists to the rear of the parade? What a freaking joke. Who from The Jaxson Mag is invited to join in? Copied this from PreseverationJax's post on instagram.
Quotepreservationjax The SUP - Grand Opening Celebration
& Parade
Saturday, April 8 at 10:00am
Riverside - 715 Riverside Ave., Jacksonville, FL, 32204
San Marco - Children's Way and Le Baron Ave., Jacksonville, FL 32207
Riverside Avondale Preservation and San Marco
Preservation Society @smpsjax are celebrating the opening of the Fuller Warren Shared-Use Path (The
SUP) together on Saturday, April 8 at 10:00am. After years of coordination, design, construction, and now completion, the FDOT announced the new 4,596 ft. long pathway will open on Thursday, April 6 at 11:00am with a ceremony of elected and agency officials.
Following this announcement, we quickly worked to organize a celebration to kick-off the community-connecting bridge. Please join us!
Visitors are invited to gather at the base of each side of
1-95 for the inaugural SUP Parade. After a few words from leadership on both sides of the St. Johns River, the community is invited to see a view of Jacksonville, unmatched, outside of a speeding vehicle. A marching band, led by the Darren Ronan School of Music @ronanschoolofmusicjax will accompany community members from the Riverside Arts Market. Merchandise and other materials will be provided, designed by Wingard Creative. Photographers are welcome and encouraged to capture this singular moment. Aerial photography by @kramkran Photography is tentative, pending federal and local approvals.
*Bicyclists requested to follow parade leaders from rear
From the press preview photos, it looks like a dashed centerline was added after FDOT took their video.
Mark Woods is a real treasure.
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/columns/mark-woods/2023/04/05/fuller-warren-bridge-multi-use-path-opens-thursday-in-jacksonville/70073735007/
We didn't get the media invite but were not really expecting to get one either. We're elated to see that discussions that took place here a decade ago have resulted in this project. It shows the power of the community to take our infrastructure projects to the next level, when we get active and involved. When we don't, we end up paying just as much for the basic minimum. This should be a good lesson for how to engage with public agencies.
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 04, 2023, 01:32:45 PM
From the press preview photos, it looks like a dashed centerline was added after FDOT took their video.
Curious, from the photos in Mark Wood's article, if there is heavy bike traffic, is there enough clearance for pedestrians to safely use the path? I wonder if maybe there should have been a bit more width to physically separate pedestrians from bikers. Comments?
I didn't think I'd ever see the day, but it's open.
Excellent! I'll have to try and walk it after work.
QuoteThe new Fuller Warren Bridge shared use path
(https://photos.moderncities.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Transportation/Fuller-Warren-Bridge-SUP/i-Tk3q9Lx/0/987c2298/L/20230406_183953-L.jpg)
Sights and scenes of downtown Jacksonville's new Fuller Warren Bridge shared use path. The new shared use path is first in Northeast Florida added to a limited access highway.
Read More: https://www.thejaxsonmag.com/article/the-new-fuller-warren-bridge-shared-use-path/[/i]
Excellent pictures! I can't wait to check it out when I'm back in town next month.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on April 06, 2023, 12:57:16 AM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 04, 2023, 01:32:45 PM
From the press preview photos, it looks like a dashed centerline was added after FDOT took their video.
Curious, from the photos in Mark Wood's article, if there is heavy bike traffic, is there enough clearance for pedestrians to safely use the path? I wonder if maybe there should have been a bit more width to physically separate pedestrians from bikers. Comments?
I've wondered about the too. I've seen it get ugly on the Brooklyn Bridge pedestrian section where bikers and walkers shared an area. But when I was there last year I saw they opened dedicated bike lanes.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on April 06, 2023, 12:57:16 AM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 04, 2023, 01:32:45 PM
From the press preview photos, it looks like a dashed centerline was added after FDOT took their video.
Curious, from the photos in Mark Wood's article, if there is heavy bike traffic, is there enough clearance for pedestrians to safely use the path? I wonder if maybe there should have been a bit more width to physically separate pedestrians from bikers. Comments?
It is a 12' wide trail. The general standard for shared-use paths is 10 to 14', depending on usage. In order to truly separate bikes and peds, the trail needed to be at least 13' wide (5' for peds and 8' for two-way bikes). There was discussion when the design was happening about trying to get it to 13-14', but FDOT said it would be very difficult.
That said, I've only seen one marked trail (in Sweden) where bikes and peds stayed in their lane!
Quote from: tufsu1 on April 10, 2023, 09:39:17 AM
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on April 06, 2023, 12:57:16 AM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 04, 2023, 01:32:45 PM
From the press preview photos, it looks like a dashed centerline was added after FDOT took their video.
Curious, from the photos in Mark Wood's article, if there is heavy bike traffic, is there enough clearance for pedestrians to safely use the path? I wonder if maybe there should have been a bit more width to physically separate pedestrians from bikers. Comments?
It is a 12' wide trail. The general standard for shared-use paths is 10 to 14', depending on usage. In order to truly separate bikes and peds, the trail needed to be at least 13' wide (5' for peds and 8' for two-way bikes). There was discussion when the design was happening about trying to get it to 13-14', but FDOT said it would be very difficult.
That said, I've only seen one marked trail (in Sweden) where bikes and peds stayed in their lane!
Did they say why it would be difficult?
It would've been great to see it future-proofed instead of potentially running into the issue of having to ban either bikes or pedestrians one day.
Likely costs. The trail alone is over $20 million. Getting 12 feet of width included in the bridge project alone is a multi generational accomplishment.
Trash.. is becoming a huge problem, in less than a week. The last time I was up there, I picked up a handful of trash, everything from a tarp, paper plate, pieces of paper, receipts, plastic and more. Mark Woods tweeted the following https://twitter.com/tumarkwoods/status/1645773326357344256?s=61&t=QlvAeVtmwSt6xpcdR1vNag (https://twitter.com/tumarkwoods/status/1645773326357344256?s=61&t=QlvAeVtmwSt6xpcdR1vNag). Of course, there's trash blowing off the Fuller Warren itself, but a group known as "Moms on the Run" were leaving baby water bottles in hiding spots at the base of the path in Riverside. Ugh.. please don't let this be ruined by trash, especially for how long we had to wait for it to open.
Really, really great article gents.
It's an awesome amenity, and a really great step in the right direction for Jax.
Got a chance to check it out Saturday at RAM. Amazing views, particularly of the Cummer's gardens, that you can't get anywhere else. Walked from RAM, across the SUP, past all the hospitals, grabbed a scooter at MOSH, and then rode across the Main Street Bridge, through the CBD, past Brooklyn, and back to RAM. The combo of the pedestrian bridges and scooter share really opens up pretty much everything from the sports district to Riverside, which is just fantastic.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on April 06, 2023, 12:57:16 AM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 04, 2023, 01:32:45 PM
From the press preview photos, it looks like a dashed centerline was added after FDOT took their video.
Curious, from the photos in Mark Wood's article, if there is heavy bike traffic, is there enough clearance for pedestrians to safely use the path? I wonder if maybe there should have been a bit more width to physically separate pedestrians from bikers. Comments?
It's totally fine. I'd imagine Saturday - during the well publicized grand opening - will be one of the more densely populated days for a while on the path, and there was plenty of room for everyone. So long as bikers watch their speeds on the declines and pedestrians are alert (e.g. not staring at their iPhones), I don't think clearance is going to be a big issue.
Walked it last night for the first time and it's great. Great views of downtown and the river south towards NAS.
Only thing that surprised me was how many dirt bikes were there under the bridge and then driving up and down Riverside Avenue. There were several of them driving on the sidewalk at times. It made me wonder if this is a common occurrence there.
Quote from: duvaltilidie on April 11, 2023, 10:55:54 AM
Trash.. is becoming a huge problem, in less than a week. The last time I was up there, I picked up a handful of trash, everything from a tarp, paper plate, pieces of paper, receipts, plastic and more. Mark Woods tweeted the following https://twitter.com/tumarkwoods/status/1645773326357344256?s=61&t=QlvAeVtmwSt6xpcdR1vNag (https://twitter.com/tumarkwoods/status/1645773326357344256?s=61&t=QlvAeVtmwSt6xpcdR1vNag). Of course, there's trash blowing off the Fuller Warren itself, but a group known as "Moms on the Run" were leaving baby water bottles in hiding spots at the base of the path in Riverside. Ugh.. please don't let this be ruined by trash, especially for how long we had to wait for it to open.
Are there garbage cans placed at either end, the midpoint (such as at the lookouts), etc. to facilitate proper disposal? And, are they animal proof, i.e. like the City provided cans for residential use?
I have noticed that garbage cans seem to be in short supply in public spaces sometimes and, rarely, if ever, are they animal proof, even though the City owns tens of thousands for residential pick ups. Aside from 2 legged animals (aka humans), raccoons and possums are everywhere nowadays and are not to be underestimated in their ability to raid garbage cans and spread trash over a wide area.
This issue will also be important for the Emerald Trail to consider. People are lazy (and, often, just plain slobs and inconsiderate) so you can't have too many cans as they will not walk any further than so many feet to throw trash in them. Sad but true. I think trash in our City is worse than other areas I have visited.
Someone on a bike is going to come hauling ass down the west side of that thing and misjudge that corner one day. Plowing into and endoing over that railing would be less than optimal.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on April 15, 2023, 10:39:54 PM
Quote from: duvaltilidie on April 11, 2023, 10:55:54 AM
Trash.. is becoming a huge problem, in less than a week. The last time I was up there, I picked up a handful of trash, everything from a tarp, paper plate, pieces of paper, receipts, plastic and more. Mark Woods tweeted the following https://twitter.com/tumarkwoods/status/1645773326357344256?s=61&t=QlvAeVtmwSt6xpcdR1vNag (https://twitter.com/tumarkwoods/status/1645773326357344256?s=61&t=QlvAeVtmwSt6xpcdR1vNag). Of course, there's trash blowing off the Fuller Warren itself, but a group known as "Moms on the Run" were leaving baby water bottles in hiding spots at the base of the path in Riverside. Ugh.. please don't let this be ruined by trash, especially for how long we had to wait for it to open.
Are there garbage cans placed at either end, the midpoint (such as at the lookouts), etc. to facilitate proper disposal? And, are they animal proof, i.e. like the City provided cans for residential use?
I have noticed that garbage cans seem to be in short supply in public spaces sometimes and, rarely, if ever, are they animal proof, even though the City owns tens of thousands for residential pick ups. Aside from 2 legged animals (aka humans), raccoons and possums are everywhere nowadays and are not to be underestimated in their ability to raid garbage cans and spread trash over a wide area.
This issue will also be important for the Emerald Trail to consider. People are lazy (and, often, just plain slobs and inconsiderate) so you can't have too many cans as they will not walk any further than so many feet to throw trash in them. Sad but true. I think trash in our City is worse than other areas I have visited.
Unfortunately, the closest trash can on the Riverside Avenue side is the one at RAM, closest to the street. There isn't 1 trash can on the entire SUP, and on the San Marco side, I believe there's 1 at the street level, closest to the lights. I might reach out to a friend who I believe has some contacts, who often does cleanups around town. It's needed, especially with how long the path is, some people won't want to carry trash with them. Also, I recently found 3 cans of flavored sparkling water sitting at the base of a light-post, just behind one of the lookouts. They were placed ever so "neatly" and all it would've taken is a huge gust of wind to knock them into the river below. I stowed them away in the bag on my bike & disposed of them properly.
Quote from: acme54321 on April 16, 2023, 12:50:30 AM
Someone on a bike is going to come hauling ass down the west side of that thing and misjudge that corner one day. Plowing into and endoing over that railing would be less than optimal.
Having rode the path around 15ish times now, I concur. Proper signage to warn bicyclists of the blind turn, with a post in the middle at the bottom, as well as the winding path once you're at the bottom would be a good idea.
It took Norway less time to build a 3km walking path underground than it took FDOT to build an elevated sidewalk.
QuoteFyllingsdalstunnelen, as it's known, opened on April 15 with a family day of sporting activities, following four years of construction that began in February 2019. The state-funded mega-project cost close to $29 million, or 300 million Norwegian kroner.
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/worlds-longest-cycling-tunnel/index.html
Mark Woods calls out FDOT for lack of trash cans and public trashing of the SUP. How long does it take to put garbage cans out... Can't FDOt do anything quickly? No one thought about that before it opened?
QuoteMark Woods: Within days of opening, the new bridge path was trashed. And then it wasn't.
....The Fuller Warren path was a Florida Department of Transportation project. So it's the state, not the city, that handles cleanup....
....This leads to one of the issues with the Fuller Warren SUP when it opened: a lack of trash receptacles.
There's a reason another Main Street, the one at Disney, is known for being clean. It's partly because there's always a trash can nearby, and partly because there's always an employee nearby picking up trash.
Not that I want trash cans lining the Fuller Warren path. It should remain unobstructed. But there should at least be cans at the ends of it — and they should at least be emptied as often as required to keep them from overflowing.
Goss said FDOT officials are working with contractors to put trash cans at the entrances of the path. He also said it takes more than that to keep roadways and paths clean....
https://www.jacksonville.com/story/news/columns/mark-woods/2023/04/18/keeping-new-fuller-warren-shared-use-path-free-of-litter-a-challenge/70119856007/