Another fintech company coming to Jax and is evaluating multiple sites including Downtown
QuoteJacksonville has beat out Atlanta and other U.S. cities to get the North American headquarters of Paysafe Ltd., a London firm that does online payment processing across the globe.
The move will bring 600 jobs to the Jacksonville area, with the company close to leasing office space.
...
The company is in conversations with a few potential sites for the office — Lowthers said "yes" when asked if he was looking at downtown or the area around the St. Johns Town Center — with a decision expected in the next few weeks.
https://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2022/11/14/paysafe-jacksonville-hq.html
Would up to 600 jobs fit in Shad's new office building?
Nice to get the jobs. $10 million in incentives isn't terrible.
^ No, I don't think Shad's building will fit much more than his own ventures, between the Jags front office and AEW and Iguana it'll be full enough.
Worth noting that Bill Foley and Fidelity/FIS/Black Knight/D&B are pretty tied up with this, so I"d be surprised if this didn't end up in the vicinity of those. Either in Brooklyn or the Town Center building D&B is in.
Quote from: Charles Hunter on November 14, 2022, 10:41:32 PM
Would up to 600 jobs fit in Shad's new office building?
No. Only about 40,000 sqft of space is not taken. You could fit 150-200 people max in that space.
Thanks. I guess it is good news that Shad's building is getting full.
Based on the 40K sqft = 150 -200 people, they will need 120,000 to 160,000 square feet?
Paysafe is a payments company which is what I thought FIS is. So, seems a little funny that Foley is directly or indirectly connected to both companies. I wonder if one day FIS comes around and buys out Paysafe to consolidate interests. That thought could also be in the back of someone's mind in locating Paysafe in Jax for now.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 15, 2022, 12:03:52 PM
Paysafe is a payments company which is what I thought FIS is. So, seems a little funny that Foley is directly or indirectly connected to both companies. I wonder if one day FIS comes around and buys out Paysafe to consolidate interests. That thought could also be in the back of someone's mind in locating Paysafe in Jax for now.
Bill Foley probably owns some FIS stock, but he isn't even on the board. This is definitely direct competition with several former FIS executives in management and the board.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 15, 2022, 12:03:52 PM
Paysafe is a payments company which is what I thought FIS is. So, seems a little funny that Foley is directly or indirectly connected to both companies. I wonder if one day FIS comes around and buys out Paysafe to consolidate interests. That thought could also be in the back of someone's mind in locating Paysafe in Jax for now.
This is a definitely yes and a consolidation will come someday. If you read the article in Dailey Record last week, FIS returns were lower and the plans costs cutting. It also says that FIS is way behind on services outside NA. Perfect opportunity to grow in Europe. And with all the management interconnections with FIS Black Knight and Brad and Dunstreet in Jax, it makes sense.
Quote from: JPalmer on November 15, 2022, 12:20:16 PM
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 15, 2022, 12:03:52 PM
Paysafe is a payments company which is what I thought FIS is. So, seems a little funny that Foley is directly or indirectly connected to both companies. I wonder if one day FIS comes around and buys out Paysafe to consolidate interests. That thought could also be in the back of someone's mind in locating Paysafe in Jax for now.
Bill Foley probably owns some FIS stock, but he isn't even on the board. This is definitely direct competition with several former FIS executives in management and the board.
Let me connect some more dots for you...
Anthony Jabbour is CEO of D & B and Black Knight (another Foley interest) and sits on Paysafe's board. Bill Foley is chairman of the board of D & B. I think it reasonable to suspect that they discussed this at some point and that Foley provided feedback/advice to Jabbour and/or others involved 8). Foley buys/sells/trades companies all the time so you can be sure he is keeping an eye on this.
QuoteConversations between Jacksonville economic development officials and Paysafe took place during the economic development trip done in conjunction with the Jacksonville Jaguars' London game. They were aided by having Anthony Jabbour — the CEO of Dun & Bradstreet, who calls Jacksonville home — on Paysafe's board.
https://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2022/11/14/paysafe-jacksonville-hq.html
Another of Foley's companies, Cannae holdings, does business with all of the affiliated companies. I'm sure Foley still owns millions in FIS stock and was on the board as recently as 5 years ago. I doubt that much happens at these companies without his knowledge/blessing.
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 15, 2022, 06:57:51 PM
Quote from: JPalmer on November 15, 2022, 12:20:16 PM
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 15, 2022, 12:03:52 PM
Paysafe is a payments company which is what I thought FIS is. So, seems a little funny that Foley is directly or indirectly connected to both companies. I wonder if one day FIS comes around and buys out Paysafe to consolidate interests. That thought could also be in the back of someone's mind in locating Paysafe in Jax for now.
Bill Foley probably owns some FIS stock, but he isn't even on the board. This is definitely direct competition with several former FIS executives in management and the board.
Let me connect some more dots for you...
Anthony Jabbour is CEO of D & B and Black Knight (another Foley interest) and sits on Paysafe's board. Bill Foley is chairman of the board of D & B. I think it reasonable to suspect that they discussed this at some point and that Foley provided feedback/advice to Jabbour and/or others involved 8). Foley buys/sells/trades companies all the time so you can be sure he is keeping an eye on this.
QuoteConversations between Jacksonville economic development officials and Paysafe took place during the economic development trip done in conjunction with the Jacksonville Jaguars' London game. They were aided by having Anthony Jabbour — the CEO of Dun & Bradstreet, who calls Jacksonville home — on Paysafe's board.
https://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2022/11/14/paysafe-jacksonville-hq.html
I worked at FIS for years, I don't need the dots connected.
^ I don't track your work history and can only go by what you post. That aside, others may not know the interconnected web of Foley's interests so info you knew but omitted brings context to my take for many.
The city is giving a rather unusual $10 million cash payment to Paysafe for coming to Jacksonville that will necessitate the creation of a new category of grant.
Any conjecture on whether Paysafe would have come regardless considering the connections discussed above?
Seems to be an emerging trend in the last two years or so where, instead of just handing out things like REV grants, we're handing out more multi-million dollar cash grants and completion grants.
QuoteThe Jacksonville City Council is expected to introduce legislation Nov. 22 that would award $10.1 million in cash grants to online payment provider Paysafe Ltd. to bring its North American headquarters and 600 jobs to Northeast Florida.
The bill, filed Nov. 16 by Mayor Lenny Curry's administration, includes an exhibit estimating the city's incentives package for London-based Paysafe's $51.5 project would have a negative return for taxpayers.
Full article: https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/city-council-to-introduce-dollar10-1-million-incentives-package-for-paysafe-headquarters
60 cents on the dollar isn't great, although I wonder if this accounts for the economic benefit of 600 high-salary employees being in town and spending money here.
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/paysafe-planning-reverse-stock-split
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on November 18, 2022, 08:59:02 PM
^ I don't track your work history and can only go by what you post. That aside, others may not know the interconnected web of Foley's interests so info you knew but omitted brings context to my take for many.
All I am saying is Bruce Lowthers, Bill Foley and others have a lot less loyalty to FIS than y'all want to give credit. PaySafe was taken public through Foley's SPAC. He clearly is interested in developing a direct competition to FIS, yet he may still own millions in FIS stock, that's just being diversified and hedging your bet.
A 92% drop in the stock price over the last 18 months and the just announced 12-1 reverse stock split doesn't make me feel particularly great about Paysafe's stability/ability to aggressively add hundreds of $150k+ jobs in the short term. $10 million is a lot of cash to hand out...
Quote from: Charles Hunter on November 15, 2022, 11:45:32 AM
Thanks. I guess it is good news that Shad's building is getting full.
Based on the 40K sqft = 150 -200 people, they will need 120,000 to 160,000 square feet?
Or, 38,000 square feet at the Town Center ::)
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2023/apr/05/paysafe-ltd-chooses-headquarters-space-in-town-center-two/
$10 million cash grant from the city for 38,000 square feet at the Town Center.
Maybe its the way that it was covered in the media but that turned out to be a little more underwhelming than initially anticipated.
Quote from: Ken_FSU on April 05, 2023, 10:21:11 AM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on November 15, 2022, 11:45:32 AM
Thanks. I guess it is good news that Shad's building is getting full.
Based on the 40K sqft = 150 -200 people, they will need 120,000 to 160,000 square feet?
Or, 38,000 square feet at the Town Center ::)
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/news/2023/apr/05/paysafe-ltd-chooses-headquarters-space-in-town-center-two/
$10 million cash grant from the city for 38,000 square feet at the Town Center.
More details from the article:
QuoteLess than a month later, City Council approved a $10.1 million cash incentives package to finalize the company's North American headquarters consolidation in Jacksonville. That was in addition to $3 million from the state's High Impact Performance Incentive program.
Founded in 1996, Paysafe offers payment processing, digital wallet and online cash solutions.
Paysafe says it is bringing 600 jobs to Northeast Florida. It is posting job openings on paysafe.com.
Wonder how much the City and State would pay me to not relocate from Jacksonville ;D? Based on 600 jobs here, I figure I am entitled to at least $21,667 for staying around. I think I am worth every penny of that, for sure 8).
Seems not-optimal for us as a city that we're struggling to revitalize downtown and manage traffic while handing companies 8 figures to locate in the suburbs.
Something is missing from the story. The article says PaySafe "is bringing 600 jobs to Northeast Florida." They aren't going to fit in 38,000 square feet - that's only 63 square feet per employee. Will there be another funding/subsidy ask for the space needed for those 600 employees?
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 05, 2023, 12:00:21 PM
Something is missing from the story. The article says PaySafe "is bringing 600 jobs to Northeast Florida." They aren't going to fit in 38,000 square feet - that's only 63 square feet per employee. Will there be another funding/subsidy ask for the space needed for those 600 employees?
I still don't buy a universe where PaySafe is in a position to aggressively add jobs in Jacksonville.
Stock is in the tank, most of the tech/fintech sector is cutting jobs faster than they're adding them, and the company is carrying like $3 billion in debt.
(https://snipboard.io/V2QZ18.jpg)
The headquarters sure feels like a bait and switch too.
Per the Daily Record article, the build-out cost looks to be around $2.6 million:
QuoteLondon-based Paysafe Ltd. appears to be setting up its North American headquarters in Town Center Two, the St. Johns Town Center-area office building owned by Dun & Bradstreet Inc. The city is reviewing a permit for DPR Construction to demolish and build-out the 38,000-square-foot fourth floor of the six-story building at 5335 Gate Parkway. The demolition cost is $70,000 and the build-out is listed at $2.5 million.
When the $10 million incentive deal was sold to the city, PaySafe promised (https://www.bizjournals.com/jacksonville/news/2022/11/18/paysafe-hq-incentives.html) an investment magnitudes larger in the new HQ.
QuoteAs well as creating 600 jobs with an average wage of $150,000 over the coming three years, Paysafe says it will invest $51.5 million in the HQ facility.
Seems like about a third of the $10 million is tied to job creation. $3.6 million will be paid out based on employment ($6k per job). So, at least there's some clawback opportunity there if the 600 jobs don't come to fruition. But man, I don't know how you build a $51.5 million, 600-employee HQ if your plan is to take over a single floor of a suburban office complex at the shopping mall.
Quote from: marcuscnelson on April 05, 2023, 11:28:51 AM
Seems not-optimal for us as a city that we're struggling to revitalize downtown and manage traffic while handing companies 8 figures to locate in the suburbs.
THIS all day long!!
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 05, 2023, 12:00:21 PM
Something is missing from the story. The article says PaySafe "is bringing 600 jobs to Northeast Florida." They aren't going to fit in 38,000 square feet - that's only 63 square feet per employee. Will there be another funding/subsidy ask for the space needed for those 600 employees?
Oh don't worry, they will likely all be work from home jobs, so who knows if they'll even be in Northeast FL!!
What's the point of having a "corporate HQ" if there is no real corporate presence to be had? This city is run by fools...this whole thing was so underwhelming and should have gone downtown (along with Dun & Bradstreet). City leaders *only* focused on throwing money at downtown apartments. How about downtown jobs for the downtown apartment residents?? How about downtown workers for the downtown bars and restaurants?
Another bad deal for the real estate community (biased here I know), but we are a city of owner-users all across the board. Major landowning families retain most of the development land left and don't have much need for the brokerage community. The largest retail landlords in town are all big families that don't use third-party brokers, and never sell their assets to investors. The largest office deals now are all done with owner-users to the exclusion of brokers, and it's all self-serving anyway (the big FIS ecosystem). Brokers who have connections to out of state investors don't have much product to bring their clients here in Jax.
There is a lot missing here...
Quote from: simms3 on April 07, 2023, 01:28:54 PM
Quote from: Charles Hunter on April 05, 2023, 12:00:21 PM
Something is missing from the story. The article says PaySafe "is bringing 600 jobs to Northeast Florida." They aren't going to fit in 38,000 square feet - that's only 63 square feet per employee. Will there be another funding/subsidy ask for the space needed for those 600 employees?
Oh don't worry, they will likely all be work from home jobs, so who knows if they'll even be in Northeast FL!!
What's the point of having a "corporate HQ" if there is no real corporate presence to be had? This city is run by fools...this whole thing was so underwhelming and should have gone downtown (along with Dun & Bradstreet). City leaders *only* focused on throwing money at downtown apartments. How about downtown jobs for the downtown apartment residents?? How about downtown workers for the downtown bars and restaurants?
Another bad deal for the real estate community (biased here I know), but we are a city of owner-users all across the board. Major landowning families retain most of the development land left and don't have much need for the brokerage community. The largest retail landlords in town are all big families that don't use third-party brokers, and never sell their assets to investors. The largest office deals now are all done with owner-users to the exclusion of brokers, and it's all self-serving anyway (the big FIS ecosystem). Brokers who have connections to out of state investors don't have much product to bring their clients here in Jax.
There is a lot missing here...
Extremely well said. There are deeper pockets outside of town, with little opportunity to be in the game like major local landowners. Not to mention DT office space is cheap and abundant.