I'm assuming this would mean another demolition of a downtown building (618 W Forsyth St)
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/dailys-may-open-downtown-gas-station-and-convenience-store (https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/dailys-may-open-downtown-gas-station-and-convenience-store)
QuoteJEA is reviewing a service availability request for First Coast Energy to develop a Daily's gas station and convenience store Downtown.
The March 25 request identifies the 1.4-acre block bounded by Bay, Broad, Forsyth and Jefferson streets.
A former bank drive-thru at 60 N. Broad St. built in 1976 and a three-story building, a former nightclub, at 618 W. Forsyth St. built in 1914 are on the site.
LoopNet.com states the nightclub structure is under contract.
Civil engineer England-Thims & Miller asks JEA to review the availability of utilities for the site, which is owned by Mark L. Rosenberg.
Rosenberg, a lawyer, referred questions to First Coast Energy.
First Coast Energy said it didn't have ownership of property in that area.
"We do not own any site downtown so I am not in a position to comment on development plans," said First Coast Energy Chief Operating Officer John Rodriguez in an email.
JEA is reviewing the availability of electric, water, sewer and reuse services.
Jacksonville-based First Coast Energy owns and operates 37 Daily's stores across the state, according to its website. They sell Shell gasoline.
Daily's also has developed its Dash fast-casual cafe concept that sells breakfast and lunch sandwiches, soups, salads, desserts and specialty coffee drinks.
It's hard to keep up with the level of demolitions for proposals that don't necessary fit with the vision of a vibrant, unique pedestrian friendly downtown core. These types of things will keep happening until we put some meat behind the importance of preservation and adaptive reuse, in the form of public policy.
The site is a complete eyesore other than the mural on the side of the building. Nearly anything would be a better use of that site.
Quote from: Peter Griffin on April 01, 2020, 08:22:31 AM
The site is a complete eyesore other than the mural on the side of the building. Nearly anything would be a better use of that site.
I completely disagree. That building should most definitely be preserved.
I agree that it's harder to argue for saving the one rundown building that remains on this site.
Had all the surrounding buildings not already been torn down, demanding reuse has a much stronger argument. These remaining historical buildings that are more disparately placed are going to be harder to save. Doesn't mean they can't be, but it was clear as long as the fire station remained in Brooklyn the longer there was just going to be an empty building surrounded by new development.
Why the F do we need a gas station downtown. That is the opposite of what this city needs.
This is a larger site than their station at Atlantic/Kings and the 3 story building only takes up about 10% of the space. If they don't plan to put in a car wash, it should be easy for them to preserve the 3 story building and put it to use. After what they put up on Hendricks and the Gate station fiasco in Brooklyn I'm not very optimistic, but if DDRB rolls over on this I think we should just dissolve the organization.
I'm not sure the DDRB has any control over if the building is demolished or not. The current property owner could apply for a demolition permit today and raze ASAP with little public notification, regardless of if Daily's buys the property or not.
Here is an image of the building:
(https://photos.moderncities.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Neighborhoods/LaVilla-Red-Light-District-December-2017/i-QB2Tr4Z/0/e24ea6a7/L/20171209_122109-L.jpg)
Also the post we made on our IG account about its history:
QuoteTwenty million immigrants arrived in the United States between 1890 and 1920. These early immigrant entrepreneurs tended to reside near their businesses or places of employment. While the Florida East Coast Railroad was one of the most energetic promoters of enticing immigrants to Florida, #Jacksonville's early #Greek settlers arrived from Southern Greece and #Turkey as sailors from ships that docked along the riverfront.
In the case of the city's early Greek population, the majority favored occupations in food-related enterprises such as restaurants and fruit markets. Anchored by wholesale grocery, produce, and fruit markets, a compact corridor near West Bay and Broad Streets quickly became a preferred location for the immigrant community.
A sign of the city's growing Greek population was the establishment of the Greek and Syrian Club by A.K. Carazar in 1915 which was once located at 618 West Forsyth Street. This part of #dtjax's history was largely erased with the razing of LaVilla during the 1990s. During the early 2000s, it was the home of Club Kartouche. Kartouche was a nightclub known for Latin, rave, R&B and hip-hop featuring the likes of Ludacris and Trick Daddy during Super Bowl XXXIX. Now one of the last buildings associated with #Jax's lost early Greek community could be on the chopping block. A Daily's gas station and convenience store is now proposed for the entire block.
Going strictly off of Google Maps, the building looks pretty sound. Four store fronts and 8-12 apartments would be pretty do-able. Unfortunately, it would be an island unto itself unless something was built in the same block.
Regardless, a gas station adds nothing of value and I am surprised that one would even be allowed by the zoning code. An entire block consumed for a gas station is about as bad as it gets.
Quote from: thelakelander on April 01, 2020, 09:16:16 AM
I'm not sure the DDRB has any control over if the building is demolished or not. The current property owner could apply for a demolition permit today and raze ASAP with little public notification, regardless of if Daily's buys the property or not.
I think that's the problem right there.
Given that they likely DON'T need to take down the building, this could be a good opportunity to do an urban gas station. They do exist, just not here. I don't think anyone will be upset about the demolition of the bank drive-through, so do a cool urban gas station and I'm fine with it.
demolition would be harder if it already is or gets landmarked - same as the First Baptist discussion
First, having a suburban-style gas station prominently located at an equally prominent gateway to downtown would be the ultimate monument to Jacksonville's history of demolishing both its historic character and its downtown feel.
And, its a perfect tribute to our infatuation with the automobile-centric mentality of downtown planning. Not to be lost is the vibe sent by it being in the shadows of the mass transit Skyway and JTA's new intermodal transit terminal and being along side a bus rapid transit corridor. Oh, the irony!
At least they should cleverly design the site to put the convenience store portion inside the ground floor of the historic structure and lease out the upper floors. If the gas station mimicked the size of some Manhattan style stations (see image below), there could even be adequate on-site parking for the tenants. There certainly doesn't need to be a dozen pump islands for Downtown. How about just 2 or 3. The real money is in the convenience store as I understand it anyway. The pumps are just a hook to get you to pull in.
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/c_scale,f_auto,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/cowtsqmcbjxiaackb6ep.png)
(https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/12/65/67/0a/the-hotel-perpendicular.jpg)
This would work as well.
^Like your picture, I saw a station in Manhattan of similar style. The only picture I could find is the one below. Not sure if this is the same one (this is also in Manhattan) that I recall, but if not, it is very close to the image I had in mind. Shows what can be done if a little creativity is applied. Unfortunately, that is in short supply in Jacksonville :(
(https://mattweberphotos.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/exxon-76-amst-1993-copy.jpg?w=1292&h=836)
^Those were in Jax too. That's what gas stations used to look like 80 years ago. We tore our gas stations like that down decades ago.
(https://photos.moderncities.com/Cities/Jacksonville/History/Florida-State-Archives/i-5ZNj2dB/0/dfac0623/L/Slide3-L.jpg)
.J. Daley, Inc. in LaVilla in 1940. Courtesy of the State Archives of Florida
I seriously doubt Daily's will build anything like that. The most "urban" thing they've done around here is the gas station off Atlantic in San Marco. Even that would be a horrible use of a full or half downtown city block.
It's good to see folks getting uppity over a gas station. Things are returning to normal. :)
Hey! That last picture is of a Daley's!! OK, the spelling is different.