Quote(https://photos.moderncities.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Development/First-Baptist-Church-Downtown-Jacksonville/i-FXDftnf/0/31c3a46f/L/Untitled-1-L.jpg)
The national trend of declining church attendance has finally impacted Downtown Jacksonville. Struggling to maintain 1.5 million square feet of space, the First Baptist Church approved plans to sell off nine blocks of its urban campus in order to survive.
Read More: https://www.thejaxsonmag.com/article/first-baptist-ready-to-sell-nine-blocks-of-downtown-jax/
Some very interesting potential uses for these properties. Let's hope it moves forward in a positive way for everyone involved. Putting 2 auditoriums on the market is really a *huge* change.
I'm less thrilled about demolishing the old Sunday School building for smaller new one with a fancy entrance, but maybe they'll be amenable to working on that.
Just saw 125 West Church on Google street view. It would be a shame to lose another perfectly functional, historic building with character.
Yea, I'm not exactly sure why it is believed that the demolition or modern mid-block entrance is needed. If gathering space is needed, I hope some additional creativity is explored, including revamping the streetscape and sidewalk width of Hogan and Church Streets. Doing so would likely reduce the amount of loan money the financially struggling institution would need to restore the Hobson Block.
The other thing that makes no sense is I'm assuming the plan is to keep the garage on that block, so wouldn't a more urban-centric welcome center that ties into the garage make more sense? Like....do something INSIDE the existing building accessible from both the street and the garage?
Quote from: thelakelander on September 09, 2019, 11:48:25 AM
Yea, I'm not exactly sure why it is believed that the demolition or modern mid-block entrance is needed. If gathering space is needed, I hope some additional creativity is explored, including revamping the streetscape and sidewalk width of Hogan and Church Streets. Doing so would likely reduce the amount of loan money the financially struggling institution would need to restore the Hobson Block.
Thinking of what I remember of the building and what it looks like from the image, I wonder if they're planning on configuring the Hobson church to open from the back, and have the entrance coming in from that new welcome center. I'm not sure how it's configured now but you'd think it would be just as easy to have it open from the street.
The FAQs are interesting. They appear to be focusing more on their suburban campuses for future growth. It also sounds like First Baptist Academy isn't long for this world, at least Downtown.
Quote
What happens if membership grows more? How do we fit them in the Hobson?
We are praying that our church will grow, and we expect that we will. Our plan is to accommodate growth through multiple services and multiple locations.
...
What will happen to the Academy?
We are working with the head of school and the FBA board on transitional and long-term plans for the school.
https://www.fbcjax.com/thestorycontinues
^That building, block and adjacent garage would quickly get gobbled up by a charter school or college, IMO.
A massive opportunity to be sure. That said, I could see it mostly being a missed opportunity.
Some buildings and parcels would lend themselves to a quick sale, like 2 & 7. Hard to see a buyer for the garages except the city.
Seems like a 10,000 seat Auditorium could be turn into something significant like a Conference/Convention Center but we all know what the future of that is.
Quote from: vicupstate on September 09, 2019, 01:00:36 PM
A massive opportunity to be sure. That said, I could see it mostly being a missed opportunity.
Some buildings and parcels would lend themselves to a quick sale, like 2 & 7. Hard to see a buyer for the garages except the city.
Seems like a 10,000 seat Auditorium could be turn into something significant like a Conference/Convention Center but we all know what the future of that is.
Yea, I'm not holding my breath for any great outcome. Without the Sunday church crowd the parking garages are completely worthless and that is half of the properties.
You hear the term "catalytic" a lot in terms of big-ticket developments like the Shipyards and the District, but this is the real deal right here.
Nine blocks becoming available, perhaps at once, in the most strategically important corridor in downtown Jacksonville.
I hope First Baptist and JEA are talking, as the JEA tower could be an amazing complimentary redevelopment for whatever happens with FBC.
I wonder if Atkins would be interested in modifying his old JEA plan to include some of the FBC property:
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/atkins-wants-more-urban-core-development
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 09, 2019, 03:10:00 PM
You hear the term "catalytic" a lot in terms of big-ticket developments like the Shipyards and the District, but this is the real deal right here.
Nine blocks becoming available, perhaps at once, in the most strategically important corridor in downtown Jacksonville.
I hope First Baptist and JEA are talking, as the JEA tower could be an amazing complimentary redevelopment for whatever happens with FBC.
I wonder if Atkins would be interested in modifying his old JEA plan to include some of the FBC property:
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/atkins-wants-more-urban-core-development
I'd agree. This is truly a once in a generational thing that's coming open - 8 blocks in the core of downtown doesn't happen often. While I honestly don't think the mayor is going to be that focused on it (let him play with his Lot J), this could be WAY more impactful.
If done right.
Quote from: Kerry on September 09, 2019, 01:52:37 PM
Quote from: vicupstate on September 09, 2019, 01:00:36 PM
A massive opportunity to be sure. That said, I could see it mostly being a missed opportunity.
Some buildings and parcels would lend themselves to a quick sale, like 2 & 7. Hard to see a buyer for the garages except the city.
Seems like a 10,000 seat Auditorium could be turn into something significant like a Conference/Convention Center but we all know what the future of that is.
Yea, I'm not holding my breath for any great outcome. Without the Sunday church crowd the parking garages are completely worthless and that is half of the properties.
I think those garages would be pretty valuable to whoever is buying the other parcels. Probably more valuable than the auditorium itself because it's essentially a massive single use building that is way to big for that use, hence the sale. Whoever redevelops the other parcels is going to need parking like it or not.
Quote from: acme54321 on September 09, 2019, 03:39:13 PM
Quote from: Kerry on September 09, 2019, 01:52:37 PM
Quote from: vicupstate on September 09, 2019, 01:00:36 PM
A massive opportunity to be sure. That said, I could see it mostly being a missed opportunity.
Some buildings and parcels would lend themselves to a quick sale, like 2 & 7. Hard to see a buyer for the garages except the city.
Seems like a 10,000 seat Auditorium could be turn into something significant like a Conference/Convention Center but we all know what the future of that is.
Yea, I'm not holding my breath for any great outcome. Without the Sunday church crowd the parking garages are completely worthless and that is half of the properties.
I think those garages would be pretty valuable to whoever is buying the other parcels. Probably more valuable than the auditorium itself because it's essentially a massive single use building that is way to big for that use, hence the sale. Whoever redevelops the other parcels is going to need parking like it or not.
A major office building on Block 5 could use the garage in Block 4 or Block 8 in theory. But if you are going to build an office building that big, why would you put it there? Brooklyn, LaVilla, the now vacant City Hall/courthouse site or even Lot J would be more appealing. And those parcels would not require an expensive demo and debris removal that Block 5 requires.
3 of the 9 blocks are for parking, and each other block is at worst diagonal from said parking garages. You COULD put in another Wells Fargo Tower, BofA tower, Everbank building, Vystar tower, whatever the Wachovia building is called now, and a BB&T building on the remaining 6 with the necessary parking mostly already there.
This property essentially frees up an additional ~50% of the CBD for development. Huge news.
Quote from: Steve on September 09, 2019, 03:21:06 PM
Quote from: Ken_FSU on September 09, 2019, 03:10:00 PM
You hear the term "catalytic" a lot in terms of big-ticket developments like the Shipyards and the District, but this is the real deal right here.
Nine blocks becoming available, perhaps at once, in the most strategically important corridor in downtown Jacksonville.
I hope First Baptist and JEA are talking, as the JEA tower could be an amazing complimentary redevelopment for whatever happens with FBC.
I wonder if Atkins would be interested in modifying his old JEA plan to include some of the FBC property:
https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/atkins-wants-more-urban-core-development
I'd agree. This is truly a once in a generational thing that's coming open - 8 blocks in the core of downtown doesn't happen often. While I honestly don't think the mayor is going to be that focused on it (let him play with his Lot J), this could be WAY more impactful.
If done right.
The Mayor not focusing on this may be a good thing for the potential development of these blocks.
Quote from: Charles Hunter on September 09, 2019, 05:11:05 PM
The Mayor not focusing on this may be a good thing for the potential development of these blocks.
Exactly!
My prayers have been answered. We need FBC out of downtown completely but this will do for now
No one is going to build anything that would require this much parking.
Quote from: JaGoaT on September 09, 2019, 07:29:41 PM
My prayers have been answered. We need FBC out of downtown completely but this will do for now
Easy, tiger.
Quote from: Kerry on September 09, 2019, 08:07:27 PM
No one is going to build anything that would require this much parking.
Never say never, and even if you're right, nothing wrong with having it available. It might mean we can build on some surface lots.
Quote from: Kerry on September 09, 2019, 08:07:27 PM
No one is going to build anything that would require this much parking.
I believe there are a ton of possibilities worth being explored. Here are a few off the top of my head:
(https://photos.moderncities.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Development/First-Baptist-Church-Downtown-Jacksonville/i-FXDftnf/0/31c3a46f/L/Untitled-1-L.jpg)
1. JTA plans to sell off the land around Rosa Park skyway station for TOD when the JRTC opens in LaVilla. Such a development could be constructed without building parking on those blocks by acquiring and using an existing FBC garage (like Block #8).
2. In the past, FSCJ has talked about desiring to make the downtown campus more a traditional college campus. They've also discussed acquiring downtown buildings and retrofitting them for the college's use. The dormitory in 20 West Adams is an example. That smaller auditorium and adjacent classroom building (Block #6 on the map) may make some sense for a college program, as opposed to them building a new STEM building. Those garages would also mean that infill development could occur on the surface lots surrounding their existing property.
3. If they close or relocate their academy (Block #3), without a doubt, that block will likely get snatched up by a local college or put to use as a charter school. Whatever the case, they'll need parking which is what (Block #4) could provide.
4. Blocks #10 and #7 are surface lots for the most part. There's also a single story 1990s era warehouse on Block 10. With one of those garages (Block #9 or #8), one could get way with infill on the south side of Beaver and utilize an existing garage for on-site parking.
The best use of these blocks would appear to be as a joint use for educational purposes by UNF, JU and/or FSCJ. UNF and JU could build dorms, rooms for visiting "executive MBA-type" or short term certification programs and classrooms on the vacant land around these properties and/or by re-purposing some of the more conventional buildings.
With an influx of students they could utilize the garages for parking AND add retail to the first floor of the garages leading to the remaking of Beaver Street as a vibrant "college town" pedestrian friendly town-center-style retail arcade.
FSCJ really could use one of the two available auditoriums for a large theater building as all they have for a 50,000+ student body is the paltry 500 seat Wilson theater on the south campus. That isn't any bigger than many high school auditoriums and they have to use a gym for any larger gatherings.
First Baptist also has a first class (at least at one time) TV/multimedia production facility that would be ideal for in-house and internet-based educational programs. They also had at one time recital/practice rooms for piano and other musical endeavors that, if still around, could support a very robust performing arts school program.
Some of the vacant blocks could be used as green space for students to enjoy a campus-style gathering/center point.
The colleges, DIA, the City and the State need to waste no time figuring out how to make this into the major urban educational campus everyone says downtown needs to thrive. Being so far back from the river and adjacent to FSCJ and the Rosa Parks station further enhances its highest and best use for higher education.
With Lot J, the Shipyards, the former City Hall/Courthouse site, Berkman Plaza II, the Landing, JEA's current building, the former Greyhound station, the District and LaVilla, there would appear to be a near glut of better positioned real estate for more conventional development such as offices, residential, nightlife and entertainment.
My 2 cents 8)!
Ten skyscrapers on each block ranging in height from 550 feet to 1,100 feet. Just kidding and playing guys, y'all know I'm a tall and super tall skyscraper fanatic. What I would like to see happen to these city blocks is for them to NOT become green open empty grass fields, parking lots, or undeveloped land that just sits long after we are all pushing up daisies!
Quote from: heights unknown on September 10, 2019, 08:37:07 PM
What I would like to see happen to these city blocks is for them to NOT become green open empty grass fields, parking lots, or undeveloped land that just sits long after we are all pushing up daisies!
I'm with you!
Best case scenario is that they sell for immediate reuse.
Worst case scenario is that they sell to an investor on long-term speculation.
I'm expecting the For Sale sign to be up for a very long time.
Quote from: Kerry on September 11, 2019, 07:43:37 AM
I'm expecting the For Sale sign to be up for a very long time.
FBC's for Sale signs? I believe the opposite. Once they are officially listed, I think they'll sell somewhat quickly. FBC is cash hungry; this is the equivalent of the person selling their house because they lost their job.
Now, could they sell it to someone that sits on it? Obviously that could happen.
The article in today's T-U seems to suggest the church is not 'cash hungry' or planning to put up For Sale signs tomorrow. I imagine they will save some money immediately by stopping any maintenance anywhere except the block they plan to keep.
There is no guarantee that these parcels flip and immediately see redevelopment.
^The Daily Record article makes it sound significantly more urgent, saying the church is in "cardiac arrest" and "bleeding money from its pores."
Made it sound like a sale might happen quickly, as soon as Q4.
jaxdailyrecord.com/article/first-baptist-church-in-cardiac-arrest--to-downsize-its-downtown-campus
Quote from: vicupstate on September 11, 2019, 11:23:40 AM
The article in today's T-U seems to suggest the church is not 'cash hungry' or planning to put up For Sale signs tomorrow. I imagine they will save some money immediately by stopping any maintenance anywhere except the block they plan to keep.
There is no guarantee that these parcels flip and immediately see redevelopment.
From what I'm nearing (both from the Daily Record article and from them directly) is that they're already spending money they don't have.
I didn't say they'd be redeveloped immediately, but I think a sale by 2020Q1 is not unlikely.
For those that think a quick sale and eminent redevelopment is in the cards, what is it about downtown Jax in the last 40 years that gives you this optimism?
From a practical stand point, if you had the money why would you even consider these properties when there is an ample supply of properties with much better locations. The only frontage on State St (the primary thoroughfare) are 3 parking garages and a giant blank wall, and even if you did put something in you are still located in homeless central.
Finally, I don't think FSCJ would be any more interested in these properties than I am. They are already sitting on more acres of parking than they are classroom space by a factor of 5, and any student parking here would have to cross both State and Unions streets which would become pedestrian kill zones.
Of course, I could be totally wrong.
Quote from: Kerry on September 11, 2019, 01:22:36 PM
For those that think a quick sale and eminent redevelopment is in the cards, what is it about downtown Jax in the last 40 years that gives you this optimism?
From a practical stand point, if you had the money why would you even consider these properties when there is an ample supply of properties with much better locations. The only frontage on State St (the primary thoroughfare) are 3 parking garages and a giant blank wall, and even if you did put something in you are still located in homeless central.
Finally, I don't think FSCJ would be any more interested in these properties than I am. They are already sitting on more acres of parking than they are classroom space by a factor of 5, and any student parking here would have to cross both State and Unions streets which would become pedestrian kill zones.
Of course, I could be totally wrong.
Motivated Seller (again, see my point about the person selling his or her house because of being let go at work). Any piece of property can be sold tomorrow downtown....for the right price. Many properties aren't priced realistically in my opinion.
Now, do I think they'll price this at Chapter 11 liquidation prices? No, I didn't say that. But, I think they'll be priced competitively.
They've already been quietly selling off property. This building was sold in November 2018:
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Development/First-Baptist-Church-Downtown-Jacksonville/i-PCdMbbs/0/c7c0f8ca/X3/20190908_173602-X3.jpg)
They've also been in negotiations to sell these:
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Development/First-Baptist-Church-Downtown-Jacksonville/i-NgJ2qrd/0/5d7054c2/X3/20190908_173520-X3.jpg)
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Development/First-Baptist-Church-Downtown-Jacksonville/i-VV4dHDr/0/e3436dcd/X3/20190908_173556-X3.jpg)
Whether they sell property or not shouldn't even be a question. If they're taking out a $30 million loan to restore the one block they want to keep, they're going to have to pay it back with interest. Relying on tithes when membership is declining isn't going to get it done. Ridding themselves of property they don't need is a much more realistic outcome. The bigger questions should be how is it sold (one piece or piecemeal....likely piecement, IMO), who buys, what will said buyer(s) use their acquired properties for and timeline of when they'll be using them?
^^
So you mean the Gay Pride colors were not on that building when First Baptist owned it?
I don't doubt they intend to sell all of it eventually and some of it immediately, but I don't see anyone buying all of it, unless it is a fire-sale. This is such a one of a kind offering, it is hard to predict anything with much confidence, but I think some parts will not be snatched up too quick.
I could see apartment developers or office space developers buying up the midrise buildings, and hopefully the city (shudders at the thought of the city buying more property from private owners in the core) will buy the garages.
Office spaces or apartments may work for the administrative buildings, but those large auditoriums may be a niche space, unless a school (as others have mentioned) could make use of it.
Quote from: vicupstate on September 11, 2019, 03:18:55 PM
^^
So you mean the Gay Pride colors were not on that building when First Baptist owned it?
I don't doubt they intend to sell all of it eventually and some of it immediately, but I don't see anyone buying all of it, unless it is a fire-sale. This is such a one of a kind offering, it is hard to predict anything with much confidence, but I think some parts will not be snatched up too quick.
That's definitely a new mural...
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Cities/Jacksonville/Development/First-Baptist-Church-Downtown-Jacksonville/i-QScGdCC/0/ec8dc0cf/X3/20190908_173500-X3.jpg)
Like you, I don't see a single buyer here. I see it being piecemealed off incrementally. However, I don't view piecemealing as a bad thing. Nevertheless, it wouldn't be bad for some Cathedral District style master planning to first take place with this area of downtown.
Looks like Florida Coastal School of Law is still struggling. As our only law school, it would be nice to see the City work with them to relocate downtown to one of the First Baptist blocks. Seems like downtown would be a more ideal location for the school with Federal and County courthouses, US and State attorneys' offices, government buildings and agencies, etc. providing experiences, resources and lots of mentoring lawyers.
The school has been working to change from for-profit to non-profit. Given that and the direction the school is going, I wonder if UNF could absorb them. Jax needs more graduate programs to take us to the next level and law would be among the easier ones to implement.
https://www.jacksonville.com/news/20190911/dean-of-struggling-florida-coastal-school-of-law-in-jacksonville-abruptly-resigns (https://www.jacksonville.com/news/20190911/dean-of-struggling-florida-coastal-school-of-law-in-jacksonville-abruptly-resigns)
Question for you urbanists out there . . . what are your development suggestions for these blocks/parcels that would allow bleed over Union and State to reduce the psychological and physical barrier that is State and Union?
Quote from: Papa33 on September 12, 2019, 11:13:57 AM
Question for you urbanists out there . . . what are your development suggestions for these blocks/parcels that would allow bleed over Union and State to reduce the psychological and physical barrier that is State and Union?
A start would be retail in the ground floor of the garages coupled with a better sidewalk and crosswalk situation.
Here are some developer suggestions https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/the-first-baptist-church-property-no-limit-what-you-could-do-here
Quote from: jaxlongtimer on September 11, 2019, 07:50:45 PM
The school has been working to change from for-profit to non-profit. Given that and the direction the school is going, I wonder if UNF could absorb them. Jax needs more graduate programs to take us to the next level and law would be among the easier ones to implement.
The article says that failed:
QuoteThe dean and a professor of law at Florida Coastal School of Law in Jacksonville abruptly resigned Tuesday afternoon a day after learning the college was denied nonprofit status.
https://www.jacksonville.com/news/20190911/dean-of-struggling-florida-coastal-school-of-law-in-jacksonville-abruptly-resigns
Quote from: thelakelander on September 12, 2019, 11:04:22 PM
The article says that failed:
QuoteThe dean and a professor of law at Florida Coastal School of Law in Jacksonville abruptly resigned Tuesday afternoon a day after learning the college was denied nonprofit status.
https://www.jacksonville.com/news/20190911/dean-of-struggling-florida-coastal-school-of-law-in-jacksonville-abruptly-resigns (https://www.jacksonville.com/news/20190911/dean-of-struggling-florida-coastal-school-of-law-in-jacksonville-abruptly-resigns)
How does this happen? Why were they denied?
Quote from: martt12 on September 12, 2019, 01:29:35 PM
Here are some developer suggestions https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/the-first-baptist-church-property-no-limit-what-you-could-do-here (https://www.jaxdailyrecord.com/article/the-first-baptist-church-property-no-limit-what-you-could-do-here)
Let's see here...
QuoteOldenburg said Tuesday it's an opportunity for something "civic-minded" to be developed Downtown. For example, the six continuous blocks could accommodate a large medical facility.
He said Colliers is working with two undisclosed hospital groups looking for expansion space although he would not say if there is interest in the First Baptist property.
Medical, interesting possibility. Would Shands want to move further into downtown? I assume Baptist would want to keep its investment in the Southbank contiguous. Ascension is pretty close too, in Riverside. Mayo also has a sizable investment where it is now, which it is expanding. I could perhaps see Memorial looking into such a thing, depending on how invested they are on University.
QuoteOldenburg said a large multifamily development on the site also would work because Downtown boosters like JAX Chamber and Downtown Vision Inc. are pushing to reach a goal of 10,000 residents in the urban core.
It depends, I guess. The Middle School building looks especially suited for conversion into multifamily, and also perhaps some of the smaller buildings. The others I wouldn't be so sure about.
QuoteThat echoes comments Sunday by Downtown Investment Authority CEO Lori Boyer who sees the six connected blocks as a spot for a medical innovation campus or expansion for a higher education institution, like the neighboring Florida State College at Jacksonville.
FSCJ seems to like its current spot, and I've talked about medical above. UNF or JU could certainly be in an interesting position to send some business downtown, and if FCSL can get its crap together maybe they could too.
QuoteElias Hionides is vice president of Petra, a family-owned real estate brokerage that specializes in redevelopment of property in Downtown and Springfield.
He sees a mix of high-density residential development and commercial office space as the best use for the site.
Bold move, Cotton.
QuoteHionides suggests the sale could be an opportunity for the Duval County Public Schools to relocate its 1701 Prudential Drive headquarters into the city's civic core from the Southbank riverfront, which would open that site for redevelopment.
"It's a very good and obvious choice," he said.
Hionides said the First Baptist children's building matches the school district's needs.
Huh. That's... interesting, actually. Could be nice to open up another riverfront parcel, assuming the District ever actually happens.
Now it's time to talk money!
QuoteA starting point could be $40 per square foot for the land, which would price the land at $21.2 million.
Obviously they're not going to let it all go for less than the loan they're taking.
QuoteOldenburg said the closest comparison is the former Florida Baptist Convention complex. That facility occupied a block on Hendricks Avenue in San Marco and sold for $6.15 million to Chadbourne II LLC in June 2017. It will be redeveloped into 345 apartments, parking and 5,500 square feet of retail space.
Extending that sale price by nine blocks would put an estimated listing price for First Baptist's Downtown campus at $55.35 million.
That's... better, but still doesn't sound like enough. I would think given the sizable structures on all that land would put the entire complex closer to $100 mil, although given the deferred maintenance it probably wouldn't cross that line.
We'll see when the offers start going public.
Quote from: Papa33 on September 12, 2019, 11:13:57 AM
Question for you urbanists out there . . . what are your development suggestions for these blocks/parcels that would allow bleed over Union and State to reduce the psychological and physical barrier that is State and Union?
Step 1 will have to be clearing out the local homeless population, which will be a challenge with the Rosa Park bus transit terminal and all the free food. Step 2...doesn't happen until Step 1 is solved.
Quote from: Kerry on September 13, 2019, 08:45:40 AM
Quote from: Papa33 on September 12, 2019, 11:13:57 AM
Question for you urbanists out there . . . what are your development suggestions for these blocks/parcels that would allow bleed over Union and State to reduce the psychological and physical barrier that is State and Union?
Step 1 will have to be clearing out the local homeless population, which will be a challenge with the Rosa Park bus transit terminal and all the free food. Step 2...doesn't happen until Step 1 is solved.
Bingo. Like it or not that's the truth. The general public's perception about that entire area is not great. The reason is pretty obvious.
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 10:19:01 AM
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
Yes, that will certainly help but I don't think the bus terminal is the real issue. The homeless services on Julia and surrounding areas have to go. No one wants to walk between the First Baptist site and FSCJ and have to play hop scotch over people spawled out all over the sidewalks. Developers know that.
Maybe between the FB and JTA sales it will increase the property values so much that the missions get an offer they can't refuse, but if you want that area to be sucesssfully redeveloped they have to move IMO. Then there is the issue of the racetrack known as State and Union...
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 10:19:01 AM
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
I asked that very question about a year ago and was told nothing is changing at Rosa Parks - it will continue as-is even after the new transit center is built. Has that changed?
Quote from: Kerry on September 13, 2019, 10:50:16 AM
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 10:19:01 AM
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
I asked that very question about a year ago and was told nothing is changing at Rosa Parks - it will continue as-is even after the new transit center is built. Has that changed?
https://www.jtafla.com/media-center/press-releases/the-jta-announces-tod-opportunities/
Press release from May.
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 10:19:01 AM
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
Correct.
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 11:17:09 AM
Quote from: Kerry on September 13, 2019, 10:50:16 AM
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 10:19:01 AM
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
I asked that very question about a year ago and was told nothing is changing at Rosa Parks - it will continue as-is even after the new transit center is built. Has that changed?
https://www.jtafla.com/media-center/press-releases/the-jta-announces-tod-opportunities/
Press release from May.
Thanks. That will certainly help the area.
Quote from: Kerry on September 13, 2019, 11:59:42 AM
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 11:17:09 AM
Quote from: Kerry on September 13, 2019, 10:50:16 AM
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 10:19:01 AM
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
I asked that very question about a year ago and was told nothing is changing at Rosa Parks - it will continue as-is even after the new transit center is built. Has that changed?
https://www.jtafla.com/media-center/press-releases/the-jta-announces-tod-opportunities/
Press release from May.
Thanks. That will certainly help the area.
To your point....in the original plan for the LaVilla bus terminal it was intended to be an additional bus transfer hub, not a replacement. Ideally this is considered when it comes to use of the FBC property in some sort of master plan as this adds another two blocks to what's for sale. Done right, all of a sudden crossing State and Union isn't as crazy as it is now, and goes to resemble crossing something like Michigan Avenue in Chicago, which is 4 lanes in either direction.
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 11:17:09 AM
Quote from: Kerry on September 13, 2019, 10:50:16 AM
Quote from: Live_Oak on September 13, 2019, 10:19:01 AM
Keep in mind that the Rosa Parks station won't be JTA's transit hub much longer. The JRTC is planned to open next year with all the bus bays moving over there.
I believe JTA will then market Rosa Parks as a TOD.
I asked that very question about a year ago and was told nothing is changing at Rosa Parks - it will continue as-is even after the new transit center is built. Has that changed?
https://www.jtafla.com/media-center/press-releases/the-jta-announces-tod-opportunities/
Press release from May.
Interesting, I had thought the Rosa Parks TOD was going to be the area adjacent to the the bus terminal.
Because I notice stuff, this line from the TOD media release caught my eye:
Quote
The JTA is now seeking unsolicited proposals to develop five Authority-owned and underutilized parcels, including a 1.5-acre site along Johnson Street, near the JRTC in LaVilla.
If they are seeking them, how are the proposals unsolicited?