From The Urban Core -
QuoteThe Burrito Gallery, MOCA, and Chew, each got a visit yesterday from the DBPR Alcohol Beverage and Tobacco.
Basically, any business that is on their watch list that lets patrons take alcoholic beverages OFF PREMISES are subject to shut down and owner arrest.
Nothing was said about people walking around with drinks. That was said to be out of their jurisdiction. In fact its only certain licenses that the ABT in particular are watching.
We have always tried to comply with this rule but have not been as strict (having someone at the door to make sure, when you are leaving the BG- we can't control what you are doing on the public sidewalk outside or where you came from. Someone else may, but not us.) about it as we will have to be next Wednesday and going forward.
Know that we will do everything we can to remain open and serving our food which is our cornerstone. Please do us a favor and not try to leave with a drink. I am not sure what the other venues (except for the ones above) are being told or what their licenses are. It seems like there hasn't been too much alcohol related trouble during the walk, but we're not everywhere. Art walk is so rubust and filled with places to get booze that We hope everyone stays safe, unarrested, and OPEN for BUSINESS!
http://theurbancoredotcom.blogspot.com/2008/09/art-walk-we-have-problem.html
Has anyone heard any more information on this and exactly what this will mean for tomorrow nights ArtWalk?
Specifically, whats the deal with the places giving out free wine and beer like the Hayden Burns Library and Jacksonville Bank? Are people going to still be able to walk around with a glass of wine and look at art?
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on September 30, 2008, 11:07:54 AM
Has anyone heard any more information on this and exactly what this will mean for tomorrow nights ArtWalk?
Specifically, whats the deal with the places giving out free wine and beer like the Hayden Burns Library and Jacksonville Bank? Are people going to still be able to walk around with a glass of wine and look at art?
the way I see it is that you will be able to have a wine INSIDE a place like a gallery or restaurant/bar but you cannot go out of the establishment and walk the streets with the wine/beer/cocktail.
Quote from: apvbguy on September 30, 2008, 11:10:34 AM
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on September 30, 2008, 11:07:54 AM
Has anyone heard any more information on this and exactly what this will mean for tomorrow nights ArtWalk?
Specifically, whats the deal with the places giving out free wine and beer like the Hayden Burns Library and Jacksonville Bank? Are people going to still be able to walk around with a glass of wine and look at art?
the way I see it is that you will be able to have a wine INSIDE a place like a gallery or restaurant/bar but you cannot go out of the establishment and walk the streets with the wine/beer/cocktail.
From what I understand, which makes no sense, is that you CAN walk with a beverage on the street as long as its in a cup (no beer cans or bottles), but you CANT buy a beverage and walk out with it, but you CAN get a FREE beverage and walk out with it.
Yes, Compound, thats how I see it too. Thats why im looking for WAY more clarification. Searched news websites, and etc. but didnt find anything.
Just get a big gulp full of coke slushi and load it up with rum!
So to clarify, no walking around with drinks you actually paid for, but free wine is ok.
I was about to criticize the city's laws for football/sporting events, but I don't understand them enough to make a solid point. I don't believe they sell alcohol outside of the stadium during NFL games, but they do allow you to walk with an alcoholic beverage that you brought. Seems like they're trying to enforce those same rules on the art walk.
BYOB
Im fine with rules just as long as everyone knows what they are. Details are very sketchy about tomorrows ArtWalk and I hope none of this deters people from attending what is, IMO, one of the best things going on these days.
I've gotta ask - regardless of alcohol availability, is the ArtWalk "kid friendly"?
Yes, the ArtWalk is kid-friendly and they usually have specific activities for kids at some of the venues, usually the Hayden Burns Library upstairs.
Any recommendations for a central starting point (i.e. parking)?
It really depends on what you want to do, certainly if you are bringing the kids along, you won't be taking the same route as, say, the Jacksonville Confidential staff. So, take a look at the PDF below that has a map and pretty good detail of everyone participating in the ArtWalk.
I usually have no trouble finding a spot on the street at a meter (meters stop at 6PM).
http://www.downtownjacksonville.org/_images/_documents/AW/oct-map.pdf
The Main Library Garage is good, as well as Kings Avenue. The skyway trip across the river is scenic and relaxing. Just make sure you check the schedule to make sure it will be running when you need it.
Sigh...One step forward then two back. I am beginning to believe this city will just never get it. Art Walk is THE downtown promoting event. Not Baseball games, not football games, nor fireworks. Freaking Artwalk. It brings people from all walks of life downtown to mingle and have fun. Young, old, black, white, etc... I have been to a great many of these and have NEVER seen an alcohol related incident. I do not doubt that there are some but please...
DamnitDamnitDamnitDamnitDamnitDamnitDamnitDamnit >:(
Exactly BridgeTroll. It seems like anytime something gets "big" in Jacksonville the City starts to freak out and worry that its going to get out of hand. The City should really have a bit more faith in us.
Well, i guess we will be "winging it" tonight. Hopefully no one gets arrested or shut down.
I will be at the Bridge... drinking on the sidewalk as always... ;)
Aren't they smart enough to have a work around for that?
Don't recall where I was at, but I remember a policy similar to this one.
The gallery sold souvineer tokens that came with 1 free drink.
You can then exchange your token for a free drink.
Problem Solved
Quote from: wwanderlust on October 01, 2008, 05:08:43 PM
F*** the Department of Business and Professional Regulation.
ArtWalk is the one reason I go downtown, and I'm not going to let a bunch of PURITAN FASCISTS ruin my evening.
See you kids there! ;D
Stay classy, wanderlust.
there were signs all over downtown about taking alcohol out of establishment...but it sure didn't stop people from coming...downtown was packed tonight!
It is obscene to think that people cannot walk around or even go outside with their drinks. Why doesn't the city mandate that all restaurants and bars be demoted to speakeasies.
Until members of Jacksonville's government (and many citizens may I add) grow up and graduate into the 20th century; Jacksonville will remain a big, underdeveloped, retarded back-hole that is not worthy enough to be considered a major American city. Sometimes, I feel we may as well be living in Utah or Pakistan or other third world country.
People in this city are just overly zealous about the most ridiculous things. It's upsetting and really making me think of moving elsewhere (which sucks since I have lived here since birth)
Most of our citizens BTW are very nice, warm-hearted and wonderful, but they are intolerant of what most everyone in the world considers normal. I guess our citizens are too "Mayberry"
There really aren't too many cities that will allow you to walk about with an open container and/or cocktail.......I actually appreciate how "lax" it's been in Jacksonville.
QuotePeople in this city are just overly zealous about the most ridiculous things. It's upsetting and really making me think of moving elsewhere (which sucks since I have lived here since birth)
You have the following choices (in designated areas I might add - except for Butte):
Butte, Montana
Kansas City, Missouri
Las Vegas, Nevada
New Orleans, Louisiana
Savannah, Georgia
BTW - I had a GREAT time @ ArtWalk tonight!
You should be able to take your container to the sidewalk though.
Doesn't the city turn a blind eye for FL-GA and did they not turn a blind eye during the Super-bowl?
Kinda hypocritical if you ask me.
this wasn't actually the City...apparently this came from state officials
I thought they made exceptions for the Fla/Ga and Superbowl. IMO, Art Walk is another opportunity for the "exception" to be exercized.
I watched as the gestapo stopped by London Bridge to inform(intimidate) the bartenders of the new enforcement regime... quite a buzzkill... :(
Quote from: RiversideGator on October 01, 2008, 10:08:08 PM
Quote from: wwanderlust on October 01, 2008, 05:08:43 PM
F*** the Department of Business and Professional Regulation.
ArtWalk is the one reason I go downtown, and I'm not going to let a bunch of PURITAN FASCISTS ruin my evening.
See you kids there! ;D
Stay classy, wanderlust.
Stay uptight, Riverside Gator. :P
Of course I am half kidding .. but seriously, not to thread hi-jack, but this discussion board really needs some humor, sarcasm, light hearted-ness. It is fun to have debates and be passionate about Jacksonville and our happenings. But not every thread has to be so serious from A - Z.
It looked like Art Walk was packed. Even with the threat of being arrested for drinking on the sidewalk outside a designated area. I love to see all the people Downtown on Art Walk night. Keep coming!
There were lots of people out last night, but IMO not as many as usual. It was quite nice to be able to go back to the Burrito Gallery bar and immediately have my drink order taken.
The "New Rules" didn't deter me from having a good time at all.
Quote from: stephElf on October 02, 2008, 09:13:15 AM
Quote from: RiversideGator on October 01, 2008, 10:08:08 PM
Quote from: wwanderlust on October 01, 2008, 05:08:43 PM
F*** the Department of Business and Professional Regulation.
ArtWalk is the one reason I go downtown, and I'm not going to let a bunch of PURITAN FASCISTS ruin my evening.
See you kids there! ;D
Stay classy, wanderlust.
Stay uptight, Riverside Gator. :P
Of course I am half kidding .. but seriously, not to thread hi-jack, but this discussion board really needs some humor, sarcasm, light hearted-ness. It is fun to have debates and be passionate about Jacksonville and our happenings. But not every thread has to be so serious from A - Z.
Just to be clear, I am not in favor of the new drinking rules. But I am also not in favor of using the f word in a thread about ArtWalk (or anything else).
Quote from: RiversideGator on October 02, 2008, 01:27:00 PM
Quote from: stephElf on October 02, 2008, 09:13:15 AM
Quote from: RiversideGator on October 01, 2008, 10:08:08 PM
Quote from: wwanderlust on October 01, 2008, 05:08:43 PM
F*** the Department of Business and Professional Regulation.
ArtWalk is the one reason I go downtown, and I'm not going to let a bunch of PURITAN FASCISTS ruin my evening.
See you kids there! ;D
Stay classy, wanderlust.
Stay uptight, Riverside Gator. :P
Of course I am half kidding .. but seriously, not to thread hi-jack, but this discussion board really needs some humor, sarcasm, light hearted-ness. It is fun to have debates and be passionate about Jacksonville and our happenings. But not every thread has to be so serious from A - Z.
Just to be clear, I am not in favor of the new drinking rules. But I am also not in favor of using the f word in a thread about ArtWalk (or anything else).
at least it was *** out.
I tend to curse like a sailor (except at work of course) so I guess we can agree to disagree.
In the post's original form, it was not *'d out. It was the actual f word. Ocklawaha was good enough to edit it for us.
As for cussing, I used to do it more too but getting older and having children cures you of a lot of that IMO.
I prefer to say EFF!!!
Quote from: RiversideGator on October 02, 2008, 01:35:29 PM
In the post's original form, it was not *'d out. It was the actual f word. Ocklawaha was good enough to edit it for us.
As for cussing, I used to do it more too but getting older and having children cures you of a lot of that IMO.
well then yea, that is tacky ;D
I just got a call from a friend who says that around 40 people were arrested at last nights ArtWalk for open container, however I have no way to confirm that information.
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on October 02, 2008, 03:04:57 PM
I just got a call from a friend who says that around 40 people were arrested at last nights ArtWalk for open container, however I have no way to confirm that information.
THAT is tacky... :-[ >:(
Yes, it is.
Quote from: BridgeTroll on October 02, 2008, 03:08:53 PM
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on October 02, 2008, 03:04:57 PM
I just got a call from a friend who says that around 40 people were arrested at last nights ArtWalk for open container, however I have no way to confirm that information.
THAT is tacky... :-[ >:(
That might deserve the F word.
http://www.jacksonville.com/tu-online/stories/100308/met_339694520.shtml
The Florida Times-Union
October 3, 2008
Art Walk not hindered by alcohol restrictions
By MATT COLEMAN,
The Times-Union
Reports of the Art Walk's demise are greatly exaggerated.
--------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------
Jacksonville message boards were buzzing this week with word the popular downtown event, which is scheduled for the first Wednesday of every month, was on the outs with law-enforcement agencies for its free flow of alcohol.
Agents from the state Division of Alcoholic Beverages and Tobacco visited vendors along the Art Walk path this week in preparation for Wednesday's event to reinforce alcohol restrictions, check liquor licenses and warn owners about the consequences of violating the law.
But authorities said Thursday nothing has changed. Alcohol is still off limits on city streets, and the Alcoholic Beverages and Tobacco Division only responded because of complaints from a vocal businessman.
The Art Walk, which has been around for five years, turns downtown Jacksonville into a walkable art gallery. Local artists display their work, musicians perform on street corners and vendors extend their hours to sell food and other items.
Assistant Chief J.R. Ross of the Jacksonville Sheriff's Office said his agency isn't trying to ruin the party for Art Walk patrons. He said the division came out because of a complaint from a downtown business owner frustrated with open-container violations during the event.
He said the concerned owner, whom he declined to identify, contacted the city and the division repeatedly to voice his concerns. His main issue was patrons taking alcohol from one of the walk's stops and traversing Jacksonville's downtown with booze in hand.
"This one individual has got everybody jumping through hoops," Ross said. "This is a political disagreement between vendors, plain and simple, and we're stuck in the middle."
Ross said the walk is typically incident-free, and the need for police involvement is rare. No one was arrested during Wednesday's Art Walk, he said.
"This isn't the Georgia-Florida game with people hooting and hollering drunk," Ross said. "It's simply not an issue."
Many downtown businesses such as the Burrito Gallery and the London Bridge Pub posted signs outlining the main rule - alcohol must be kept inside the premises.
Burrito Gallery co-owner Paul Shockey said agents met with him and his staff before Wednesday's festivities to inform them they would be watching to ensure his business complied.
He said he had an employee at the door with a trash can ready to keep patrons from walking onto the streets with their drinks.
He also removed all seating from the restaurant's patio area to make it into a "holding area" for people to wait and finish their drinks.
The stricter rules didn't keep people away. Shockey said his staff served 800 food orders - a better than average Art Walk haul.
Juanita Bedo, daytime manager of the London Bridge Pub, said her restaurant took similar precautions.
IDs were checked, signs were posted and the letter of the law was obeyed, she said. She was just worried someone who snuck out alcohol could ruin things for businesses.
Nice job, I thought that 40 peeps arrested thing would turn out to be false.
I have a sneaking suspicion that I know this un-named local businessman and if you guys think a bit on it, you probably will too.
I was thinking the same thing... >:(
I didn't see a ridiclious amount of police out this artwalk either. Plus I still carried my free wine from venue to venue as usual, although I was unclear about on that rule. I know you can't buy a drink and walk off, but the various venues that hand out the wine, I didn't see any signs in there.
It does seem as though they should designate an area to walk with your drinks as they do it with any major college/jaguars game. The beach does it for their festivals too. I just don't see the point of someone getting in trouble when the law applies to a certain physical location but not another.
But like the article said, this is artwalk, not a football game, so it really isn't something i'd get worked up about. I'm there to enjoy the illusion of a vibrant downtown that artwalk creates, not to get smashed :D
One place that didnt allow peeps to leave with free beer or wine was the old (Hayden Burns) Main Library. So that was confusing to me since I did see others walking around with theirs.
Obviously the rules need to be laid out a little clearer I think.
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on October 03, 2008, 09:21:18 AM
Nice job, I thought that 40 peeps arrested thing would turn out to be false.
I have a sneaking suspicion that I know this un-named local businessman and if you guys think a bit on it, you probably will too.
well there is one guy who owns a restaurant downtown who seems overly concerned about people buying alcohol...it mainly seems to be about his obsession with the homeless problem....and as a result of his past actions, I refuse to patronize his estbalishment!
YES, thats the exact person Im talking about. Though I love his youtube videos, and understand his frustration with the homeless Downtown, I do NOT feel the same way about the ArtWalk. I was looking for a video he had posted a while back where he was specifically saying that ArtWalk was ruining his business because of the parking situation, but I think hes removed it from youtube. I couldnt find it. Maybe he should take part in ArtWalk instead of bashing it.
he's ruined his business...no one else.
Quote from: tufsu1 on October 03, 2008, 10:51:47 AM
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on October 03, 2008, 09:21:18 AM
Nice job, I thought that 40 peeps arrested thing would turn out to be false.
I have a sneaking suspicion that I know this un-named local businessman and if you guys think a bit on it, you probably will too.
well there is one guy who owns a restaurant downtown who seems overly concerned about people buying alcohol...it mainly seems to be about his obsession with the homeless problem....and as a result of his past actions, I refuse to patronize his estbalishment!
That's ok. He prefers adult customers with good taste anyway. ;)
oooh, burn. that was a low blow RSG
Quote from: RiversideGator on October 03, 2008, 12:10:12 PM
Quote from: tufsu1 on October 03, 2008, 10:51:47 AM
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on October 03, 2008, 09:21:18 AM
Nice job, I thought that 40 peeps arrested thing would turn out to be false.
I have a sneaking suspicion that I know this un-named local businessman and if you guys think a bit on it, you probably will too.
well there is one guy who owns a restaurant downtown who seems overly concerned about people buying alcohol...it mainly seems to be about his obsession with the homeless problem....and as a result of his past actions, I refuse to patronize his estbalishment!
That's ok. He prefers adult customers with good taste anyway. ;)
As an adult with good taste who liberally spends money at various downtown establishments he has lost my business also. His actions are sour grapes... no more no less.
Quote from: stephendare on October 03, 2008, 12:15:32 PM
Having actually met Jason, Instead of raining coals down from a middle class law office, I can verify that he is a both an adult and his numerous restaurant reviews on jacksonvilleconfidential.com show him to be a person of discerning (and excellent) taste.
Thanks Stephen
Quote from: stephendare on October 03, 2008, 12:15:32 PM
Having actually met Jason, Instead of raining coals down from a middle class law office, I can verify that he is a both an adult and his numerous restaurant reviews on jacksonvilleconfidential.com show him to be a person of discerning (and excellent) taste.
I'm pretty sure that was a shot at me...but that's ok!
Quote from: tufsu1 on October 03, 2008, 12:57:25 PM
Quote from: stephendare on October 03, 2008, 12:15:32 PM
Having actually met Jason, Instead of raining coals down from a middle class law office, I can verify that he is a both an adult and his numerous restaurant reviews on jacksonvilleconfidential.com show him to be a person of discerning (and excellent) taste.
I'm pretty sure that was a shot at me...but that's ok!
Naw... it was aimed at RG :)
Quote from: BridgeTroll on October 03, 2008, 01:01:00 PM
Quote from: tufsu1 on October 03, 2008, 12:57:25 PM
Quote from: stephendare on October 03, 2008, 12:15:32 PM
Having actually met Jason, Instead of raining coals down from a middle class law office, I can verify that he is a both an adult and his numerous restaurant reviews on jacksonvilleconfidential.com show him to be a person of discerning (and excellent) taste.
I'm pretty sure that was a shot at me...but that's ok!
Naw... it was aimed at RG :)
sorry..I meant RG's initial post
Quote from: stephendare on October 03, 2008, 02:39:48 PM
Im right there with you wanderlust.
the English Language is a beautiful thing. There arent any 'dirty' words.
Attacking or abusing someone is one thing, but these silly pollyannas who pretend to faint dead away at language they themselves use is a little ridiculous.
ditto
Quote from: stephendare on October 03, 2008, 12:15:32 PM
Having actually met Jason, Instead of raining coals down from a middle class law office, I can verify that he is a both an adult and his numerous restaurant reviews on jacksonvilleconfidential.com show him to be a person of discerning (and excellent) taste.
What did I do?
And thank you Stephen, I do have excellent taste. :)
Hey Jason, Im Jason too.
Quote from: wwanderlust on October 03, 2008, 02:37:33 PM
Words are words. They communicate ideas, and 'shoot' does no more harm than 'POO'. No one is injured, no one is traumatized. An idea is communicated--NOTHING MORE.
Keep it classy Wanderlust.
;)
Quote from: tufsu1 on October 03, 2008, 10:51:47 AM
well there is one guy who owns a restaurant downtown who seems overly concerned about people buying alcohol...it mainly seems to be about his obsession with the homeless problem....and as a result of his past actions, I refuse to patronize his estbalishment!
I'm hopelessly in the dark. What establishment is this?
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on October 03, 2008, 03:15:46 PM
Hey Jason, Im Jason too.
I was wondering if I blacked out after writing the restaraunt review. :D
I'm glad you took JacksonvilleConfidential as a user name because too many "Jason"s make for a hazardous blogging experience. I try to keep the hockey mask and machette locked up...
If you would prefer peeps to call me JC that would be fine, my nickname is Jace anyway.
I'm curious to know also. He should be pressuring the city to address the homeless issue not the thousands of people who come downtown to support the Art Walk and businesses like his. I guess he chooses not to stay open during Art Walk? My mountain bike was stolen from Hemming Plaza at the August Art Walk. While I was filing the report three homeless men (obviously impaired) verbally assaulted and argued with the officer. He was professional and asked them to leave. My take on this was he is doing his best to make downtown a viable place to live and visit but has his hands tied. He made a few comments to this effect.
Quote from: jacksonvilleconfidential on October 03, 2008, 03:37:11 PM
If you would prefer peeps to call me JC that would be fine, my nickname is Jace anyway.
They can call you whatever they want. Just been kidding around. ;)
Quote from: stephendare on October 03, 2008, 12:15:32 PM
Having actually met Jason, Instead of raining coals down from a middle class law office, I can verify that he is a both an adult and his numerous restaurant reviews on jacksonvilleconfidential.com show him to be a person of discerning (and excellent) taste.
Sorry I am not to the manor born like Stephen. :D
And who was talking about Jason?
Quote from: wwanderlust on October 03, 2008, 02:37:33 PM
Quote from: RiversideGator on October 02, 2008, 01:35:29 PM
In the post's original form, it was not *'d out. It was the actual f word. Ocklawaha was good enough to edit it for us.
As for cussing, I used to do it more too but getting older and having children cures you of a lot of that IMO.
Are you kidding me? You absolutely must be kidding. This forum censors what SOME consider to be "naughty words"?!?
Words are words. They communicate ideas, and 'shoot' does no more harm than 'shit'. No one is injured, no one is traumatized. An idea is communicated--NOTHING MORE.
They. Are. Just. WORDS.
In the real world--and not the world of PBS children's programming that some forum members appear to live in--things are not always shiny and polite. Something happens that angers us, and being free to express not only what makes us happy, but what makes us angry is part of what makes this country so great. How dare you censor one man's speech because you arbitrarily decide your way of saying it is better?
It wouldn't shock me if this entire post gets deleted or re-worded in the spirit of fascism with which the Puritan minority seems to operate here.
Disgusting.
Sorry if you dont get it but words and ideas do have meaning. As a prime example, the very fact that you are making the inane argument that they do not have meaning indicates you have imbibed the rantings of any number of nihilists. Thanks for proving my point though. ;)
Sorry but I was here first.
As for words, if you think they dont hurt anyone, go yell epithets at various groups around town and see what happens.
Sorry to further derail from the initial point of this thread, but I have to agree. I don't see why it's such a big deal that Wanderlust used the F word once in passing. Sure, if you over use swear words it detracts from what you are trying to say and makes you come off as trashy but I don't see anything wrong with saying them every once in awhile whether it's in person or on a forum.
Unless of course that forum has specific rules against it.
Who is the business owner that complained about the Art Walk?