Considering solar for your home or business?
Find out how much it will cost.
Find out how much you will save.
Find out how long it will take to break even.
http://findsolar.com/index.php?page=rightforme
I would like to install a solar system but still cost prohibitive. I'm sure it will come down in the next couple of years.
That is what I have seen also...
If the State would up their incentives packages, these systems would be much easier to afford.
Imagine every home in the state crankin' out their own power with a utility connection to pick up the slack. There would be a lot less complaining about utility rates and many many less would suffer the extended outages caused by hurricanes.
Quote from: Jason on August 01, 2008, 02:38:32 PM
If the State would up their incentives packages, these systems would be much easier to afford.
Imagine every home in the state crankin' out their own power with a utility connection to pick up the slack. There would be a lot less complaining about utility rates and many many less would suffer the extended outages caused by hurricanes.
They could... and may. But... you are the "state" and will pay for it either at one end or the other...
I am surprised there has not been more enthusiasm for or comments on this calculator. There are many people on this site who are very pro solar. I am one of these. I was hoping someone would have used the calculator and say they were going to get one installed. My guess is that the enthusiasm wilts when confronted with reality.
More info...
http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy04osti/35297.pdf
Here is a link to a supplier of these systems and components with prices:
http://www.mrsolar.com/
I would love to get a solar system for my home. It's the right thing to do for the city (by reducing pollution, emissions, decreasing strain on JEA) and environmentally.
At this time, the most advanced solar panel is only about 23% efficient at converting the sun's rays into electricity. The cost of a system (as estimated on the initial link) is very cost prohibitive for me.
I think like others, I am waiting for systems to become more efficient and powerful. I also assume the price of solar systems will continue to decrease over the next few years.
But there are some who feel that it is the right thing to do despite the cost. I am not one of those but there seems to be many who feel this way...
I feel it is the right thing to do but can't afford the cost!
I've also used other calculators in the past and all have told me that its cost prohibitive. Although, the link you posted is the best I've seen so far. I need to get my utility bill out and see if its more accurate.
For me it takes about 20 years to break even. The problem THEN is the life cycle for these systems is around 25 years... So after 5 yeras of free energy a must shell out a huge chunk of cash to replace it...
The calculator makes a couple of questionable assumptions. The big one is the low figure for the rate of increase in the cost for KWHs. I think our electric rates will go up much faster. Also, houses with low energy consumption and solar panels and solar hot water heaters will go up in value faster than others too.
Cost for the solar cells will come down some with the new technologies that use less silicon, but they will probably take more square feet of space as they are less efficient.
Alas, grid-tied P/V systems cannot be used for power during a hurricane-caused power outage. Grid tied inverters will only work when they sense 60 cycle voltage on their output side. I guess you could put a standard inverter in the system in addition to the grid-tied inverter with a switching method to move the solar panel's power over but, $$$$$$! Generator would be cheaper.
Remember, first step in going solar is to install a solar hot water heater. After heating/air-conditioning it is the second largest consumer of power or gas in your home.
Also, warranty for panels is 25 years. Actual life span is unknown, but is estimated to be 35-40 years. Lifespan of solar hot water heaters is indefinite. There are 70 year old units still working fine....no moving parts.
I am looking closer at the hot water heater option. It seems a bit more doable but also still seems to be quite an investment with a break even point quite a ways down the road...
Am still surprised no one on this site has decided to make the move... hmmmm...
Here's an interesting article, relating to this discussion:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/11/business/11solar.html?partner=rssyahoo&emc=rss (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/11/business/11solar.html?partner=rssyahoo&emc=rss)
Quote
Giant Retailers Look to Sun for Energy Savings
By STEPHANIE ROSENBLOOM
Published: August 10, 2008
Retailers are typically obsessed with what to put under their roofs, not on them. Yet the nation’s biggest store chains are coming to see their immense, flat roofs as an untapped resource.
In recent months, chains including Wal-Mart Stores, Kohl’s, Safeway and Whole Foods Market have installed solar panels on roofs of their stores to generate electricity on a large scale.
Rest of the article at the above link. Interesting stuff.
Great article Doc... I have often thought these are the entities who can afford the initial cost of installation. Large companies and government. Think of all the huge rooftops some of these companies own... warehouses, manufacturing plants, etc. This makes more sense to me than covering the desert or prairie with these panels...
An interesting factoid from the article...
QuoteBooming demand in recent years has driven up the price of solar panels, and analysts say it costs far more to generate electricity from solar energy than from coal.
Coal generation costs about 6 cents for a kilowatt hour, which is enough electricity to run a hair dryer for an hour. Natural gas generation costs about 9 cents a kilowatt hour, said Reese Tisdale, a senior analyst with the consulting firm Emerging Energy Research. In comparison, “best case†for power from solar panels is about 25 to 30 cents a kilowatt hour, he said.
Quote
This makes more sense to me than covering the desert or prairie with these panels...
Agree. You're right on with the warehouses, distribution centers, factories, etc. that are owned by business conglomerates. How about all the Federal, State, and Municipal government properties? Courthouses, offices, jails, post offices, and on and on. The rooftops of Washington DC should be covered with solar panels as far as the eye can see.
Furthermore - if the government gets on board, and this trend with corporations continue, would that not in the long run bring down the price of such panels? Production would conceivable ramp up to meet demand, thus dropping prices. Then us commonfolk could more readily get in on the action like we're wanting to.
I have always felt that conversion to solar or wind will happen when it makes economic sense not ecologicol sense or mandated by government. When Exxon or GE can make a profit providing cheap and clean energy to everyone they will be the first ones to abandon the expense of drilling for oil or the unpredictability of foriegn governments. Oil must be found, extracted, refined and transported, all at enormous cost before the first dollar is made. The problem is that solar and wind energy still costs more to create than oil. Until it at least equals oil gas and coal it will remain an alternative energy source only...
Quote from: BridgeTroll on August 11, 2008, 05:15:02 PM
I have always felt that conversion to solar or wind will happen when it makes economic sense not ecologicol sense or mandated by government.
What about when it makes national security sense.
Ok you are probably right it's all about the
dollar money.
Quote from: JeffreyS on August 16, 2008, 09:12:53 AM
Quote from: BridgeTroll on August 11, 2008, 05:15:02 PM
I have always felt that conversion to solar or wind will happen when it makes economic sense not ecologicol sense or mandated by government.
What about when it makes national security sense.
Ok you are probably right it's all about the dollar money.
Its not "all about the money" no more than the silly "its all about oil" argument. When you reduce your argument to Bumper stickers and slogans you loose credibility Jeff...
It was just breivity. I didn't mean to be too extreem just agreeing the ecconomics will be the driving factor. Even if I wish there was more to it.
Also if your bumper sticker slogan is true it is as credible as a 500 page text book on whatever subject.
Quote from: JeffreyS on August 16, 2008, 11:11:36 AM
Also if your bumper sticker slogan is true it is as credible as a 500 page text book on whatever subject.
But they seldom are... the presidential race is a prime example. You hear plenty of empty rhetoric, slogans and bumper stickers in replacement of real discussion of the topics. Sadly most americans seem to favor this style of debate...
I get what you are saying. I do however think simple statements are often true and often wrong. They are no more or less valid because of their style. They do have a tendency I will grant you to be too powerful and limit debate or close minds.
This brings me back to this topic... Many seem very enthusiastic about solar power until they get to the nuts and bolts. So many people epecially on this site tout solar as one of the answers to our energy problems but NO ONE has yet to act on it. I am more than a bit surprised that not one person has yet to claim ownership of a system or decided to invest in one... My guess is that it really is "all about the dollar..."
You are right. In fairness we had a poster put pics up of their solar system not log ago, but generally you are correct.
My solar hot water heater supplies 98% of my hot water. Electric back up was only on during the last Northeaster in March and last week during Fay.
My 5KW, grid-tied P/V system supplies about $130 of electricity per month (at this month's rate!) which is more than half of my usage in the summer. In the winter I have to give my surplus to JEA for no compensation and no carry forward of the KWH credit. They then CHARGE ME a minimum "service" charge for the connection. Hope that policy changes. JEA is behind the other utilities in the State in this.
Someone on this site HAS made the move.
I am glad to hear that you did... Would you mind sharing your costs? Have you broken even yet? How big is the array?