Keane who doesn't have an advance degree in finance Could make $5,200 a week should he put in a 40 hour week. You have got to be kidding. :o IMO Keane is a huge part of this cop & fire pension problem. Read this story for yourself. http://jacksonville.com/news/metro/2015-10-01/story/former-pension-fund-chief-john-keane-hammers-out-deal-130-hour-post
I don't understand why there isn't an angry mob downtown protesting this! This is a slap in the face to everyone in Jacksonville. So wishing Keane would fall into one of those road sinkholes on Liberty street!
I've lurked on here long enough to feel pretty confident that you are up on Jacksonville current events.
Quote from: stephendare on October 02, 2015, 11:35:38 AM
I don't know enough about this issue. What is it that John Keane is supposed to have done?
I don't know enough about the position either.
What exactly is he supposed to do?
I don't get too worked up over salaries, some people make more; some less - it's not my place to judge. I do get worked up over performance, and I'm not sure what he's paid to do.
If it's his job to ensure that the pension generates as much money as possible, then he's done a helluva job.
If his job was to create a symbiotic relationship with the city and the pension to ensure a sustainable program that would benefit both, he's done an absolutely shitty job.
Well...I'm not sure entirely what his job entails, but it appears negotiating with the city regarding the Police and Fire Retirement Fund is a pretty big component. From what I can see, from what he negotiated for himself in regards to his own salary and retirement fund...then I would say he's a god damn genius at it.
Agree Apache. I think he has been very successful at feathering his own nest. However the fund that he is supposed to be running - for the benefit of the police and firemen who are putting their necks on the line - runs the very real risk of becoming insolvent. The city certainly must own part of the responsibility for that as well, but Keane's lack of expertise in finance and strong sense of personal entitlement is apparent.
Stephen,
It really comes down to the ethics of one person being your Executive Director, Collective Bargaining Agent and creator of his own personal pension plan outside of COJ. An even though it was recommended for many years, he had no associate director. So as the plan grew in size and importance relative to the COJ, having such a large role in just one person became a flash point.
No one has accused him of malfeasance, but his refusal to take vacations, hire an associate (so he could take vacations), and prop up his pension (guaranteed by the way) when the fund he manages is underfunded, make people see self-dealing. Delaying his retirement date until he could "collect" made more people suspicious, even though he was probably allowed under his generous contract.
His bio:
http://www.coj.net/departments/police-fire-pension-fund/administration/john-keane.aspx (http://www.coj.net/departments/police-fire-pension-fund/administration/john-keane.aspx)
Joining the Sheriff's Office in 1962 and transferring to the new Fire/Rescue Department on February 1, 1969. Mr. Keane earned his A.A. and A.S. degrees from Florida Community College at Jacksonville and a B.S. in Workforce Education and Training from Southern Illinois University - Carbondale. He was an active member of the Fraternal Order of Police (Lodge 30), served as Business Agent and Executive Board member of the Jacksonville Association of Firefighters #122, served as a member and Chairman of the Pension Advisory Committee, and Member of the Board of Pension Administration. He was elected to the first Police and Fire Pension Fund Board of Trustees when the Fund became independent of the City. John has served as an Executive Committee member of the National Conference on Public Employee Retirement Systems, and served on the Administrator's Committee and Public Employees Committee of the International Foundation of Employee Benefit Plans.
John served three terms as a member of the Executive Committee of the Coalition to Preserve Retirement Security. He also serves on the Council of Institutional Investors Executive Committee and is a member of the Government Finance Officers Association Focal Group. He has been awarded the Certified Retirement Administrator and Certified Retirement Counselor designations by the International Foundation of Retirement Education. He frequently speaks at seminars, conferences, and forums on public pension issues.
Per Jacksonville.com:
http://jacksonville.com/news/2015-08-28/story/john-keane-controversial-head-police-and-fire-pension-board-will-step-down (http://jacksonville.com/news/2015-08-28/story/john-keane-controversial-head-police-and-fire-pension-board-will-step-down)
As executive director of the pension fund, Keane was on the frontline of negotiations with city officials over the past 25 years on pension benefits for police and firefighters. A major provision of the pension deal signed in June is that in the future, the pension fund will not be involved any longer in negotiating benefits, which instead will get decided in collective bargaining between the city and unions.
Keane picked up his share of critics who said he leaned too far in favor of advocating for police and firefighters' benefits, even in the face of the rising cost to city government for those benefits.
"You shouldn't assume that there's a never-ending pot of money that will flow into your coffers," said Curt Lee, a citizen activist who frequently criticized Keane. "I think he didn't balance things properly."
Lee successfully sued the pension fund for public record violations stemming from his attempts to get documents. Lee also won a lawsuit that found the pension fund and the city violated state Sunshine law by negotiating pension benefits in non-public meetings going back to 2000."I think he's been inept and he's violated the law several times," Lee said. "I would say, 'Good riddance.' "
Keane's tenure as executive director began in the roaring decade of the 1990s when the stock market soared, and then overlapped the recession in the early 2000s and the stock market crash in 2008, which badly damaged the pension fund's investment portfolio. The city's debt to the pension fund for future pension obligations is about $1.6 billion.
As the city's annual contribution to the fund soared to around $150 million, Keane met repeatedly with city administrators in negotiating sessions.
"He has an encyclopedic knowledge of pension fund history," said Chris Hand, who was chief of staff for Mayor Alvin Brown when they sat across the table from Keane in public meetings last year at City Hall. "He's smart. He's savvy. In the words of Kenny Rogers, he knew when to hold 'em, when to fold 'em."
The pension fund and the city eventually agreed to a pension deal that reduces benefits for new police and firefighter hires, while modifying benefits for current employees.
Per Folio:
Since 1990, John Keane has reigned supreme over the Jacksonville Police and Fire Pension Fund, during which time he has amassed for himself a very special pension worth north of $2 million that the city believes is ill-gotten (that's in addition to the $310,000 salary Keane, a retired rank-and-file member of the fire department, makes for managing all of six people). And, oh yeah, Keane's pension fund is in the red to the tune of $1.7 billion, and could potentially cripple the city's finances. No, that's not all Keane's fault. But while the mayor and City Council grapple with so many tough questions and unpalatable solutions, John Keane's got nothing to worry about: his retirement plan, which he negotiated himself, is fully funded (100 percent, baby!) and in no danger. Keane's not the only one who's learned how to suck us dry: In August, the Times-Union reported that the chairman of the pension fund's board of trustees, Bobby Deal, a retired cop, had worked the city's Deferred Retirement Option Plan for a $4.9 million retirement. Hey, man, to the victor go the spoils.
Per Business Insider: (2011 article) Where he states that while many civic pension funds were going insolvent, Jacksonville would be healthy because he uses an 8% rate. (the others were using a 4% rate) In this case he was wrong, but that is why there was so much arguments over "exactly" what our pension liability truly was. Based on Keane's rate or the rate used by the rest of the United States.
Jacksonville Pension Director Says He Can Earn 8% ROI And There Won't Be A Solvency Crisis
We recently published projections by Professors Robert Novy-Marx and Joshua Rauh that showed dozens of city pension plans running dry in the next few years.
The claim that Jacksonville's fund would become insolvent by 2020 drew a response from Jacksonville Police & Fire Pension Fund Director John Keane.
Keane objects to the assumption of a 4% return on investment. Instead, Keane assumes an 8% return, which would allow the fund to remain solvent through tax amortization. Depending on which rate you use, Jacksonville's unfunded liability is $4 billion or $1.5 billion.
https://jaxburningissues.wordpress.com/ (https://jaxburningissues.wordpress.com/)
When Ron Littlepage went after the Pension Fund in his column, that brought people out of the woodwork. Essentially saying that having your ED administer the investments as well as collective bargain and have a personal pension created for his role alone.
President Randy Wyse's response to the Times Union,
As I read your column this morning, I have a sense that you don't understand (or purposely omit) a few things that are key to the pension debate.
You quote John Keane saying "We're not going to make any changes for current employees." The part you get right is that Mr. Keane's job is to administer the fund. In administering any fund, it is the responsibility of the administrator to abide by any court ruling that tells the fund the benefit structure and how the fund is run.
The part you get wrong is that pension benefits are set through collective bargaining with the Fraternal Order of Police and the Jacksonville Association of Firefighters. The Jacksonville Association of Firefighters has maintained that the 30 year contract between the City of Jacksonville and the Police and Fire Pension fund is binding. If you look back through the collective bargaining agreements over the last 4 decades, you will not find any language that relates to pension benefits. Any agreement over pension reform must be between the City of Jacksonville and the Pension fund. The Pension Fund and the City of Jacksonville have come to two agreements over the last 3 years as it relates to pension reform. One agreement with Mayor Peyton and one agreement with Mayor Brown. There were several reasons why neither of these agreements were accepted by the City Council, most of them political.
The unfunded liability is the biggest cost driver as it relates to the City's annual payment to the Police and Fire pension fund. The Mayor's Task Force has done great work identifying ways to pay down the unfunded liability. I hope our city leaders will choose to use some of these ideas which will greatly assist with the annual contribution to the fund.
I think it is time to unlatch your simple mind on the thoughts that Police Officers and Firefighters are unwilling to help fix the pension problem. The Times Union would be well served by assisting the citizens of Jacksonville on understanding the whole pension problem.
Randy Wyse
President
Jacksonville Association of Firefighters
Quote from: spuwho on October 02, 2015, 09:39:11 PM
Stephen,
It really comes down to the ethics of one person being your Executive Director, Collective Bargaining Agent and creator of his own personal pension plan outside of COJ. An even though it was recommended for many years, he had no associate director. So as the plan grew in size and importance relative to the COJ, having such a large role in just one person became a flash point.
No one has accused him of malfeasance, but his refusal to take vacations, hire an associate (so he could take vacations), and prop up his pension (guaranteed by the way) when the fund he manages is underfunded, make people see self-dealing. Delaying his retirement date until he could "collect" made more people suspicious, even though he was probably allowed under his generous contract.
His bio:
http://www.coj.net/departments/police-fire-pension-fund/administration/john-keane.aspx (http://www.coj.net/departments/police-fire-pension-fund/administration/john-keane.aspx)
Joining the Sheriff's Office in 1962 and transferring to the new Fire/Rescue Department on February 1, 1969. Mr. Keane earned his A.A. and A.S. degrees from Florida Community College at Jacksonville and a B.S. in Workforce Education and Training from Southern Illinois University - Carbondale. He was an active member of the Fraternal Order of Police (Lodge 30), served as Business Agent and Executive Board member of the Jacksonville Association of Firefighters #122, served as a member and Chairman of the Pension Advisory Committee, and Member of the Board of Pension Administration. He was elected to the first Police and Fire Pension Fund Board of Trustees when the Fund became independent of the City. John has served as an Executive Committee member of the National Conference on Public Employee Retirement Systems, and served on the Administrator's Committee and Public Employees Committee of the International Foundation of Employee Benefit Plans.
John served three terms as a member of the Executive Committee of the Coalition to Preserve Retirement Security. He also serves on the Council of Institutional Investors Executive Committee and is a member of the Government Finance Officers Association Focal Group. He has been awarded the Certified Retirement Administrator and Certified Retirement Counselor designations by the International Foundation of Retirement Education. He frequently speaks at seminars, conferences, and forums on public pension issues.
Per Jacksonville.com:
http://jacksonville.com/news/2015-08-28/story/john-keane-controversial-head-police-and-fire-pension-board-will-step-down (http://jacksonville.com/news/2015-08-28/story/john-keane-controversial-head-police-and-fire-pension-board-will-step-down)
As executive director of the pension fund, Keane was on the frontline of negotiations with city officials over the past 25 years on pension benefits for police and firefighters. A major provision of the pension deal signed in June is that in the future, the pension fund will not be involved any longer in negotiating benefits, which instead will get decided in collective bargaining between the city and unions.
Keane picked up his share of critics who said he leaned too far in favor of advocating for police and firefighters' benefits, even in the face of the rising cost to city government for those benefits.
"You shouldn't assume that there's a never-ending pot of money that will flow into your coffers," said Curt Lee, a citizen activist who frequently criticized Keane. "I think he didn't balance things properly."
Lee successfully sued the pension fund for public record violations stemming from his attempts to get documents. Lee also won a lawsuit that found the pension fund and the city violated state Sunshine law by negotiating pension benefits in non-public meetings going back to 2000."I think he's been inept and he's violated the law several times," Lee said. "I would say, 'Good riddance.' "
Keane's tenure as executive director began in the roaring decade of the 1990s when the stock market soared, and then overlapped the recession in the early 2000s and the stock market crash in 2008, which badly damaged the pension fund's investment portfolio. The city's debt to the pension fund for future pension obligations is about $1.6 billion.
As the city's annual contribution to the fund soared to around $150 million, Keane met repeatedly with city administrators in negotiating sessions.
"He has an encyclopedic knowledge of pension fund history," said Chris Hand, who was chief of staff for Mayor Alvin Brown when they sat across the table from Keane in public meetings last year at City Hall. "He's smart. He's savvy. In the words of Kenny Rogers, he knew when to hold 'em, when to fold 'em."
The pension fund and the city eventually agreed to a pension deal that reduces benefits for new police and firefighter hires, while modifying benefits for current employees.
Per Folio:
Since 1990, John Keane has reigned supreme over the Jacksonville Police and Fire Pension Fund, during which time he has amassed for himself a very special pension worth north of $2 million that the city believes is ill-gotten (that's in addition to the $310,000 salary Keane, a retired rank-and-file member of the fire department, makes for managing all of six people). And, oh yeah, Keane's pension fund is in the red to the tune of $1.7 billion, and could potentially cripple the city's finances. No, that's not all Keane's fault. But while the mayor and City Council grapple with so many tough questions and unpalatable solutions, John Keane's got nothing to worry about: his retirement plan, which he negotiated himself, is fully funded (100 percent, baby!) and in no danger. Keane's not the only one who's learned how to suck us dry: In August, the Times-Union reported that the chairman of the pension fund's board of trustees, Bobby Deal, a retired cop, had worked the city's Deferred Retirement Option Plan for a $4.9 million retirement. Hey, man, to the victor go the spoils.
Per Business Insider: (2011 article) Where he states that while many civic pension funds were going insolvent, Jacksonville would be healthy because he uses an 8% rate. (the others were using a 4% rate) In this case he was wrong, but that is why there was so much arguments over "exactly" what our pension liability truly was. Based on Keane's rate or the rate used by the rest of the United States.
Jacksonville Pension Director Says He Can Earn 8% ROI And There Won't Be A Solvency Crisis
We recently published projections by Professors Robert Novy-Marx and Joshua Rauh that showed dozens of city pension plans running dry in the next few years.
The claim that Jacksonville's fund would become insolvent by 2020 drew a response from Jacksonville Police & Fire Pension Fund Director John Keane.
Keane objects to the assumption of a 4% return on investment. Instead, Keane assumes an 8% return, which would allow the fund to remain solvent through tax amortization. Depending on which rate you use, Jacksonville's unfunded liability is $4 billion or $1.5 billion.
https://jaxburningissues.wordpress.com/ (https://jaxburningissues.wordpress.com/)
When Ron Littlepage went after the Pension Fund in his column, that brought people out of the woodwork. Essentially saying that having your ED administer the investments as well as collective bargain and have a personal pension created for his role alone.
President Randy Wyse's response to the Times Union,
As I read your column this morning, I have a sense that you don't understand (or purposely omit) a few things that are key to the pension debate.
You quote John Keane saying "We're not going to make any changes for current employees." The part you get right is that Mr. Keane's job is to administer the fund. In administering any fund, it is the responsibility of the administrator to abide by any court ruling that tells the fund the benefit structure and how the fund is run.
The part you get wrong is that pension benefits are set through collective bargaining with the Fraternal Order of Police and the Jacksonville Association of Firefighters. The Jacksonville Association of Firefighters has maintained that the 30 year contract between the City of Jacksonville and the Police and Fire Pension fund is binding. If you look back through the collective bargaining agreements over the last 4 decades, you will not find any language that relates to pension benefits. Any agreement over pension reform must be between the City of Jacksonville and the Pension fund. The Pension Fund and the City of Jacksonville have come to two agreements over the last 3 years as it relates to pension reform. One agreement with Mayor Peyton and one agreement with Mayor Brown. There were several reasons why neither of these agreements were accepted by the City Council, most of them political.
The unfunded liability is the biggest cost driver as it relates to the City's annual payment to the Police and Fire pension fund. The Mayor's Task Force has done great work identifying ways to pay down the unfunded liability. I hope our city leaders will choose to use some of these ideas which will greatly assist with the annual contribution to the fund.
I think it is time to unlatch your simple mind on the thoughts that Police Officers and Firefighters are unwilling to help fix the pension problem. The Times Union would be well served by assisting the citizens of Jacksonville on understanding the whole pension problem.
Randy Wyse
President
Jacksonville Association of Firefighters
Thank you Spuwho now I know a lot more of what is going on with the cop & fire pension fund and John Keane the Wizard of this pension.